Ok, I'm sure these kinds of threads been up before, but not during "my time" here at the boards. And I'm sure there's alot of old threads like this one to browse through but I thought I might as well start my own. :)
A couple of days ago a friend of mine started his new campaign, the thing takes place in the Empire, Warhammer world. We play a mercenary group lead by the son of the soon to be new Elector Count in the province of Middenland. In the group there's the son of EC, an engineer from the acadamy of Nuln, a knight, going for paladin, from Bretonnia and me playing a fearsome fighter from Averland.
This maybe doesn't seem strange at all for most, and nothing looks strange with this group reading that description, but the thing is, this is all there is. We've played 2 sessions, and the characters have spent a little more than a month together including the downtime, but my fellow players just can't seem to flesh out their characters, not even making them interesting a single bit. And this is what it always looks like.
I've tried to make them bring pics of thier characters, write a short history/background etc and think of thier characters goal and motives. But it seems like the most important things are how well thier characters sneak attack, turn undead, do massive damage or how much hp they have considering their level...
I've always drawn a drawing of my character and showing it to them while I explain what he/she looks like, his/her background, and what his/her goals and motives are etc... That seems to work quite good and they get enthusiastic about thier characters for awhile...
Do you understand where I'm getting at? And do you guys have some ideas on how to get my friends more "invlolved" in the bits and pieces between dice-rolling.
Try taking it up with your DM? I mean, he is the 'referee' of the game and if he says that his players have got to come up with some sort of written background, a picture, then his players haven't got much choice if they want to play.(This works for my party)
If they make it clear they're not up for this sort of thing, then maybe you could try finding another party to play with?
Try taking it up with your DM? I mean, he is the 'referee' of the game and if he says that his players have got to come up with some sort of written background, a picture, then his players haven't got much choice if they want to play.(This works for my party)
If they make it clear they're not up for this sort of thing, then maybe you could try finding another party to play with?
Well, living in a small town finding a new group is a major issue. And since they're all good friends of mine I feel comfortable talking about this issue and have on alot of occasions, but they keep saying they don't think it's that important. Which I have to respect.
Mostly I DM, and the DM who runs the game now doesn't share my point of view either.
If there only was a way to lure them into fleshing out their characters for my needs, lol.
Last time we played I had one of my friends explain the looks of his PC to me, tomorrow I'm bringing a drawing of his character. :P Maybe that'll help.
I've found that actually offering an xp bonus for answering RP related "homework" questions between sessions goes a long way towards encouraging players to flesh out their characters. Those that do the work, get the xp.
--Fang
I have been in a similar situation. First of all most DMs will run campaigns towards what they like as a player. It is important to offer players a world consisting of their interests. You could be an incredible campaign designer but still have players not interested because you don't focus on their interests. So you need give and take. Only try to have the players flesh out their characters when you DM. As difficult as this may be, if you push too hard the may be turned off from your ideas altogether. Try to find out about what they want. DMG II has some good ideas for this and I recommend having them rate different game aspects on a scale of 1 to 10 as Gary Gygax did in Dragon a few years ago.
I like detail in my campaign be it the description of the surrounding or the flaws of the NPCs. I feel this helps characters make decisions. " I'm a good thief, I could climb that wall and break in." Unfortunately it is often difficult for players to process it all. If I am giving a wonderfully colorful description out of a module they tune much of it out. So I am trying to give them the basics and let them ask.
The person who just took a break from DMing, has folder upon folder of NPCs. He likes to have fleshed out NPCs and cares less about getting xp. The downside to his campaign is often the players take a backseat to the NPCs. After two sessions in my campaign he has already asked for there to be less adventuring and more interaction.
A third player who is DMing once a week has the least experience but best opportunity because the remainder of us do not have the intergroup squabble as in the other campaigns. He has a difficult time thinking on the fly. Also he is very guilty of DMing to have things that suit his interests. He introduced guns when the other three players said they did not like the idea. He plays a personal character, to do the things he wants to do in other campaigns.
