I think she would have been better served with a non-flesh-color-mesh-see-through-top. If had been something like a metalic green, there would have been no concern. Frankly some people feel that the deep necklines are actually hurting girls psychological and emotional develop. Making them feel as if they have to dress as such to be accepted, even if they are not entirely comfortable doing so. I think some parents may wish to wait until their children actually have a top to worry about before discussing whether such outfits are appropriate or not.I don't think it is necessary for everyone to agree with those parents, but I also think it is not entirely appropriate to say they should not be concerned with such issues.
Do you even have a dog in this fight? I thought you didn't have kids.
Also, aren't there less theoretical targets against which such complaints could (and possibly should) be lodged? High School Musical, those Bratz dolls, etc, etc. Girls are being encouraged to be sexual at a very young age, and a skit on Sesame Street, with a relatively chaste outfit, isn't really a significant player in that trend. Sesame Street's target demographic don't even dress themselves and are still struggling with the concept of what makes a boy different from a girl - I highly doubt that they are initiating conversations about appropriate outfits, particularly a conversation based upon a 3 minute skit on an hour long show that they likely watch multiple times per week.
People can be concerned about whatever they want, and can over-react however they please. I'd like to take their concern seriously, but it's pretty difficult with a claim like this.
You are correct, the parents that didn't like it, are all douchebags.
You are correct, the parents that didn't like it, are all douchebags.
Woot! Total agreement.
Woot! Total agreement.
You are correct, the parents that didn't like it, are all douchebags.
You said:
I'd like to take their concern seriously, but it's pretty difficult with a claim like this.
Obviously you believe they have no valid claim to complain. I don't see why you now attempt to move away from that position?
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You do realize the outfit wasn't one uniform color correct? You did actually watch the video right?
Yeah, I watched it. However, seeing as how I'm not a repressed Puritan, it's fairly likely that I wasn't as obsessively focused on her cleavage as you were when you watched it on loop for a few hours. :P
Or perhaps it's just your professional interest as a potential Sesame Street wardrobe consultant.
You do realize the outfit wasn't one uniform color correct? You did actually watch the video right?Yeah, I watched it.
Actually I didn't watch it initially and blew it off because I heard the Sesame Street/Children's Network (?I don't know the exact name of the operation) representative said it wasn't like you could really see anything it wasn't really skin, it was a flesh-colored top (her claim). So I didn't really think much of it, obviously folks who start threads do though. My wife mentioned that, you can see through the top part. I answered, again with only going with what I saw on the news from the representative, "Nah, it is just flesh-colored, you can't REALLY see anything." To which she said, "The mesh might be flesh-colored but you can see through it." And that is when I watched the video for the first time. So if seems as if I am a little more aware of the details of the top, it is because I (1)heard the representative describe it, (2)went by that description, and (3)was proven that the description while truthful wasn't completely descriptive.
Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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Woot! Total agreement.
You are correct, the parents that didn't like it, are all douchebags.You said:
I'd like to take their concern seriously, but it's pretty difficult with a claim like this.Obviously you believe they have no valid claim to complain. I don't see why you now attempt to move away from that position?
I find it difficult to take your concern seriously that I actually think someone is a douchebag because I find it difficult to take their concern seriously.
Also, I recommend flagging this post, because by the language above, as interpreted by you, I just called you a douchebag. That wasn't my intent, nor is it what I actually said, but I realize that your main (only?) rhetorical tool is misrepresenting what someone posts. I just want to help you do it on a consistent basis.
*typical pony snark*
How about this. People that actually care about the issue, contact the people that make such decisions, and let those people who make those decisions do so. That is what happened. You don't think they should have made the decision they ultimately did, why not contact the people that decide and try to sway them back. Maybe they could put it in next season if they can't fit it in this season at this point. Obviously, if you are better able to prove that the other people's concerns are not valid, then this should be possible.
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Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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*typical pony snark*How about this. People that actually care about the issue, contact the people that make such decisions, and let those people who make those decisions do so. That is what happened. You don't think they should have made the decision they ultimately did, why not contact the people that decide and try to sway them back. Maybe they could put it in next season if they can't fit it in this season at this point. Obviously, if you are better able to prove that the other people's concerns are not valid, then this should be possible.
I don't follow...how do you prove that someone's concerns are not valid?
