I have three reasons:
1) Casters shouldn't all have to take Spellcraft to cast on the defensive/not lose a spell when hit with damage or in a storm. As is, you're intentionally gimping yourself if you want a Cleric or Druid who casts off simple faith or a Sorcerer who casts "from the hip." There has been talk of moving this use of concentration into a different system entirely, which is fine, but then there's still...
2) Backwards compatibility. Concentration is very important to the Expanded Psionics Handbook, and the Tome of Battle makes good use of it as well. While most of the skill consolidations are a simple enough fix ("It says make a Tumble check? Well, roll your Acrobatics."), Concentration was basically eliminated, which means you would have to shoehorn gaining Psionic Focus or using Sapphire Nightmare Blade into other skills that don't really fit and/or aren't class skills for most of the classes that would want to use them.
3) To a lesser extent, Concentration is also useful to rogues who might want to use their skills in combat, at least hypothetically. Since Pathfinder also seems to be in the business of shoring up the weaker skills, it would be a good idea to change the rules for interruption to apply to all actions, which suddenly makes AoOs against movement a much bigger deal to avoid (which makes sense: "Oh, you tried to run by my fighter but got hit in the face with a greataxe? Sorry, that knocks you on your ass"). This would make it a useful skill for everyone.
Oh god give it up allready, for the record I agree I like concentration as its own skill, but Jason has put his foot down several times and isn't going to change his mind. move on to things he is willing to change.
Well, at least we can hear the reasoning behind it, now that it's the appropriate time to discuss skills.
I have gone back and forth on this issue.
I was once in favor of keeping concentration because it was an equal investment for all casters (as opposed to any "mental" ability which would make certain casters better on average than others with the skill.)
I also dislike "mandatory" skills, e.g. all bards should take perform. A necessary skill is not a choice, and therefore should not be a skill. Skill selection allows you to make your character different from others of the same class and race, by specifying their interests and expertise. Both Concentration (3.5) and Spellcraft (PFBeta) are guilty of creating a mandatory skill.
Mr. Bulmahn's new proposed solution (Will Save) is interesting, but it is biased toward Wisdom casters. My playtest crew has been using [1d20 + CL + Key Ability] for concentration rolls. This avoids mandatory skill points, and is unbiased across all casters without creating a tacked on solution (Wis for Spellcraft?).
From there it is a small step to make Spell identification an Arcana roll and eliminate Spellcraft (or eliminate Arcana, I don't care which). Some have been lobbying to use Religion for divine magic identification, I'm okay with that. It helps to further distinguish the styles of magic.
I hope this helps to convince you that Concentration should stay deprecated. Of the suggested solutions, my favor goes to the one that eliminates mandatory skills, ability bias, and overlapping concept skills.
Well, at least we can hear the reasoning behind it, now that it's the appropriate time to discuss skills.
Agreed. I've never been sure about the removal of concentration, it was a marginal skill that was used only by spellcasters 90% of the time, but the other 10% of cases do come up from time to time, and there need to be rules in place to handle them without it simply being DM fiat.
If it was simply a matter of removing some of the marginal skills that only seem really useful to specific classes, I'd much rather have seen Spellcraft removed, with it's effects split up among Concentration and Knowledge (Arcana), possibly along with Knowledge (Religion) or Knowledge (Nature) as well.
1) Casters shouldn't all have to take Spellcraft to cast on the defensive/not lose a spell when hit with damage or in a storm. As is, you're intentionally gimping yourself if you want a Cleric or Druid who casts off simple faith or a Sorcerer who casts "from the hip." There has been talk of moving this use of concentration into a different system entirely, which is fine, but then there's still...
Meh, I agree with you overall, but this one doesn't do much for me. I don't see any reason a "shoot from the hip" sorcerer couldn't have spellcraft, the same way a "shoot form the hip" artist would still have an appropriate perform skill.
2) Backwards compatibility. Concentration is very important to the Expanded Psionics Handbook, and the Tome of Battle makes good use of it as well. While most of the skill consolidations are a simple enough fix ("It says make a Tumble check? Well, roll your Acrobatics."), Concentration was basically eliminated, which means you would have to shoehorn gaining Psionic Focus or using Sapphire Nightmare Blade into other skills that don't really fit and/or aren't class skills for most of the classes that would want to use them.
This one is a big one for me, I don't plan on using a ton of 3.5 books for every game, but there are enough classes and mechanics that rely on Concentration that I'd like to avoid breaking compatibility.
3) To a lesser extent, Concentration is also useful to rogues who might want to use their skills in combat, at least hypothetically. Since Pathfinder also seems to be in the business of shoring up the weaker skills, it would be a good idea to change the rules for interruption to apply to all actions, which suddenly makes AoOs against movement a much bigger deal to avoid (which makes sense: "Oh, you tried to run by my fighter but got hit in the face with a greataxe? Sorry, that knocks you on your ass"). This would make it a useful skill for everyone.
I really, really like this idea. I'd limit it to actions that can inspire an attack of opportunity instead of all actions, otherwise readied actions might be a bit too powerful, but the idea of AOO's forcing your opponent to make a concentration check to avoid losing their action sounds like it would be worth exploring.
In a related area, spell-like abilities provoke AoO. In 3.5, you could use these abilities defensively by making a Concentration check. This is part of the reason why some 3.5 spell-like abilities listed an equivalent spell level (others typically mimic a spell).
While this does not always affect PCs, it does effect creatures. The summoning abilities of demons are example of this. Whatever the final changes are, they should be balanced for creatures and, perhaps, any non-caster class/prestige class with spell-like abilities.
Director of Games
|
Concentration is out. It is a mandatory skill that is only used by casters (99% of the time). It was also the only skill based off Con, which is an ability that has enough perks associated with it. The functions of this skill will either become a Will save or a caster level check. I am still mulling over the possibilities.
This thread is locked.
Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer
Paizo Publishing