How did the paladin get such an absurd AC at that level?
I'll assume it was by the rules, but the simplest thing to do is have the monsters realize quickly into the fight, if not before, that the dude in the shiny armor is too well armored for a regular assault to hit so they should concentrate their attacks on his friends if that's all they have.
Also, play the monster as smart. There's a will-o'-wisp in that section, right? Give it a brain and let it do standard will-o'-wisp tactics and lead unwary travelers into peril.
The River Kingdoms are wet. Finding a sucking bog or quicksand shouldn't be hard, especially one with duckweed or light grass growing over it disguising the peril. Have the will-o'-wisp get the paladin to chase him there by the simple expedient of floating over the treacherous ground then using his lightning to zap all the members of the party it can kill, starting with the wizard and anyone with ranged attacks. The paladin? Leave him until he decides to run in close, possibly in some dramatic swashbuckling maneuver because while the will-o'-wisp is floating high enough you can't touch it, it "foolishly" forgot that paladins have mounts and if he summoned his mighty charger and High-Ho Silvered off a particular hummock, he could do a ride-by attack on the will-o'-wisp.
Of course, in reality, he'll belly flop into a bog, heavy armor and all. AC? Who cares what your AC is. You're drowning.
There's a leucrotta is the same module. Have it lead the paladin into a bog too. A leucrotta that tries to run up and bite a paladin is likely a brain-damaged pitbull that someone hit with polymorph other.
Yes, there will be some simple-minded mooks who do paladin-assisted suicide. Let them. It's one of the joys of the class. But the actual thinking and treacherous villains will kill their enemies intelligently.
You can also get the paladin wet and then let him think that leeches have crawled inside his armor and he has to take it off to remove the leeches and let his armor dry so it won't rust. While he's sitting in his skivvies in front of the fire, let the monsters choose that moment to attack.
Let the Pally keep his high ac. After a swing or two, intelligent opponents will realize that they are up against someone who is hard to hit and adjust their tactics accordingly, i.e. call for flanking buddies, attack someone else, use splash (touch) weapons, or grapple. Animals in particular would probably go for a grapple then pin after some missed attacks.
Hope this helps.
Edit: Ninja'd! Also, running away is also an option. Even if it's just so you can attack later (like at night when the pally is in his skivvies).
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There are several tried and true methods for high AC.
Higher Ground +1
Aid Other +2
Flanking +2
Charging +2
Trip -4 to Defender AC
Touch attacks
Splash Weapons
Swarm attacks (no hit needed)
Conditions
Entangled -4 Dex (-2 net AC/Ref save)
Fatigued -2 Str & Dex
Grappled -4 Dex
--Vrock'em Sock'em Robots!
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You can also get the paladin wet and then let him think that leeches have crawled inside his armor and he has to take it off to remove the leeches and let his armor dry so it won't rust. While he's sitting in his skivvies in front of the fire, let the monsters choose that moment to attack.
Where's the fun in that?
Don't just let him 'think' leeches are inside his armor, when you could actually just do it.
AC 29 paly?
Full plate +1 is 10 AC right there.
Heavy shield +1 is 3 more, so we are sitting tight on a 23 without doing anything...
Like the +1 ring of protection, and +1 amulet of natural armor.
Just 7,9xx gp there for an AC 25 with dex of 13 we are up to 26, and dodge for 27.
With 16,000 gp for a sixth level character I think we could easily see that up to +2 armor and a +2 heavy shield. so we are now up to 29 with most our wealth eaten up (13,900 gp in AC boosting).
try things that grapple, trip and other combat maneuvers (take a look at the apg for additional ones), things that require saves. Like others said use advantageous situations, and dont forget if your monsters have trouble hitting have the weaker ones aid. And touch attacks are definitely your best means of taking on the paly.
You can also get the paladin wet and then let him think that leeches have crawled inside his armor and he has to take it off to remove the leeches and let his armor dry so it won't rust. While he's sitting in his skivvies in front of the fire, let the monsters choose that moment to attack.Where's the fun in that?
Don't just let him 'think' leeches are inside his armor, when you could actually just do it.
Point.
Though depending on how they drain blood--if it's Con like stirges, that can be very bad--it would be entirely possible that a swarm of leeches could suck the paladin dry before they ever got his armor off, especially if the leather straps swelled with the water.
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Just don't go overboard.
Make it challenging for the Pally, sure -- throw some touch attacks, etc. at him but don't make EVERY encounter one that makes his awesome AC worthless.
