Druid Spells

So I just started playing my first-ever druid (menhir savant archetype from UM). He's a level 2 PFS character.

What spells are good? Now, as I peruse the 1st- and 2nd-level druid spell lists, I can't swing a dead cat without hitting a good 2nd-level spell. But what about level 1 spells? Which ones are good to prepare most days? They all seem so... specific. Suggestions?

Core:
Cure Light Wounds
Longstrider (especially if wearing Hide Armor)
Magic Fang
Obscuring Mist
Shillelagh

UM:
Frostbite (good debuff and some damage)

UC:
Deadeye's Lore
Liberating Command (immediate action niceness)

Those would be my favorites and enough so that it makes it hard for me to decide which to memorize.

Core:

Cure Light Wounds
Longstrider (especially if wearing Hide Armor)
Magic Fang
Obscuring Mist
Shillelagh

CLW is right out, because I have a wand.

UM:

Frostbite (good debuff and some damage)

Ooooh, I like! No saves, even!

UC:

Deadeye's Lore
Liberating Command (immediate action niceness)

Deadeye's Lore is intriguing... I might prepare that one on an "as-needed" basis.

Liberating Command is pretty cool, though specific. I could see maybe devoting one slot to having something like that up my sleeve. It'd be cool if it came up. :D

Thanks for the input!

Longstrider - is it really worth it? (I'm wearing a dragonhide breastplate, but same difference for movement.)

Magic Fang is also right out, as I have no natural weapons (or animal companion).
Obscuring Mist I've considered... what sorts of situations is it usually good for?
I guess Shillelagh could be good... it just seems so crude. ;)

I'm a fan of mobility, so the +10 movement is gold to me. Plus, casting this on gnomes, halflings, and dwarves will make them your buddies.

No animal companion... yeah, Magic Fang would then be over-rated. It might still get some use though depending on who you get in your group. There are a few classes with animal companions as well as the monk getting good benefit.

Obscuring Mist is good for nixing combat advantage of the foes over your party. If the foes surprise you, or have good position on you, this spell can be used to delay them and/or eliminate the advantageous position. It also can buy you time to escape or buff up for a combat.

Shillelagh... crude? You betcha. 2d6 one handed magical weapon at level 2? Awesome!

I'm a fan of mobility, so the +10 movement is gold to me. Plus, casting this on gnomes, halflings, and dwarves will make them your buddies.

Longstrider is 'personal' - benefits you but not your buddies.

I think Faerie Fire is an extremely good level 1 druid spell, but it's more what you put in one or more of those slots when you have, say, 3rd level spells available. I wouldn't really pick it at level 2.

Still, in the long run I think it's (situationally) pretty great for its level.

So I just started playing my first-ever druid (menhir savant archetype from UM). He's a level 2 PFS character.

What spells are good? Now, as I peruse the 1st- and 2nd-level druid spell lists, I can't swing a dead cat without hitting a good 2nd-level spell. But what about level 1 spells? Which ones are good to prepare most days? They all seem so... specific. Suggestions?

Entangle was extremely good in 3.5, and is merely good in PF. Be prepared to accept some variance from PFS GMs as to how effective it is in some environments.

Entangle was extremely good in 3.5, and is merely good in PF. Be prepared to accept some variance from PFS GMs as to how effective it is in some environments.

Yeah, entangle doesn't really look that good to me (I'm not familiar with the 3.5 version, though). I do think I'd prepare it, though, if I found myself at a table with multiple archers/casters. Tee hee hee.

Now that I'm past level 1, produce flame is looking good. Multiple attacks against touch that get past DR and can be either ranged or melee... seems reasonable for a single spell slot.

I'm also considering buying a couple of second-level scrolls, since my Place Magic ability would let me auto-pass the CL check.

Oh, by the way, for further advice-givers: it might be relevant to note that I'm running on a 14 WIS, so save-negates spells may not be the best options.

The APG gives us Aspect of the Falcon for ranged attacks, Hydraulic Push for battlefield control, and Flare Burst for good old fashioned dazing. Keen Senses might be good too, but it's more of a utility spell.

Treantmonk's Druid Spells Guide {Core Only}

I'm tempted to get a wand of Hydraulic Push with my Wizard. He'd call it a fire extinguisher.

Yeah, entangle doesn't really look that good to me (I'm not familiar with the 3.5 version, though). I do think I'd prepare it, though, if I found myself at a table with multiple archers/casters. Tee hee hee.

Keep in mind it has a truly enormous area of effect. Even in PF it's pretty awesome for encounters with multiple melee monsters; something is bound to fail its save no matter how low your WIS is, and that lets the party focus fire on the stuff that didn't.

Rory wrote:

Core:

Longstrider - is it really worth it? (I'm wearing a dragonhide breastplate, but same difference for movement.)

Thanks for the input!

