As am I. It is nice to know there are some sane people is this city of ours. :)
You desribed me to a jot and tittle. Glad there's more of us in this cowtown. :P
Just wish there was more of them out there on the road today. I think they were staying at home as most sensibly sane individuals do. There's a lot of people traipsing the outerbelt alone that need their drivers license revoked. :P
<recites mantra> Tomorrow is humpday tomorrow is humpday. </recites mantra>
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Wow. I'm more of a fiscal moderate, but I really agree with your...
Thanks. I think if I was pressed I would likely compromise when it comes to fiscal matters. I can see value in having certain programs sponsored by the government. It wouldn't take long to convince me of the need for governmental school funding, for instance, as it is one of those subjects I can easily move on. I feel strongly about our nation's need to adequately educate its populace.
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More or less +2, but I would add that access to a good education and sufficient health care should fall under the protection of the federal government.
I can be convinced of that, certainly. I am a bit skittish with health care but after spending the last 9 years without benefits of any kind I am able to lean on that subject.
I can see value in continuing to publicly fund schools so long as a few reforms are thrown in for good measure. Though I am not sure if that would make things worse or better.
Incidentally, when I was in high school, a fellow student of mine was heavily involved with the school equity funding suit in Ohio. That event helped me better understand the nature of education in Ohio and it made me seriously consider how our schools operate. It drove me towards education as a serious career choice.
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Just wish there was more of them out there on the road today. I think they were staying at home as most sensibly sane individuals do. There's a lot of people traipsing the outerbelt alone that need their drivers license revoked. :P
<recites mantra> Tomorrow is humpday tomorrow is humpday. </recites mantra>
I agree entirely. Having driven in many cities across this nation, including Boston, I have to say Columbus drivers are just a pain in the butt to deal with. While other cities might be able to claim the title for rudest drivers, Columbus can clearly claim the ultimate title for stupid and thoughtless drivers.
I agree entirely. Having driven in many cities across this nation, including Boston, I have to say Columbus drivers are just a pain in the butt to deal with. While other cities might be able to claim the title for rudest drivers, Columbus can clearly claim the ultimate title for stupid and thoughtless drivers.
Well, once they get off their druthers and get the I-71/I-70 mess started and completed and address issues with I-70/I-270/Brice and SR315/I-270/US23, then it won't be so bad.
And, somehow, his contribution to the National Debt seems quaint after eight years of Bush, and Obama tripling Bush in ten months...
Admitting having voted for the guy, the fiscal policy has been driving me nuts. There had better be a light at the end of the tunnel with all of these prop-ups and their implied returns of potential profit or I'm going to stew a little. I know things take time and I can be patient, but instead of the audacity of hope, I'd like to see the fruits of those promises.
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That's about me as well, but I tend to sound a lot more conservative over the Interwebz than I actually am. In my view the government should be out of both the boardroom and the bedroom. Let people live the life they want, don't throw up a morass of bureaucracy and try to live a little frugally.
Exactly.
Capitalism is wonderful. But one of the pitfalls of capitalism is the fact some businesses will simply fail. Stepping in to save those companies is contrary to that ideal. But then free market capitalism hasn't been seen in recent decades so the bailouts are unsurprising.
I truly believe frugal living is key for the government and its populace. We need to learn how to do without, as it were. And constantly spending money while simultaneously placing us in serious debt with one of our major competitors on the world stage is not a good way to rejuvenate this country.
Edit: I should note, that I am happy some jobs were preserved with those bailouts. I hope it didn't just delay that loss of jobs and that it truly re-invigorates those business who got the money. I know how much of a nightmare being laid off can be as I have been jobless for over a year after the program I worked with was shut down.
frugal living? <shudder> But I need all of my Paizo crack.
:P
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I agree entirely. Having driven in many cities across this nation, including Boston, I have to say Columbus drivers are just a pain in the butt to deal with. While other cities might be able to claim the title for rudest drivers, Columbus can clearly claim the ultimate title for stupid and thoughtless drivers.Well, once they get off their druthers and get the I-71/I-70 mess started and completed and address issues with I-70/I-270/Brice and SR315/I-270/US23, then it won't be so bad.
Ah yes, Brice/I-70/I-270. That is definitely a nightmare. Same with the I-71/I-70 split. Living on the east side(outside of the loop), but working downtown meant I had to deal with both every day. That was one thing I didn't miss after I got laid off. :)
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Admitting having voted for the guy, the fiscal policy has been driving me nuts. There had better be a light at the end of the tunnel with all of these prop-ups and their implied returns of potential profit or I'm going to stew a little. I know things take time and I can be patient, but instead of the audacity of hope, I'd like to see the fruits of those promises.
