OK! ENOUGH ALREADY! Our financial system just got a prison-style beatdown by greedy people making bad loans and more greedy people buying and insuring those loans.
Is there any real solution to this beyond government regulation? I mean I personally don't like government interfering to a large scale in the economy, but this is just... ugh.
We need to break out the guillotine.
Who's head is first on the block?
Oh...where to start...?
Greenspan.
Not bad... I see your Greenspan and raise you Daniel Mudd, CEO of Fannie Mae!
I counter your CEO with my own, James Cayne, former CEO of Bear Stearns.Not bad... I see your Greenspan and raise you Daniel Mudd, CEO of Fannie Mae!Oh...where to start...?
Greenspan.
I tap my CEO of Fannie Mae to play Angelo R Mozilo (CEO Legend Rare), the guy who oversaw CountryWide as they were encouraging borrowers not to fudge a bit on their mortgage loan applications.
I counter your CEO with my own, James Cayne, former CEO of Bear Stearns.Not bad... I see your Greenspan and raise you Daniel Mudd, CEO of Fannie Mae!Oh...where to start...?
Greenspan.
Ahh, so many to choose from...
How about we line up all CEOs according to compensation and send them to a little island where they have to work to survive? We can call it the Ego Wars.
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I am very much against government regulation. Let the market care for itself. By the same token, no government bailouts either. Unfortunately we have let large corporations know that they can take radical risks with only moderate repurcussions. Our conservative administration is engaging in socialism in the financial market, instead of engaging in free market policies.
These amazingly large corporations take amazingly large risks because they counted on, expected and were rewarded by the government.
Sure, some stockholders lost some money. The corporate leadership didn't though, I can assure you of that. Until stockholders stand up and hold corporate leaders responsible then these abuses will continue.
Until then the government will bail out these greedy corporations and waste tax payer money doing so.
We can call it the Ego Wars.Does that mean Sebastian would end up there?
No. He gets his own island. lol.
Still, it might make for some good TV.
Let's not forget the politicians who are also responsible for this. Their heads needs to be on the block as well.
Let's not forget the politicians who are also responsible for this. Their heads needs to be on the block as well.
I guess looking at hindsight, how would they have been able to do something unless they were investigating the lending practices of the mortgage companies and requiring additional government oversight of their lending.
I can easily see how that is going to slow down the lending process.
Let's not forget the politicians who are also responsible for this. Their heads needs to be on the block as well.I guess looking at hindsight, how would they have been able to do something unless they were investigating the lending practices of the mortgage companies and requiring additional government oversight of their lending.
I can easily see how that is going to slow down the lending process.
Many people(like McCain) saw the problem several years ago and wanted to stop it. The lobbyists from these firms filled the pockets of both parties to keep any legislation from coming about.
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Many people(like McCain) saw the problem several years ago and wanted to stop it. The lobbyists from these firms filled the pockets of both parties to keep any legislation from coming about.
Hmmm...perhaps we'll start with the lobbyists then. The good thing about that is we get a lot of ex-politicians while we're at it!
Many people(like McCain) saw the problem several years ago and wanted to stop it. The lobbyists from these firms filled the pockets of both parties to keep any legislation from coming about.Hmmm...perhaps we'll start with the lobbyists then. The good thing about that is we get a lot of ex-politicians while we're at it!
I like it! *digs thru shed for pitchfork, torches, and whetstone for the guillotine*
I like it! *digs thru shed for pitchfork, torches, and whetstone for the guillotine*Many people(like McCain) saw the problem several years ago and wanted to stop it. The lobbyists from these firms filled the pockets of both parties to keep any legislation from coming about.Hmmm...perhaps we'll start with the lobbyists then. The good thing about that is we get a lot of ex-politicians while we're at it!
We could get a bonfire going. It'd be a lot quicker than the guillotine.
I'll bring the marshmallows!
First up on my bonfire hit parade, the champion of Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae, the wonderful congressman from my home state, Barney Frank.
His hair alone should toast up several nice marshmallows and his hot air will keep the fire bright!
Amazing the thought that you could give no downpayment unsecured mortgages to 'needy low-income families' and that everything would turn out OK. Government and big business hand in hand singing hosannas. BOTH FREAKIN' SIDES ONCE AGAIN!
GO LIBERTARIANS IN 2012!!
Editorial on subject from New Hampshire Union Leader newspaper.
One month from tomorrow, U.S. Rep. Barney Frank, D-Mass., will be the keynote speaker at the New Hampshire Democratic Party’s annual Jefferson-Jackson dinner. It is a coveted and high-profile role previously filled by such notables as Hillary Clinton and Al Gore. The Democrats’ choice of House Financial Services Committee Chairman Barney Frank is, therefore, very revealing.
The party announced Frank as the keynote speaker on Sept. 11 — three days after the U.S. government took control of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, costing taxpayers untold billions. That takeover probably could have been prevented had Frank not worked to thwart every attempt to limit the risks taken on by the two government-sponsored mortgage giants.
For 16 years reformers in Congress have tried to improve oversight of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac and prevent the government-chartered companies from putting the housing market and the whole economy at risk. All that time, Frank was involved in efforts to block those attempts, and in the last eight years he was a leader of those efforts.
In 2002, shortly before accounting irregularities were exposed at both companies, Frank said, “I do not regard Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac as problems,” The Wall Street Journal reported. After the Freddie Mac accounting scandal in 2003, Frank said, “I do not think we are facing any kind of a crisis.”
