In a recent turn of events, two of my villains have lived due to the compassion of my PCs. Tsuto was spared, but handed over to the guards. He eventually is to stand trial in Magnimar. And Lyrie has been encountered under Thistletop, and coward that she is, she surrendered to the PCs (after hearing that they had not killed Tsuto). They will most likely let her go, as she has bluffed and posed as a not-so-innocent scholar, recruited by Tsuto, not Nualia.
My question is, do I let the story end there? The temptation is to have Lyrie act upon her information and go to save poor Tsuto (whom she's infatuated with), assaulting the wagon/whatnot as it travels with him to Magnimar. I worry though, that I'm undermining the actions of the PCs. They went to trouble to capture and deal with them without bloodshed, and this could serve to punish them. It could send the message that you should kill them all, or else they come back.
I love the cinematics of it, with a Bonnie and Clyde style getaway to turn up later. But I also believe in being fair to the players; not every plan they come up with backfires because I'm the omniscient DM.
Opinions, oh wise ones?
In a recent turn of events, two of my villains have lived due to the compassion of my PCs. Tsuto was spared, but handed over to the guards. He eventually is to stand trial in Magnimar. And Lyrie has been encountered under Thistletop, and coward that she is, she surrendered to the PCs (after hearing that they had not killed Tsuto). They will most likely let her go, as she has bluffed and posed as a not-so-innocent scholar, recruited by Tsuto, not Nualia.
My question is, do I let the story end there? The temptation is to have Lyrie act upon her information and go to save poor Tsuto (whom she's infatuated with), assaulting the wagon/whatnot as it travels with him to Magnimar. I worry though, that I'm undermining the actions of the PCs. They went to trouble to capture and deal with them without bloodshed, and this could serve to punish them. It could send the message that you should kill them all, or else they come back.
I love the cinematics of it, with a Bonnie and Clyde style getaway to turn up later. But I also believe in being fair to the players; not every plan they come up with backfires because I'm the omniscient DM.
Opinions, oh wise ones?
Have Tsuto and Lyrie come back, but in a way that rewards the players. Perhaps the pair finds love, and turn over a new leaf together. The players could encounter them later and see that they are on the straight and narrow...maybe they even help defend Sandpoint against the giants (with a few more levels under their belts, of course). The actions of the players affect the world in a positive way, and everyone wins. And you get your Bonnie and Clyde moment. :)
Of course, Tsuto has some fairly serious stuff to answer for, but I don't think he is beyond redemption. Maybe all he ever wanted was a little love! *sniff*
Your player's characters are heroes...I think compassion should be rewarded more often than not.
Good luck.
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I'm in a similar spot, Tsuto got captured, interrogated and is currently in a jail. So far my plan is to have him hanged in Sandpoint because I do not think that Sandpoint sends all their prisoners to Magnimar for trial. Certainly not, I think when the evidence is so overwhelming.
I'll have him hanged while Lyrie, that human warrior are sent to sandpoint to investigate the sudden quietness of Tsuto / Quasit girl. Lyrie will want revenge on the players afterward and will ambush them when they are heading to Thistletop.
I'd agree that they should resurface in a non-threatening way sometime in the future. However, I'd suggest staging an encounter sooner rather than later, as the repercussions of their actions will be more apparent. That, and I think it might be a stretch to find a reason for Tsuto and Lyrie to be hanging around Sandpoint when they are both on the run—I doubt they would want to stick their necks out for the town in that case.
I could imagine them hiding out in the shadow in Magnimar. Perhaps feeding your PCs the information that they escaped and are at large somewhere in the city will be enough to get them to track the fugitives down; if not, adding the incentive of a bounty issued by the High Court of Magnimar might pique their interest and afford you the opportunity to flesh out Ironbriar a bit, either as a foil or faux-friend.
You could then have a fairly interesting side adventure where the PCs navigate the Magnimarian criminal underworld in search of the pair, and once they've cornered them, a group of mercenaries could show up to either claim the bounty for themselves, or to assassinate the PCs at Ironbriar's behest to prevent from unearthing the Skinsaw cult. Whichever motive, it should be clear that the PCs are outgunned and outmatched. Then having Tsuto and Lyrie side with the PCs to even the odds would provide an interesting choice for the PCs to make once the fight is over.
Hope you like the suggestion!
Tsuto got captured, interrogated and is currently in a jail. So far my plan is to have him hanged
I really like the idea that if they hand over a prisoner to the authorities, the PCs get to find out about the punishment. It fits with the slightly gruesome nature of ROTRL.