The fourth player has never been a DM. He is the guy who comes up with 4 crazy ideas that will not work, but then has that one great idea. He has suggested running a gauntlet- a dungeon when everyone keeps going until every last character is dead. This is not wanted by the other players in the least. His interest is peaked when he has something he is recognized for, that makes his character special.
The best solution for you is to find out what your players want and combine that with your world/ideas. This is the only way to have a camapign enjoyed by both the players and DM. Again check out DMG II for some ideas. Remember to retain some of your own ideas otherwise you will be miserable. This is not mentioned much if at all in the DMG II and often the ideas feel like catering. Good luck.
I know what you mean man but what you gotta ask yourself is how many characters have they/you played this year?
Because i was like yourself into all that stuff but after many many characters it gets hard trying to make up more backgrounds etc and the other thing is you sound like your a true fan of D&D - and maybe their not.
But its threds like this that makes me realise how lucky i am with my group, we all like tog et the most outta our characters(dmg/hp/stats etc)but we always roleplay the character the best we can so maybe you need to lets them get the most outta it and they might become fond of their character's and who knows......
Last thing you really sound like my DM......Glen is that you??!!=)
My suggestion would be - use WFRP instead. The careers in WFRP make excellent backgrounds for PCs.
Failing that you cannot force anyone to invest in their characters, they either do or do not.
when you say they are not fleshed out; does that mean they have no background or history?
Fang; yes, I've done that once, and one of the players did the "homework" and asked for more, and more after that, which wasn't the point of the whole thing either. But I guess that would work for some.
Baramay; Thanks for the insight in your RP-group. I guess, when I DM, I easily "get lost" in my world of descriptions and my needs, not really paying attention on how the players reacted. I favor players who play their characters in every situation, which I think is fair enough, but maybe I favor them too obviously? For example, once a player played this Sorcerer, with 8 in stat wisdom(18 charisma though), Flaws to bring will save down, etc, his motivations to this choice was that he wanted to play a sorcerer that in the beginning was low-willed and a bit of a coward but who in time realize hes powerful etc. He did an excellent job, on the 9th level he took a feat to get rid of his flaw-feat, and played him more brave then before, on 12th level he took Force of Personality at this stage he had 21 in charisma(23 with items) and bam all of a sudden he had +6 will save. And I thought he played that well as well. I got too caught up in the development of this character that I forgot about the other players, sadly enough. But I've learnt my lessons, and just wanted it too be nice if the rest of the group could come up with some cool idea like this sometimes. I mean, this was not "Cool, I'm level 6 fighter and I can bash a trolls head in one blow" This was will save and playing a coward turning into a diva! It was great.
SteveO; Fair enough, altough I don't think we go trough as many PC's as other groups in general, but alot of the players wants to "die" or "leave the party" with their characters so they can play some other power-freak they've come up with :/...
Hehe nope, I'm no Glen-guy, I'm from Sweden! :P Although Glenn is a Swedish name as well...
Nermal2097; I don't know what WFRP is, but I'll look into that...
Valegrim; Yes, and when their PC's do have a history/goal/motivation/background or religious faith, they dont play it that way.
Brought the drawing to him yesterday btw, that went well, he really enjoyed that and proudly showed the others his character. And now they all wanted their characters drawn! :P Maybe I am converting them into the "love your character" kind of thinking anyway!
As a DM I tend to encourage character development by pulling my story ideas almost entirely from the background stories of the player characters. When the story is their story, I find, they become much more interested in the shadowy recesses of their characters pasts and their hopes and plans for the future.
As a player it's tougher, but one thing I have tried sometimes was to make a character whose background is tied to one of the other characters, where we came from the same hometown, or were brothers, or served in the same army--which gives good opportunities to talk about "our" characters' backgrounds, rather than "his" character's background.
Now I will say this. I have been in groups before where I'd thought they had just never played a "real" roleplaying game before--so I ran them a game full of rich history and deep storyline and interesting NPCs, and they did pretty well, but nonetheless shruged and said it was okay, but they preferred just a straight no-story dungeon crawl. Some people just have different tastes and sometimes the best you can do is try to enjoy those types of games for what they are and try not to overthink it, until you can find a better group that is and then RUN!