There's something in the rulebook about not using the Locked Passageway if you are playing Solo with a character who has little chance of defeating it.
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I know when we play, if you have a basic card you love, and you KNOW you'll be adding it back to your deck, you might as well bury it instead banishing it. I have one player who LOVES his caltrops. I hate the situation where, say you used a basic item you LOVE (like the caltrops) and you ended up winning an item you dislike. I hate that, by the rules, you will keep the item you dislike, and can't go back for your basic item. I usually let people go back "to the shop" for basic stuff.
Thanks! I learned something new today!
You go in the box and find some cards with the Basic trait to replace the holes in your deck. It's on page 19 of the rule book.
how DO you set up an avatar anyway? I can't seem to figure it out.
We are clearly the weirdest gaming group ever. Or awesomest. You decide.weirdest = awesomest Weird at last, Weird at last, Thank God... weird at last.
So far, from what I'm hearing, the game is DESIGNED for you to win if you are smart. I can't think that making it any easier would make it any funner. I can see the that increasing player interaction would be fun, but part of the fun of a co-op game is the risk of loosing, and this variant seems like it would take the idea of dying/loosing down to zero.
I would imagine. I can't think of a scenario where she can't explore though. Move comes before explore, so she should always be able to move to a location that she can explore.
No PC needs to have a weapon to use base STR or DEX for a combat check. Where does it say this in the book? I read a line saying that without a weapon, you can use the MELEE skill or base STR, but i've never once seen DEX. It would kinda make the Monk's power pointless
Well a lot of times mental damage has the qualifier that it may not be reduced, so it doesn't always work against mind tricks. But sometimes it does :P If you'll notice, that is always on monster cards. When you suffer damage from failing to defeat a monster, that's "combat damage" which is why sometime the monster will specifically say "it's mental and cannot be prevented." Take Black Fang for example - before you encounter him, you might take Acid damage. That is not combat damage, it's acid damage. If you roll an 8, and it takes 12 to defeat black fang, you DO take 4 points of combat damage that armor can work against. It gets complicated when you start looking at things like the Siren. It's got a wisdom check on it, but its a monster card, meaning you the damage you take from her IS combat damage. It just also had the little addendum that any damage you take from her will be Mental damage, and can't be prevented.
You can always have those characters you want to trade with run a mission TOGETHER? Who knows - they might get something great?
Think of every spell you find as a scroll. Anyone can read the funny characters and have a spell take place, but once they do, the magic in the scroll has burnt out and it's just a peice of paper fit for kindling once more. The letters burn out and it's gone. This is how my DM always handled scrolls in DnD. Now if you get that spell in the hands of the right caster, they can memorize the little squiggles and cast it using their own internal energy (or their god's energy) and it comes into the world the same way. The only real difference is that the Caster doesn't rely on the scroll. Anyone can cast a spell, but if you aren't memorizing it and remembering it, USING the spell turns it into so much paper.
Also remember - what benefits one person benefits everyone in this game. You all work as a team, so when one person is doing particularly well, the others often share their success. If A and B have taken heavy combat damage and are at death's door, C can come in and do the fighting while they take a few turns to heal (or just wait out the clock).
I often think about that same question when I'm playing LEM and I know I'll need to use that cure spell again next turn.
I bought http://www.boardsandbits.com/product_info.php?products_id=22694 and made some pretty great ones.
@TClifford - Character death is one way this might happen. The other is when we have a variable sized gaming group. One week we have four players and complete some of the scenarios, the next week we have five (three the same as the previous week) and finish the adventure. Strictly speaking should I tell the two new ones that they don't get the prize? The vast majority of rewards are just "draw a random weapon from the box" and I could see THOSE rewards going to everyone no matter how far you are. The "level up" rewards (feats) should be reserved for those who are going to be there consistently - if you ask me.
I printed out some cardstock standees and got some little plastic card holders that work pretty good until then. I just hate the amount of table space the "token" card takes up.