How about you break the cliché and *not* have her rescue Tsuto. Then when the PCs are in Magnimar they just happen across a public hanging - of Tsuto. Of course Lyrie will have followed Tsuto to Magnimar, tried to bust him out of jail but failed. As the PCs move closer to see who is being hanged, who should they come across but Lyrie, distraught and past the point of breakdown. She is now a broken woman, pathetic and of no danger. Maybe she tries to rush the scaffold to reach Tsuto, only to be cut down by the local guard.
That way the PCs see the psychological trauma they caused by their kindness and adherence to the law. Don't give the chance to just kill them when they try to get revenge. Twist the dagger more subtly...
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If you want to have the pair come back in a useful manner to the PCs, have Tsuto sentenced to work with the Black Arrows of Fort Rannik (and Lyrie join with him due to love, it happens...) - maybe replacing one of the Graul Prisoners with him, or just add him as a bit of backup. Lyrie awaits at the Fort, ready to throw her weight into the battle as well.
That way, no matter if you increase the number of soldiers helping the PCs or not, it'll look like going the extra mile paid off not only for the NPCs, but also for the PCs.
EDIT: Why do i keep messing up that NPCs name?
My question is, do I let the story end there?
I don't think that there's a universal right answer. What would be the most fun for your group?
I think that you've identified a key point though, that their plans shouldn't always backfire. If capturing and imprisoning villains inevitably leads to those villains escaping and causing the party further grief then they'll get trained to always just kill everybody they oppose. It sounds like the PCs bested Tsuto, "winning" that encounter. It also sounds like they got bested by Lyrie, believing her bluffs and letting a guilty party walk away free.
This to me suggests that Lyrie is part of the story they ought to "defeat" at some point, whatever that means. Perhaps she and Tsuto move to Magnimar, where they disagree over how to proceed. Maybe she joins a certain murderous cult. Maybe Tsuto sincerely turns over a new leaf and dumps here, or keeps her around but disagrees with her evil bent. ("She can change! I just know it!")
In my game Tsuto, Lyrie, and Orik have all escaped. Tsuto is actually back in Sandpoint, posing as a helpful returned prodigal son who was the victim in all this. Lyrie got badly burned by the PCs, and Orik smuggled her out of Thistletop while Nualia and Bruthazmus were busy getting killed. I'm not sure yet how I'm going to use them, but I don't think I'm going to spontaneously redeem them without the PCs actually having some sort of victory.
Everybody's game is different though, so it's really down to what your players would most enjoy.
I don't see any reason why Lyrie couldn't go to Sandpoint; I don't see why she would be wanted there, even if her involvement with Nualia comes out...last time I checked, folks weren't generally considered responsible for the crimes of their employer. And I don't get the impression the suspicions of the Pathfinder society are common knowledge in Sandpoint...
Tsuto would be worse. I personally think killing his stepfather is forgivable...the man murdered his mother. Some might say he had it coming. No one knows about his involvement in the initial raid unless the PCs share this information...the killing of the glassworkers would warrant a death sentence *if* Tsuto's involvement becomes known. In my game, Ameiko doesn't know Tsuto was directly involved with killing the workers, though that may change depending what the players tell her.
I'd say Lyrie could walk into Sandpoint with impunity, while at the very least Tsuto would be arrested and tried for "manslaughter."
I'd say Lyrie could walk into Sandpoint with impunity, while at the very least Tsuto would be arrested and tried for "manslaughter."
...unless Tsuto has managed to get away with everything. In my game, the PCs were slow to get to the glassworks and so never had anything to directly connect him with what happened there. He actually helped his sister escape from being sacrificed to Lamashtu, so there's something he can leverage to "prove" that he's one of the good guys.
I agree that there's nothing stopping Lyrie from walking into Sandpoint. I might have her and Orik move there somewhat permanently, perhaps getting some sort of contract with the Sczarni.
**Potential Spoilers**
If he's brought back to Magnimar have a certain Justice Ironbriar take interest in the case. Ironbriar will have heard about what has happened in sandpoint from Foxglove so it would stand to reason that any survivors might prove to be a potential recruit. You could even have the PCs escort Tsuto to Magnimar and have them meet Ironbriar, maybe even count him as a friend or potential contact. That way the reveal of Ironbriar being in charge will be even more dramatic.
If you want to strengthen Ironbriar when the PCs encounter him have Tsuto in the room with him. Maybe for his initiation into the cult Tsuto has to kill someone close to him, like Lyrie.
The PC's could hear about that and it could be another angle when they arrive in Magnimar.
