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Good question. Sadly, it is a question with far too many situational answers/solutions/methods to really ever properly answer outside of being very broad and general, such as...
Find a monster lair, eradicate the populace, "Greyhawk" the bodies, scour the place from top to bottom, walk out with all hard currency and anything worth over 1gp in value.
More or less, anything you can get your hands on is considered treasure. Some of it is just better than its contemporaries.
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Good question. Sadly, it is a question with far too many situational answers/solutions/methods to really ever properly answer outside of being very broad and general, such as...
Find a monster lair, eradicate the populace, "Greyhawk" the bodies, scour the place from top to bottom, walk out with all hard currency and anything worth over 1gp in value.
More or less, anything you can get your hands on is considered treasure. Some of it is just better than its contemporaries.
What about using spells to locate treasure or magical items. We tend to use Detect Magic quite a lot. Are the other spells worth using?
What about using spells to locate treasure or magical items. We tend to use Detect Magic quite a lot. Are the other spells worth using?Good question. Sadly, it is a question with far too many situational answers/solutions/methods to really ever properly answer outside of being very broad and general, such as...
Find a monster lair, eradicate the populace, "Greyhawk" the bodies, scour the place from top to bottom, walk out with all hard currency and anything worth over 1gp in value.
More or less, anything you can get your hands on is considered treasure. Some of it is just better than its contemporaries.
Detect magic is relatively good for discovering the presence of magical items. Probably the best, unless you know what you're searching for - in which case scrying, locate object etc. makes the well-prepared caster shine.
A healthy description from the GM does a lot. Sorry if I am stepping on anyones opinion or such, but to me you never really needed a Perception check to spot "That finely crafted *insert item name* with magical runes/other flavourful text can be used, if provided, though paraphrasing is good if the players know the book too well" when it's placed right on the floor/table/any other placement with obvious sight.
I often allow character a Spellcraft/UMD/Knowledge Arcana to figure out if there's some magic to things and maybe hint a little towards what kind if I got a good idea or feel generous. Appraise might even be enough, but I'd crave insane checks.
Appraise is however, generally good for getting the valuable items (but remember it's DC 20 for COMMON items, so you want the Intelligent, Trained character to do it, preferably not on a roll, but a take 10 or such.)
Perception checks are really good, but shouldn't be taken for searching unless the character actively search, whiel things that are simply slightly hidden or noticeable might be discovered on a Perception check or noticed as more than what strikes the unknowing eye by a Knowledge/Spellcraft or such.
Sometimes you can also encourage the players to think too much of looting. I have seen players go obsessive about it and using the main part of a session on driving their GM insane with Perception checks, treasure lists and getting the value of things. Sometimes you might want to get on. Maybe give them the items a bit easier this once for the sake of progress. Maybe lower that DC by 5, to move along. This shouldn't be standard procedure, but I'd say it's better than the treasure consuming all the time you could have used on having a great adventure.
Identify is also a useful spell. It's one of those spells Pathfinder hs really added value to.
Truth be told, sometimes you miss an item. It happens. No need to be too paranoid about it. It's just another item and unless your GM's mean you'll never be too badly behind the level appropriate gold and items, unless there's a seriously great story reason for it.
Hope you could use it.
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What about using spells to locate treasure or magical items. We tend to use Detect Magic quite a lot. Are the other spells worth using?
Other spells? Most of the detect spells ones might (remember, its situational) pick up auras on items, places, or equipment. I mean, honestly, its standard practice for the good, magic stuff to be rather apparent after a dungeon delve/adventure, and anything else to be only slightly out of view.
But, if you don't mind my asking, what's with the treasure-seeking?
During one of our latest campaigns, one of the characters (Paladin 2/Warrior 1, and looked basically like He-Man), who had lots of crafting skills, insisted on making all the types of equipment he could, and also wanted to set up a shop. So he saw a treasure in just about everything. Some cases I remember with distinct humour:
-He cut off an expensive-looking piece of carpet inside a magical dungeon owned by a genie. He used it to, well, craft himself a cape.
-Stole the crimson-and-gold cushion on which the genie's lamp rested, and sewed it to his bedroll for extra comfort. Tried to also steal the lamp, but the genie showed up.
