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Ok, I've been on a major inquisition lately in my group to find ways to speed up gameplay, and to quit losing time on erroneous stuff like map drawing, initiative, etc.
Here's what I've done so far.
Pre-rolled the NPC Initiatives and their initiative cards on fights I know that will happen.
Pre-rolled random encounters, and their treasures.
Bought supplies for pre-drawing maps, and it's on the to do list.
I use the maintenance variant to eliminate taking time to handle all the random less than 1gp cost transactions.
Made a rule that if players catch me off-topic that they get a +4 on a roll of choice for that session. (I get off topic A LOT!)
Is there anything else that anyone can think of that I can do to speed up gameplay, so that we can do the things we actually care about. Combat and Roleplaying.
Pre-rolled the NPC Initiatives and their initiative cards on fights I know that will happen.
Initiative is often too complicated. I chunk initiatives. Most foes have a single initiative which I roll each round. This is the number to beat. Every PC with a higher initiative gets to go in whatever order the players want. Then the bad guys go. Then everyone else. No cards necessary. No initiative countdowns.
Also, if you're up for something a bit more radical, get rid of AoO.
Mark L. Chance | Spes Magna Games
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Pre-rolled the NPC Initiatives and their initiative cards on fights I know that will happen.Initiative is often too complicated. I chunk initiatives. Most foes have a single initiative which I roll each round. This is the number to beat. Every PC with a higher initiative gets to go in whatever order the players want. Then the bad guys go. Then everyone else. No cards necessary. No initiative countdowns.
Also, if you're up for something a bit more radical, get rid of AoO.
Mark L. Chance | Spes Magna Games
I find chunking initiative drastically shifts battle tactics, and removes a lot of the ability to manipulate timing in battle. I do however chunk familiars and animal companions with their masters, because they can quickly add up.
AoO, I don't find causes too much of an issue. You roll attack and damage, and it's relatively quick and easy.
Though thank you for the suggestions though.
I tried block initiative for a session or two. The quiet players got skipped because they didn't speak up when their block came up and the loud players called their actions. If they stopped to discuss tactics we slowed down combat even worse. Went back to individual order next session.
I fully agree. Individual init is probably the LAST thing I'd cut.
I don't find initiative takes long, not for me, anyway. I group monsters, i.e all the Orcs get on roll, the 2 Ogres get another. If individual monsters have different modifiers, they can end up going seperately, but usually they go at the same time. I roll, I add, I sort the cards.
What takes a long time is player initiative: "What? Oh. Huh? Initiative? Where's my D20? Wait. Darn, it rolled off the table! Hold on."
After everyone rolls I pin index cards to a Cork Board so everyone can keep track and know when their turn is coming up. Also I strictly enforce the 5-second rule. If you sit and think and don't at least start your turn for 5 seconds, you get skipped as if you Delayed Action. After that, you can pipe up when you figured out your move an act on the new initiative count.
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I've got a decent sized group, and one thing I've started doing that helps speed combat up is when I call out who's turn it is I also tell who's up next, or on deck. This alerts the next player to consider what they are going to do. (my player's have never been able to pay attention for very long so there's no helping that they're distracted by other things during combat...)
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I've got a decent sized group, and one thing I've started doing that helps speed combat up is when I call out who's turn it is I also tell who's up next, or on deck. This alerts the next player to consider what they are going to do. (my player's have never been able to pay attention for very long so there's no helping that they're distracted by other things during combat...)
Oooo...I like that idea. I have the same problem with my players. They're almost as bad as me when it comes to ADD. I usually have something to focus on when I play as GM though lol.
Over the years I've given a lot of thought into how to speed up the game session, especially with large groups.
- One thing was to have a designated player keep track of initiative results on a specially designed worksheet(freeing up the ref for other mechanical issues).
- Minimize minis/landscape use. No matter how much you think it helps with visualizations, it hinders other aspects of speed and gameplay. If you need help with visualizations, it's probably during BIG/IMPORTANT battles - then just use them with big/important battles only!
