Hey people,
I'm putting a fighter together and I was wondering what other people thought. I know it s simple class the fighter but I feel as though with the Armor and Weapon training it makes it abit more dynamic.
Heres the basic idea
Full Name Brend Reidar "Little Raven Warrior"
Race Human - Shoanti Skoan Quah Tribe
Classes/Levels Fighter/1
Gender Male
Size Medium
Age 18
Special Abilities None
Alignment Chaotic Neutral
Deity
Location The Cinderlands
Languages Common, Shoanti, Cheilaxian
Occupation Nomad
Strength 18
Dexterity 18
Constitution 14
Intelligence 14
Wisdom 17
Charisma 15
Feats: Weapon Focus: Earthbreaker
Weapon Focus: Klar
Two Weapon Fighting
2nd lvl feat: Thunder and Fang ( curse of the crimson throne book 4 pg 29 )
3rd: Improved Shield Bash
4th: Weapon Specialization: Earthbreaker
5th: Weapon Specialization: Klar
6th: Shield Bash
7th: Double Slice
8th: Shield Focus
9th: Greater Shield Focus
10th: Improved Two Weapon Fighting
11th: Shield Master
ect ect...
3rd: Improved Shield Bash
6th: Shield Bash
Is your character a very quick study? :)
I don't have Patherfinder #10 on me at the moment, but doesn't Thunder and Fang require Weapon Spec. for both earthbreakers and klars before you can take it?
I thought it did, but it's been a LONG time since I've read over that feat.
New Feat: Thunder and Fang
You have mastered the ancient Shoanti fighting style of
Thunder and Fang, allowing you to fight with increased
effectiveness when wielding an earth breaker and a klar. As
you swing at foes with Thunder (your earth breaker), you
slash at them with the Fang (your klar).
Prerequisites: Str 15, Two-Weapon Fighting, Weapon
Focus (earth breaker), Weapon Focus (klar)
Benefit: As long as you are fighting with an earth
breaker and a klar (and you make attacks with your klar as
your offhand attack), you can fight with both weapons as if
you were wielding a double weapon, and retain your shield
bonus to your Armor Class granted by your klar. Treat your
klar as a light weapon for the purposes of determining
your total penalty to attack.
Special: A fighter may select Thunder and Fang as one
of his fighter bonus feats.
3rd: Improved Shield Bash
6th: Shield BashIs your character a very quick study? :)
I thought it would be a change of pace since majority of the time that I see someone play a fighter its always Two Handers or Two Weapons. Though a traditional (loose usage) sword and board would be nice to see.
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I don't have Patherfinder #10 on me at the moment, but doesn't Thunder and Fang require Weapon Spec. for both earthbreakers and klars before you can take it?
I thought it did, but it's been a LONG time since I've read over that feat.
New Feat: Thunder and Fang
words
Hell yeah, then! Let me know how it works out. I've been wanting to play a Thunder and Fanger barbarian for a while now! :)
I thought it would be a change of pace since majority of the time that I see someone play a fighter its always Two Handers or Two Weapons. Though a traditional (loose usage) sword and board would be nice to see.3rd: Improved Shield Bash
6th: Shield BashIs your character a very quick study? :)
I think Stormraven is trying to point out that you took Improved shield bash before you took shield bash.
Hes got his feats in the right order, he just misnamed Shield Bash when it should be Shield Slam.
Theres no shield bash feat, that just comes with wielding a shield. Improved Shield Bash would let him keep his shield to AC when bashing. Shield Slam gives him the free Bull Rush when bashing.
Hes got his feats in the right order, he just misnamed Shield Bash when it should be Shield Slam.
Theres no shield bash feat, that just comes with wielding a shield. Improved Shield Bash would let him keep his shield to AC when bashing. Shield Slam gives him the free Bull Rush when bashing.
Yes, my mistake. I did more then glance at the feat but I do tend to get names wrong now and then.
In my opinion with this particular setup, its starts becmong over powered after 11th lvl due to no penalty while fighting with a shield. Though I could be wrong as well. In my mind that tells me two weapon fighting no longer gives me the penalty as long as my off hand is a shield.