Similarly, if I'm Ezren playing Force Missile ("For your combat check, discard this card to roll your Arcane die")... Under your interpretation, my "Arcane die" is d12 (not d12 + 3 + any feat bonuses), so those bonuses wouldn't transfer into Force Missile. Read though the example of play on page 20. I am not sure exactly WHAT the answer is- but it's pretty much in black and white there.
Fun Fact - it also doesn't have the "attack" trait.Yes it does... Corrected. I guess the only thing that works well against the monk is another monk.
You know, someone mentioned this game being similar to Sentinels of the Multiverse - another character-based cooperative game. I know in THAT game, the rule book says something to the effect of "this is a cooperative game, and it is up to the players to resolve things in the way that benefits them most" Perhaps we should just say "die" is whatever benefits the player most?
I've tried all the characters solo. I really like Lem, because you can always get the Cure spell back with his power. Expect long games with him though, because his fighting is not very strong. I love that using his ability, you can "cycle" though your deck REALLY fast. Really, having him and the Fighter back each other up is a really great combo. The fighter gets an extra 1d4 to everything, and the bard gets an extra 1d4 to combat checks. It's a win-win! What weapon do you usually have for Lem? He's had a dagger for ages with me, but the Sling looks good too. Once he gets his first power feat, I'll make sure he can use weapons and it'll open him up to all manner of bows.
I've gone though twice - once with the monk and priest, and once with the fighter an the bard. I've found the later to be the most effective. When I went though with the monk/priest, I felt like I was loosing almost every weapon/armor I found, and I WAS loosing every arcane spell I found. Note - when I say "loosing" I am referring to when you rebuild your decks after the mission is complete.
Is it much more difficult controlling more than one character at the same time? Should I be aiming at using 3-4 characters? Depends on what you enjoy. It's possible to solo with only one character, but I think you'll have a funner time with a pair. Controlling TWO characters is a breeze for me. If I had to wrap my head around four, I'd likely have a hard time keeping things straight. This game IS designed to be solo game. The druid is one of the worst characters to play solo with. She has utility and can heal, but she's got almost no way to roll high combat scores herself. If I had to suggest one character to go with alone, it would be the Rouge. She can recharge to increase her own rolls (since she'll always be alone at her location). This gives you another benefit of cycling though your deck for her few weapons quicker.
I went though and re-read the example of play in the rulebook. It indicates that when Ezren rolls his spell damage (his "arcane die" plus 2d4) he ends up totaling up his numbers and adding 2 to them (because his "arcane die is a d12+2"). This would lend far more credit to Quantum Ninja. I just don't want this to be so! Lini is just turning out to be such an awful character, and this handicaps her even MORE.
Well, I've never played "just one character" before. Every time I've played solo I've controlled at least two characters. I find it best to play a pair that can USE all of the boons you acquire. Ideally, you'd want a divine caster, an arcane caster, and a weapons-type to take full use of everything. I run with the fighter and the bard.
When my family got really into playing Smash Up, I spent like... $20 and got twenty packs of clear sleeves. I don't think I'll EVER run out of them. I wish we could have someone who's good with graphic design get us one big PDF that's just the "smaller" versions of the character sheets.
I would say so.
I know if you want to paint them yourself, Reaper has most of them available in their BONES series.
Or you can use the really, really nice character sheets that Paizo created and not worry about marking up your cards. Mainly because I don't have the room at my table for everyone to have a huge pile of full-sized papers in front of them during play. The cards are way too convenient, and cheap 10 cent sleeves are a great fix for permanently marking up your cards. The downloadable character sheets are great, but i've always seen them as a way for people to keep track of what is in their character's deck, and the feats they've gotten, when said decks need to be torn down and put back into the box.... or if more than one person wants to play the same character in multiple sessions (eg someone in my sunday meetup group wants to play the barbarian, but my friend john I play with on fridays also wants to play her). It might be kinda genius for people to print up tiny versions of the character cards that fit in a sleeve so people can mark them until their heart is content.
I don't mean to sound like a whiner or anything - but can we get a druid that doesn't need other characters to carry her though missions? That was my biggest disappointment in this game by far was how Lini is so underpowered compared to the rest of the characters.
