For firearms in my games:
Flintlock pistol: 1d6 (small); 2d4 (medium); 2d6 (large); x3 crit; 20' range increment.
Flintlock rifle: 2d4 (small); 2d6 (medium); 2d8 (large); x3 crit; 50' range increment.
One full round to reload, Rapid Reload reduces this to a move action.
Any flintlock with a rifled barrel is automatically required to be a masterwork weapon and the range increment doubles.
Rangers can adapt the Crossbow combat style to work with the firearms.
On a misfire (natural 1), roll a d20 to confirm crit failure. If a 1 comes up, it jams and explodes doing normal damage to the wielder. 2 - 7 weapon takes the damage, 8 - 20 weapon jams.
A couple of feats specific for firearms and some weapon enchantments and you're good to go.
I have a problem with the guns = touch ac concept and thts special materials ok a good gun can shoot through your tin plate mail but what about an adamantite set you lead bullet would be a decorative new badge and little else really.
Still the pathfinder armor rules don't work that way therefore all you can really do is assume armor works against guns.
Sure they do. Adamantine armor has damage reduction, which overthrows the touch AC thing to at least some degree.
Hell, protection from normal missiles would manage it even better.
Then again, this comes back to the thought that magical defenses work better than mundane ones.
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I think that the sounds of guns making PC's shaken is a ridiculous concept. Adventurers can face down almost anything but dragons without becoming shaken, and even then they can make a save. We don't make players make saving throws for a ball of fire exploding all around them or for battling the average walking dead- but the mere sound of a gunshot?
RE: Iron Kingdoms
I love the look of the setting, adore my Hordes and Warmachine armies, but absolutely hate the Iron Kingdoms firearms rules. If you're thinking of converting your entire campaign to firearms-centric, it might work, but if you're trying to maintain a level playing field otherwise, it won't work at all. Plus, firearms in the IK are bogged down with too many additional rolls/rules and are horribly lacking in - dare I use the "R" word? - realism with regards loading times. And really, it is the reloading time that determines more than almost anything else whether all of the PCs will be packing heat and never pick another weapon up again.
I've dallied in the past with firearms here and there, but read the IK firearms rules first when it came to time to make a decision on actually incorporating them full time. Frankly, I don't find anybody else's rules adequate to the task, so made my own with only a slight nod to bits and pieces picked up here and there. D20 Past, which is hard to find now, comes closest to fair for these things in a fantasy setting. I borrowed most from that for my own stuff.
My personal feeling is that each GM is going to have to tweak gunpowder to make it fair and to make it fit their campaign.
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I have a problem with the guns = touch ac concept and thts special materials ok a good gun can shoot through your tin plate mail but what about an adamantite set you lead bullet would be a decorative new badge and little else really.
That would be easy enough to house-rule. Generally, if the armor used to stop the bullet is tougher than the ammo (as in your example), reduce the damage and convert the remainder to non-lethal damage.
The other option is: Use the touch AC to hit the torso (largest section of the body) and deal non-lethal damage OR use the full AC to hit the body, apply DR based on the armor's material, and then apply the remainder of the damage as lethal damage.
I have a problem with the guns = touch ac concept and thts special materials ok a good gun can shoot through your tin plate mail but what about an adamantite set you lead bullet would be a decorative new badge and little else really.That would be easy enough to house-rule. Generally, if the armor used to stop the bullet is tougher than the ammo (as in your example), reduce the damage and convert the remainder to non-lethal damage.
The other option is: Use the touch AC to hit the torso (largest section of the body) and deal non-lethal damage OR use the full AC to hit the body, apply DR based on the armor's material, and then apply the remainder of the damage as lethal damage.
Of course, this also opens up the possibility of mithral and adamantine bullets. Not to mention the inevitable subject of the "magic bullet".
"So let me get this straight. You're saying that this one sniper fired one bullet that went in the Prime Minister's shoulder, came out his armpit, turned around and went in through his belly, blew out his spine, then came round and hit him in the back of the skull?"
"Ayup."
"G*~!#+ned wizards." ; )
"So let me get this straight. You're saying that this one sniper fired one bullet that went in the Prime Minister's shoulder, came out his armpit, turned around and went in through his belly, blew out his spine, then came round and hit him in the back of the skull?"
"Ayup."
"G&!+*~ned wizards." ; )
Or maybe a home brewed Grammaton Cleric using a part of his Gun Kata feat tree.
Greg
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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I hate to say it, but has anyone looked at wands as a good 'mechanic' for guns?
A pistol with a 60' range increment, doing 1d6 X3 damage. Make the pistol 350 GP, with each 'bullet' (shot, powder, etc) being 8 GP. 50 shots = 400 GP. So 50 shots to hit, + pistol = 750.
Wand of magic missile... 750 GP.
'Rifle' with a 120' range increment, doing 2d6 X3 damage. The Rifle itself is 1,000 GP, each 'bullet' is 50 GP. 50 shots + rifle = 3500
Wand of scorching ray = 4500 GP.
Just a thought. You're trading the reliability of magic for a regular hit roll. If you add in a 'jam/hangfire' on a fumble, I'd drop the cost by half. So the Rifle above would be 500, with each bullet being 25 GP a shot. More expensive than even a composite longbow, but not as expensive as in the campaign setting book.
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I hate to say it, but has anyone looked at wands as a good 'mechanic' for guns?
A pistol with a 60' range increment, doing 1d6 X3 damage. Make the pistol 350 GP, with each 'bullet' (shot, powder, etc) being 8 GP. 50 shots = 400 GP. So 50 shots to hit, + pistol = 750.
Wand of magic missile... 750 GP.
'Rifle' with a 120' range increment, doing 2d6 X3 damage. The Rifle itself is 1,000 GP, each 'bullet' is 50 GP. 50 shots + rifle = 3500
Wand of scorching ray = 4500 GP.
Just a thought. You're trading the reliability of magic for a regular hit roll. If you add in a 'jam/hangfire' on a fumble, I'd drop the cost by half. So the Rifle above would be 500, with each bullet being 25 GP a shot. More expensive than even a composite longbow, but not as expensive as in the campaign setting book.
Wow. That's an excellent build. Thanks for sharing.
Expensive ammo is a decent way to balance it, definitely something to think about. Makes it compare poorly with the bow though in a lot of ways.
Yeah. If the ammo's more expensive, it should accomplish more than just an arrow -- or at least have certain advantages that an arrow doesn't. All things being equal, to do otherwise means there's no reason to choose a firearm over a bow.