I am right there with you. I voted for Obama and I am getting a bit frustrated with the current track. I did it because I thought he could truly do what he was saying he could do. I hope this doesn't turn out to be a great big bust as our debt mounts with no relief in sight.
Ah yes, Brice/I-70/I-270. That is definitely a nightmare. Same with the I-71/I-70 split. Living on the east side(outside of the loop), but working downtown meant I had to deal with both every day. That was one thing I didn't miss after I got laid off. :)
I live on the east side outside the loop too. I wonder if I can see your house from my front window better than Sarah can see the Ruskies from her front porch. :P
Oh well, of course. I certainly wasn't thinking about Paizo products when I said that. Or books in general for that matter. No need to go crazy and cut out the things that make life worth living. ;)frugal living? <shudder> But I need all of my Paizo crack.
:P
Should've told me that earlier when I made sad puppy faces to my woman when I wanted to stop by HPB after we left her post-op appt. An additional 20% off was hard to resist. I have more books than I know what to do with and when she told my father today what we had done, he said I should go to the library like he does. At least she's wise enough to respond that the stuff I buy are usually obscure and not necessarily found tucked neatly away within the cobbled dungeons of their dewey decimal system. :D
And, somehow, his contribution to the National Debt seems quaint after eight years of Bush, and Obama tripling Bush in ten months...
I frankly fail to understand how that changes anything. But even if it did, according to wikipedia:
"Public debt in dollars quadrupled during the Reagan and Bush presidencies from 1980 to 1992, and remained at about the same level by the end of the Clinton presidency in 2000. During the administration of President George W. Bush, the total debt increased from $5.6 trillion in January 2001 to $10.7 trillion by December 2008,[7] rising from 54% of GDP to 75% of GDP. During March 2009, the Congressional Budget Office estimated that public debt will rise from 40.8% of GDP in 2008 to 70.1% in 2012.[8] The total debt is projected to continue increasing significantly during President Obama's administration to nearly 100% of GDP, its highest level since World War II."
Making the *only* president who didn't meaningfully contribute to the debt in my adult life a "tax and spend" Democrat. Of course, it isn't as simple as "the president did it," but as I said, anyone paying attention knows both parties have zero credibility when it comes to fixing our debt problem.
Thanks. I think if I was pressed I would likely compromise when it comes to fiscal matters. I can see value in having certain programs sponsored by the government. It wouldn't take long to convince me of the need for governmental school funding, for instance, as it is one of those subjects I can easily move on. I feel strongly about our nation's need to adequately educate its populace.
Here's my deal: Some things cannot be handled by the market. There are many externalized costs that are not properly captured in the market price (tragedy of the commons). Information is imperfect. Demand for some items is almost completely inelastic (health care, for example). The market can't do everything. To me, stepping in in those cases is an appropriate function of government. That said, the profit motive is important, and there remains no better demonstrated way of allocating the tools of production than capitalism.
*cough* wikipediaiswithoutbiasoropinion *cough*
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Nice. That was amusing. :) I am old enough, for the most part. Though I was very young when he first took office, that is true.Are you old enough to remember Reagan? :POn topic, despite his flaws I do think Reagan provided more good overall. He changed the world in many key ways.
Though I am not sure I miss him as much as I miss my perception of that time. It seemed simpler somehow. But then, isn't that always how we view the past as we continue to age?
I am wondering, how old were all of us on this thread when Reagan was elected?
Who was the first president you voted for and what year?
For me, I was about 13 when he was elected, so my first election was
Bush 1 vs Dukaukis.
I voted for Dukaukis because I disliked Bush. Then I voted for Perot in 1992 cause I didn't like Bush. Thats when I learned my lesson about third parties. And I learned Bush 1 wasn't so bad after all. It's been down hill since.
Who was the first president you voted for and what year?
Bush Sr in '92. I was a registered Republican and couldn't stand Slick Willy. Changed my mind after Clinton's second term, and actually registered Democrat in '04 after Junior's first term.
*cough* wikipediaiswithoutbiasoropinion *cough*
For goodness sake; how about the CBO?
Clinton takes office ('93): 3.24 trillion
Clinton leaves office ('01): 3.31 trillion
Adjust for inflation and the increase goes away. Index to GDP and the debt goes *down.*
Or keep obfuscating.
Edit: And I'm not saying the Democrats are good! They both suck. I do think it is interesting, however, that the supposed fiscal conservatives have a much worse debt record than the liberals. The current Republican rhetoric certainly doesn't match their past behavior.
Who was the first president you voted for and what year?
I voted for Clinton in '92; I was twenty. It was a tough call; I didn't hate Bush Sr. I voted for Clinton again in '96, then voted Libertarian in disgust in '00. I voted for Kerry in '04, though to be fair I would have voted for Fozzie Bear if he had run against Bush Jr.
