I have created (maybe am creating :)) a prestige class to combine paladin and wizard in response to a thread asking for help and i'd like to invite you all to kick the tires then flame me about how bad it is :D
P.S. any constructive criticism while probably accidental will be gratefully received ;P
I think one less Smite and one less caster level.
But I would the Arcane Armor training feat to list of bonus feats.
Also let you some advance learning an add Paladin spells to your wizard spell list.
Good suggestions i'll give them some thought thnks for the input :)
Looks decently balanced as far as I can tell. I might add the Arcane Armor training feats staggered throughout as bonus feats for the class, and in exchange get rid of the bonus feat.
It just feels to me like this class really needs those feats to fit what you're going for.
Nice capstone, really nice.
The skill requirements indicate 5th level paladin, 5th level wizard. Consider changing the requirement "Able to cast and prepare arcane spells of 2nd level or higher. Arcane Bond to a Weapon or Familiar" to "Able to cast and prepare arcane spells of 2nd level or higher. Arcane Bond to a Weapon or Familiar." This would open the class up to sorcerers, albeit a level later.
Does the Spells per day bonus apply solely to arcane spells or could they up their paladin spells per day?
I agree with the Arcane Armour suggestions above.
I like Templar's Mercy, but you might consider changing the CL to arcane templar level plus arcane caster level rather than 2 x templar level.
Nice capstone, really nice.
The skill requirements indicate 5th level paladin, 5th level wizard. Consider changing the requirement "Able to cast and prepare arcane spells of 2nd level or higher. Arcane Bond to a Weapon or Familiar" to "Able to cast and prepare arcane spells of 2nd level or higher. Arcane Bond to a Weapon or Familiar." This would open the class up to sorcerers, albeit a level later.
As to the requirements they are set so a lvl 3 wizard level 4 paladin in needed to enter the class as any class can add ranks to any skill. I was trying to avoid sorcerers as the pure charisma would probably unbalance the class somewhat :)
Does the Spells per day bonus apply solely to arcane spells or could they up their paladin spells per day?
As intended it is for the wizard spells and i would consider the ability to add paladin spells to the wizards spell lists at +1 level in place of actually leveling the paladin spells. That being said my first draft filled the blank caster levels with bonuses to paladin casting.
I agree with the Arcane Armour suggestions above.
I've added the armor feats. I was toying with the idea anyway so with you, Tom, and Sylvanite all suggesting them too its a sure thing :)
I like Templar's Mercy, but you might consider changing the CL to arcane templar level plus arcane caster level rather than 2 x templar level.
The x2 Templar level was to let them hve a fair shot at dispelling a spell of an = CL caster to party level. What i think i'll do is either use it at character level or say adding the templars paladin and wizard levels to his templar level for the purposes of caster level.
I like it. Might make a nifty PrC for a Magus/paladin, too, if they choose the Familiar arcana (assuming that would fulfill the qualification).
Or a witch (again, assuming it fulfills the qualification).
Overall, nice job. And the capstone is really well done.
I like it. Might make a nifty PrC for a Magus/paladin, too, if they choose the Familiar arcana (assuming that would fulfill the qualification).
Or a witch (again, assuming it fulfills the qualification).Overall, nice job. And the capstone is really well done.
Thanks i had forgotten about magus and witch :). An elven or half-elven magus/paladin of Yuelral sounds an awsome defender of the faith/elven way character and very good at fighting treerazor's minions
The capstone didn't take much thought really i just thought of it as a slight bypass to the MAD stats problem for casters.= at least when fighting the BBEG type fights.
I kinda like filling the dead spaces that way too but in the end i think it may tip the balance.
My other thought would be to allow them to add 1 paladin spell to their arcane spell list for each level of Arcane Templar these spells would be 1 level higher than they are as paladin spells i'd probably call the ability Arcane Prayer.
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I kinda like filling the dead spaces that way too but in the end i think it may tip the balance.
My other thought would be to allow them to add 1 paladin spell to their arcane spell list for each level of Arcane Templar these spells would be 1 level higher than they are as paladin spells i'd probably call the ability Arcane Prayer.
