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Using the Pathfinder Core and Bestiary
Ok I'm trying to understand something that most of you probably have already internalized, which is basically how to determine how natural attacks work for creatures.
Now for most characters, its simply subtract 5 from the base attack bonus, if you have a positive number greater than 0, they can take another attack, and you can repeat this proccess until the final number is 0 or less
I have found there are little rule gotcha's scattered about the various texts and its a little confusing.
Pathfinder CORE PG 182
You do not receive additional natural attacks for a high base attack bonus. Instead, you receive additional attack rolls for multiple limb and body parts capable of making the attack (as noted by the race or ability that grants the attacks). If you possess only one natural attack (such as a bite—two claw attacks do not qualify), you add 1–1/2 times your Strength bonus on damage rolls made with that attack. Some natural attacks are denoted as secondary natural attacks, such as tails and wings. Attacks with secondary natural attacks are made using your base attack bonus minus 5. These attacks deal an amount of damage depending on their type, but you only add half your Strength modifier on damage rolls.
Moster Introduction (GRD)
Melee: The creature's melee attacks are listed here, with its attack roll modifier listed after the attack's name followed by the damage in parentheses.
Now if you look at the young red dragon...
BAB is listed as 11
Str is 25 (+7)
Melee bite +17 (2d6+10), 2 claws +17 (1d8+7), 2 wings +12 (1d6+3), tail slap +12 (1d8+10)
Now Bites and claws are Primary attacks, the wings and tailslaps are secondary
So how many bites, claws, wing bashes and tail swipes does a dragon get
1 Primary + 1 Secondary? Does he get them all?
If some sadistic godling damages the sail portion of a dragons wings so he cannot fly, and tosses him into a pit, what kind of blender is he?
Gotta get 'em all.
Just look at the stat block. It tells you exactly what attacks the critter gets. Primary and secondary attacks don't really matter when you're running the game, only when you're making a new monster or modifying an old one.
So how many bites, claws, wing bashes and tail swipes does a dragon get
Melee bite +17 (2d6+10), 2 claws +17 (1d8+7), 2 wings +12 (1d6+3), tail slap +12 (1d8+10)
One bite, two claws, two wing buffert, and one tail slap. It doesn't matter for running purposes, but for instruction purposes, the bite and claws are primary attacks (they're at full attack bonus: 11 BAB, +7 strength, -1 size) and the wing buffets and tail slap are secondary attacks (they're at full attack bonus minus five: 17 - 5 secondary attack = 12).
On the other hand, I'm not sure what's up with the tail slap. It should be either 1d8+3 damage as a secondary attack (half of 7 strength, rounded down), or the attack bonus should be +17 as a primary attack.
Using the Pathfinder Core and Bestiary
Ok I'm trying to understand something that most of you probably have already internalized, which is basically how to determine how natural attacks work for creatures.
Now for most characters, its simply subtract 5 from the base attack bonus, if you have a positive number greater than 0, they can take another attack, and you can repeat this proccess until the final number is 0 or less
I have found there are little rule gotcha's scattered about the various texts and its a little confusing.
Pathfinder CORE PG 182
You do not receive additional natural attacks for a high base attack bonus. Instead, you receive additional attack rolls for multiple limb and body parts capable of making the attack (as noted by the race or ability that grants the attacks). If you possess only one natural attack (such as a bite—two claw attacks do not qualify), you add 1–1/2 times your Strength bonus on damage rolls made with that attack. Some natural attacks are denoted as secondary natural attacks, such as tails and wings. Attacks with secondary natural attacks are made using your base attack bonus minus 5. These attacks deal an amount of damage depending on their type, but you only add half your Strength modifier on damage rolls.Moster Introduction (GRD)
Melee: The creature's melee attacks are listed here, with its attack roll modifier listed after the attack's name followed by the damage in parentheses.Now if you look at the young red dragon...
BAB is listed as 11
Str is 25 (+7)
Melee bite +17 (2d6+10), 2 claws +17 (1d8+7), 2 wings +12 (1d6+3), tail slap +12 (1d8+10)
Now Bites and claws are Primary attacks, the wings and tailslaps are secondarySo how many bites, claws, wing bashes and tail swipes does a dragon get
1 Primary + 1 Secondary? Does he get them all?If some sadistic godling damages the sail portion of a dragons wings so he cannot fly, and tosses him into a pit, what kind of blender is he?
On a full attack action the dragon gets all of them. On a single attack (standard action or cleave or something of the sort) he gets only one of them.
So in case of the Aboleth who only has 1 natural attack (4 tentacles), can the creature move 10ft (or swim 60ft) and still attack with all 4 tentacles?
On the other hand, I'm not sure what's up with the tail slap. It should be either 1d8+3 damage as a secondary attack (half of 7 strength, rounded down), or the attack bonus should be +17 as a primary attack.
Dragon tail slaps have special rules:
"Tail Slap: The dragon can slap one foe each round with its Colossal dragons). tail. A tail slap is a secondary attack that deals the indicated damage plus 1-1/2 times the dragon's Strength bonus (this is an exception to the normal secondary attack rules). "
Likewise, dragon bites always add 1-1/2 times the dragon's Strength bonus, too.
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So in case of the Aboleth who only has 1 natural attack (4 tentacles), can the creature move 10ft (or swim 60ft) and still attack with all 4 tentacles?
He has 4 natural attacks, but 1 natural weapon.
No, since you can't take a full attack (the 4 tentacles) with also taking a move.
Even the Hydra has to work within the normal rules now, so the system is consistent now.