- If you fixate on minis, have them at the ready. Don't dump them all into giant bags where you have to go fishing for the right one - ALA Legos.
- Small sand hourglasses are useful for declarations. It's menacing, it's visual, everyone can see it, and when the last grain is gone without a declaration, you've lost your turn or delayed your action (character hesitation).
- Streamline / modify character sheets. No stock/published character sheet I've seen is ever adequate enough, in my opinion. Far more info needs to be included on them, but, if you get your players trained well, speed will improve.
- Appoint someone as a reference aide. Someone who can quickly locate a spell/rule/passage and read it aloud if an issue arises.
- Get the food/drinks out of the way first.
- Prepare all your NPC's, adventure outline, maps, etc all the night before. This can't be stressed enough.
- Dry erase markers are far more useful than wet erase. No fiddling with water, rags, inked hands, etc. Use clear overlays on paper maps if need be (I have a glass frame I hand made specifically for this).
- Adopt a very fair, but stern approach to things... One of my personal favorite mantras: "If it's not on your character sheet, you don't have it. You MUST keep clear records."
- Don't bog down your team with NPC's. The player may like having a favored NPC around but really do your best to try to keep the party lean and mean.
- The players need to be responsible for their spellcasting. It's their character and their spell, they should know the details or have their book at the ready to answer questions. If they don't know the answer to a basic question like "what's the range of your spell" and you have to waste time looking it up yourself, it's actual range is halved. Same goes for damage, durations, etc.
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Before I get lynched, I have to stress something. Some of these techniques may seem harsh or that I'm being a jerk. This isn't indiscriminate or needlessly punitive. They are designed to be harsh in order to achieve an end.
The end being faster play, more streamlined cooperation, and more responsible players. Eventually, with players trained to take a more proactive approach to gaming (rather than just lazily "dialing" it in) things will run smoother.
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Here's my 2 domars
- Make sure you get plenty of sleep the night before, if it isn't your turn or you are not the focus try to stay involved. That or expect to wake up with funny things written on your face or being left out in the street (on the chair with rollers) in late night traffic. This is a team effort, not a "me only" effort - stay active, and follow up on your options (core book) if the focus is not on you at the time.
- Don't focus on other things at the table -no watching TV/DVDs, working on other projects, games, fantasy football, jerking/joking around, etc. If you are not reading the core book or something related to your PC you are wasting your time and everyone else's time.
Game time is game time.
- As a player try running a game once in awhile. It is always easier to criticize the process when the burden is always placed on the same person. Perspective can be attained and things learned if other people help out and pick up the slack - hell, the current DM may learn about time management if he gets to play in a game once every, oh I don't know 4-5 years. Games over many years develop bloat, in rules and in items at the table.
New games/simple games are a way of running thing faster -until they bloat, but in any case new DMs/GMs can help the burden and provide other DM ideas and insights into how to run things differently - lead by example. It's much easier to criticise a DM when you rarely or never take on the mantle. Multiple DMs help in streamlining and evolving the process for the whole group. Each person can bring a process top the table and you never know, a new standard can be built.
- Learn the rules. Make an effort to learn how the mechanics of the game work and do this with some zeal. If a DM doesn't know a rule, he can wing it since he probably has an idea associated with the rule. If a player doesn't understand how an obscure spell works there is a good chance no one will have read it. As a DM I haven't memorized the entire damn Spell Compendium, if you have some obscure/niche spell read the damn thing - understand it or ask questions ahead of time. Don't wait for deploy to discuss how the thing works.
- As a player BE PREPARED - have your one responsibility ready, your character sheet. Don't wait an hour in to go get it, have the damn thing on the table with all the other garbage your DM has to set up.
- Minimize distractions -this includes phones calls. Try to make sure you have a "disturbance free zone" to the best of you and your groups ability.
- Set up - players should help with this, there are no excuses. If you are playing at a different spot or don't have a permanent set-up the players should assist within their ability to get the whole thing moving instead of watch their DM do it.
