I have a player that just created a 9th level Sorcerer and selected the Elemental Bloodline. Now never having played a Sorcerer in Pathfinder yet I find I have a couple of questions that I have been unable to find answers for. If there is no official answer that is fine I will make one for us.
Here is my question, at 3rd level a Sorcerer gains the bonus spell Burning Hands. However, he cannot cast a 2nd level spell yet until he reaches 4th character level. So does the Bonus Bloodline spell count against his 1st level Spells Per Day count or is it a total freebie?
If it is a total freebie is there any restrictions on number of uses per day?
It appears that all of the Bonus Bloodline Spells are granted a level before they are available normally. I understand they are not counted against the Spells Known.
I am not trying to start an argument nor incite a riot. Just want a logical answer or at least a suggestion on how to handle this. Thank you for your time.
If this has been answered elsewhere please post where and delete this thread.
I think you may be reading something wrong. Burning hands is a 1st level spell, not a 2nd level one. What other bonus bloodline spells are you seeing that are gained a level too early?
having just looked at the sorcerer bonus spell lists, i must admit i cant find any given to early. So the spell would just count against his normal total
You are correct I did misread the Burning Hands spell, and the other bonus spells. However, that still brings to mind how are the bonus spells counted? Are they counted against his Spells Per Day count or are they freebies? If they are level appropriate spells as it appears then I think they should count against his Spells Per Day slots.
Yes, I understand they are "in addition to" Spells Known. That is not my question. I will decide that the Bonus Bloodline Spells still count as a use of his daily allotment of spell slots. Thank you all for your time and consideration.
Yes, I understand they are "in addition to" Spells Known. That is not my question. I will decide that the Bonus Bloodline Spells still count as a use of his daily allotment of spell slots. Thank you all for your time and consideration.
That is how it's supposed to be. The bonus spells are just additional spells that the sorcerer knows how to cast; it does not give him additional uses per day. Just add them to his repetoire of spells.
DogBone
I think I can see the RAW here, but would appreciate confirmation, if not a thought or two of explanation.
Sorcerer elemental bloodline bonus spells reads
"Bonus Spells: burning hands* (3rd), scorching ray* (5th), protection from energy (7th), elemental body I (9th), elemental body II (11th), elemental body III (13th), elemental body IV (15th), summon monster VIII (elementals only) (17th), elemental swarm (19th).
*These spells always deal a type of damage determined by your element. In addition, the subtype of these spells changes to match the energy type of your element."
There are no asterisks for Protection from Energy, nor the elemental body spells. So if I have a sorcerer who has chosen fire for his element, he can cast Protection from Energy for ANY energy type? And he can cast water elemental body just as easily as fire elemental body?
It just seems strange. "Aha! I will now use my mastery of fire to give myself a body of elemental earth!" Perhaps I'm missing something.
Correct. No asterisk or other qualifier, no problem. Play it however you think your character would, though. My goblin can technically ride a horse or pony, but he doesn't do so unless his life is on the line, and he still considers eating one of his party's mounts when he gets sick of trail rations.
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Looking at this as a "bonus" is what puzzles me. Why would I not take burning hands at first level anyways if I'm a fire elemental sorcerer? It seems stupid to go through 3 levels without it just so you can add it for free later on.
Because it doesn't do enough until 3rd level, anyhow?
More seriously, you can take it at first, get it as a bonus spell at 3rd, then retrain the version you learned at 1st level into a different 1st level spell at 4th level. Or use the UCam retraining rules at 3rd level to retrain it, so you don't have the wasted level.
Looking at this as a "bonus" is what puzzles me. Why would I not take burning hands at first level anyways if I'm a fire elemental sorcerer? It seems stupid to go through 3 levels without it just so you can add it for free later on.
It's a pretty simple fix for us. If you take a 'bonus spell' early then at the appropriate level you can take any spell you like. If you take Burning Hands at 1st level then at third level he can select any first level spell in its place.
Looking at this as a "bonus" is what puzzles me. Why would I not take burning hands at first level anyways if I'm a fire elemental sorcerer? It seems stupid to go through 3 levels without it just so you can add it for free later on.
You might not like that particular spell, or you may not rate it high enough to take that early.