The Player chose to put everything into his AC -- that should be a GOOD decision from time to time as well. There was nothing wrong with him doing that.
I know if I spend all my gold, for example, on a Ring of Evasion and the DM stopped using monsters that give me a REF Save, I'd be pissed -- I spent all my $$ on that Ring, afterall; don't trump my ability.
In other words, balance what you do. Give him a few encounters where the monsters can't hit him mixed with a few encounters where they use touch attacks, etc.
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Just don't go overboard.
Make it challenging for the Pally, sure -- throw some touch attacks, etc. at him but don't make EVERY encounter one that makes his awesome AC worthless.
The Player chose to put everything into his AC -- that should be a GOOD decision from time to time as well. There was nothing wrong with him doing that.
Ridiculous! We should automatically try to think of as many ways as possible to DM fiat it into uselessness!
What you should do is have a purple worm swallow him whole and then prevent him from rolling a Wizard!Has anyone ever seen a thread that goes like this:
"Omg, the Wizard/Sorcerer keeps destroying stuff outright with magic! How can I give orcs anti-magic fields?!"
"OMG, the Rogue keeps sneak attacking everything for insane damage. How do I give bears tremorsense?!"
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Ridiculous! We should automatically try to think of as many ways as possible to DM fiat it into uselessness!
What you should do is have a purple worm swallow him whole and then prevent him from rolling a Wizard!
There are no Purple Worms in Kingmaker. I don't think they're indigenous to the Stolen Lands.
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There are no Purple Worms in Kingmaker. I don't think they're indigenous to the Stolen Lands.Ridiculous! We should automatically try to think of as many ways as possible to DM fiat it into uselessness!
What you should do is have a purple worm swallow him whole and then prevent him from rolling a Wizard!
This requires a rimshot or a facepalm. I'm not sure which.
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Remember, monsters aren't stupid.
That depends what the monsters are. Even 'intelligent' monsters may not, as a racial design, be tectically minded and would have no reason to form some sort of tactical assault based around taking into account the heavily armored Paladin.
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This requires a rimshot or a facepalm. I'm not sure which
Facepalm, all the way.
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(Some) monsters are smart, yes.
Let's take a look at your Will-o-Wisp.
. . . . You know, a smart monster that creates fear to feed off of.
. . . . If you're playing it smart -- the Will-o-Wisp will NOT EVEN GO AFTER the Pally -- there's NO FOOD there!
I'm all for playing monsters smart -- but I'm even more for playing them fun.
Also remember that that 29 AC is nice and shiny until the caster/monster starts slinging touch attacks. Touch attack seem him as what? AC 14?
Also remember that that 29 AC is nice and shiny until the caster/monster starts slinging touch attacks. Touch attack seem him as what? AC 14?
I demand more spite for some one trying to survive as a melee character!
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1. Next time you place treasure don't put just XXXX gp so the guy can go to Magic'r'us and buy another ring of protection. You should place some magic items aswell, put a magic weapon there, looks like he really needs it, and the party needs it even more.
2. Talk to the player and the other players about the problem. If he keeps raising AC and neglecting attack and damage he will eventually grow useless to the party. Someone that can't kill stuff at the rate needed by other members of the party and is just defending himself until he can get his part of the treasure isn't someone that fit in the party.
3. No matter what you do, the average fighter or paladin will always have a high AC even if he doesn't try to maximize it. Don't panick, everyone does well against something, just use different monsters with different kind of attacks.
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This requires a rimshot or a facepalm. I'm not sure which.There are no Purple Worms in Kingmaker. I don't think they're indigenous to the Stolen Lands.Ridiculous! We should automatically try to think of as many ways as possible to DM fiat it into uselessness!
What you should do is have a purple worm swallow him whole and then prevent him from rolling a Wizard!
+1 funny.
RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32
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Cartigan and Jeremiziah: Pathfinder Manzai duo. Just which is the boke and which the tsukkomi is the question...
Paladins, I find, are pretty difficult to challenge: they usually have good AC, they usually slaughter things physically (ESPECIALLY if they're evil (or even evil-ish)), it's hard to hurt them using indirect methods like spells, poisons, or diseases... What really challenges them is social conflict. What if someone's doing something detrimental to the party, but it's neither evil nor unlawful? That'll create a problem for a player playing a paladin.
... Well, playing a paladin well, at least. Anyways, I like the idea with the Wisp: give them a mental challenge, rather than a challenge of strength.