I hear you, Vic... but sometimes you run across those rules lawyers. =(Why would anyone be a rules lawyer over a cooperative game? Some people's greatest joy in life is being right. I call those people "folks I don't want to hang around with."
Give Paizo some credit though - they aren't known to try and pricegouge their customer bases. The miniatures were originally aimed at the RPG players, and it's a pretty good prognostication that just because the card game came out, there will be any less players doing the pen and paper RPG. Once they realize there is a profit to be had by selling an 11 pack of minis, they'll develop one. Afterall, buying the random packs is next to pointless for someone who only plays the card game - the ONLY minis they need are the iconic characters afterall, the rest would be wasted.
Cooperative games are usually known as being brutally difficult. If you take a game like Ghost Stories or even Forbidden Island (on a more challenging mode) you usually end up loosing more than you win. The thing that keeps people coming back to co-op games is that they are a challenge and that you can't just auto-pilot your way to victory. The real only way that most co-op games are REALLY exciting is when you have a very real chance of loosing. What sort of win/loss rates have everyone experienced? I'm not sure if i've gotten really lucky, or if the game gets dramatically harder, but we've been successful almost every time we've played. When playing in solo mode with two characters, I've won every single game up though attack on sandpoint. When playing with new players in a 5 player game, we won all three attempts though the lost coast missions. In the five player games, our victory often came down to the last two blessing cards. At no time, did we get a victory when it wasn't that player's "last turn" (AKA- there were not enough blessings to make it around the table to get to them again). When playing solo with two characters though, i've found that I always end up with at least 8 to 12 blessing cards left over. We've never had a character death either. Long question short - How often do you loose? How often do you suffer character death? Do you think the game is too easy? Do you think it will get dramatically harder with each new adventure deck? What are your thoughts?
Ah, nevermind. Removed from game is forever. Found in a related post regarding what do with banished Basic cards once you start the Hook Mountain adventure. Usually if something is "removed from the game" it's no longer needed. For banes, it's because the difficulty of the game is going up, and you don't need the slow-pitch baddies with an 8 difficuty. Remember as well, for boons you CAN discard them. If you particularly like your thief kits, you CAN opt to keep them in. Also - you COULD always just "reset" the game. Take all the adventure packs out and put them in their respective boxes and play though the game again from scratch. It's not as if someone is asking you to rip up the cards. I hope you used pencil on your character cards though (I use a sharpie on a sleeve with the player's name on it.)
The henchmen have the same graphic layout, and not all henchmen are monsters. We do have at least ONE type of barrier-henchman.
Fun Fact - it also doesn't have the "attack" trait. You can use it to take down the monk henchman in 'attack at sandpoint" without increasing the difficulty.
[...] you'll have way more cards than you started with most times.You know you have to pare back down to 15 cards at the end of each scenario, right? Yes. That's one of the basic tenants of the game. I'm just saying that picking up an extra 5 cards and "building your deck" back down to the minimum size afterwards still gives the player a lot of control over what is in their deck. Do you hate that starknife? See if anyone has an extra weapon. If no one has an extra weapon, beg and maybe they'll let you replace it with a basic weapon like a sling?
Plus, I'd rather not "throw away" one session as a learning session with every new player. I think if you talk to most board/card gamers, almost every new player spends their first game "learning" the game. You can explain the rules in depth before hand, but unless you actually SEE everything working, you won't really understand them. Unless you are talking about Glory to Rome or Power Grid, almost every game can and should be learned by playing (don't get me started on Glory to Rome). We play games to have fun, and if you approach it with a good humor, learning/teaching can be just as fun as playing. Also - I think those preconstructed decklists choices are a little wonky too, I believe I read that a dev put the starknife in the ranger's deck because he was left with very few other options after having built every other deck. Usually, I build a "basic" deck FOR each player before we start, and let them have imput on it too "Ok, so you are playing our Cleric, you'll have the innate ability to cast a cure spell, but I can put the cure card in here too, or would you rather be more offensive minded? You can buff too if you'd like." As long as everyone is having fun and dosen't feel forced, everyone is winning.