But there was a crisis, thanks in large part to Frank, Sen. Charles Schumer and others on the leash of these companies. In Congress, they made sure there was no additional oversight, no additional limit on executive behavior and compensation, and no further restraint on the growth of the companies’ mortgage-backed-securities portfolios, among other changes.
(All of these needed reforms, by the way, have been championed for years by Sen. John Sununu.)
In fact, Frank & Co. made matters worse by pushing Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to take on greater risk. They wanted more loans to people who might not qualify for traditional bank financing. And, as The Wall Street Journal has pointed out, Frank “pressured regulators to ease up on their capital requirements — which now means taxpayers will have to make up that capital shortfall.”
Even now, after the government took the companies over (which Frank repeatedly said over the years was not a possibility), Frank opposes limits on the amount of money they can risk on mortgage backed securities — the one reform that might have done the most to prevent the current meltdown and probably would do the most to keep it from happening again.
Barney Frank is the very symbol of Washington’s deliberate refusal to prevent the collapse — the predicted collapse — of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. And this is the guy the New Hampshire Democratic Party showcases at its most prestigious annual event. That ought to tell you a lot right there.
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I like it! *digs thru shed for pitchfork, torches, and whetstone for the guillotine*Many people(like McCain) saw the problem several years ago and wanted to stop it. The lobbyists from these firms filled the pockets of both parties to keep any legislation from coming about.Hmmm...perhaps we'll start with the lobbyists then. The good thing about that is we get a lot of ex-politicians while we're at it!We could get a bonfire going. It'd be a lot quicker than the guillotine.
I'll bring the marshmallows!
I forget what it is called but there is a variation on the guillotine that was set up so the victim could watch the blade come to them.
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OK! ENOUGH ALREADY! Our financial system just got a prison-style beatdown by greedy people making bad loans and more greedy people buying and insuring those loans.
Is there any real solution to this beyond government regulation? I mean I personally don't like government interfering to a large scale in the economy, but this is just... ugh.
The problem was a relaxation of previous laws preventing this. Unfortunately we can not blame one administration on this incredible stupidity since multiple administrations relaxed laws over several years to cause this unadulterated incompetence to come about.
Found this tidbit...
Found this tidbit...
From the above article:
These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.
Thanks Barney. You're doin' a heckuva job!
Found this tidbit...
From the above article:
These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.Thanks Barney. You're doin' a heckuva job!
On top of that the 'social need' to increase the quantity of affordable housing drove up home prices. Increased demand yielded higher home costs and more demand for credit (benefiting whom?...). Insert the 'social need' element and you get an increase in mortgage failures, due to people getting into houses they couldn't afford. Add the greed/manipulation factor and other people default on the bullsh#t mortgages they signed up for.
5 years later the house of cards collapses.
What ticks me off is that the Dem candidates act like Bush did nothing. This article shows he tried. 5 YEARS AGO. I'm no fan of him, but I get real tired, real fast with this election year posturing/BS.
November 5 and it's over! :) Unless we have more hanging chads. :(
Both parties have a lot to account for. Personally I say let the market clear itself up, one of the main problem with this whole mess is that the reason the whole 'sub prime' culture of risky loans appeared was there was the feeling that Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae would pick up the bogus loans. Now if the govt bails out the ones in trouble now, just you wait. 700 Billion is just the beginning. Plus you are giving taxpayer dollars to the people who ran roughshod over the system in the first place? Why not have the govt give every family $50,000? That will jumpstart the economy quite nicely.
Will there be pain if the institutions go under? Of course. Will people suffer? Sure. Am I immune? Hell no, I work in the construction/manufacturing business. I look at it this way: When a doctor tells someone they have aggressive cancer, do they,
A) Recommend radical surgery/chemotherapy to try and save the patient and stop the cancer.
B) Prescribe a scad of opiates to dull the pain in the hopes that the cancer will take care of itself so the patient can keep doing whatever they want without discomfort?
This $700 Billion is a big handful of opiates for our cancerous mortgage system. Once the opiates are gone they will ask for another handful, wait and see. Plus they will keep smoking the Sub Prime Chesterfields because "They feel fine."
Neither party wants to fess up on this. No one likes this bill, it stinks to high Heaven. The spin doctors have been screaming about how Great Depression II is on the horizon if we don't PASS THIS RIGHT NOW!!!!!!! This bill is already larded up with every special project, pet bill, etc. known to man. It has more useless ornaments than the Rockefeller Center Christmas tree. And we are going to blithely pass this bolus of debt on down to our kids so we don't have to deal with it.
Well, the only silver lining is perhaps it will shake some people off the Republican/Democrat parties and swell the Libertarian ranks.
Well, the only silver lining is perhaps it will shake some people off the Republican/Democrat parties and swell the Libertarian ranks.
Yeah, GO BOB BARR! WOOOooooOOOo!
(Hehe)
Feh .. Bob Barr is a true Libertarian like George Bush is a Reagan Republican.
No it will cause people to become more insular and polarized causing fewer and fewer Libertarians.
I disagree. My hope is that when the whole rotten house of cards comes down (and mark my words, even if this ridiculous bill passes it will only delay and exacerbate the crash) that people will finally see that the two parties that have shared power in America since the CIVIL WAR have become so intertwined and corrupt that we need to look at other options.
Well, they passed it, for better or worse. From the early indications it did literaly no good, but the US stock market hasn't opened yet. I'm thinking the cancer is terminal and the opiates are not enough for the patient to feel better.
You know, I now feel sorry for whomever has to pick up the pieces of this mess come January '09. It's beginning to look like the presidency is going to be an apple with razor blades in it this time around.