Thought I'd finished the feat progression, hopefully I have them all named correctly.
12th: Greater Weapon Specialization Earthbreaker
13th: Greater Weapon Specialization Klar
14th: Greater Weapon Focus Klar
15th: Penetrating Strike
16th: Greater Penetrating Strike
17th: Greater Two Weapon Fighting
18th: Power Attack
19th: Improved Overrun
20th: Greater Overrun
Hed two feats I like but I'm on the fence about due to they are in the beta edition, Overhand Chop and Backhand Swing
Looking at the Thunder and Fang feat, it seems that it lets you a) wield the Earthbreaker as a one-handed weapon so long as you also weilding a klar, and b) keep your klar's shield bonus to AC while wielding an Earthbreaker, even if you attack with the klar.
In essence, Thunder and Fang duplicates the effects of Improved Shield bash with the klar. Although if you want Shield Slam, you'll need to take Improved Shield Bash anyways.
The klar is treated as a light weapon normally as well as when using this feat. Thus, when you attack with both weapons using TWF you take a -2 penalty on attacks with both weapons. Thunder and Fang doesn't remove this penalty. Shield Master would remove it for the klar but not the Earthbreaker.
If you are looking at shield bashing, definitely get Improved and Greater Bull Rush. This makes your slams much better, and Greater Bull Rush makes any movement you cause against a foe due to your bull rushing shield slam provoke attacks of opportunities from your allies (but not you). This provides a huge tactical benefit to your build.
You might want to reconsider the Shield Focus feats. They don't stack with the Shield Master feat, according to the designers (i.e. the +2 from Greater Shield Focus won't add to attack and damage with the shield); however your DM might let them. Otherwise, dodge is a better feat investment as it will boost your touch AC and CMD where shield focus will not.
You don't have Power Attack in your build anywhere. I'd definitely want that so that you can dish the damage out against lower AC opponents. Otherwise you will be stuck doing just base damage all the time.
If it was me, I'd keep your first 11 feats the same except for the feats in 7, 8, 9, and 10; I'd take Power Attack, Imp Bull Rush, Grtr Bull Rush, and Imp TWF. Not necessarily in that order but I'd want them all by 10th.
Hes got his feats in the right order, he just misnamed Shield Bash when it should be Shield Slam.
Theres no shield bash feat, that just comes with wielding a shield. Improved Shield Bash would let him keep his shield to AC when bashing. Shield Slam gives him the free Bull Rush when bashing.
I don't use shields so I'm not too familiar with all the shield feats. That was my fault for not pulling out the book to check up on that.
Thanks!
If it was me, I'd keep your first 11 feats the same except for the feats in 7, 8, 9, and 10; I'd take Power Attack, Imp Bull Rush, Grtr Bull Rush, and Imp TWF. Not necessarily in that order but I'd want them all by 10th.
Bull Rush or Overrun?
Bull Rush is a nice idea though if all I'm doing is basically pushing them away then my party memebers as well myself would always have to move every round. Not saying thats a bad thing but, Bull rush allows my party AOO were as Overrun allows me a AOO, and being one of the Dmg dealers of the party it sounds better in my head at least.
7th: Power Attack
8th: Improved Overrun
9th: Greater Overrun
10th: Improved Two Weapon Fighting
11th: Shield Master
Yeah but don't forget that if you shield bash someone you get a free bull rush attempt against them thanks to the Shield Slam feat. So you get to whack them a bunch of times with your Earthbreaker, then slice them with the klar and push them away from you (possibly provoking AoOs from your teammates). Then they will have to move in order to close with you. So you can get full attacks and they can only get one.
Plus with overrun you have to move, so that you can't take advantage of all your TWF/shield feats.
Ah alright now I understand.
Noticed I may change ouf some of the upper end feats as well Crit Focus and Bleeding Crit looks kinda nice. The bleeding crit though would it stack with a Rogues Bleed as well? I know I know off topic but still a feasible question.
Strength 18
Dexterity 18
Constitution 14
Intelligence 14
Wisdom 17
Charisma 15
Are you kidding me? There's no way that you rolled that or used any point by system in the book to get those scores. If you want to re-examine your character, perhaps re-examine the fact that he has the attribute scores of a god?