- Help out. If you see an opportunity to assist another player, give it. Sometimes players who may not be versed in all the rules may pass over an option due to the complexity, help these players out.
If a player hits a wall or doesn’t understand something, your side knowledge and assistance (as the game is running) can be a great boon when it’s that player’s turn who is going to try something new/complex/difficult. If you have the knowledge, provide it to those who may have questions. This can reduce the time it takes to explain things to the player if they are done ahead of time or during down time (not your turn).
One thing I tried in a large group I had (and it worked well) was that each person had to keep track of their own initiative. I'd start counting down and they would tell me when I got to their number, then they would take their turn. It worked pretty well and kept things going quickly.
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One thing I tried in a large group I had (and it worked well) was that each person had to keep track of their own initiative. I'd start counting down and they would tell me when I got to their number, then they would take their turn. It worked pretty well and kept things going quickly.
I've tried that, it didn't work well for my group. I found it easier to just have their names on a sheet and go round the table and get them all, quickly slip them in the spots on the init cards and go from there.
You can replace initiative with a random draw. Just put a bunch of cardboard tokens in a bag, and draw them out one at a time. Then toss them all back in.
Average damage +1
If you have a bunch of similar bad guys, add their HP together (3 x 60 = 180). Keep track of the total. Every time the total drops by 60, one dies.
Predraw the map.
If you want there to be rules, you have to enforce rules. It's not mean, it's mandatory.
Cut people off if they don't know what they are doing. You'll be amazed how much people focus when you say "I'm putting you on delay"
If you need to make a decision, 1-3 it works, 4-6 if fails is a good rule. Look it up after the game, and get it right next time.
Make nametage for NPCs, so everyone knows who you are trying to be.
Write out index cards for all the individual items of treasure. If you have the card, you have the item. If not, too bad. You can give them out in envelopes. For extra fun, trap an envelope.
Go here for more awesome ideas.
http://www.treasuretables.org/
I use a 6 second rule.
If the player doesn't declare their action in 6 seconds, they delay. And i stress that when it's not their turn, that they should be thinking about what they're going to do and like Ref Discretion, if they're unsure about any aspect of a spell/combat maneouvre, to have the entry ready to read.
I find that this has not only quickened gameplay, but also created more interest in the combat when its not their turn, and made combat much more realistic and exciting.
There are a lot of gaming podcasts out there and most/all have dealt with the issue of time management. My personal favorite is "The Brilliant Gameologists."
They did an episode a while back on time management in game. Or, rather, it was a portion of the episode. You should check it out.
Also, from a more personal position, summoning is something that can eat up a lot of time, but only if the player/GM is unprepared for it. It's not one of those tactics that should be used on the fly. I suggest printing off stat blocks ahead of time for easy reference for 2-3 different creatures.
Additionally, random little modifiers can bog down play. I find it kind of amazing that people have so much trouble doing low-value addition and multiplication in their heads, but it is what it is. I had a player in my last group who would sometimes spend 3-4 minutes each turn just adding up modifiers to his attack and damage rolls. Eventually, I helped him make a chart for easy reference. It helped out A TON. Moral of this story is to understand player weaknesses. Getting statistical stuff handled before the game can go a long way to speeding things up in-game.
Aside from altering game mechanics, it really just comes down to..
pay attention. don't be sleeping while its someone else's turn.
Know when your turn is coming up. It shouldn't require someone else keeping track. You know Your init, and when they do roll call at the beginning of combat- just note who is before you. Easily. Done.
Know Your Character.
If you are going to be disarming, look up the disarm rules *prior* to declaring the action.
If you disarm *alot* then get the specific rules printed out for your (and the group's) convenience.
The same really goes for spells. There's no good reaason to not have your entire spell book printed out and ready.
Clerics/Druids can't do this effectively but if you have a few "no brainer"spells you always prepare, you can have those ready. If you already decided what you are going to cast that round, go ahead and open the book to it.