Looking over the paladin spell progression...I really don't think it'd tip the scales that much, if at all. In total from your class, a PC would get access to having access to one level higher of Paladin Spells. Meaning they could cast 2 1st and 2 2nd on average. Not a threat when compared to the additional arcane might your class has. it adds a deal to the survivability to the class as well. As those 5 levels of caster can hurt the melee capacity of this class, which strikes me as a semi-arcane tank.
Been play testing it a bit.
So far a deadly build is a Halfling Paladin5/Arcane Duelist(Bard)6, for a charisma route type caster. Lot's of self buffing and synergies to saves.
As the class is written bards wouldn't qualify as they don't prepare spells. Still i have no problems with people changing stuff on the class it was made to help someone and i hope it's doing that job, if others get enjoyment from it with a few tweaks thats just kudos. :D
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As the class is written bards wouldn't qualify as they don't prepare spells. Still i have no problems with people changing stuff on the class it was made to help someone and i hope it's doing that job, if others get enjoyment from it with a few tweaks thats just kudos. :D
I took Arcane Preparation as a feat...from Complete Arcane. That and being an arcane duelist variant bard. I felt it still qualified.
Sorry to take so long to get back. Holidays and such. Hope I provided a better explanation on how I got my spontantious caster shoehorned in. Granted if you don't think that qualifies, I'll understand.
As the class is written bards wouldn't qualify as they don't prepare spells. Still i have no problems with people changing stuff on the class it was made to help someone and i hope it's doing that job, if others get enjoyment from it with a few tweaks thats just kudos. :DI took Arcane Preparation as a feat...from Complete Arcane. That and being an arcane duelist variant bard. I felt it still qualified.
Sorry to take so long to get back. Holidays and such. Hope I provided a better explanation on how I got my spontantious caster shoehorned in. Granted if you don't think that qualifies, I'll understand.
I really don't mind how people use it if anyone gets some enjoyment from it i'm happy :)
The prepared spells requirement can be dropped if thats how people want to play it although i would lose the Arcane Smite's bonus to save dc's for charisma casters to attempt some balance probably.
Thank you!
This looks really great, I have sent a link to my GM.
Thank you!
This looks really great, I have sent a link to my GM.
This is literally a "no brainer" PrC. Such PrCs have been explicitly stated as something of a 'no-no' for PRPG.
Entry is at 8th level for the AT instead of 7th for the EK .
EK gains a total of 2 more arcane spell casting levels over AT - this may be a balancing factor, but it is not much of one compared to the Smite Evil, Divine Bond (weapon), and lay-on-hands-to-dispel magic that the AT gains in trade. I notice that the Bonus Wizard Feat is not on the class chart, although it is in the class' list of abilities beneath the chart.
The lay-on-hands-to-dispel magic is at total character level, far better than anything else the character can normally do. At 14th character level as a standard melee touch (swift action to do it on yourself) the lay-on-hands-to-dispel magic becomes lay-on-hands-to-break-enchantment. Uh - no. No. NO. No. no... have I said no ? Standard action to deliver what is normally a 1 minute casting time spell as a (Sp) ability, bypassing the normal V and S components ... the only "major" limitation is the integral "+15" in the text of break enchantment... which is pretty much a non-issue unless the character is played past 17th level.
The capstone ability is nice, and is an excellent fit for the concept. The 17th level palizard will definitely enjoy the massive bonus to punch through SR and to the save DC of their arcane spells to soften up the bad guys before wading in to lop off noggins and administer a proper smack down.
Thank you!
This looks really great, I have sent a link to my GM.
This is literally a "no brainer" PrC. Such PrCs have been explicitly stated as something of a 'no-no' for PRPG.
Entry is at 8th level for the AT instead of 7th for the EK .
EK gains a total of 2 more arcane spell casting levels over AT - this may be a balancing factor, but it is not much of one compared to the Smite Evil, Divine Bond (weapon), and lay-on-hands-to-dispel magic that the AT gains in trade. I notice that the Bonus Wizard Feat is not on the class chart, although it is in the class' list of abilities beneath the chart.
The lay-on-hands-to-dispel magic is at total character level, far better than anything else the character can normally do. At 14th character level as a standard melee touch (swift action to do it on yourself) the lay-on-hands-to-dispel magic becomes lay-on-hands-to-break-enchantment. Uh - no. No. NO. No. no... have I said no ? Standard action to deliver what is normally a 1 minute casting time spell as a (Sp) ability, bypassing the normal V and S components ... the only "major" limitation is the integral "+15" in the text of break enchantment... which is pretty much a non-issue unless the character is played past 17th level.