And why would I contact the decision makers? I don't particularly care. I'm not offended that it was cut out, I wouldn't have been offended if it were in, and I wouldn't be offended if it were put back in. A 3 minute clip on Sesame Street, that may or may not feature too much boob, just doesn't rise to the level of me giving a f#@!. I find it funny that other people are so offended, I find it odd that cleavage is being used to refer to a look that I would never call cleavage, and I am sad that the people who are so worried about overly sexualized kids can't find a better target and actually make a difference on that issue. But offended enough to take action above and beyond pointing out how absurd the argument is on a message board...not so much.
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 8
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Sesame Street producers have said they were hoping that having Katy Perry on would get young mothers to sit down with their children and watch the program together. Since (1) parents who are more involved in their children's television viewing are more likely to make good decisions about how much television their children watch, (2) parents who watch educational programs with their kids can build upon what their kids learn and increase the educational value of the programs, and (3) Katy Perry attracts younger mothers whose children are often less successful in school ... I think the proper conservative response is to demand Sesame Street put the clip back on.
Personally, thanks to this discussion I just enjoyed forty minutes searching the Internet with my wife discussing boobs (size, shape, etc.) so, either way, I'm good.
I thought it was the letters T and A and the number 69. :)
Mildly-amusing tangent: Elmo's Potty Time is brought to you by the letter P and by the number 2. (Really!)
Personally, I've long been of the opinion that it's dumb to have "celebrities" of which young children couldn't possibly be aware on Sesame Street. However, Tarren Dei's explanation makes some sense: encouraging parents to sit down and watch and discuss TV with the kids, rather than just plop them in front of it and walk away.
(And, yes, I have young children; it's how I know about Elmo's Potty Time.)
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I find the whole thing laughable, my wife wears more revealing tops to work. The thing is Katy is a rather top heavy woman, the outfit she wore seemed to really downplay her "assets". As for the statement made that it's "see through"..... uh.... maybe if you're Superman.
Other than it being a butt ugly dress, I got no problem with what she wore. And I do have kids, 3 of them. None of which did anything more than laugh at the silly skit when I showed it to them.... ok well my oldest did groan and say "Uhg... Elmo is for babies daaaaaaaad".
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Sesame Street producers have said they were hoping that having Katy Perry on would get young mothers to sit down with their children and watch the program together. Since (1) parents who are more involved in their children's television viewing are more likely to make good decisions about how much television their children watch, (2) parents who watch educational programs with their kids can build upon what their kids learn and increase the educational value of the programs, and (3) Katy Perry attracts younger mothers whose children are often less successful in school ... I think the proper conservative response is to demand Sesame Street put the clip back on.
Personally, thanks to this discussion I just enjoyed forty minutes searching the Internet with my wife discussing boobs (size, shape, etc.) so, either way, I'm good.
And so this thread wins the Tarren Dei Award for Peace. ;)
Maybe if we did let women walk around topless we would not be so obsessed with boobs. You can't child proof the world.
Maybe if we did let women walk around topless we would not be so obsessed with boobs. You can't child proof the world.Dude, I already walk around obsessed with boobs. You have women walk around with them free and open and I'd have a brain melt.
Like a newborn in a topless bar.
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Like a newborn in a topless bar.Maybe if we did let women walk around topless we would not be so obsessed with boobs. You can't child proof the world.Dude, I already walk around obsessed with boobs. You have women walk around with them free and open and I'd have a brain melt.
Psh, I go to the All Nude one down on Seaboard St.
~nomnomnomnomnomnomnomnomnom~
Maybe if we did let women walk around topless we would not be so obsessed with boobs. You can't child proof the world.Dude, I already walk around obsessed with boobs. You have women walk around with them free and open and I'd have a brain melt.
And melting Moorlucks brain would be bad in what way?
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And melting Moorlucks brain would be bad in what way?Maybe if we did let women walk around topless we would not be so obsessed with boobs. You can't child proof the world.Dude, I already walk around obsessed with boobs. You have women walk around with them free and open and I'd have a brain melt.
I didn't say it would be a bad thing, or even all that hard really. ;)
I think Aberzombie prefers them fried, but meh.
I think Aberzombie prefers them fried, but meh.Yeah but melted brains go better with nachos.
mmmmmmmmmm Nachos.... damn Now I need to go eat something.
This may come to you as a shock, but one of the most important and effective ways that human children understand appropriate behavior around them is to observe adults in action. This is why, for example, a child raised in a home where foul language is used regularly, will use that language even if periodically "corrected". The observed behavior is stronger because it is shown to be "real" while the corrected behavior is "false" (since the parents themselves do not practice it).
Nope. Doesn't come as a shock at all. But I still don't see the connection.
There's a difference between seeing an adult do something, and being made to do it oneself by a parent, no?
Sorry, I just can't summon the necessary moral outrage.