You might want to follow up on this rule in the guide, page 19

Always Available Items
You may always purchase the following items or
equipment so long as you’re in an appropriately sized
settlement (see above).
• All basic armor, gear, items, and weapons from
Chapter 6 of the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook,
including Small and Large-sized items. This does
not include equipment made from dragonhide, but it
does include equipment made from the other special
materials, such as alchemical silver and cold iron
(see the Special Materials section on page 154 of the
Core Rulebook). All mundane (completely nonmagical)
weapons, armor, equipment, and alchemical gear
found in any other source that is legal for play are
considered always available

Obscuring mist is a great defensive spell. It provides a 50% miss chance and attackers can't use sight to locate you. Archers are hosed. Even against melee, the 20% miss chance provides a valuable layer of defense and negates sneak attacks (unless the attacker has shadow strike). This is great spell to use if you are trying to lure in ranged attackers or if it looks like your group might be overwhelmed.

The APG gives us Aspect of the Falcon for ranged attacks, Hydraulic Push for battlefield control, and Flare Burst for good old fashioned dazing. Keen Senses might be good too, but it's more of a utility spell.

Correction: Flare Burst doesn't actually daze, it dazzles, which is worse. I stand by Aspect and Hydraulic Push though.

@jjaamm: Like so many others before you, you're confusing "always available" with "available at all". Dragonhide not being on the always available list just means that I don't automatically have access to it from the get-go; I have to either spend PA to acquire the item, have sufficient fame to purchase it with gold, or have it on a chronicle (and purchase it with gold). It does not mean that it's not legal for play.

@Marius Castille: I've thought about Obscuring Mist, but as you note, it seems to be mostly good for escaping. And perhaps this is a tad metagamey, but there's not much room for escapes in PFS scenarios.

Rory wrote:

I'm a fan of mobility, so the +10 movement is gold to me. Plus, casting this on gnomes, halflings, and dwarves will make them your buddies.

Longstrider is 'personal' - benefits you but not your buddies.

Well drats. Thanks!

@jjaamm: Like so many others before you, you're confusing "always available" with "available at all". Dragonhide not being on the always available list just means that I don't automatically have access to it from the get-go; I have to either spend PA to acquire the item, have sufficient fame to purchase it with gold, or have it on a chronicle (and purchase it with gold). It does not mean that it's not legal for play.

@Marius Castille: I've thought about Obscuring Mist, but as you note, it seems to be mostly good for escaping. And perhaps this is a tad metagamey, but there's not much room for escapes in PFS scenarios.

missed the PA option. Im a PA hoarder, so dont spend them much.

Jiggy wrote:

@jjaamm: Like so many others before you, you're confusing "always available" with "available at all". Dragonhide not being on the always available list just means that I don't automatically have access to it from the get-go; I have to either spend PA to acquire the item, have sufficient fame to purchase it with gold, or have it on a chronicle (and purchase it with gold). It does not mean that it's not legal for play.

missed the PA option. Im a PA hoarder, so dont spend them much.

To be clear, you can still buy dragonhide with gold, just not as soon as other armor.

There are basically three ways for something to be available for purchase:

1) Be on the "always available" list.
2) Be on a chronicle.
3) Cost no more than your current spending limit based on your Fame (there's a table in the Guide).

Using option #3, I bought a dragonhide buckler (330gp, if memory serves) once I'd gotten 4 Fame, since 4 Fame means you can buy anything costing 500gp or less.

A lot of the specific spells are GREAT as scrolls. You don't need faerie fire all the time, but when you do, you NEED it.

For every day, I like shilleleagh, produce flame, CLW, and entangle. If urban, take hydraulic torrent.

As a Druid, you will need to predict the upcoming terrain as best you can. You will have spells for wild areas, stone and rock, and air/water spells. This becomes more important over time.

jjaamm/Keldar wrote:

Jiggy wrote:

@jjaamm: Like so many others before you, you're confusing "always available" with "available at all". Dragonhide not being on the always available list just means that I don't automatically have access to it from the get-go; I have to either spend PA to acquire the item, have sufficient fame to purchase it with gold, or have it on a chronicle (and purchase it with gold). It does not mean that it's not legal for play.

missed the PA option. Im a PA hoarder, so dont spend them much.

To be clear, you can still buy dragonhide with gold, just not as soon as other armor.

There are basically three ways for something to be available for purchase:

1) Be on the "always available" list.
2) Be on a chronicle.
3) Cost no more than your current spending limit based on your Fame (there's a table in the Guide).

Using option #3, I bought a dragonhide buckler (330gp, if memory serves) once I'd gotten 4 Fame, since 4 Fame means you can buy anything costing 500gp or less.

the confusion is you said brestplate-700 gold. needing 9 fame, which is 3rd level minumim. have never seen it on any chroncle sheet,so posted. sorry for derailing.

As a Druid, you will need to predict the upcoming terrain as best you can. You will have spells for wild areas, stone and rock, and air/water spells. This becomes more important over time.

Agreed.

It's too bad there is not a spontaneous version of a druid. Kind of like what an oracle is to a cleric or a sorcerer is to a wizard ...

That would be a very cool class ... :)

It's too bad there is not a spontaneous version of a druid. Kind of like what an oracle is to a cleric or a sorcerer is to a wizard ...

