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Good question, not specifically answered in the rulebooks as far as I am aware. I personally would allow it, as it intended to allow sorcerer to get rid of spells which are no longer as useful as newer high level spells - like getting rid of Invisibility once Greater Invisibility is learned. It seems a bit rough to expect a character to keep those lower level spell just because he's taken a level of Archmage instead of sorcerer.
"Upon reaching 4th level, and at every even-numbered sorcerer level after that (6th, 8th, and so on), a sorcerer can choose to learn a new spell in place of one he already knows. In effect, the sorcerer "loses" the old spell in exchange for the new one. The new spell’s level must be the same as that of the spell being exchanged, and it must be at least two levels lower than the highest-level sorcerer spell the sorcerer can cast. A sorcerer may swap only a single spell at any given level, and must choose whether or not to swap the spell at the same time that he gains new spells known for the level."
and also
When a new archmage level is gained, the character gains new spells per day (and spells known, if applicable) as if he had also gained a level in whatever arcane spellcasting class in which he could cast 7th-level spells before he added the prestige class level. He does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained. If a character had more than one arcane spellcasting class in which he could cast 7th-level spells before he became an archmage, he must decide to which class he adds each level of archmage for the purpose of determining spells per day.
IMC, I would allow the Sorceror to unlearn a spell.
A strict reading of the rules, however, indicates the unlearning is a function of Sorceror level, not caster level. This make the unlearning processs similar to wizards' learning new Metamagic/Item Creation feats - something not improved upon by increasing caster level only.
In a similar vein, does a wizard get free spells added to his spellbook? Does your familiar beef up, or does it fall behind and become likely to die in the next fireball? Neither of these are addressed either, leading the default answer to be "no", but all DMs I play with prefer to answer yes.
In a similar vein, does a wizard get free spells added to his spellbook? Does your familiar beef up, or does it fall behind and become likely to die in the next fireball? Neither of these are addressed either, leading the default answer to be "no", but all DMs I play with prefer to answer yes.
By a strict interpretation, again with the 'no'. The wizard learns the new spells as part of levelling, not based on caster level. IMC, I would allow it.
The familiar issue is much more specific. A familiar's power is based on the class level of the sorceror/wizard, not on their caster level. As such, the rules for increasing caster level states that the familiar would <B>[Edit]</B> not <B>[/Edit]</B>become more powerful.
"Upon reaching 4th level, and at every even-numbered sorcerer level after that (6th, 8th, and so on), a sorcerer can choose to learn a new spell in place of one he already knows. In effect, the sorcerer "loses" the old spell in exchange for the new one. The new spell’s level must be the same as that of the spell being exchanged, and it must be at least two levels lower than the highest-level sorcerer spell the sorcerer can cast. A sorcerer may swap only a single spell at any given level, and must choose whether or not to swap the spell at the same time that he gains new spells known for the level."and also
When a new archmage level is gained, the character gains new spells per day (and spells known, if applicable) as if he had also gained a level in whatever arcane spellcasting class in which he could cast 7th-level spells before he added the prestige class level. He does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained. If a character had more than one arcane spellcasting class in which he could cast 7th-level spells before he became an archmage, he must decide to which class he adds each level of archmage for the purpose of determining spells per day.
IMC, I would allow the Sorceror to unlearn a spell.
A strict reading of the rules, however, indicates the unlearning is a function of Sorceror level, not caster level. This make the unlearning processs similar to wizards' learning new Metamagic/Item Creation feats - something not improved upon by increasing caster level only.
I don't have any idea where to find the quote - if it's even available. I very distinctly remember Andy Collins talking on a thread over on the WotC boards, though, shortly after 3.5 hit the streets. This (the sorcerer thing was one of the things that was asked, and Andy specifically said the ability to replace spells is part of spellcasting for bards and sorcerers, not a class feature. Therefore, the +1 caster level prestige classes allows you to swap spells still.
The basis for that ruling is that the stuff you quoted above about swapping spells is contained within the "spellcasting" section under the sorcerer. When you get "+1 caster level" it effects everything described within the "Spells" section of the class.