Whatever your chaaracter can do, be ready for it. Familiar? know the familiar rules. (i.e. printed out, ready for access). Have a combat mount? same thing.
The more difficult thing:
prepare a "secondary" move.
Maybe someone kills the guy you were going to disarm or a melee charges into the way of your fireball. Take a moment to decide what you may do in case what you were going to do, doesn't work out.
RELAX.
It's a game. Not the military. Expediency is useful but taking it too far just makes the game we enjoy too much like a job. Blech.
-S
Make nametage for NPCs, so everyone knows who you are trying to be.
Had to read and re-read that a few times before I realized what was happening.
As it happens, I think you've generated a great NPC name. "Nametage the Dread Sorcerer" or something. Nam-uh-tazh-ee.
Neat.
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STOP
Using
Battlemats.
Those stupid things takes SOOO much time it's ridiculous!
If the PCs want to Flank say "Okay" and give 'em their +2 and Sneak.
If the Wizard asks how many Dark Creepers he can get in his fireball and still get the Dark Stalker, give him a reasonable answer and let him do it.
If a PC needs to move out of the way to avoid an AoO -- he does.
If, on the other hand, you've decided the only way to get to a Flanking position is to provoke an AoO -- tell the PC and let him decide.
Let the Wizard choose if he wants to get the Dark Stalker and only one Dark Creeper or if he wants to get 6 Dark Creepers (including the 2 already injured) but no Dark Stalker.
Counting squares on a mat is the greatest waste of time since giving fighter-types 35 attacks in one round at higher levels.
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Also, I've done the "Hey, Bob, your turn is up next" thing. It really helps casters.
And in really big groups, instead of rolling initiative, the PCs sit around the table according to whoever has the highest init bonus and we go clockwise around the table. I always pre-roll init's for monsters (actually I arbitrarilly decide them pre-game) and when a monster goes between two PCs I just put a stack of D&D books between the two Players and in combat it's easy to see when the monster goes.
I'm really not big on time limits for Players, especially for casters who have to look up exactly how trouble-shooting spells work. I ask casters to spend other Players' initiatives looking up spells and, of course, let them know when their turn is soon. . . .
The Caster tells me how the spell works according to RAW; I don't look it up. Sheesh, the Player JUST looked it up, why do I need to?!!
Finally, like many others, I have the Players "color code" their dice and roll them simultaneously -- the cool red d20 is the 1st attack, then the black d20 and the old blue d20 is the 3rd attack roll -- rolled at the same time with the (also color-coded) damage dice. (If you use Threat ranges RAW -- unlike me where a 20 always crits) -- you'll have to decide if the "next" d20 is used as a confirmation roll or if the PC should reroll the same d20 to confirm.)
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Here's how I've streamlined over the years:
1. One Initiative for encounter
2. DM knows rules and the encounters intimately
3. Players know their characters & not looking up rules. Should have "cheat sheets" if needed. No one should be flipping thru player's guide for something on their sheet.
4. Spell cards & Monster cards for summoners and casters. Summon spells used to be biggest drag on game time, now not at all.
5. Battlemat. It isn't that slow for me. While I draw the encounter, the party should be preparing mentally what they're doing.
6. 15-second max turn or you delay till end of round.
7. Environmental or situational modifiers (like flanking, elevated attack position) I mentally adjust the foe's AC rather than giving the player another + or - to keep track of. Did this after noticing several long pauses of players trying to figure out all their modifiers this round or that round. They still are responsible for their party buffs, like a bard song, etc.
8. Condition cards. I made cards with a "condition", graphic of that condition, and the game modifiers. If someone gets the condition (e.g. shaken, dazzled), they get the card as a reminder.
9. Morale. Not all enemies fight to the death, end battles when needed.
10. Wrong calls. Don't stop the game to adjudicate. Make a ruling. If you are right, great. If wrong, admit after the encounter and see what can be done to set things straight.
11. Roll simultaneous dice for attacks, damage, and miss chance.
*I kinda like the bonus if players catch the DM goofing off / slowing the game.
