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On the plane ride home from PaizoCon last weekend, I spent some time rereading the Core Rulebook from the beginning. As I was reading the bard's class ability descriptions, I had an image of a character using those abilities in a monastery setting.
There's nothing saying a bard can't show religious fervor and dedicate his abilities to singing and oratory, providing a monastery with excellent sermons and musical inspiration.
The Inspire competence ability conveyed via Gregorian-style chanting could improve the quality of illuminated manuscripts, especially if the monastery were crafted to allow the bard's song to flow through the halls for all to hear.
It strikes me as a good alternative to creating a whole new class to create something more akin to the Medieval monk (rather than a cleric or the martial arts oriented monk).
Has anyone else thought of doing this or actually tried it?
Haven't thought of it but it should work fine. The bard is pigeon hold by most gamers into one style where it does not have to be. Nothing in the rules keeps it from being your monk or a marshal, mystic warrior or any of 1000 other concepts that are not a singing minstrel. I say run with it.
Oh but it can, say for an AP or game with a long running story arc. You could always have a reason why, you just need to know what kinda game your making him for is all.
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I suppose you're right, shadow! In the right campaign, most anything's possible. An urban-based campaign like that would be neat.
Interestingly enough, I also noticed that "The Name of the Rose" was listed in the Gamemastery Guide as a source of inspiration. I like the idea of such character helping to uncover a mystery, either in a monastery or cathedral or anywhere else nearby.
Dangit...I wish I had time to do this, now.
And thanks, Sozin! Let us know how it works out for you.
You know, not all medieval monks were cloistered. The mendicant orders were skilled orators and could be both bawdy and rowdy, preaching in the streets in a manner designed to appeal to the common people.
I think the monkish bard sounds like a really cool concept and would love to see how it works out in play.
You know, not all medieval monks were cloistered. The mendicant orders were skilled orators and could be both bawdy and rowdy, preaching in the streets in a manner designed to appeal to the common people.
I think the monkish bard sounds like a really cool concept and would love to see how it works out in play.
Referred to as friars. Nice idea. Non cloistered, wondering. Friar Tuck for example in Robin Hood. Hard time seeing him sing (I'm thinking the Errol Flynn version), but a good chant, that I can see :)
The Friar Tuck example is a good one, too. He did sing songs in the Kevin Costner version of Robin Hood. They were mostly about beer, if I recall. ;-)
Still, the idea of the bard belting out hymns of praise and inspiration or chanting ancient songs works well.
Well, every good setting should have a god of beer :D
And monks are known for being good at brewing, too. Actually Friar Tuck makes more sense as a bard than as a cleric anyway.
And monks are known for being good at brewing, too. Actually Friar Tuck makes more sense as a bard than as a cleric anyway.
I have friars in my game and the Cleric was never the best fit for the role. I'm "Pathfinderizing" my campaign now and this looks like a really good fit for the role they have in my game. Thank you all for the evolution of the idea. I'm going to take a peek at the spell list and mull it over...
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I think a bard as a cloistered monk sounds like a great idea. Its allot of fun to think out of the box when it comes to character classes. Currently i have an inquisitor of Iomedae. the character isn't an inquisitor, but a sherif. I thought the Inquisitor class would make an excellent lawman. I have modeled the character after Hugh Berenger from the Brother Cadfael mystery series.
I think changing the thief to Rogue was a great move, it allowed for much more character concepts to work.
On a similar note I wish that Pathfinder had changed the "monk" oriental, class to "marital artist". One of the real drawbacks of calling the class "monk" is that people first think of the orange robed ones. if they called the class martial artist there would be room for lots more character concepts.
I have begun to ramble. All in all, excellent idea for having a bard as a cloistered monk.
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I think a bard as a cloistered monk sounds like a great idea. Its allot of fun to think out of the box when it comes to character classes. Currently i have an inquisitor of Iomedae. the character isn't an inquisitor, but a sherif. I thought the Inquisitor class would make an excellent lawman. I have modeled the character after Hugh Berenger from the Brother Cadfael mystery series.
I think changing the thief to Rogue was a great move, it allowed for much more character concepts to work.
On a similar note I wish that Pathfinder had changed the "monk" oriental, class to "marital artist". One of the real drawbacks of calling the class "monk" is that people first think of the orange robed ones. if they called the class martial artist there would be room for lots more character concepts.
I have begun to ramble. All in all, excellent idea for having a bard as a cloistered monk.
I agree, Elyas. Doing this with classes is very much like what Sean K Reynolds has been advocating with his "filing off the serial numbers" posts on Facebook (for quick and easy ways to use monsters in different roles). Paizo has been encouraging us to "play with our food" for some time now and I like where the process is taking my creative thinking.