*cough* wikipediaiswithoutbiasoropinion *cough*For goodness sake; how about the CBO?
The CBO is full of obsfucation, rhetoric bloat, and statistical facade.
I voted for Clinton in '92; I was twenty. It was a tough call; I didn't hate Bush Sr. I voted for Clinton again in '96, then voted Libertarian in disgust in '00. I voted for Kerry in '04, though to be fair I would have voted for Fozzie Bear if he had run against Bush Jr.
Ain't that the truth. I voted for Kerry only because he wasn't Dubya.
What? Three purple hearts? Well heck. <check marks ballot, but not good enough where it left chad hanging>
I am wondering, how old were all of us on this thread when Reagan was elected?
Who was the first president you voted for and what year?
I was 13. I was a former 'kid for Carter' who watched a lot of scary crap happen in the late Seventies. I liked Reagan's style. Still do.
I voted for Bush Sr. in 1988 for my first election because I hated Dukakis (He was our governor, so I saw him up close before the race).
I did Clinton in '92 because I thought Bush Sr. was fairly inneffective. I won't pretend I saw him as noble, at the time I thought he ended up a yutzy president. Perot tempted me, but I hadn't begun my love affair with third parties yet.
'96 Clinton: Thought things were going OK, and Dole was a poor choice for the 'Pubs.
'00 Nader. What can I say? I thought that Al Gore was basically Bush Sr. (D.). I thought Bush Jr. was a sad joke. Two priviledged scions of political families duking it out. Fantabulous! Only the photo finish and all the drama afterwards even makes the campaign memorable.
'04 Badnarik. Started trending 3rd party Libertarian out of dusgust.
'08 McCain. Liked McCain, thought he might be able to work with both parties. Liked Palin too (gasp!). Didn't like Obama's platform or ideas. Would have voted Libertarian again, but, srsly, Bob Barr?
stuff
Ok; you got me, damn you. ;)
From the reading I've done on this thread it seems that there is something seriously f!*@ed up about the American political system, but I just can't put my finger on it.
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And, somehow, his contribution to the National Debt seems quaint after eight years of Bush, and Obama tripling Bush in ten months...I frankly fail to understand how that changes anything. But even if it did, according to wikipedia:
"Public debt in dollars quadrupled during the Reagan and Bush presidencies from 1980 to 1992, and remained at about the same level by the end of the Clinton presidency in 2000. During the administration of President George W. Bush, the total debt increased from $5.6 trillion in January 2001 to $10.7 trillion by December 2008,[7] rising from 54% of GDP to 75% of GDP. During March 2009, the Congressional Budget Office estimated that public debt will rise from 40.8% of GDP in 2008 to 70.1% in 2012.[8] The total debt is projected to continue increasing significantly during President Obama's administration to nearly 100% of GDP, its highest level since World War II."
Making the *only* president who didn't meaningfully contribute to the debt in my adult life a "tax and spend" Democrat. Of course, it isn't as simple as "the president did it," but as I said, anyone paying attention knows both parties have zero credibility when it comes to fixing our debt problem.
Ok, so Conservative Republican President + Liberal Democratic Congress = Bad. "Conservative" Republican President + "Conservative" Republican Congress = Bad. Liberal Democrat President with Liberal Democrat Congress = Really Bad. Moderate Democrat President + Conservative Republican Congress = Not as Bad.
Hmmm, is it too late to bring Clinton, Dole and Newt back?
From the reading I've done on this thread it seems that there is something seriously f~!*ed up about the American political system, but I just can't put my finger on it.That would be the American politicians and the American Media. Neither give a rat's ass about the American People.
Who vote for the American politicians and watch the American media.... So confused.
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Who vote for the American politicians and watch the American media.... So confused.From the reading I've done on this thread it seems that there is something seriously f~!*ed up about the American political system, but I just can't put my finger on it.That would be the American politicians and the American Media. Neither give a rat's ass about the American People.
Shhh just be nice and calm over there across the sea and don't worry about all these bombs pointing towards you. :P
Ok, so Conservative Republican President + Liberal Democratic Congress = Bad. "Conservative" Republican President + "Conservative" Republican Congress = Bad. Liberal Democrat President with Liberal Democrat Congress = Really Bad. Moderate Democrat President + Conservative Republican Congress = Not as Bad.
Hmmm, is it too late to bring Clinton, Dole and Newt back?
No; running up the debt is bad. For better or for worse, people tend to blame the president for what goes on under his watch, as this thread clearly shows.
Put down your dukes for a second, and re-read what I said: The debt is the problem. History clearly shows that neither major party, irrespective of their rhetoric, has an iota of credibility on fiscal responsibility.*
* Edit: At least in their modern incarnations; I was referring to '76 (or so) and forward.