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STOP Using Battlemats... it's ridiculous.
So (is) arguing over where the characters are in the room.
I conceed.
I've never had a problem with Players arguing, or even beeing confused on where their PCs are. And I'm convinced that any fair and consistent DM could keep a smooth fight.
But, yeah, you're ABSOLUTELY right. Different groups have different things that work.
Try going commando, though, for one session. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised at how easy it is to let go of HAVING to count squares and areas of effect and such. Trust your DM to be fair and let you get as many whatevers in the Fireball as possible and have fun.
DON'T try to get your DM to describe everything. Or practically anything. . That's it. Nothing else.
And the Players say, "Okay, I charge the nearest Mephit." And "I Fireball the troll, how many mephits can I get without hitting the Tank?" etc.
Later, I asked him why he was acting oddly and he admitted he was upset about his PC dying. After hearing his side of the story I pointed out that the other 7 Players understood, so I felt good about my arbitration but, when I had him draw out how he thought the encounter looked I saw his confusion. There was NO WAY his PC would have ever done in that situation what he did -- that was obvious.
And I retroactively changed my ruling and declared the PC had done something else and not died.
So, one confusion in the last several years -- and, after talking with the Player out of game, got it cleaned up.
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I find index cards make combat go much quicker. I have each player fill out a card with the following info:
Name:
Class/Level:
AC:
Saving throws:
CMB/CMD:
I do this with index cards that have been laminated, thus I can write the starting init at the top, or just stack them by init and roll through the pile. As long as I have made the NPC/monsters on cards too, then I can keep track of each monsters stats also.
Also I have found the following usefull as a player:
Perram's Spellbook for keeping a list of all spells that I know and their info. I also use these as a DM for scrolls. Just have the player hand me back the little printed card when the scroll has been used.
Happy Camper's Class Specialized pathfinder Character sheets The last page of the character sheet has some great info about DC's and skills, also some of them (mostly melee combat classes) have a great section for pre-calculating out the CMD/CMB for all the combat maneuvers and shorthand rules for each.
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Try going commando, though, for one session. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised at how easy it is to let go of HAVING to count squares and areas of effect and such. Trust your DM to be fair and let you get as many whatevers in the Fireball as possible and have fun.
I AM the DM, and I did try it. I admit I have a problem with sparse descriptions, which probably contributed to my players asking for a battlemat. But I also have a Fighter PC who is built around AoOs and planning his maneuvers around the battlefield. So, to reiterate, my players told me 'that was too confusing, can we have a battlemat?'
STOP
Using
Battlemats.
Our group started without battlemats and then started using mat and minis both after a year or two.
One of our biggest problems without the mats was distance.
When you tell player A that he is 250 feet away from the enemy, player B that he is 55 feet away, player C that he is 13 feet away, and player D that he is in melee--then player A announces that he is taking the run action to move 120 feet and now only has 130 feet to go--most everyone else (GM included) just forgot what the distances/positions were for players B, C, and D in the midst of the calculations.
We had a few arguments about who was where in relation to everyone else a few times too. The game IS slow with a battlemat (not necessarily slowER), but at least everyone is on the same page most of the time.
STOP
Using
Battlemats.
You know what? It suddenly occurs to me that it's time for multiple controversies to merge.
We've got the "do battlemats and minis hinder immersion" thread which is highly contentious. You've got the "why is fudging happening" thread, which is also highly contentious. Now unify them here.
Without a battlemat, a DM is constantly fudging. Want the PCs to be able to fireball five mephits, not eight? Say it. The DM always has a model in his head that is utterly morphic and arbitrary. He doesn't even have conscious control over some of this because if he hasn't made a relativity decision before a player asks for that ruling, he's GOT to be influenced by how the overall fight is going. The universe is subjective if there's no battlemat.
Now all we need to do is figure out if it's okay for a paladin to use a falcatta on a full-BAB Magus and we won't need the forum anymore.