Personal Thoughts and Findings: Samurai

[CalebTGordan]

I hear samurai and I think different things depending on the topic. If we are speaking about history I think "Asian knight." If the topic is literature I think of a lone swordsman whose blade is faster and deadlier then any other.

Historically, a Samurai is more or less a European Knight. What opinions people have about one being able to beat the other is mostly based on fiction and not fact. Although if we were to pick only one Japanese Samurai and one European Knight from the history books, Miyamoto Musashi would undoubtedly win hands down, though it is my personal feelings that he would have been considered the best warrior of all time no matter where he lived or what warrior culture he grew up in.

When I read the Samurai class I asked myself, "Could this class also fit a European Knight?" The answer is: mostly. And I think that is a good thing.

For one, it silences my fears the Asian based classes are going to be better then other classes simply because they are Asian. It bothers me to think people who have no genealogical ties to Japan think that they were better at a most things with only fiction as their proof. This class however makes me really like the idea of playing a Samurai, but I also feel like I could play the class but call myself a Knight.

So what is in the class that sets it apart from the European Knight? The weapon proficiencies and the orders. There are some ideas on how to help this class be further set apart, but will save those for later.

By way of fiction and literature, this class has a little ways to go to fully match what we see Jack and Sanjuro do, but it is almost there. I don't think we can have a class feature that causes defeated enemies to spurt impossible amounts of blood all over the place, or to stumble around without a limb (or head) for a few seconds though. When I GM a game with a samurai there will be lots of blood though.

What can be done to further set apart this class from the knight, and to help it fit slightly better with fictional samurai, is to look into class features that do two things. Unarmed/Grappling attack options and dealing extra damage on the draw of the blade.

One thing I cannot argue with is that Jujitsu and Iaijitsu are thematically unique to Samurai. Jujitsu was a big part of a samurai's training, and many fictional samurai proved that they were still dangerous without a sword. Iaijitsu is the art of killing someone with the draw of your blade. Zatoichi is the fictional character that comes to mind when I think of Iaijitsu. It always seems that a limb goes missing on a bad guy the moment he draws his hidden sword.

Here is what I plan on exploring with my play tests:
Does the Samurai have a unique feel to it?
Would the name Knight be out of place with these class features?
Can I introduce some form of unarmed combat to the class?
Can I introduce an Iaijitsu mechanic?
Are there any existing abilities that need to be adjusted or replaced?

I am not going to be able to play test this until tomorrow, but until then I am going to put on my copy of "Yojimbo" and brainstorm.

P.S. Isn't it funny that I could put on "Fist Full of Dollars" and brain storm for the Gunslinger?

[Pendagast]

CalebTGordan wrote:

I hear samurai and I think different things depending on the topic. If we are speaking about history I think "Asian knight." If the topic is literature I think of a lone swordsman whose blade is faster and deadlier then any other.

Historically, a Samurai is more or less a European Knight. What opinions people have about one being able to beat the other is mostly based on fiction and not fact. Although if we were to pick only one Japanese Samurai and one European Knight from the history books, Miyamoto Musashi would undoubtedly win hands down, though it is my personal feelings that he would have been considered the best warrior of all time no matter where he lived or what warrior culture he grew up in.

When I read the Samurai class I asked myself, "Could this class also fit a European Knight?" The answer is: mostly. And I think that is a good thing.

For one, it silences my fears the Asian based classes are going to be better then other classes simply because they are Asian. It bothers me to think people who have no genealogical ties to Japan think that they were better at a most things with only fiction as their proof. This class however makes me really like the idea of playing a Samurai, but I also feel like I could play the class but call myself a Knight.

So what is in the class that sets it apart from the European Knight? The weapon proficiencies and the orders. There are some ideas on how to help this class be further set apart, but will save those for later.

By way of fiction and literature, this class has a little ways to go to fully match what we see Jack and Sanjuro do, but it is almost there. I don't think we can have a class feature that causes defeated enemies to spurt impossible amounts of blood all over the place, or to stumble around without a limb (or head) for a few seconds though. When I GM a game with a samurai there will be lots of blood though.

What can be done to further set apart this class from the knight, and to help it fit slightly better with fictional...

Iaijutsu is essentially fast draw and improved initiative

[CalebTGordan]

Pendagast wrote:

Iaijutsu is essentially fast draw and improved initiative

Yes, in the real world those feats are basically it, and being reminded of that maybe the mechanic is simply that they gain those feats for free?

But in fiction, isn't it a little more then that?

[Pendagast]

CalebTGordan wrote:

Pendagast wrote:

Iaijutsu is essentially fast draw and improved initiative

Yes, in the real world those feats are basically it, and being reminded of that maybe the mechanic is simply that they gain those feats for free?

But in fiction, isn't it a little more then that?

well no not really unless you are talking anime,

ITs pulling the sword out really fast and attacking with blinding speed.
It doesnt do more damage or cause lightening bolts or anything, its attacking fast with a sheathed weapon.

[Magus Black]

CalebTGordan wrote:

Actually I think your referring to battojutsu, iaijutsu is more about mental awareness and posture. The latter is more the defensive parts of fighting without the sword drawn, while the former is about the offensive actions taken as the sword is being drawn…at least I think it is…

[Pendagast]

Magus Black wrote:

CalebTGordan wrote:

Actually I think your referring to battojutsu, iaijutsu is more about mental awareness and posture. The latter is more the defensive parts of fighting without the sword drawn, while the former is about the offensive actions taken as the sword is being drawn…at least I think it is…

iaijutsu is a martial art/from focusing on the fast draw of the sword, from its scabbard and attacking int he same motion.

The focus is on daily life (and as such the style assumes unarmored opponents). Iaijutsu assumes the sword is worn edge up. It has maneuvers from a seated, kneeling and standing positions.

It's the classic samurai in meditation, ninja sneaks up to attack, samurai draws katana and whirls around to cut ninja in motion maneuver seen in various movies.

Interestingly, iaijutsu isnt used on the battlefield, as there, opponents would be armored.

But this is DnD/pathfinder so we can ignore that.

[CalebTGordan]

Magus Black wrote:

CalebTGordan wrote:

Actually I think your referring to battojutsu, iaijutsu is more about mental awareness and posture. The latter is more the defensive parts of fighting without the sword drawn, while the former is about the offensive actions taken as the sword is being drawn…at least I think it is…

You might be right. I am not an expert by any means on the Japanese culture. I was talking to a friend of mine and he explained the difference.

My initial introduction to the idea of Iaijitsu was from the Oriental Adventures book for 3rd ed, so you should at least understand why I was prone to thinking it would be nice to have a mechanic for it.