Extending this logic, it would seem that technically wizards do not add new spells to their spellbook for free when they gain a level. The text is under the sub-heading of "Spellbooks" not "Spells," and here's what it says:
A wizard begins play with a spellbook containing all 0-level wizard spells (except those from her prohibited school or schools, if any; see School Specialization, below) plus three 1st-level spells of your choice. For each point of Intelligence bonus the wizard has, the spellbook holds one additional 1st-level spell of your choice. At each new wizard level, she gains two new spells of any spell level or levels that she can cast (based on her new wizard level) for her spellbook. At any time, a wizard can also add spells found in other wizards’ spellbooks to her own.
That said, I don't think I've ever seen a DM that doesn't allow the two free wizard spells when gaining a level in a prestige class...
Unfortunately, I wouldn't know where to find the exact quote from Andy to verify my memory is working in this case - if it even exists still, since WotC regularly purges their forums.
The basis for that ruling is that the stuff you quoted above about swapping spells is contained within the "spellcasting" section under the sorcerer. When you get "+1 caster level" it effects everything described within the "Spells" section of the class.
I concur. This is precisely the same interpretation I have of the RAW pertaining to this question. The swapping of spells every even level is a function of the "Spellcasting" class feature of a sorcerer, and thus a PrC that continues the "Spellcasting" feature also allows the swapping to continue. As for wizards gaining new spells, I have always considered that the portion about gaining new spells every level should be included under a wizard's "Spellcasting" class feature. After all, the spellbook itself is not a seperate class feature but is, in fact, merely an aspect of the wizard's "Spellcasting" class feature.
So while the rules say that unlearning and free spellbook additions are class features, I'd suggest adding them as core components of intuitive casting and book casting regardless of which classes or prestige classes the character takes. That's certainly my house rule, and I wish it didn't have to be a house rule. Or maybe it's not a house rule, as VedicCold suggests. That would be nice.
With familiars, I'm going to call this one of the "proud nails" of the D&D system. A familiar spirit in western mythology is a spirit that takes the form of an animal to teach the arts of magic to an otherwise clueless human. A familiar in D&D is a pet with some magical abilities, but one that for the most part is too weak to be a major component of the character's power. Having not seen familiars used to good gaming or storytelling effect yet in the 20+ years I've been playing, this is one of the things I'd like to see quietly rewritten in the rules. As it stands, a familiar gives some bonuses but it prone to being forgotten, getting killed when not forgotten, and being a liability to a character who takes prestige class levels. I'd rather see them written up as a class option the same way school specialization works, with stronger bonuses and hinderances to make them worth keeping in mind during play; something that explains why a caster would keep such a creature around, whether that references the mythological roots or no.
Bonus marks for having such a good question.
Like the rest of the DMs posting I've always assumed this sort of thing was just part of being a caster and not specific to the class, though I see now that the RAW does not support that interpretation.
I'll probably just jerk the chains of my players for a short while by pointing out that they don't get this before giving in 'because I'm such a nice DM and a pushover'. Kind of like built in brownie points to collect from ones players ... which will help keep them a tad less vocal if subsequently a Demon tears off one of their characters arms and legs before gating back to the Abyss with their pilfered limbs.
In a similar vein, does a wizard get free spells added to his spellbook? Does your familiar beef up, or does it fall behind and become likely to die in the next fireball? Neither of these are addressed either, leading the default answer to be "no", but all DMs I play with prefer to answer yes.By a strict interpretation, again with the 'no'. The wizard learns the new spells as part of levelling, not based on caster level. IMC, I would allow it.
OK I've managed to get myself in trouble with this one.
Here's the relevant quote from the SRD.
"When a new archmage level is gained, the character gains new spells per day (and spells known, if applicable) as if he had also gained a level in whatever arcane spellcasting class in which he could cast 7th-level spells before he added the prestige class level. He does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained.
Basically the plan was to point this out to the players and then let them have it. That way the next time I killed on of their precious characters I could stifle the persistent complaining I am forced to put up with every single time I disembowel, decapitate, disintegrate etc. one of their characters.
Did not play out like I had envisioned - The players kept insisting that the spells they added to the wizards spell book were both new and unknown to the wizard before hand. My argument that these additional spells were in fact old and completely known fell kind of flat - I resorted to
"They're old and completely known because I say so and I'm the DM!"
That has the rather unfortunate effect of causing them all to start chanting "DM treachery and cheating!" in unison. Its really disturbing - I'm beginning to hear that chant in my sleep - it haunts me.