Once you're familiar with it, the hindu shuffle is both very fast and a good shuffle for a small number of cards. This is super cool! I'm gonna practice this when I get home.
Depending on your character, your deck will look WAY different after a play or two anyway. Half of the monk's items will have been banished, and you'll have way more cards than you started with most times. I usually find that most new players can jump right in with the preconstructed decks, and learn enough about how the game plays to rebuild them on their own. That's just been my experience.
Mind you have you a similar issue with the Strength spell that adds +3 to all STR checks. Strength doesn't get you into any real stickiness though, because 95% of the things you'll play "as your check" for a STR enchantment are weapons. There's zero question about being able to cast Strength and then use a weapon. In DnD lore, there's no reason why you couldn't cast Strength on yourself, and then Fiery Weapon, and then go on a killing spree with your Longsword of Poot Noodeling. I'm willing to bet this will be errattaed eventually.
"banish" is to put back in the box. "remove from the game" is to put the card somewhere else separate from the box. I think one of the devs said that putting the cards in the character expansion box, or one of the adventure boxes would be best.
I'd love to hear a ruling on this! So far, it just seems like there are really no real "timing" rules for this game. It doesn't seem like you could "respond" to pulling an ogre with playing Glibness and then doing your force missiles. I never thought of using it to help Lem recharge is cards easier though! that's kinda genius. I just started using Lem last night and have to say that he's my favorite character thus far.
Most everyone at my table just uses the pile method. You lay out your cards into three little piles, lay the cards down in order into one of these three piles, and then pick them up in whatever order you want. Do this two or three times and you'll have a fairly randomized deck. You can also do a "side shuffle" where you hold the cards in your palm, and pick up "a few" cards from the bottom and throw them on the top. You'll end up picking a few from the center of the deck too this way. As long as you aren't getting the exact same cards every time, you end up creating a fair amount of randomness. This way is great because it's much faster than the pile method, though not quite as "perfectly random." I have a few friends who can't shuffle any deck no matter how big it is - they use the pile method. There are still others who don't sleeve their cards, and don't want to put much wear on them who use the pile method. Try these out and see what works for you.
Reveal this card to add 1d4 with the Magic trait to your combat check; you may not play a spell with the Attack trait or a weapon on this check. You can only ever have one card that says "for your combat check..." Any player could still play Strength or Guidance on you if they decided they wanted to... you could play it on yourself as well. I don't think I can think of a single "attack" spell that you can cast FOR someone else.
I had great luck with him for a while. I want to say I've used him two whole games and never summoned the devil once. With him, you essentially get a "free explore" every turn. It's not a FULL explore, but it's nothing to sneeze at either. If you are playing a hardy type (four card hand size), and you manage to play him four times without summoning the sandpoint devil, then it's already more efficient than using four blessings. The way I see it, if the SPD gets summoned, you'll loose a maximum of three cards in your hand (only three because he's already on the top of your deck). Once you you can play him (Hand size -1) times per game, you've made it more efficient than using allies/blessings.
He does allow you to encounter non-monsters, right? I don't have the card in front of me right now.
Every other ally that lets you explore requires you to discard them. He lets you get an extra explore every turn and not loose any cards in your deck (because you return him to the TOP of your deck). Sure, you run a 1 in 12 risk of loosing all the cards in your hand (which is what you will do if you come across the sandpoint devil), but if you get lucky, you could potentially have double the explores.
Two fire sneezes might get a little SNOTTY. PUNS!
I'm in no way saying you are wrong - I'm just saying many of the things everyone in this thread has used to justify he validity are things that most any other character can take advantage of. What I would really like to hear is a dev chime in on the design decision for her. Why was she designed the way she was? What was the logic in some of the decisions? And yes, the +1d4 is a huge advantage. Last time I played with her, I was never able to even keep an animal in my hand due to the constant damage I was unable to mitigate. If you never take damage, she's a great "jack of all trades" due to that extra die. Considering she's got zero mitigation and all her innate rolls are so low - taking a lot of damage is fairly likely. |