this is my first attempt at DMing. Currently playing as a character (cleric) through the SCAP and loving it. So much in fact that I have picked up all issues of the AoWAPand have started to DM it.
Now comes the fun part. It is written for 4 players. I started with that but due to the awesomeness of the adventure, or my DMing skill, the players told 2 friends, who told 2 friends , who.....You get the idea. I know am DMing 7 players...
I figure to just double the enemies in each encounter within reason. 2 lurkers instead of 1. I threw in some kuo-toas with the small water elemental, and some more of the giant bombadier beetles with the crazed egg earth elemental, etc...
No wmy players are stating that they arent getting XP fast enough, nor treasure. I told them that I added monsters but due to the size of the party, the XP wouldnt be as fast as if there were only 4 of them obvioulsy.
Heres the question:
How can I increase XP output without killing the party by way of larger encounters ???
thanks in advance for the wisdom,
this is my first attempt at DMing. Currently playing as a character (cleric) through the SCAP and loving it. So much in fact that I have picked up all issues of the AoWAPand have started to DM it.
Now comes the fun part. It is written for 4 players. I started with that but due to the awesomeness of the adventure, or my DMing skill, the players told 2 friends, who told 2 friends , who.....You get the idea. I know am DMing 7 players...
I figure to just double the enemies in each encounter within reason. 2 lurkers instead of 1. I threw in some kuo-toas with the small water elemental, and some more of the giant bombadier beetles with the crazed egg earth elemental, etc...
No wmy players are stating that they arent getting XP fast enough, nor treasure. I told them that I added monsters but due to the size of the party, the XP wouldnt be as fast as if there were only 4 of them obvioulsy.
Heres the question:
How can I increase XP output without killing the party by way of larger encounters ???
thanks in advance for the wisdom,
Young Padawan, you are about to invoke the long honored DM rule #1 on your group of players:
DM Rule #1: The DM has the FINAL word on ANY game issue, period.
Apply this rule to your players' issues and you will find easy resolution:
Players: "We arent getting XP fast enough, nor treasure."
DM: "By whose standards? Yours? The Core Books? All bunk. In my world, you gain XPs and treaure at a rate that is appropriate for my campaign setting and my table."
Rule #1 aside...have you increased the CR of the encounters that you have boosted with more or added monsters? The higher CR generates more XPs (that still must be divided amongst party members); the treaure is ALL up to you - don't let player griping force you to be more "generaous" with treaure. I suspect that your collective age is fairly young, which means that there is an urge to slide into "Monty Haul" gaming (where DMs award outrageous treaure, resulting in hyper-rich characters and no game balance) - DON'T DO IT! JUST SAY NO!
Here is a great link for calculating XPs:
http://www.d20srd.org/encounterCalculator.htm
M (DMing since 1983)
example...
1 lurking strangler = CR 2
so I added another....
then I gave them ((xp for CR) * 2 )/ 7 party members....
Are you saying that a 2 CR creature encounter may be higher then the XP value of 2 CR 2 creatures ??
thanks
example...
1 lurking strangler = CR 2so I added another....
then I gave them ((xp for CR) * 2 )/ 7 party members....
Are you saying that a 2 CR creature encounter may be higher then the XP value of 2 CR 2 creatures ??
thanks
Sounds to me like you're doing it correctly...just double the number of monsters (or add more monsters of the same or similar CR) so that the XP gets doubled. You should also double the treaseure, although AoW has way too much treasure to begin with (according to the wealth guidelines in the DMG). If you're doing this and your players are complaining, that's their problem, not yours. If they don't like it, they can take a hike and you can go back to 4-5 players.
What you DON'T want to do is start replacing CR 2 monsters with CR 4 monsters, for example. This would also double the XP, but could quickly lead to player deaths as the tougher monsters may have abilities the PCs (even 7 of them) can't handle. Like say, a harpy's song ability, which could end up hypnotizing all 7 of them.
If you find your party is not at the appropriate level to tackle the challenges when you get to the next adventure, you can do two things to fix the problem:
--side quests
--give out enough story award XPs to raise them to the next level, "for accomplishing plot goals." (I.e. "since you figured out Zosiel's name and were able to open his sarcophagus and recover the valuable items inside, here's 500 XP each. You're now 3rd level and are ready to take on the next phase of your quest.")
Umm...Before you go adjusting encounters, you should probably take a look at the other AoW threads. The path is hard and requires smart playing. Most DM's have had the PC's at 2nd level before they start. I'd suggest running the first couple of adventures as is. Make sure you're familiar with the encounters and the creatures (especially their special abilities). And after that see what needs adjusting. The guidelines say 4-6 characters, but Erik Mona was on here saying you should have 6. 7 isn't really a huge stretch, and if it is the CR's and XP will eventually balance out (PC's find fight too easy, split up xp and find themselves behind, next fight is at the right level of difficulty, and so on).
Our group had the same problem in RotToEE. The DM resolved it by increasing the number of monsters - though we were also doubly penalized at first because he was also maxing out their HD. It sounds to me that you are doing all in your power to ensure that your players are getting what they deserve. Besides, it sounds like you are also on the first adventure. Remind them that they won't find any Holy Avengers or Portable Holes in an adventure that's designated levels 1 to 3.
I'm a relatively new DM also, and am playing with vetran gamers who know how to work the system to get what they want. One thing I've noticed is everyone is generally just playing to have a good time with their character while driving the DM nuts. They are also motivated by their own goals, and grouping their needs together helps them use each other and play off one another. I also decide spontaniousley to throw in the chance for a player to prove their guys worth with a good deed or something that helps develop their character alignment towards the story. If they prove themselves enough I reward bonus points so they work to play their characters more personally. Like the whim of a god or apocalyptic force driving destiny.
Noneedfor,
Seven players is a lot of players, especially for a new DM. I think you're making great decisions concerning encounters. Whispering Cairn is the first module, and thus it's slow. At my table, the first two six-hour sessions boasted only 1 encounter: the lurking stangler. Rightly so. Some PCs have under 20 hp, and overall, they shouldn't be eager to fight. The first few games of any campaign should be slow and steady.
I wouldn't tell your players, "This is my table and XP flows at the rate I designate." Don't be abrasive like that. Simply explain that the Whispering Cairn has been plundered in the past and many of the lairing monsters have been killed or driven out.
Also, remember the CR for defeating/disabling traps. That's extra XP. Give bonus XP for good ideas, knowledge checks, diplomacy checks, bluff checks, disguise checks, etc., AND good role-playing.
Definitely don't let your players dictate how you run your table. However, don't butt heads with them. I've made that mistake, and it's just uncomfortable for everyone. Give your players explainations in-game. A PC dies, and the player says, "That is such garbage." DM responds, "No doubt that would be your PC's final thought. Next." ;-)
"There is always a bigger fish." -Qui-gon Jinn, Jedi Master ;)
I belive that xp should flow freely, but that items should be held in more check. In the group I DM, I run a few things that might help you, among others:
XP awards: An XP award equals 20xlevel of character.
1) Each session the players get to award one amongst them with one award, for anything they find commendable. I have no say in this, but they must all back the choice.
2) Throughout a session, I will give xp awards for things I like, generally; good roleplaying, ingenuity, good planning, good use of non-combat skills/abilities, sacrifice for the group. A normal 4-hour session will see 1-4 xp awards per player (more in RP heavy sessions, lesser in combat heavy sessions).
3) The players get a "pool" of 1 award per player at the beginning of a game. Xp awards from this pool can be dealt out like 1 (see above), but the pool will only get bigger if the players complete an adventure/campaign, or do something as a team that is spectacular.
I hope this can help you.