Frankly I don't understand this aversion to new base classes. Look at the excitement generated by the playtest of the APG and the upcoming Magus. Why not more?
Frankly I don't understand this aversion to new base classes. Look at the excitement generated by the playtest of the APG and the upcoming Magus. Why not more?
Fear of power creep, of archetypal classes being outdone, etc.. Completely understandable in some cases ( Beguiler! ), in other cases a new class can fill a niche which was unoccupied or insufficiently occupied ( Scout as a mobile skirmisher ).
Sword and Planet may need to wait for Pathfinder Psionics. Castrovel should be fun.I would be thrilled with an Oriental themed AP and setting book. So would my wife.
Any hope for some extra-Golarion adventures or info? Something involving space travel and a little sword and planet action would be wonderful.
Yeah I thought that too. I have never really been interested in psionics, but do want to see them for Pathfinder. I guess I am a bit of a paizo geek that way.
Despite what I have said before, I have faith that Paizo will do the right thing regarding the crunch for upcoming adventure paths and support material, even though the suspected upcoming APs, announced (i.e. Carrion Crown) or unannounced (i.e. Jade Regent), don't entice me much, as neither Tian Xia's asian-themed fantasy nor Ustalav's horror-themed fantasy hold much interest for me and I can't really see me playing, much less GMing these APs or reall enjoying their support material.
Well at least Serpent's Skull is shaping up to be awesome. And I'm certain somewhere up the line, more awesome APs are coming one day.
Frankly I don't understand this aversion to new base classes. Look at the excitement generated by the playtest of the APG and the upcoming Magus. Why not more?
I'm just not a fan of class bloat. Personally, the only one of the new classes I see a "need" for is the oracle, as we don't have a spontaneous divine caster yet. It makes sense to have one. The cavalier, summoner, and witch are very specialized forms of base classes. The alchemist is a weird class that somehow comes out of left field, and I don't get the role of the inquisitor at all. And I especially don't think the magus as a class is necessary - to me, the eldritch knight is good enough for that concept, but that's already been discussed ad nauseam.
Also, more classes, and especially more feats and more spells completely change the game, even without power creep. In 3.5 the problems was basically that mostly everything for the DM (i.e. adventures) was built assuming the core rules only, and many challenges were often easily outdone by new crunch for the players the authors never accounted for.
That said, I still look forward to the APG, and I trust Paizo to do a good job with it.
Frankly I don't understand this aversion to new base classes. Look at the excitement generated by the playtest of the APG and the upcoming Magus. Why not more?Fear of power creep, of archetypal classes being outdone, etc.. Completely understandable in some cases ( Beguiler! ), in other cases a new class can fill a niche which was unoccupied or insufficiently occupied ( Scout as a mobile skirmisher ).
That I understand but more base classes does not equal power creep. We should have faith in Paizo
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So to continue with rampant speculations what do people think will be the first AP for 2012? I like the Worldwound idea.
I've been fighting for a Mendev/Worldwould based mass battle AP ala something out of the Heroes of Battle supplement for a while now. Would love to see it Feb 2012. The mass combat rules in Kingmaker were a good start but definitely need to be expanded on in either a full article or even a companion book or something.
Especially I like from the Heroes of Battle the idea of running a mass battle as a dungeon rather than as a single encounter. A medieval battle is generally a rather long event with plenty of opportunity for small player group sized encounters within it all aiding the greater battle.
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There's a ton of goodies to be found in a Mendevian Crusades adventure path. The crusades, inquisitions, demon hordes and other forms of demonic presence, Heroes of Battle-style adventuring, Mendev, the Worldwound, celestials, demons, profiteers, religious zeal, gritty Warhammeresque battles...the list goes on and on.
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So to continue with rampant speculations what do people think will be the first AP for 2012? I like the Worldwound idea.I've been fighting for a Mendev/Worldwould based mass battle AP ala something out of the Heroes of Battle supplement for a while now. Would love to see it Feb 2012. The mass combat rules in Kingmaker were a good start but definitely need to be expanded on in either a full article or even a companion book or something.
Especially I like from the Heroes of Battle the idea of running a mass battle as a dungeon rather than as a single encounter. A medieval battle is generally a rather long event with plenty of opportunity for small player group sized encounters within it all aiding the greater battle.
