I've been running a group through Rise of the Runelords for the past year or so, and we're in the middle of the Hook Mountain Massacre. The group was short one member when they met Black Magga during the Turtleback Ferry flood, so they consisted of:
8th level Catfolk Ranger
9th level Fetchling Shadow Caller (energy drained down to level 6 in Fort Rannick)
8th level Aasimar Cleric
Both the cleric and the summoner have companions, a fighter and a wizard, respectively. The group was not getting anywhere near Black Magga, and tried to engage her from max range by having the ranger fire on her from about 450 feet away. Wanting to give them a bit of a break, I had her spend most of the 4 rounds closing with them (her swim speed is only 60 feet, so even a run is just 240) and then breath weapon them on the 4th round and leave. The group's attempts to deal damage to her failed miserably, and had the combat continued past the 4 rounds dictated in the module, they would have died. Nobody was able to make the DC 27 will save to resist the wisdom drain/confusion; only the Ranger escaped because he (wisely) bailed in the third round.
Now, the book actually has a contingency for giving the group extra XP if they manage to defeat Black Magga in those 4 rounds. How on earth is a 8-9th level party supposed to drop Black Magga in 4 rounds? Even with a bit of HP lost from falling down a waterfall, we're talking about a CR15 creature with DR 15 (cold iron AND magic, not OR), SR 26, Acid/Cold resist 20 (so the usual workaround for SR of using acid conjuration spells is nixed) and an AC of 30. With 5 attacks, at an average of +20 per attack (and a bite with a 2 level energy drain). I can't imagine a 9th level Fighter surviving more than 2 rounds of that kind of abuse, and that's with a pretty well optimized AC and HP pool. Add in the fact that if they'd engaged at close range as was intended, they'd have taken the breath weapon in round one and possibly spent the entire combat Confused.
Am I missing something here?
they aren't intended to do anything but chase it away....
the extra xp is kind of an accommodation, if your suicidal group manages to pull this off, throw 'em this extra bone.
There was a mounted paladin with horseshoes of a zephyr.
He did NOT manage to kill it, but he did enough damage for her to flee in four rounds.
From that, I infer that a flying glass-cannon mounted charger type paladin thing would be able to do this. He wouldn't really be any good at anything else, though.
My players did it in less than 1 round.
Paladin Crit on a Charge with a Lance & a Smite.
The Archery specialist Ranger Happened to Have Evil Outsiders as their Favored Enemy after a certain Quasit & Aasimar Pissed em off earlier in the campaign. He also Crit, but more importantly got a Full Attack sequence off.
And a Dragon Disciple who spent most of his wealth on a Robe of Arcane Heritage to get his breath weapon maxed out.
Poor Black Magga didn't have a chance.
My players did it in less than 1 round.
Paladin Crit on a Charge with a Lance & a Smite.The Archery specialist Ranger Happened to Have Evil Outsiders as their Favored Enemy after a certain Quasit Pissed em off earlier in the campaign. He also Crit, but more importantly got a Full Attack sequence off.
And a Dragon Disciple who spent most of his wealth on a Robe of Arcane Heritage to get his breath weapon maxed out.
Poor Black Magga didn't have a chance.
How did he overcome the mobility challenges of the flooded town? Even with horseshoes of a zephyr, the paladin I ran this for had a hard time closing and charging effectively...
Admittedly, I played in MapTool on a very specific map, so maybe Magga maneuvered effectively... I don't recall how the scene is written.
In any case, OP, a combination of paladinness and mountedness makes it possible.
How did he overcome the mobility challenges of the flooded town? Even with horseshoes of a zephyr, the paladin I ran this for had a hard time closing and charging effectively...
Admittedly, I played in MapTool on a very specific map, so maybe Magga maneuvered effectively... I don't recall how the scene is written.
In any case, OP, a combination of paladinness and mountedness makes it possible.
I believe he still had an allied cast Fly Spell up on him from rescuing the children on the boat prior to this encounter. IIRC, the Magga Appears soon after rescuing the teacher and her flock of students, so it was well within the 9 minutes left of it's casting.
There was a mounted paladin with horseshoes of a zephyr.
He did NOT manage to kill it, but he did enough damage for her to flee in four rounds.
From that, I infer that a flying glass-cannon mounted charger type paladin thing would be able to do this. He wouldn't really be any good at anything else, though.
Black Magga flees in four rounds regardless of HP, iirc. Otherwise the party I described would have been screwed. Only the ranger was capable of doing damage that was both cold iron AND magical.
To the OP: Negative levels do not actually lower ones level in Pathfinder they just imply penalties to all ability checks, attack rolls, combat maneuver checks, Combat Maneuver Defense, saving throws, and skill checks. In addition, the creature reduces its current and total hit points by 5 for each negative level it possesses. The creature is also treated as one level lower for the purpose of level-dependent variables (such as spellcasting) for each negative level possessed.
Even if these negative levels become permanent level is not reduced.
The party I run for is on fortress of the stone giants but I remember them slaying black magga in two rounds. It involved the paladin casting Litany of the Righteous, closing and then full attacking while smiting on the second round and criting twice while powerattacking with a falcion. The party archer took two full attacks with deadly aim and hit at least four times, twice in each round, one of which was a crit with many shot. The rest of the party ran around confused having failed their save against the breath weapon. I think the monk got some damage on it from panther style while he ate up the AoO's so the paladin could close but it couldn't have been much.
Our group knows how negative levels work in Pathfinder; a Summoner who is treated as 3 levels lower, however, is in a pretty bad position and he's been grouching about it for weeks. I'm not surprised that the Paladin was able to make the saving throw (though still, a 27 is nothing to sneeze at), but how far away was the archer? DR15 applying to each attack is also pretty brutal. It sounds like they were fortunate to get the crits in when they did.
Oh sorry about that your wording seemed to indicate he had lost actual levels. My mistake.
The details are fuzzy because this was back in the spring but the ranger was probably pretty close, not sure if he managed to avoid the breath weapon or just make the save.I would ask him but if I don't remember I doubt he will.
My players are vicious power-gaming rocket taggers and I've learned not to be surprised by it. I should note that we roll for statistics so it leads to some pretty beefy characters occasionally. The paladins last character was an arcane trickster who turned out pretty weak and I still suspect he ran into that pack of shocker lizards on purpose in fort rannick. It seemed pretty strange he would fail his reflex save.
I hate that litany spell BTW as that paladin has used it twice now to trivialize encounters. (He made Mokmurian his b^t$#) He uses a falcion with improved crit and his attack rolls are high and since he has a good aura he triggers it. Even though I've clarified with him that doubling and doubling is only tripling it's still always massive damage.
Still they are having fun and that's what counts.
The Shadow Caller is similarly ridiculously powerful (when at full strength). The energy drain (unless we're doing it wrong) has neutered his Eidolon pretty harshly, but his constant summoning of leopards/eagles/wolves with the Shadow template has made it bearable for him.
I'm impressed with your group's optimization though, taking down Black Magga in 2 rounds.
Having talked to the Ranger he said he made his save on a nat 20 (pure luck) but got around DR using clustered shots.
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A couple of archers with +3 weapons or cluster shot should make short work of her. As will a gundslinger using grit for touch attack at greater ranges. The casters should be boosting the archers. A good archer at that level should have around +20 to hit before buffs or range penalties. A greater heroism adds +4. Haste is another +1. With those two common buffs up, hitting shouldn't be too much of an issue. I was in a group that dropped her in two rounds. Helps that I rolled a high 30 something on my knowledge check so I knew most of her details.