
Kirth Gersen |

In AD&D, the only way to really raise Int was with a Tome (1 pt) and Gem of Intellect (1 pt). That was IT. (Well, except aging, but aging never got you past 18, except for Wisdom).
That feeds into one of the solutions above: making Int-boost items minor artifacts, rather than E-Z-Craft freebies. That, or cranking the point-buy system with a table (yeah, it's not obvious what the costs are, but you only use it once per character, so it's not like you're interrupting play), or, alternatively, just telling the players to use the Elite stat array and be done with it (if you have a lower-power campaign).

Kirth Gersen |

I'm liking your idea of converting iteratives to movement on full-attacks more. I'm wondering when do you actually see it really enter play however. Do PC's use it at BAB +6 at all? Or is it mostly when they get to BAB +11 that it really starts to get noticed?
Honestly, I see no incentive to use it at 6th (just take a move action and a standard action to attack), so it wouldn't come into play until 11th. And as that's fairly late in the game for such a minor ability, I may have to redo the concept to make it matter more at 6th. Off the top of my head, something like "you can take a move action and a full attack, splitting up the movement between attacks if desired." In essence, everyone would get Pounce, but since swift lion's pounce is like a 2nd level spell, that's not a game-breaking idea.

SlimGauge |

Then later on they craft a headband +6 and a book +5 ... make mental stat items minor artifacts rather than craft-able items, and outright ban wishes for higher Int.
I've been playing a LONG time. I've NEVER (in game) seen one of those stat-boosting books or any belt/headband better than +2. My DMs must all be stingy. So the ONLY way to get one would be to have a player craft it, but no one in my groups ever wants to spend the feats. And a WISH spell ? Wouldn't touch one with a 10 foot pole.
So it always bugs me when an arguement assumes availability of such things.

Kirth Gersen |

So the ONLY way to get one would be to have a player craft it, but no one in my groups ever wants to spend the feats.
Say you spend one (1) feat and a small amount of gold relative to your level to get a headband +4, giving you more skill points and extra bonus spells -- and also +2 to all your spell save DCs. That's the equivalent of Spell Focus feats in all schools, and also Greater Spell Focus feats in all schools -- already the equivalent of 16 feats right there, and it stacks with existing SF and/or GSF -- and no one was willing to do that? Why in God's name not?

stringburka |

Have you tried simply dropping bonus spells for high casting attribute? With less spells per day, but equally powerful ones, wizards still get to shine but just a limited number of times per day. Intelligence loses some value as it affects less, and the need for non-spell solution increases.
And it's simple.
EDIT: To compensate, it might be a good idea to bump their hit dice to d8 levels in the case of wizards and sorcerers (without increasing the BAB). Arcane casters are dependent on spells more than divine ones are, generally, and increasing their HD somewhat reduces the need for defensive buffs, freeing some spell slots for offensive options.

stringburka |

Honestly, I see no incentive to use it at 6th (just take a move action and a standard action to attack), so it wouldn't come into play until 11th. And as that's fairly late in the game for such a minor ability, I may have to redo the concept to make it matter more at 6th. Off the top of my head, something like "you can take a move action and a full attack, splitting up the movement between attacks if desired." In essence, everyone would get Pounce, but since swift lion's pounce is like a 2nd level spell, that's not a game-breaking idea.

anthony Valente |

Anthony valente wrote:I'm liking your idea of converting iteratives to movement on full-attacks more. I'm wondering when do you actually see it really enter play however. Do PC's use it at BAB +6 at all? Or is it mostly when they get to BAB +11 that it really starts to get noticed?Honestly, I see no incentive to use it at 6th (just take a move action and a standard action to attack), so it wouldn't come into play until 11th. And as that's fairly late in the game for such a minor ability, I may have to redo the concept to make it matter more at 6th. Off the top of my head, something like "you can take a move action and a full attack, splitting up the movement between attacks if desired." In essence, everyone would get Pounce, but since swift lion's pounce is like a 2nd level spell, that's not a game-breaking idea.
Recently, I've pondered just porting over 1E's initiative system into my game. It has a certain flavor that I really enjoy.
On the other hand, I do like your solution for trading iteratives for movement because it makes sense from a narrative POV and it meshes nicely with the existing rules without creating ripples anywhere in them.
I still keep my idea (on the back burner) of basically expanding the "radius" of movement on a full attack so that it scales with BAB:
1) At BAB +1 to +5 you play the rules as normal
2) At BAB +6 to +10 you may move up to 10' on a full attack
3) At BAB +11 to +15 you may move up to 15' on a full attack
4) At BAB +16 to +20 you may move up to 20' on a full attack
The movement and attacks are interchangeable. At BAB +11, you could move 5 feet make two attacks, move 10 more feet, make your third attack.
Never came to a decision whether or not the movement provokes. Or if it provokes but one 5' increment could be made with a 5' step.
The only thing holding me back is how it disrupts the the reach rules somewhat and some of the feats in the game by diminishing their quality (like Spring Attack, and Mobility for instance). That's probably not a bad thing however.
Back on topic. You know, I think making spell save DCs based off of Cha isn't such a bad thing. I can see it being rationalized. I do like your idea of moving mental stat boosting items into the minor artifact category better though. I can draw similarities between that type of change and how 1E handled the issue by allowing only warriors to benefit from high Strength and Constitution. And that might be all that is needed actually. To be honest though, I've not been a fan of stat boosting items for years now and have for the most part excluded them from my games with the commencement of my most recent campaign. I can't stand 1st of all how boring an item they are from a role playing standpoint, and I don't like how much power they give to PCs relative to monsters in the Bestiary. Monsters are a little more challenging again. Oh, and the fact that, to make NPCs challenging they have their own sets of stat boosters too. I find it an irksome part of game design when virtually ALL high level PCs and NPCs are sporting a set of belt and headband customized to their abilities. Not to mention that just about all of them also wear a "cloak." I've re-flavored the "cloak" as a robe of resistance, or an amulet of resistance from time to time, but that only goes so far.