Strength 18
Dexterity 18
Constitution 14
Intelligence 14
Wisdom 17
Charisma 15Are you kidding me? There's no way that you rolled that or used any point by system in the book to get those scores. If you want to re-examine your character, perhaps re-examine the fact that he has the attribute scores of a god?
Actually he could have rolled it... it's just not a highly likely senerio... and gods are typically sitting on stats of "Yes"... usually in the range of 40+ as starting points.
Are you kidding me? There's no way that you rolled that or used any point by system in the book to get those scores.
He could've rolled it. He could've used a stat gen system not in a book. He could've just written down numbers. I've done that before. "Hmm, I think my character should have a 9 Intelligence and an 18 Wisdom." Once, ages ago while home on leave, I played in a 1st-level 1E one-shot. We used 4d6 arranged to taste. I rolled in front of the DM and the other players three 18s. (I forget the other rolls.) They went into Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution. (I also forget what I rolled for exceptional Strength.) Then, I stuck him in studded leather armor and fought with a trident. That was a great game.
Zerumm: My only advice is to avoid making your character too much of a one-trick pony, especially one dependent on certain pieces of equipment. Your build invests a lot into shields. How much do you lose if you also lose your shield?
Zerumm: My only advice is to avoid making your character too much of a one-trick pony, especially one dependent on certain pieces of equipment. Your build invests a lot into shields. How much do you lose if you also lose your shield?
My advice as well. You get plenty of offense from Power Attack and weapon training. Maybe trade Weapon Spec, etc, for feats that give you more variety in options? Feats like Lunge, Stand Still, Combat Reflexes, or some ranged expertise? One of my personal favorites is Quickdraw and being good with both a melee weapon and ranged weapon. Not sure how that would work with the klar though, unless you used javelins/spears/throwing axes.
Ok, on the matter of stats, there was a roll but its was made by my GM and everyone int he group had to go by this roll for creation. the numbers are: 18,17,16,15,14,14
As for my particulatre build its 16/18(+2for Human,18,15,14,17,14. I oppted for better dex rather then go with 20 Str in the begining granted that would still be handy.
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In the subject of being seen as a one trick pony. My reasoning for doing that is mainly unless I pigeon hole myself like that I tend to be all over the map so to speak for feats. I tend to lose focus on a build to quickly and end up being unhappy either way.
The up side to that I can focus on that one thing and exploi....find its maximum potential. The down side yes if I somehow lose either item I'm for the most part screwed. But being a fighter, if I get a weapon in my hands I can manage for the most part. Though I'm not trying to say cool I have my build Earthbreaker and Klar hmm >shrug, toss weapons< whats next. Your most likely right about taking some feats outside of the build and it will raise my survivability a couple notches.
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Well you can always switch out some of the item specific feats. Granted you need WF for both the Earthbreaker and the klar in order to take Thunder and Fang. But the ones after that might be a little overkill, especially since your weapon training will be giving nice boosts anyways. I am a big fan of extra to-hit and damage bonuses, but a little more rounded abilities might be just as good. Crit feats aren't bad and they work with any weapon (except for Improved Crit), same with other combat maneuver abilites. Or even a saving throw feat to boost those.
I think Crit focus and Bleeding critical would probably result in just as much extra damage as would Weapon Spec/Grt Weapon Spec on the klar. Especially with all the extra attacks from TWF, since you'll be getting a lot more critical chances.
Ok then how about this build
1st: Weapon Focus: Earthbreaker
Weapon Focus: Klar
Two Two Weapon Fighting
2nd: Thunder and Fang
3rd: Power Attack
4th: Weapon Specialization: Klar
5th: Improved Shield Bash
6th: Shield Slam
7th: Improved Bull Rush
8th: Greater Bull Rush
9th: Improved Two Weapon Fighting
10th: Double Slice
11th: Shield Master
12th: Two Weapon Rend
13th: Point Blank Shot
14th: Precise Shot
15th: Greater Weapon Specialization: Klar
16th: Penatrating Strike
17th: Greater Penetrating Strike
18th: Vital Strike
19th: Improved Vital Strike
20th: Greater Vital Strike
I understand dipping into ranged attack feats, everyone needs a backup plan.. but why Precise Shot? If there's melee combat taking place, shouldn't you be a part of it?