As an aside, though...I think "marital artist" might be a class for a different kind of book, don't you? I think that would require a very different group of abilities. ;p
reminds me of the "crazy southern preacher" bard I wanted to make. "OH BROTHERS AND SISTERS, TODAY YA GONNA RAISE TO YO FEET, YA GONNA REACH UP TA THE SUN, AND YOU GONNA PASS THOSE SKILL CHECKS, WHO'S WITH ME?!? PRAISE BE TO CAYDEN CAILEAN"
The flip side being my Nathan Explosion Gnome Bard idea, deathmetal singing, deep voice, actual battle axe enchanted to sound like an electric guitar when played, to shred both on and off the battlefield I've been wanting to use that guy hehehe
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Paris Crenshaw, thanks for taking the time to respond to my post. As for a “ marital artist” being an entirely different class? Perhaps. I just think the name of the class namely “monk” is miss leading.
When a Thief was a Thief one only thought of members of a guild. When a thief became a rogue, people readily applied more character concepts to it, like diplomat, intelligence agent, merchant, thief, and yes possibly lawman.
When one says monk one is immediately drawn to oriental ideas of shao lin monks, something like that.
Where as a monk character class could easily be an agent, lawman, gladiator, thug, there are lots of possibilities. This would especially be the case if they removed the lawful alignment requirement.
I just think a name change would help facilitate this.
Then we could call our “cloistered clerics” monks, which they are after all.
Speaking of cloistered clerics from the Unearthed Arcana book that might be a place to look for a more scholarly monk as opposed to a martial monk. I believe there is another “priest” class in the tome of secrets as well.
But I digress I still like your idea of a bard as a cloistered monk who illuminates manuscripts and sings. May I copy your excellent idea?
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May I copy your excellent idea?
Oh, absolutely! Please feel free. I imagine I'm not the first to come up with the idea, anyway.
And I totally get what you're saying about the "monk" class name. I was actually just making a bad joke on your typo ("marital artist" vs. "martial artist"). Sorry...I couldn't help myself.
I've seen the cloistered cleric from UA and I seem to recall a priest class from a couple of sources...one of the Fantasy Flight books had a Village Priest class, that I found interesting, as well.
What I find most appealing about using the bard is that I can do so without going outside of the core rules and further multiplying the number of classes in my games.
It's important to note that medieval monks could actually be incredibly hardcore. It wasn't uncommon for them to journey across the map from monastery to monastery, making copies of books that his own monastery didn't have to bring back, and promising the monks at each place for the same service in return. And those roads weren't known for their safety and civility.
So yeah, there were a lot of stay-at-home monks, but there were also monks that were more similar to Indiana Jones then Friar Tuck.
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Thank you Paris Crenshaw, I may steal away. As you may guess, i am not the best of spellers, and I use the spell checker to well check my spelling. Ha Marital artist vs Martial artist I could not have done that if i tried.
Also you made a very good point about the bard. you have not strayed from the core rules and don't have to get it approved.
Professor Cirno, another good point. monks going from monastery to monastery collecting and copying books to distribute. what an excellent idea for a another character concept.
On another note, I wonder how the inquisitor might fit into all of this?
Many monks also joined the order late in life. I believe Sean Connery's character in The Name of the Rose says something to the effect of "I wasn't always a monk, you know." PBS's Mystery series also had a great character, Cadfael, who joined the monestary after returning from the crusades. Apparently, its a book series too. I think he would make a great Inquisitor. wikipedia
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Caineach, I happen to be a big fand of the Brother Cadfael murder mystery books, and the PBS mystery series
here is my Pathfinder organized play character
Hugh Berenger, Inquisitor of Iomaedae level 3
Strength 14
Dexterity 14
Constitution 10
Intelegence 14
Wisdom 16
Charisma 10
Weapons:
Long sword: +4 to hit 1d8+2 damage
Long bow: +5 to hit 1d8 damage
Morning Star: +4 to hit 1d8 +2 damage
Skills: Bluff +5, Climb +7, Diplomacy +5, Intimidate +6, Knowledge arcana, dungeoneering, Nature, Planes: +7/10, Perception +8, Profession Town Watch / Bounty hunter +8, Sence Motive +9, Stealth +7, Survival +10, Swim +7
Feats: Point blank shot, Precise shot, Weapon focus: Long bow
Teamwork feat: lookout
Tratis Explorer (andoran), Armor expert
Cleric domain: war- battle rage
Spells known
Osirions: acid splash creat water, disrupt undead, light, stableize, detect poison
1st level : Cure light wounds, Magic weapon, Protection from Evil, True Strike