I have a question that a few of my friends and I have been kicking around with regard to using a skill check to repair damage to non-intelligent undead.
My friends are of the opinion that they could use a skill similar to the the Craft check one can apply to a warforged (see Eberron Campaign Setting, pg.46) to heal damage to undead with a Intelligence score of -- (i.e. non-intelligent).
I on the other-hand believe that the usage of such a skill check would fly in the face of the rule set down in the Librus Mortus (see pg.10) that states that non-intelligent undead cannot be healed or recover hit points unless it is through the application of negative energy - unless they have a special ability like fast healing (but that is a rare occurrence).
In my opinion, the use of a skill to heal damage does not really "heal", but facilitates the body of the one who the skill is applied to, enabling it repair itself due to their condition as a living creature or one with a "soul" still anchored to their mortal coil. To try and say that becuase warforged can be fixed with the usage of a skill so mindless undead should be ble to be fixed in the same manner is a farse in my opinion - they are clearly VERY different, as on has an Intelligence score and is considered a living creature, and the other is the exact opposite - no intelligence and not living.
It has also been said that un-intelligent undead should be able to be repaired, like bolting on a new arm or parts, and that the magic that animates them would allow said limbs and parts to function normally, due to the negative energy that would animate the new parts.
I think that this is untrue, for one, the undead that have been hacked up, broken, and are missing parts when they are animated do not gain functionality of those parts that are broken or missing. And to say that the magic would "spill over" to the new parts is a weak argument too - the spells animate dead are realitively low level and only animate the dead creature is it cast on - I do not see it as being a strong connection to the Negitive Energy Plane that would just attach itself to anything.
Now I do realize that intelligent undead heal hit points naturally (if that word even really applies) based upon their HD just as living creatures do. I believe this to be due to the fact that these undead are of a higher order and have a stronger connection to the Negative Energy Plan then their mindless counterpoints, and would therefore be eligible to have a skill (either Heal check or some other related skill) that would allow them to regain lost hit points at a higher rate).
I could really use an official call on the application of the rules one could use to heal or repair mindless undead, and if a non-magical skill check could actually be used to accomplish such an act.
If some of you fellas at Dungeon and Dragon have the time, I would really appreciate a more "official" answer to this issue.
Though anyones insight into this matter would be appreciated as well.
My "ruling" isn't official or, for that matter, final. If there's a strong argument in favor of healing zombies by tying detached limbs onto them, I may well recant.
Undead are not constructs -- the former are dead bodies kept animate by negative energy, while the latter are pseudomachines powered by a generally unspecified type of magic. In the case of warforged in particular, a craft check to "heal" them is just repairing damage to their bodies. I wouldn't allow a skill to hasten the recovery of a sentient undead such as a lich either -- just funnel in more negative energy. If you're convinced that holding body parts in place or some such is appropriate, I'd say to just use Heal at a penalty.
Regarding the "spilling over" of negative energy in a mindless undead: that's silly. There's a finite amount of negative energy within the creature -- that's why adding more heals the thing. Rearranging that energy won't add hit points. I might allow it to return use of a limb to a zombie, likely at the cost of some hit points (the energy being spread across a larger area and thus weakened in intensity), but it wouldn't be likely.
I think that what your friends are trying for isn't a zombie, it's a Cadaver Golem.
Well, the craft check to "heal" a construct isn't really healing it. You're doing repairs to make it more functional, just as one would do repairs on a car or a computer. Hit points is an abstract term that means a creature's ability to exist and continue doing what it wants/is supposed to do. So repairing the constructs that are warforged is just that- using fire and metal (or whatever) to patch them back together.
Now, I can definately see you problem with just stitching on parts to an undead creature to repair them. However, the thought of using sewing needles and surgical tools to repair the corpse in the same way you repair a machine has a certain allure to it, really enhancing the groteqsue feel of the undead and reinforcing some of the Dr. Frankenstien-style lore.
Now, you may want to require a specific spells or feat to do it (at which point just buying a potion or scroll of inflict moderate wounds becomes a much more viable option), but personally, I wouldn't have a problem with a necromancer (or someone he could assist or instruct) making checks to repair non-intelligent undead. Perhaps he has to make Heal checks instead (since Heal really just means Knowledge (medical)), or perhaps he gets a synergy between Heal and some craft skill, or perhaps he has to have both. The flavor and style of it, and whether to allow it or not, is completely in the realm of your jurisdiction. The topic is nebulous enough that you can make pretty strong arguments (relative to each other) in any direction you choose, so you can't really go wrong, especially as a DM!
I suggest you read the Stage of Decay thread here in general discussion; some people have posted some pretty well thought out and ssubstantiated ideas that undead like zombies heal normally over time; though, specific to your question, i know of no skill that would help or enhance healing such creatures. Mostly on that other thread we are discussing can a zombie be made to look good but it has some stuff on negative energy and sustaining/healing that might be of use.
Thanks you all for the replys - I was hoping to get a more official standing on this issue and so I have e-mailed this same question to the Sage in hopes that I will get a response - lately I have not whrn I have sent in a question, but I am hoping that he (or she) will look up from the dusty tomes of lore before him (or her) and provide me with a offical answer.
Please - I will beg if that is what it takes!
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A skill-based method of healing the undead would really amount to a house rule. It's an interesting concept, sort of Frankenstein-like, as has been pointed out earlier.
It should probably be a time consuming application of the Heal skill. Whereas long-term care on living creatures involves tending their wounds while they rest (maybe administering herbal remedies of the like), repairing an undead is like intensive surgery.
I would suggest introducing a feat to enable that application of the Heal skill.
I would suggest introducing a feat to enable that application of the Heal skill.
You could modify corpsecrafter or one of the subsequent feats to do just that (or creat a subsequent feat that would do just that).
Libris Mortis kicks bony behind.