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This pic of Graywall in Dragon 368. There are some minor differences, but the overall effect is strikingly similar to the one of Korvosa. A large keep type structure in the middle surrounded by dilapidated buildings and flying creatures. The only thing missing from the WoTC image is the lightning. I do not have that PF image available, but I do have a wallpaper that shows the different PF characters on the background I described. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, right?
I understand many do not subscribe to the DDi pages so I posted the picture. If that is wrong please delete and forgive me. I also hope this wasn't posted a bazillion times, but just so happened to NOT be on the first page when I looked.
This image is kind of hard to see with the heroes in the middle. I hope this can at least help show what I am talking about.
I can see the similarities.
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I can see what you mean but I think that the Korovsa pic is much more dynamic, has a lot more details and (at least for me) creates another general mood (much more realistic, much more dynamic and much more scarier than the seemingly sleepy Graywall).
I wouldn't read too much into it. On the other hand, you never know where an artist's inspiration may stem from and the Korvosa image is awesome.
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I can see what you mean but I think that the Korovsa pic is much more dynamic, has a lot more details and (at least for me) creates another general mood (much more realistic, much more dynamic and much more scarier than the seemingly sleepy Graywall).
I wouldn't read too much into it. On the other hand, you never know where an artist's inspiration may stem from and the Korvosa image is awesome.
I agree with you on that. I also know in any genre you can only have so many different types before overlap occurs. I am not sure if I thought it was coincidental, or the conspiracy part of my brain overreacted. Especially after reading about WoTC profiling the same god that Paizo put so much effort into.
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Here is the Korvosa pic, for reference.
Thank you very much! I knew it was out there, but didn't have to much time to search for it. I definitely love that image.
The ramshackle city whose skyline is dominated by a dark menacing edifice while strange creatures take wing isn't exactly new.
For the record I like the Graywall image better, more subtle, moodier and more finely painted IMO.
frm an amateur atist point of wiev...
the images are similar but is a common topic you could say so that`s quite common.
the color and painting looks better on Korvosa pic giving a more dinamic and chaotic fell the Graywall pic looks static in coparation, on the other hand when looking at the building design Graywall comes on top.
finally the colors used by Korvosa are a lot more vivid depicting dawn/dusk and is better constructed, tough the lighting I think was not a good idea, it shift the focus of the pic too much, while greywall pic is mostly at night explaining the softer and colder colors but dosn`t really play with contrast making quite aplain picture.
overall these are pics of a similar topic but really diferent in theyr realization and fell beyond just the stile of thr artist.
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OK let's look at things though.
They have an open playtest... after Paizo did
Paizo decides to focus on Baphomet... then so does WOTC
Paizo has an amazing pic... WOTC finds one rather similar...
These are just the first three copy-cat issues I can think of.
Once is coincidence, twice unusual, but three times or more shows me they are watching Paizo and using ideas...
Creative Director
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Although the choice to do a demonomicon on Baphomet when he already has had one and there are other demons who are still waiting for a demonomiconn entry is, frankly quite baffling to me... I'm relatively sure that it's not WotC trying to copy us. I'm not really sure where the idea that we're going to "focus more on Baphomet" came from, in fact... we haven't said pretty much ANYTHING about him in any product yet except in the PFCS, and that was in the section about demon lords where we talked about him as much as other demons. In Pathfinder #18, we're doing a big article about the demon lords but again, Baphomet isn't the focus.
My only guess is that people have misunderstood the choice we made to not have Orcus have a big role in Golarion. He's still there, but he won't be the "demon lord of choice" for us because he HAS had his finger in the pie for a lot of stuff already (the Bloodstone war modules, Necromancer Games stuff, Savage Tide, the Ghostwalk setting, the 4th edition Monster Manual, and the Planescape setting being the major ones that come to mind). We've got 28 other demon lords aside from Orcus to play with, and of them, the one we've done the MOST with so far is probably Abraxas. Baphomet has the advantage of being a demon lord in Golarion that D&D players will recognize immediately... along with Jubilex, Kostchtchie, Pazuzu, Orcus, and a few others.
We're more likely to do something with Baphomet than Orcus... but you can say that about any demon lord, to be honest.
I love the Korvosa picture! Does this scene take place in the CoCT AP?
XD this mind sound ridiculus, and probably is ...
MMRPG Ragnarok online -> trademar boss, Baphomet...
nah honestly, baphomet is a name well know to most people, not only D&D players, is a good choice for any game to focus soem attention on it,I would not read much into it.
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Baphomet has the advantage of being a demon lord in Golarion that D&D players will recognize immediately... along with Jubilex, Kostchtchie, Pazuzu, Orcus, and a few others.
Speaking of Pazuzu, seeing that the original mythological Pazuzu had a very adversarial relationship with Lamashtu is there any possibility of this being explored in future Pathfinder material? I very much like the idea of two chaotic evil forces who are at open war inspiring ordinary non-evil people to pay service to the other one to keep the other one's ravages away.
