A little complaint about Phantasmal Revenge


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

A few weeks ago I complained about there still being save-or-die spells in the game, like Phantasmal Killer. James was so kind to asnwer, saying that the developers wanted to preserve at least some of them, with caveats like the double save for Phantasmal Killer.

Now, the APG introduced the spell Phantasmal Revenge, which is basically using a corpse to send a Phantasmal Killer to the being who killed the subject. The difference to the normal Phantasmal Killer being that two unsuccessful saves mean 10 damage / level, instead of an insta-death.

Would that mean that the developer stance on the last remaining save-or-die spells has changed somewhat? It strikes me as strange otherwise that the effect, which is almost similar to Phantasmal Killer in its presentation, would have been amended to be more along the lines of other former save-or-die spells.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

magnuskn wrote:

A few weeks ago I complained about there still being save-or-die spells in the game, like Phantasmal Killer. James was so kind to asnwer, saying that the developers wanted to preserve at least some of them, with caveats like the double save for Phantasmal Killer.

Now, the APG introduced the spell Phantasmal Revenge, which is basically using a corpse to send a Phantasmal Killer to the being who killed the subject. The difference to the normal Phantasmal Killer being that two unsuccessful saves mean 10 damage / level, instead of an insta-death.

Would that mean that the developer stance on the last remaining save-or-die spells has changed somewhat? It strikes me as strange otherwise that the effect, which is almost similar to Phantasmal Killer in its presentation, would have been amended to be more along the lines of other former save-or-die spells.

Not really; the thing with phantasmal revenge is that it's a LOT harder to stop the bad guy from casting it. Counterspells and attacks of opportunity/combat casting aren't really an option for phantasmal revenge, which means that it's easier to get the spell going, so we made it a little less instant-death than phantasmal killer.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
James Jacobs wrote:
magnuskn wrote:

A few weeks ago I complained about there still being save-or-die spells in the game, like Phantasmal Killer. James was so kind to asnwer, saying that the developers wanted to preserve at least some of them, with caveats like the double save for Phantasmal Killer.

Now, the APG introduced the spell Phantasmal Revenge, which is basically using a corpse to send a Phantasmal Killer to the being who killed the subject. The difference to the normal Phantasmal Killer being that two unsuccessful saves mean 10 damage / level, instead of an insta-death.

Would that mean that the developer stance on the last remaining save-or-die spells has changed somewhat? It strikes me as strange otherwise that the effect, which is almost similar to Phantasmal Killer in its presentation, would have been amended to be more along the lines of other former save-or-die spells.

Not really; the thing with phantasmal revenge is that it's a LOT harder to stop the bad guy from casting it. Counterspells and attacks of opportunity/combat casting aren't really an option for phantasmal revenge, which means that it's easier to get the spell going, so we made it a little less instant-death than phantasmal killer.

Thanks, that sounds well thought-out. It also confirms my suspicion that this a bit more of an NPC spell. :p

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