Clinton in '92 was my first.
'08 McCain. Liked McCain, thought he might be able to work with both parties. Liked Palin too (gasp!). Didn't like Obama's platform or ideas. Would have voted Libertarian again, but, srsly, Bob Barr?
I actually like McCain, but I really thought Palin was selected to pander toward the women vote as a desperation move. Seriously, there were much better choices to choose from for VeeP. Now if Obama had taken Hillary as a Veep choice, then McCain-Palin might have a chance because Hillary has such a polarizing love-her-or-hate-her enigma amongst the populace.
As sexist as it might sound, the first thing I thought when I saw her first public appearance, I was like ... whoah, where have they been hiding this guv'ner? <american pie> MILF.... </american pie> Then she started speaking. Then any amour I had for her ceased to exist.
From the reading I've done on this thread it seems that there is something seriously f~!*ed up about the American political system, but I just can't put my finger on it.
It's the candidates and the electorates who vote for them. :P
*cough* wikipediaiswithoutbiasoropinion *cough*Would you prefer?
** spoiler omitted **
Holeeee crap. I thought I was gonna get rick rolled. Wow. :D
I could have lived with McCain; I have respect for the guy. Palin would have been a total f'in disaster.
I could have lived with McCain; I have respect for the guy. Palin would have been a total f'in disaster.Ditto. Also, I think that McCain should have been the Republican pick of '00, and therefore ultimately president, not Bush.
Agreed too.
Life would have been so much better if he had been.Agreed too.I could have lived with McCain; I have respect for the guy. Palin would have been a total f'in disaster.Ditto. Also, I think that McCain should have been the Republican pick of '00, and therefore ultimately president, not Bush.
Yep. McCain wouldn't have pulled that "AlQaeda's hiding out in Iraq" crap since it wasn't his daddy that needed the political payback because some chump in the Middle East is making oogly googly faces at him because he's still runnin' his regime.
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Yep. McCain wouldn't have pulled that "AlQaeda's hiding out in Iraq" crap since it wasn't his daddy that needed the political payback because some chump in the Middle East is making oogly googly faces at him because he's still runnin' his regime.Life would have been so much better if he had been.Agreed too.I could have lived with McCain; I have respect for the guy. Palin would have been a total f'in disaster.Ditto. Also, I think that McCain should have been the Republican pick of '00, and therefore ultimately president, not Bush.
Well he might have however, he would not have told their military to go home he would have had them all stay in separate locations and placed new leaders in charge. He would have left right after the trail of Saddam and would have accepted the friendship overtures of Iran. Which would have left the moderates in charge of that country and have given us another ally in the middle east. Plus we would have kept out eye on the ball and stayed deep inside of Afghanistan with most of the Al-qaida leaders we had under lock and key still under lock and key and he would have..............
But he didn't.because he was not in charge and as such we have to deal with what was and what is.
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I could have lived with McCain; I have respect for the guy. Palin would have been a total f'in disaster.
McCain and Bush 2 really lost me with there support for the illegal alien amnesty bill. Some one slipped them the koolaid spiked with some brown acid left over from woodstock I guess.
I really wanted McCain to beat Bush 2 in the 2000 primary. He would have handled 9/11 and Afganistan much better in my opinion. Whether he would have still fallen into Iraq would be interesting. (Despite all the anti Bush "he did it cause of daddy" crapolla, I still believe there was a bigger reason we went back. And that bigger reason has to do with Iran and our ability to manipulate/control Saddamn.)
So, had to vote for Bush 2 (despite the fact I disliked him more than I had his father). Gore disgusted me because of his wifes PMRC organization (Parent Music Resource Center) a pro censorship anti artist group of senators wifes who tried to bully the record industry because of who their husbands were and his support of it. He was also anti second amendment. He would have beaten Bush 2 if he had just lied like obama did on that topic. It cost him some rank and file union folks that value their guns to much. And that left it up to the hanging chads.
But hey, I think Palin would be doing a much better job of VP than Joe Biden is.
I really wanted McCain to beat Bush 2 in the 2000 primary. He would have handled 9/11 and Afganistan much better in my opinion. Whether he would have still fallen into Iraq would be interesting. (Despite all the anti Bush "he did it cause of daddy" crapolla, I still believe there was a bigger reason we went back. And that bigger reason has to do with Iran and our ability to manipulate/control Saddamn.)
Haliburton, Cheney, Oil.
Gore disgusted me because of his wifes PMRC organization (Parent Music Resource Center) a pro censorship anti artist group of senators wifes who tried to bully the record industry because of who their husbands were and his support of it.
I haven't forgotten about that. Loved Dee Snider's appearance when called in. :D
But hey, I think Palin would be doing a much better job of VP than Joe Biden is.
Well, she is easier on the eyes...