That would be a very cool class ... :)

Had they not "used up" the word in some of the druid archetypes, they could've made such a class and called it the "shaman".

rkraus2 wrote:

As a Druid, you will need to predict the upcoming terrain as best you can. You will have spells for wild areas, stone and rock, and air/water spells. This becomes more important over time.

Agreed.

It's too bad there is not a spontaneous version of a druid. Kind of like what an oracle is to a cleric or a sorcerer is to a wizard ...

That would be a very cool class ... :)

interesting thought. Urban druid gets to spontaneous cast domain spells, and the weather one from UM.

Marc Radle wrote:

It's too bad there is not a spontaneous version of a druid. Kind of like what an oracle is to a cleric or a sorcerer is to a wizard ...

That would be a very cool class ... :)

Had they not "used up" the word in some of the druid archetypes, they could've made such a class and called it the "shaman".

I think calling such a class a Shaman, especially if it had some cool and interesting abilities pertaining to both the natural and spirit world, would be a perfectly fine idea. In fact ... heh ... I may have already done exactly that for the Winter issue of a popular magazine ... :)

Did I say that out loud???

So I just started playing my first-ever druid (menhir savant archetype from UM). He's a level 2 PFS character.

What spells are good? Now, as I peruse the 1st- and 2nd-level druid spell lists, I can't swing a dead cat without hitting a good 2nd-level spell. But what about level 1 spells? Which ones are good to prepare most days? They all seem so... specific. Suggestions?

What domain does your druid have? I don't think I've ever seen you play him. Just curious if you get anything useful from the domain for low-lvl spells or even a familiar.

One of my unplayed PFS backups is a Frog menhir savant, only reason I ask. This is some of what I've put together for myself:

1st
aspect of the falcon - if you're focusing on casting, this is decent for letting you do backup ranged attacks.
endure elements - you'll have a need to prep this for a lot of adventure paths. I'm tempted to get this early in a wand rather than CLW.
entangle - still a solid control spell, especially if there is a lot of ranged dps at your gaming session. I've seen a good number of archers and such in Twin Cities gaming sessions. Situational, but always there to prep.
faerie fire - I'd pay the 25gp to keep an emergency scroll of it around for anti-blur/invis. Probably not worth a spell slot early on.
longstrider - Movement is always useful and long duration. Another solid wand option for 2 PP.
feather step - Situational and probably not a "must-prep", but it could be another nice 25gp scroll option. You never know when an evil venture captain is going to pinion you between oozes and swarms in the middle of a sewer.
frostbite - a good attack spell option. I prefer shillelagh if I'm a melee druid and hydraulic push if I'm caster, but you can't really find fault with this spell.
hydraulic push - one of my favorite 1st level spell options for a caster druid.
liberating command - situational, but if you expect to face any grappling hazard it's nice.
obscuring mist - meh, I'm not as in love with it as TreantMonk's solid druid guide but it's a good spell. Situational, but if you get caught in a situation where you need the concealment and don't have it prepped you'll be kicking yourself in the butt. Another candidate for emergency 25gp scroll.
shillelagh - I'm a big fan of this spell. It's fun to hit things with a giant enchanted stick. If you're neglecting Str and avoiding melee, it's not going to look as cool.
summon nature's ally I - You get three rounds of riding dog or something else decent at 2nd level using place magic. That's not shabby. Obviously you're not prepping this, but I wanted to include it to make the point that situational/emergency spells can be converted into it. That adds value to prepping an obscuring mist or such.

2nd
Too much awesomeness to list. It's hard to go wrong with preparing 2nd-level druid spells. When in doubt, flaming sphere. If you have a familiar, burning gaze is hilarious. Frost fall and wilderness soldiers from UC look interesting, but I've never used them.

What domain does your druid have? I don't think I've ever seen you play him.

You haven't; I created him to play through First Steps this past Saturday. He hasn't been played in a normal Sunday session yet. His domain is Earth, with the Caves subdomain (go go Pit spells!).

Endure Elements, Faerie Fire and Feather Step all seem like good scroll options (though the rest of the table can buy their own potions/wands/scrolls for EnEl - I'm not buying a wand or batches of six scrolls to use on the whole party).

Frostbite is a definite winner, as it allows no save (save DCs are my weakness - only 14 WIS) and instead relies on a touch attack (17 STR).

Hydraulic Push also seems worth a slot, especially now that I've got place magic to make up for my low WIS.

I think I'll only prepare Entangle if there's a lot of range at my table and the scenario appears to be outdoorsy.

2nd

Too much awesomeness to list. It's hard to go wrong with preparing 2nd-level druid spells.

Tell me about it. Speaking of which: know a nice thing about place magic? If you're one level shy of getting a new spell level, you can activate a scroll of that level and use place magic to make your CL check an auto-success. ;) I'm seriously considering dropping a few hundred GP on some 2nd level spells right now.

Tell me about it. Speaking of which: know a nice thing about place magic? If you're one level shy of getting a new spell level, you can activate a scroll of that level and use place magic to make your CL check an auto-success. ;) I'm seriously considering dropping a few hundred GP on some 2nd level spells right now.

Nice catch, I didn't think about that!

(Wish I could have made First Steps.)