the improved quality reduces the Armor Check Penalty presumably because it is easier to move in the Masterwork Armor than in the Standard Armor.
on the same grounds...
why is the Arcane Spell Failure Chance not also reduced? (though I don't see the reduction stick with shields dangling on the casters arm)
An increase of the Maximum Dex Bonus by 1 would also be logical.
With the feats Arcane Armor Training and Arcane Armor Mastery available there are already ways to get an Arcane Spell Failure Chance of 0 with certain types of armor, so it wouldn't really be abusing the system.
Yes, this should be brought up in Equipment Chapter.
I don't see why ASF shouldn't be keyed off of the effective Armor Penalty,
rather than the 'type' of Armor (which is dependent on the Armor designer choosing an arbitrary ASF).
ASF only applies to spells with SOMATIC components.
Armor Penalty applies to DEX or STR skills (i.e. involving bodily movement = Somatic)
It makes more sense to unify the mechanism, since then Masterwork, Feats & Traits can modify one simple thing.
Yes, this should be brought up in Equipment Chapter.
I don't see why ASF shouldn't be keyed off of the effective Armor Penalty,
rather than the 'type' of Armor (which is dependent on the Armor designer choosing an arbitrary ASF).ASF only applies to spells with SOMATIC components.
Armor Penalty applies to DEX or STR skills (i.e. involving bodily movement = Somatic)
It makes more sense to unify the mechanism, since then Masterwork, Feats & Traits can modify one simple thing.
Indeed 5% per -1 ACP would make perfect sense to me.
And Percentages could be simplified to a d20 mechanic.
(or that could just be explicitly suggested as the way to resolve % chances)
You could just make it a DC X + spell level Spellcraft check to which armor check penalties apply.
...I would have to disagree with that.
The whole point is that it's a "flat" chance that you can't change by normal means.Pretty much like Miss Chance/Concealment. Which is the only other sub-system that uses the % nomenclature.
Sure, there ARE some ways to improve your chances with these (Blindfight, Arcane Armor Feats),
but those are very specialized, not usages of normal things you would have anyways.
(BAB doesn't at all improve your chances w/ Miss Chance. ASF is the same thing, but for spellcasting)
If Spellcraft->ASF were to be implemented, that would mean high level Casters would be more likely to wear heavy armors.
I think that isn't quite Pathfinder's intent...
(not to mention the current regime encourages using NO armor, which SPEEDS GAME PLAY by not having to roll ASF AT ALL)
I've never understood the ASF of shields. The rules clearly allow for a wizard to hold something in one hand, he just needs one free. So why would it matter if that other hand was holding a shield? It's not like wizards are going to mad-rush the armor shop for shields if you cut the ASF from them. The shield spell is still better. Just seems silly to me.
And Percentages could be simplified to a d20 mechanic.
(or that could just be explicitly suggested as the way to resolve % chances)
100% devideed by 20 sides = 5% per dice point
5% = natural 1
10% = 2 or less
15% = 3 or less
etc.
of course, d100% converts to d20 easily enough (since the %'s are always in convenient 5% amounts)
but why isn't that in the rules? why is every other game mechanic explicit, except this one requires extrapolation?
(or non-standard d100 dice, though since I've never seen non-5% chances, that doesn't actually add anything)
why is every other game mechanic explicit, except this one requires extrapolation?
(or non-standard d100 dice, though since I've never seen non-5% chances, that doesn't actually add anything)
maybe something else was planned but not implemented.
examples:
- reducing the ASF chance by 1% per rank on Sleight of Hand
- reducing the ASF chance by 1% per point the DEX modifier is higher than the ACP
- increasing the ASF chance by 1% per point the DEX modifier is lower than the ACP
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I favor switching Arcane Spell Failure to a Spellcraft check DC 15 + spell level, modified by Armor Check Penalty for worn armor and shields. I'd let Bards wearing armor and shields with 0 Armor Check Penalty (including Masterwork quality items) skip the Spellcraft roll to beat ASF, though other arcane casters would always roll for ASF when wearing armor or shields.