-After killing a salt semielemental, he started asking the rest of the party for bags in order to get the salt back to town. He ended up using his own boots as containers (salt sells pretty nicely, after all).
-Stole a spitoon from a tavern in order to craft a helmet. He didn't notice it was a spitoon until after he turned it over to check what was inside.
-Somehow managed to remove a marble statue from a lord's mannor without the owner or any of the guards noticing (and I really tried to have them notice. Dice were not on my side that day). He then broke it down into pieces, crafted miniature statuettes of himself and sold them as, literal quoting, "Wonderful art pieces of incalculable value".
-Later, he used the money collected from the sales of salt, statuettes and other sources to actually set up his shop, which he then tried to use to start a cult to the "Cooler, Less Uptight Half-Brother of Pelor, Polor". He got two apprentices. The story hasn't moved from that point yet.
So as you can see, just about anything could be considered treasure, depending on what your character's motivations are. We all really had a lot of fun with this guy, since he was able to find value in the most useless of things (and turned them into useful stuff thanks to all his Craft skills).
I often follow two routes with treasure: It is either significant, story-important magic stuff with very specific functions (I usually steer away from most generic magic items, unless it is time to add some random treasure), and the occasional random treasure, since my players like to stumble upon piles of miscelaneous things and figuring out new uses for a +1 Cork and a Net of Disruption.
I very, very rarely add monsters with loot, though, unless they are humanoids of some kind, in which case they tend to include their basic equipment and some extra bonus if the NPC was somewhat important to the story.
A DM friend of mine was running two concurrent campaigns of the same dungeon.
Myself and one group, and another group entirely on a different day.
Our group seemed to pick up whatever incidental loot we found. if something was obviously valuable or magical in a way that we could use or handily sell then it came with us.
The other group however was known for doing such things as pulling up the marble tile from floors to resell it later on. Literally.
heh. Value is subjective :)
To the point of your question however- I think mainly its up to the player to have Appraise and ask the value of things. Just like you would tell your DM to "check the statue" for hidden compartments, you should tell your DM that you want to "check the statue" for possible resale value. same for rugs, doors, vases, art in general or anything that is described to you that you think might have some value.
Then you just have to worry about getting it out..
-S
Then you just have to worry about getting it out..-S
This gives me the picture of a group of hard-boiled adventurers trying to leave a dreadful dungeon with their pockets filled with candles, rugs, cutlery, half-drank bottles of wine, dirty monster laundry and the shoes from the previous party.
Epic heroes indeed!
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Epic heroes? No, these are much better. These are adventurers. Much better, sure they explore ancient and ruined temples but only because there's awesome stuff to sell inside. Sure they rescue princesses, princes, and orphans because there's half a kingdom, or an entire village's coffers on offer as a reward. What you call heroism, cunning and bravery others call trespass, genocide and burgulary. Everything they do is technically an adventure including the murder of natives, the destruction of property and the patronage of businesses of ill repute. But then what can you expect of the type of person who meets some strangers in a tavern and decides that the defiling, looting and tomb robbing of ancient burial sites is a pleasant way to spend a weekend?
During one of our latest campaigns, one of the characters (Paladin 2/Warrior 1, and looked basically like He-Man), who had lots of crafting skills, insisted on making all the types of equipment he could, and also wanted to set up a shop. So he saw a treasure in just about everything. Some cases I remember with distinct humour:
-He cut off an expensive-looking piece of carpet inside a magical dungeon owned by a genie. He used it to, well, craft himself a cape.
-Stole the crimson-and-gold cushion on which the genie's lamp rested, and sewed it to his bedroll for extra comfort. Tried to also steal the lamp, but the genie showed up.
-After killing a salt semielemental, he started asking the rest of the party for bags in order to get the salt back to town. He ended up using his own boots as containers (salt sells pretty nicely, after all).
-Stole a spitoon from a tavern in order to craft a helmet. He didn't notice it was a spitoon until after he turned it over to check what was inside.
-Somehow managed to remove a marble statue from a lord's mannor without the owner or any of the guards noticing (and I really tried to have them notice. Dice were not on my side that day). He then broke it down into pieces, crafted miniature statuettes of himself and sold them as, literal quoting, "Wonderful art pieces of incalculable value".
