A simpler way it could've been done...


Gunslinger Discussion: Round 1


To get gun statics:
Pull look at D20 modern http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/article/msrd
Guns should not be better than what's in Modern. Period.
Take a few of those weapon statistics & use them for the basis for your old-time fire arms. Grab 2-3 from each category(pistol/longarm) and use the low end ranges plus average & low damages for the weapons of each category(so you can have multiple types for each category). Then, knock the damage down a category. Give it crossbow reload times, appropriate to the category(pistols equal light crossbow, muskets equal heavy crossbow).

If there are any enchants that are great for guns(I honestly haven't looked in a while), use them, since it's the pretty much the same weapon magic enchant system as Pathfinder. Also, incorporate any firearms feats that look like they'd fit with the type of weaponry. Lastly, look at core weapons/ammo & then come up with a reasonable price based on how your guns stack up.

This assuming you want to put in some effort just use some existing available firearms source that actually has prices you can work with in gold(such as the 3.5 DMG).

For the Gunslinger itself:
Take Fighter, Ranger, & Rogue. Tweak the ranged specialties each a bit to be more gun themed and you've got multiple Gunslinger options to fit different types of gun users.


The thing with d20 Modern is that the damage values mirrored their rules on massive damage. Look those up. Pathfinder uses different rules for massive damage, so those values don't work quite as well.

Furthermore, look at the average pistol damage in d20 Modern. 2d6. The starting Musket damage presented here is 1d12. The guns here are not better. By far.

The guns they have here are historically accurate enough to work. The guns, as they are, are FINE. The gunslinger should be able to make them better. For everyone else, the guns work. Everyone needs to STOP COMPLAINING ABOUT THE GUNS.

Suggestions for upgrading guns can be found in threads here and here.

Dark Archive

There is no Pathfinder Modern rules set, at least no official one. So until they DO make one your premise has no weight.

Scarab Sages

InfernosReaper wrote:

To get gun statics:

Pull look at D20 modern http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/article/msrd
Guns should not be better than what's in Modern. Period.

You mean the system where one of the authors, Charles Ryan, plainly admitted in interviews in Dragon magazine that he didn't want people choosing weapons based on damage?? The system where reflection of actually statistics and capabilities of real world weapons was never a consideration?

That system?

Poor choice of an anchor for your argument.


It was just a reference for guns that I could link people to. 3.5 D&D has guns in the DMG, but didn't include a cost for ammo, but you can figure it out.

The only real problem with the guns is cost & the misfire/explode thing. There's not a big enough advantage to guns to justify those. This is reflected in my part where the price of guns need to be based off what they do in relation to what other weapons do.

My primary point of this thread is that the class itself is completely needless. The guns bit, while longer, is less important.

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