Actually, why the hell haven't I already sent in a proposal for a PFS scenario detailing the conflict between cults of Lamashtu and Pazuzu?
EDIT: Oh, and by the way... WIZARDS IN PATHFINDER RPG CAN CAST CANTRIPS AS SPELL-LIKE ABILITIES AT WILL JUST LIKE IN D&D 4E OMG PAIZO IS TOTALLY COPYING WOTC!!!!1 ;)
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Creative Director
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Speaking of Pazuzu, seeing that the original mythological Pazuzu had a very adversarial relationship with Lamashtu is there any possibility of this being explored in future Pathfinder material? I very much like the idea of two chaotic evil forces who are at open war inspiring ordinary non-evil people to pay service to the other one to keep the other one's ravages away.
We've already got that adversarial relationship up and running. Pathfinder #5 has a big article about Lamashtu, and details on her conflict with Pazuzu are all over that article.
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Speaking of Pazuzu, seeing that the original mythological Pazuzu had a very adversarial relationship with Lamashtu is there any possibility of this being explored in future Pathfinder material? I very much like the idea of two chaotic evil forces who are at open war inspiring ordinary non-evil people to pay service to the other one to keep the other one's ravages away.We've already got that adversarial relationship up and running. Pathfinder #5 has a big article about Lamashtu, and details on her conflict with Pazuzu are all over that article.
Well I'll be damned, I might just have to pick that up simply for that. Thank you for making a mythology nerd giddy with glee. :)
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Creative Director
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Well I'll be damned, I might just have to pick that up simply for that. Thank you for making a mythology nerd giddy with glee. :)Speaking of Pazuzu, seeing that the original mythological Pazuzu had a very adversarial relationship with Lamashtu is there any possibility of this being explored in future Pathfinder material? I very much like the idea of two chaotic evil forces who are at open war inspiring ordinary non-evil people to pay service to the other one to keep the other one's ravages away.We've already got that adversarial relationship up and running. Pathfinder #5 has a big article about Lamashtu, and details on her conflict with Pazuzu are all over that article.
No Prob! I've actually been doing Lamashtu vs. Pazuzu stuff as far back as Dragon #329, actually, so to me it's sort of an assumption that the two go hand in hand.
These are just the first three copy-cat issues I can think of. Once is coincidence, [SNIP] ....
Wasn't there a bonus 'Paragon Path' (or whatever, I can't remember all the 4E terminology) for the ranger called Pathfinder. And wasn't one of their abilities called misstep? ;p
Back on topic, I love all the Paizo artwork. There was a link on the blog a while back to the company who does a lot of it - very interesting. And it's great how free Paizo is with all the art (thanks guys - you've given me quality desktop wallpaper after quality desktop wallpaper!).
I love the picture of Korvosa - easily my favorite fantasy city. I can't wait to run my Pathfinder game set there. Go Korvosa!
Peace,
tfad
Although the choice to do a demonomicon on Baphomet when he already has had one and there are other demons who are still waiting for a demonomiconn entry is, frankly quite baffling to me...
Because the new D&D multiverse pretty much has nothing to do with the old one. All that stuff needs to be re-done, because the old stuff isn't relevant anymore...
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These are just the first three copy-cat issues I can think of. Once is coincidence, [SNIP] ....Wasn't there a bonus 'Paragon Path' (or whatever, I can't remember all the 4E terminology) for the ranger called Pathfinder. And wasn't one of their abilities called misstep? ;p
It's Wrong Step, if I recall correctly. All that Paizo needs to do is create a Pathfinder prestige class called Wizard of the Coast (or Coast Wizard) which has the 10th level ability "Screwing the Fanbase". ;)
I love the Korvosa picture! Does this scene take place in the CoCT AP?
Not directly, but it does take place in Korvosa several times a year.
Korvosa has an infestation of imps, as the Academae studends are required to conjure up a devil during their studies - and since they're not fit for keeping a pit fiend in line, they go for the weakest link - imps. After that, many of those limps get away and make their new home in Korvosa.
The pseudodragons are their natural enemies in Korvosa. There are many and more pseudodragons in Korvosa, too, and they gang up on the imps.
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Although the choice to do a demonomicon on Baphomet when he already has had one and there are other demons who are still waiting for a demonomiconn entry is, frankly quite baffling to me... I'm relatively sure that it's not WotC trying to copy us.
Your article on Baphomet was excellent. He'd never been high up on my list of interesting demon lords but since then I've had lots of ideas for using him or his cultists in adventures.
He really didn't need re-doing so soon; location aside, surely the politics of the new Abyss aren't that different from the old one? Anyway, I'm happy with my current version and its not worth my time reading the new article (even assuming it is on the free part of the site, which I doubt).
surely the politics of the new Abyss aren't that different from the old one?
Since demons are supposed to be mindless killing machines now, I guess there isn't much in the way of Abyss politics in 4e. Just kill kill kill kill kill kill.