-Later, he used the money collected from the sales of salt, statuettes and other sources to actually set up his shop, which he then tried to use to start a cult to the "Cooler, Less Uptight Half-Brother of Pelor, Polor". He got two apprentices. The story hasn't moved from that point yet.
So as you can see, just about anything could be considered treasure, depending on what your character's motivations are. We all really had a lot of fun with this guy, since he was able to find value in the most useless of things (and turned them into useful stuff thanks to all his Craft skills).
I often follow two routes with treasure: It is either significant, story-important magic stuff...
I assume after all of that VERY non-Lawful Thievery, he no longer has his Paladin powers?
But, that sort of collecting is great. Most of my players have had characters who collected something, from colored glass bottles to statues to long-finned fish...
Once you have that going for you as a GM, there are all sorts of things to use as treasure and motivation.
I had a character who WAS an archaelogist. He didn't want the cool +2 sword, he wanted books and statues and old pottery...and our GM obliged.
And in every group, there is someone (normally the wizard or cleric) who likes to collect books. The Infernal Book in Silent Tide became the best treasure for the party that played that adventure.
As for describing it. Obvious treasure (gold, glowing magic swords, etc.) don;t require a perception check. Noticing that the bedding is exceptionally nice is either perception, appraise, or just good role playing. ("I check the Sorceress' bed to see how nice the sheets are.)
Then again, I have a player (male, half-elf rogue) who went nuts over the blouse and skirt from the Cleric of Urgotha in Into the Haunted Woods. His character still wears them...
Yeah, I don;t know either. But he's happy.
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Epic heroes? No, these are much better. These are adventurers. Much better, sure they explore ancient and ruined temples but only because there's awesome stuff to sell inside. Sure they rescue princesses, princes, and orphans because there's half a kingdom, or an entire village's coffers on offer as a reward. What you call heroism, cunning and bravery others call trespass, genocide and burgulary. Everything they do is technically an adventure including the murder of natives, the destruction of property and the patronage of businesses of ill repute. But then what can you expect of the type of person who meets some strangers in a tavern and decides that the defiling, looting and tomb robbing of ancient burial sites is a pleasant way to spend a weekend?
What's that joke? Something about how people started calling themselves "adventurers" because "murderous hobos" didn't have the same ring to it.
Epic heroes? No, these are much better. These are adventurers. Much better, sure they explore ancient and ruined temples but only because there's awesome stuff to sell inside. Sure they rescue princesses, princes, and orphans because there's half a kingdom, or an entire village's coffers on offer as a reward. What you call heroism, cunning and bravery others call trespass, genocide and burgulary. Everything they do is technically an adventure including the murder of natives, the destruction of property and the patronage of businesses of ill repute. But then what can you expect of the type of person who meets some strangers in a tavern and decides that the defiling, looting and tomb robbing of ancient burial sites is a pleasant way to spend a weekend?
Hahaha! I think you just made my day.
I assume after all of that VERY non-Lawful Thievery, he no longer has his Paladin powers?
I allowed it to slide at first, since most of the, let us say, "object confiscation" was done in dungeons such as extradimensional mage towers and hidden heretic temples under the city's main square, but as time went by, aye, I had to tell him that he was striding too far from Lawful. And he agreed without any complaints (though he did try to sweet-talk me into believing it could all be interpreted in some obscure fashion of a grand plan). His background was, after all, that his character was "politely asked" to leave the paladinesque order due to his lack of discipline and temperance.
Then again, I have a player (male, half-elf rogue) who went nuts over the blouse and skirt from the Cleric of Urgotha in Into the Haunted Woods. His character still wears them...
Yeah, I don;t know either. But he's happy.
Hehehe
Interesting. A bit off topic, but lack of discipline and temperence = no paladin power in my book. Paladins are all about dsicipline and following their diety...
The Paladin in my campaign has lost his powers once already, but he's new to RPGs and is learning what a Paladin really is. (He didn't get trained. He's an ex-murderer who "found" Sarenrae in prison and devoted his life to being better...and its a struggle for him every day.)
Aside from that though, I like the way your player loots...