The capstone ability is nice, and is an excellent fit for the concept. The 17th level palizard will definitely enjoy the massive bonus to punch through SR and to the save DC of their arcane spells to soften up the bad guys before wading in to lop off noggins and administer a proper smack down.
Thanks for the input :)
The Dispel mercy my be slightly overpowered my first version was the opposite i was trying to make it usable rather than being so many levels behind it couldn't actually dispel anything maybe i chould make it use 2 lay on hands like channeling
The break enchantment is probably too much would dispel evil be a better choice?
The wizard feat is old data and got replaced with the armor training ones i have deleted the entry
The 2 less than EK is on purpose added to the extra level needed to enter and the 2 wizard levels less at entry the Palizard will never match the arcane might of an EK or Wizard.
The capstone is the main reason i set the class to be non-charisma casters if the character was totally based in charisma then the bonus to save dcs would be very broken (hence my suggestion above to remove that bit if allowed to be used on a charisma caster).
I would think dispel evil is a better match than break enchantment. To continue the theme of increased arcane goodness, greater dispel magic would be a better fit I think.
The dispel mercy is not a bad thing per se - it needs some cleaning up (so that the palizard doesn't cure a bad guy along with the dispel, let's say).
I would think dispel evil is a better match than break enchantment. To continue the theme of increased arcane goodness, greater dispel magic would be a better fit I think.
The dispel mercy is not a bad thing per se - it needs some cleaning up (so that the palizard doesn't cure a bad guy along with the dispel, let's say).
Hmm as written dispel evil would only auto dispel an evil spell or an effect from an evil caster as i limited the mercy to dispeling 1 negative effect
Still looking at greater dispel it also can dispel curses which keeps to the healing theme better so i'll probably go with that although i'll leave the changes untill i see if anyone else has some thoughts on it.
Might want to cut most of the additional stuff.
I would just give class abilities where the EK gets feats and where the templare isn't getting caster levels.
Might want to cut most of the additional stuff.
I would just give class abilities where the EK gets feats and where the templare isn't getting caster levels.
Something more like this?
Might want to cut most of the additional stuff.
I would just give class abilities where the EK gets feats and where the templare isn't getting caster levels.
Something more like this?
Link isn't working unfortunately.
Sorry i didn't share it properly it should work now
That is MUCH more palatable. Ineptus, you may print that out in full and notify the Palizard that she may swap EK 1 for AT 1.
That is MUCH more palatable. Ineptus, you may print that out in full and notify the Palizard that she may swap EK 1 for AT 1.
Woot! Thanks, hope she likes this final form.
Happy to be of service :) which one of you requested the access by e-mail btw?
Happy to be of service :) which one of you requested the access by e-mail btw?
That was probably me.
Happy to be of service :) which one of you requested the access by e-mail btw?That was probably me.
I gave you editing rights so if you need tweaks you can do it without needing me :)
I gave you editing rights so if you need tweaks you can do it without needing me :)Happy to be of service :) which one of you requested the access by e-mail btw?That was probably me.
Yes I had noticed, thank you.
The Palizard wanted to make note that the class has a higher requirement than the EK. The Arcane Templar generally requires 2 additional level no matter the class combination.
The level thing was deliberate however you can change the lay on hands requirement to mercy class feature with little problem :)
@Torsin divine bond is not needed it's gained in a more limited fashion than the full paladin (can only enhance the arcane bonded weapon or allow a familiar to "level up" as if the character was gaining wizard levels)
The level thing was deliberate however you can change the lay on hands requirement to mercy class feature with little problem :)
@Torsin divine bond is not needed it's gained in a more limited fashion than the full paladin (can only enhance the arcane bonded weapon or allow a familiar to "level up" as if the character was gaining wizard levels)
For regular play a character normally will only get to level 16 maybe 17 if they are lucky, thus why you usually get into a 10 level PrC by 7th. To be more in-line with other PrCs you might want to change this to fit that standard.
However it might not be able to be done. The only thing I can think of is reduce the spell casting capability to fit this concept, 1st level spells requirement? That would be 1 level wizard/5 paladin making it 6 as you need divine bound for this PrC.
Have you considered bending the reqs into the PrC to allow clerics into it?