Nice, Cainus! If we combine this with WormysQueue's idea that Tsuto is Ironbriar's son then this could really cascade things.
I might not use both ideas, but it's certainly worth a long, hard ponder.
**Potential Spoilers**
If he's brought back to Magnimar have a certain Justice Ironbriar take interest in the case. Ironbriar will have heard about what has happened in sandpoint from Foxglove so it would stand to reason that any survivors might prove to be a potential recruit. You could even have the PCs escort Tsuto to Magnimar and have them meet Ironbriar, maybe even count him as a friend or potential contact. That way the reveal of Ironbriar being in charge will be even more dramatic.
If you want to strengthen Ironbriar when the PCs encounter him have Tsuto in the room with him. Maybe for his initiation into the cult Tsuto has to kill someone close to him, like Lyrie.
The PC's could hear about that and it could be another angle when they arrive in Magnimar.
Good idea....anything that fleshes out Ironbriar is ok by me.
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Possibly silly question here, but isn't Tsuto in love with Nualia?
Why in the world would he hook up with Lyrie?
How I'd play it: Lyrie busts him out of the clink, only to get the cold shoulder. Lyrie goes ballistic, but Tsuto leaves her, going off to find some way to raise Nualia. Lyrie comes back to the party, admits what she did, and asks for some kind of revenge. Party has opportunity to redeem Lyrie - maybe she can find a non-bloodthirsty alternative? - and put Tsuto down once and for all. Or catch him for the law again. After all, he won't be getting rescued a second time...
Don't forget too that the Skinsaw Man is going to be on the scene at any moment, and both Lyrie and Tsuto are potential victims (Lyrie especially). If she dies before the rescue happens, all the rest becomes moot...
Possibly silly question here, but isn't Tsuto in love with Nualia?
Why in the world would he hook up with Lyrie?
1. Nualia is dead.
2. Lyrie is hot and wants him.3. Tsuto is shallow.
It's not perfect, but if it works for your plots then there's justification enough, I think. I'm having a similar issue hooking up Lyrie and Orik, particularly since Tsuto is alive and well. Tsuto abandoned her though, and Orik saved her life twice. I'm just going with it.
UPDATE: The PCs strongarmed Lyrie into going back to Sandpoint, but they weren't overly mean about it. They're even interested in having her study ancient things on their behalf, retainer and all. For them, it's a path of redemption, not quite realizing how wicked she is.
There was a nice scene in the Jail with her under Sheriff Hemlock's scrutiny. He's ordered her to pay restitution for the blood money she earned from Nualia, and she'll be under a watchful eye while in Sandpoint. The perceptive PCs did notice her obvious looks of longing towards Tsuto, who was back in his cell. So all the warning signs are there.
Once Tsuto is to be transported to Magnimar for trial, she'll make her move. It may be doomed to failure. Lyrie's really intelligent, but this is where her logic fails.
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From all the comments in here, I just tried to compile some of the ones that I thought would work well together into a quick list. Sorry for the lousy formatting, I just sort of threw this together as I was thinking it, trying to work out how things would progress.
Tsuto- Ironbriars son(don't remember Ironbriars race but I saw this possibility mentioned above)
Tsuto is wayward, but connections to the cult gave him info on Lonjeiko used for attack
After capture, Tsuto is sent to Magnimar to face trial.
Lyrie follows to try and 'spring' him, going to tell Ironbriar of his sons peril, meaning PCs don't find her in thistletop, but do find journal talking of her and tsuto.
Ironbriar takes over as judge for the case, finds Tsuto innocent.
Tsuto gives Lyrie the cold shoulder wanting to try and find a way to bring Nualia back.
Lyrie comes to the PCs, seeking revenge for being scorned. Tells them that Tsuto is out and that Ironbriar is his father(gives the PCs some doubt about Ironbriars corruption, may question if he is just looking out for his child rather then being part of the cult they will just be learning about)
Tsuto is brought into the cult('Help your old man and perhaps we'll see if we can get your girlfriend back, after all she would fit well with us').
When the PC's reach Ironbriar, they encounter a slightly beefier tsuto alongside him since this fight is generally considered to be a pushover.
I don't know if it all fits cleanly, I'll have to look through all my issues when I get home, but it could work for something of a subplot that the PCs could learn of. It gives them bits more information and sends them directly on the trail towards ironbriar as a reward for sparing the prisoner, while also letting what is normally seen as an easy boss fight(especially compared to xanesha) a little bit tougher.
Thoughts?
-Tarlane