I haven't read the mass battle rules from Kingmaker yet, so I can't comment there. But I agree with you 100% about the Heroes of Battle approach of running a battle like a dungeon.
For those unfamiliar with HoB, "running like a dungeon" means seeding various managable encounters for the hero PCs to accomplish while battle rages all around them. Encounters might include destroying a bridge which was your enemy's route for transporting food and equipment to their troops; protecting a messenger so that he can deliver a crucial message into or out of the warzone; infiltrating the enemy camp to rescue a captured general; not taking on the whole army, but taking out key individuals, such as a spellcaster guarding a mountain pass, or an enemy messenger to gain important information; etc.
The idea is much less one army vs another army facing each other off on a large battlemat, and much more run like a traditional adventure where each encounter adds victory points which contribute to your army's overall progress in battle.
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Frankly I don't understand this aversion to new base classes. Look at the excitement generated by the playtest of the APG and the upcoming Magus. Why not more?I'm just not a fan of class bloat. Personally, the only one of the new classes I see a "need" for is the oracle, as we don't have a spontaneous divine caster yet. It makes sense to have one. The cavalier, summoner, and witch are very specialized forms of base classes. The alchemist is a weird class that somehow comes out of left field, and I don't get the role of the inquisitor at all. And I especially don't think the magus as a class is necessary - to me, the eldritch knight is good enough for that concept, but that's already been discussed ad nauseam.
I generally like what I've seen so far with the new APG classes. They're not all for me, eg I don't really see the need for a cavalier, but the point is that different classes will appeal to different players, and if the concept of a cavalier appeals to another player, then it's good for them. For example, the witch class inspired me to build a character I don't think I ever would have using any of the core classes. While the mechanics might be similar - hey it's just another spellcaster - often its the detail that can spur the imagination and build the flavour.
Archetypes and other class options to be found in the APG may very well sway my opinion on base classes for oriental characters, particularly if in the next 12 months we start seeing players identifying their characters at the table not as "Hi I'm Trevish, a Chelish halfling rogue" but "Hi I'm Trevish, a Chelish halfling sniper", ie if archetypes transcend the base classes they're hung on, and take on an identity of their own. It's like learning a new language - it only feels natural once you stop translating things over from your mother-tongue.
James, if we didn't rampantly speculate we would give the internet a bad name. :)
ALSO: This rampant speculation is pretty much the #1 reason we tightly control when we reveal adventure path titles and plots. It's hard to manage expectations and provide any sort of preview material when we don't have solid footing ourselves to talk about things. We ONLY JUST announced "Carrion Crown," and haven't even released the first Serpent's Skull yet. Give us some time. We'll get to what's coming next in a while. Probably in about six months.
That´s right. We do this "rampant speculation" because we love Paizo products and the APs and because we CAN DO IT! :)
Uhm... Carrion Crown will be about a ruler in Ustalav, who raises armies of the dead to conquer the region and sets free Tar-Baphon. Right? ;)
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Personally I think Carrion Crown looks really cool but hey it's a Pathfinder Adventure Path, They are all pretty cool so far.
I pretty much guarantee that whatever the paizo folks come up with will be very interesting.
At the moment I am agonising about whether to run Serpent's Skull or Kingmaker next. Frankly that's a good quandry to have.
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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So to continue with rampant speculations what do people think will be the first AP for 2012? I like the Worldwound idea.I've been fighting for a Mendev/Worldwould based mass battle AP ala something out of the Heroes of Battle supplement for a while now. Would love to see it Feb 2012. The mass combat rules in Kingmaker were a good start but definitely need to be expanded on in either a full article or even a companion book or something.
Especially I like from the Heroes of Battle the idea of running a mass battle as a dungeon rather than as a single encounter. A medieval battle is generally a rather long event with plenty of opportunity for small player group sized encounters within it all aiding the greater battle.
Count me in on the "Mendev/Worldwound" AP. I sketched out a general plotline you could use for one months back over here. That's just one way it could go, but any way you slice it I think it would be awesome.
Perhaps this could be something plotted out to release alongside an updated book on cities, kingdoms, and mass combat.