I understand dipping into ranged attack feats, everyone needs a backup plan.. but why Precise Shot? If there's melee combat taking place, shouldn't you be a part of it?
Precise shot is almost mandatory if you are going ranged at all. That -4 to hurts.
I understand dipping into ranged attack feats, everyone needs a backup plan.. but why Precise Shot? If there's melee combat taking place, shouldn't you be a part of it?
Rationaly yes I should but thats not always a option in the games I seem to join.
Ok then how about this build
1st: Weapon Focus: Earthbreaker
Weapon Focus: Klar
Two Two Weapon Fighting2nd: Thunder and Fang
3rd: Power Attack
4th: Weapon Specialization: Klar
5th: Improved Shield Bash
6th: Shield Slam
7th: Improved Bull Rush
8th: Greater Bull Rush
9th: Improved Two Weapon Fighting
10th: Double Slice
11th: Shield Master
12th: Two Weapon Rend
13th: Point Blank Shot
14th: Precise Shot
15th: Greater Weapon Specialization: Klar
16th: Penatrating Strike
17th: Greater Penetrating Strike
18th: Vital Strike
19th: Improved Vital Strike
20th: Greater Vital Strike
Hmm, I'd recommend the following order:
1) Weapon Focus: Earthbreaker, Weapon Focus: Klar, Two-Weapon Fighting
2) Thunder and Fang
3) Improved Shield Bash
4) Double Slice
5) Shield Slam
At this point, your character concept seems pretty nailed down to me. After that, I'd keep a list of feats I'm thinking of (obviously including the later ones you have here) and choose those that seem most campaign appropriate as you rise in level. You may find you might want to boost your saves, or your defense, or your hit points, or your utility. It's hard to say what would ultimately be best according to your campaign and your group's style of play. In general, I find that the most useful feats tend to be the "boring" ones (Improved Initiative, Toughness, Iron Will, Dodge, etc.) As a case in point, the last campaign I participated in as a player (using 3.5… I've only GMed Pathfinder), I played a fighter. I always seemed to be getting grappled. Close-Quarters Fighting (a 3.5 feat) put an end to that.
I'm suggesting the particular order, so that you get the most out of two-weapon fighting AND retaining your shield bonus to AC as soon as possible. Double Slice trumps Weapon Spec: Klar slightly overall (same bonus damage with potential for more or if you find yourself with another off-hand weapon in hand). Shield Slam earlier, since if gives you a nice free extra to an attack sequence you'll be doing often.
Hmm, I'd recommend the following order:
1) Weapon Focus: Earthbreaker, Weapon Focus: Klar, Two-Weapon Fighting
2) Thunder and Fang
3) Improved Shield Bash
4) Double Slice
5) Shield Slam
At this point, your character concept seems pretty nailed down to me. After that, I'd keep a list of feats I'm thinking of (obviously including the later ones you have here) and choose those that seem most campaign appropriate as you rise in level. You may find you might want to boost your saves, or your defense, or your hit points, or your utility. It's hard to say what would ultimately be best according to your campaign and your group's style of play. In general, I find that the most useful feats tend to be the "boring" ones (Improved Initiative, Toughness, Iron Will, Dodge, etc.) As a case in point, the last campaign I participated in as a player (using 3.5… I've only GMed Pathfinder), I played a fighter. I always seemed to be getting grappled. Close-Quarters Fighting (a 3.5 feat) put an end to that.
I'm suggesting the particular order, so that you get the most out of two-weapon fighting AND retaining your shield bonus to AC as soon as possible. Double Slice trumps Weapon Spec: Klar slightly overall (same bonus damage with potential for more or if you find yourself with another off-hand weapon in hand). Shield Slam earlier,...
With that order I agree only thing is no shield slam till 6 BAB no I need to fill that slot for 5th so perhaps Overhand chop (in beta) Allows 2 times str on a 2HW swing instead of 1 1/2 str. then at 7th Backhand swing so I can get mutiple attacks and still get Overhand chop's bonus.