Other Check Penalties (such as encumbrance) would also apply to this check, and might require Spellcraft check to beat ASF even if the caster isn't wearing armor or a shield.
This would work out worse than percentage-chance ASF for lower-level casters, but would make it easier for higher-level casters to beat ASF, which makes perfect sense to me. Also, you could ditch a mechanic that's really only used in one specific circumstance, in favor of leaning on another that has other uses in the game.
The Spellcraft DC for casting a spell while Entangled is 15 + spell level, it seems to me (for casting purposes, anyway) being entangled is roughly comparable to wearing armor. I'd also give the +4 from Combat Casting to Spellcraft checks against Arcane Spell Failure, though Armor and Shield proficiencies would not negate Armor Check Penalties applying to Spellcraft checks to overcome Arcane Spell Failure.
Of course, this means that Wizards who multiclass into Fighter would be wearing better armor due to the Fighter's Armor training class feature. But then you wouldn't have to write up special PrCs so wizards could wear armor, since Fighter/Wizard builds would (using core rules) naturally improve their ability to cast spells while wearing armor. And if a wizard wants to take feats like Combat Casting or higher Armor Proficiences to get all gishy, well, that's what feats are for :)
I've written all of that up as house rules for my own game and plan on testing this out next year, with NPCs even if none of my players bite.
(for casting purposes, anyway) being entangled is roughly comparable to wearing armor.
for matters of spell casting, being entangled counts as a distraction, not as an encumbrance:
An entangled character who attempts to cast a spell must make a Concentration check (DC 15 + the spell's level) or lose the spell.
and I guess the flat % check is meant to discourage using armour equally at all levels, which it still is since you can invest your 1st level feat in Arcane Armor Training and also have to invest a Swift Action for the round you want to use it.
lumping it in with Spellcraft would practically make it available for free
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(for casting purposes, anyway) being entangled is roughly comparable to wearing armor.for matters of spell casting, being entangled counts as a distraction, not as an encumbrance:
An entangled character who attempts to cast a spell must make a Concentration check (DC 15 + the spell's level) or lose the spell.
True, although remember Concentration is no longer a skill in PRPG. The equivalent PRPG chart for Spellcraft DCs to avoid losing spells is on page 72 in the Beta.
And I personally would consider spell failure chance due to either entanglement or wearing bulky armor as at least in the same ballpark. This just depends on how you treat the rules in your game, I suppose :)
and I guess the flat % check is meant to discourage using armour equally at all levels, which it still is since you can invest your 1st level feat in Arcane Armor Training and also have to invest a Swift Action for the round you want to use it.
lumping it in with Spellcraft would practically make it available for free
Oh, good point - I did forget about the Arcane Armor feats. So, leaving Combat Casting out of it, I think you could still easily houserule % ASF out in favor of a Spellcraft check while keeping the intended flavor of these feats, like so:
Assuming you wanted to ditch the % ASF in your game, of course - I'm going to at least give this a try to see how it works out.
True, although remember Concentration is no longer a skill in PRPG. The equivalent PRPG chart for Spellcraft DCs to avoid losing spells is on page 72 in the Beta.
wow, have another look at that table:
Cast a spell while grappled 15 + spell level
so you are house ruling that wearing armour is encumbering you more than someone actively (through a grapple) trying to stop you from casting?
DC 15+Spell level is a 35% fail chance for a 1st level caster with maxed out Spellcraft and +5 bonus on casting ability [ (15+1-4-5)*5% ]
and this is without adding your proposed modified by Armor Check Penalty.
At the moment for a 35% failure chance the caster can wear Full Plate!
methinks you system to replace the flat ASF % chance by a Spellcraft check is broken.
It sucks till about level 15 where it will equal the current chances if you trade 5% for an increase of the DC by 1
and remember that not every caster will have the luxury to place 20 on the casting related ability.