Tom Carpenter's page

Thanks so much for these, Shisumo, excellent work!

I'll definitely be printing these out and taking with me to PaizoConOz and other conventions for new players to choose from.

Linkified:

• Pathfinder Society Pregens for Pathfinder RPG
• Pathfinder Society Pregens for the Advanced Player's Guide

Cheers,
DarkWhite

Is there an updated link for these files?? The ones in the thread go to a Nissan page..... I know I had these on my computer but can't find them anywhere. I am trying to update a couple of old D&D adventures to Pathfinder and having these for new players would really simplify things.

Rick was a great player, but a greater person. Always easy to talk to and be around. He had a strong knowledge of the rules as a player and as a GM but always played and ran to tell a memorable story. We all always looked forward to having Rick at the table whether it was at a convention, game store or when he often opened his home to us. While his battle was long, he never let it affect those around him and was always positive. He was a true asset to our community, a true friend, and will be sorely missed.

Hey Jason, way to go!

Now you don't need to ask me all those annoying questions every gameday...

:)

Congratulations to Rick Lighthiser, who will be the new Venture Lieutenant for Northern New Jersey!

Rick has been running PFS games at local game stores and filling in at Regional Conventions for the last few years and has become very knowledgable with the local players and GM's.

I am proud to have him as my new Venture Lieutenant and look forward to expanding PFS to all our local stores!

Welcome aboard Rick. Congratulations!

I wanted to take a minute to welcome aboard the new Venture-Captain assigned to New Jersey. I will let Ismael Soler introduce himself, advise about any websites he will utilize for coordinating, and any other information he wishes to share.

As for areas that fall within his region, he will cover all of New Jersey with the help of Brian Lefebvre, the southern New Jersey VL.

Welcome to the team!

Hey June, congratulations!

Great choice Mike, glad to see June come aboard.

You think it's a tough question NOW? I would wonder how you would have managed in old first edition AD&D when you had ONE, count them... ONE spell per day. Period... no bonuses from attributes or any of that... just ONE single measley spell.

Lazar, we were a different breed of gamer back in the day. We were used to the Gygaxian style of adventure - PC death was the norm, not the rare exception with raises easily available. BTW, remember the old Red Box with the Caves of Chaos adventure? The clerics of old had NO spell at first level - just a Mace or Staff.

1st level wizard PC's in Pathfinder should look at the cantrips for creative, useful repeat effects, keep a crossbow handy and carefully look at the specific abilities of the arcane schools. An initial level of sorceror or rogue might give wizard PC's some versatility as well at the sacrifice of a level of wizard.

Looks like we got Cthulu!

Welcome aboard Brian. Best of luck with your new duties!

horobin815 wrote:

Love the idea of these but would be intrested to know if the cone 60' extensions and the 40' (& 30' when you make one) Radius will be available in another pack?

We're not planning any new offerings anytime soon.

Anything new on the horizon for this line??

Tom Carpenter wrote:

But seriously, I am sure there will be several legitimate class action suits being filed soon. Just add your name to one of them, I guess

And the lawyers will take 50% right off the top before any of the actual victims see a dime. Or is 50% too conservative of an estimate?

The lawyers will get the cash and the participents will get a coupon good for 5 gallons of regular unleaded at any participating BP station.

Or do I sound a bit cynical?

I wonder how to file a lawsuit against BP? Does anyone know how to start a lawsuit?

You have not been getting the "oil spill lawsuit", "BP lawsuit" and "Loisiana lawyers, contact now" spam e-mail for oh, the last two to three weeks or so?

At least the "huge results, guarenteed" and "Canadian viagra/cialis from Mexico" e-mails have stopped......

Come to think of it, no one from Nigeria has contacted me in quite a while.

But seriously, I am sure there will be several legitimate class action suits being filed soon. Just add your name to one of them, I guess

Here is an idea; if a woman, not a U.S. citizen, gives birth to a baby on U.S. soil, she can petition for her child to be granted citizenship, but that citizenship is not automatically bestowed.
Would that be a better idea?

DogBone

I am fine with this idea if she is here legally.

If the woman broke the law to enter the US and then had a child here, then no. Both should be deported to their own country. If the child grows up and attempts to legally immigrate here their parents choice should not be held against them. Nor should those choices help them.

It's really simple. Break the law as a non citizen and you are out of here. If you wish to return, cross the t's and dot the i's at the embassy and wait your turn. And yes, if you entered prior to that illegally then that should be taken into account when you apply. Not an automatic disqualifier, but part of the whole picture. Those applicants with the best resumes that fill job openings where there is a shortage get first preference. And if you don't begin the citizenship process within a reasonable time, you may have to leave and reapply.

I'm not sure why illegal immigration is so incredibly dire a threat that we must make frustrating the desires of people so engaged into a moral imperative and call it a failure if we give them something they want. But that said:

Well, it is a dire threat if you don't know who is coming here and why. As I see it, the Federal Government has an obligation to secure the borders and regulate who enters and when and where that entry/exit occurs. Has to do with that "provide for the common defense" line, among other things.

Sure, maybe you just want to come here and get a job and work hard to support your wife and kids. But how about this: Did you get the same vaccinations we require our citizens to have? Are you a drug addict? Do you really hate our country for some percieved past wrong (real or imagined)? In order to get here, are you smuggling contraband in (drugs, counterfit money) or back out (illegally obtained weapons your country prohibits)? Are you a wanted criminal in your own country?

Are these not legitimate concerns for any given nation regarding immigration (legal or not)?

I would say the Federal government, regardless of who's administration we look at, has failed at this. And miserably. Whether it has been through negligence or by design is not important. They have failed to protect the people they were elected/appointed to serve.

Illegal immigrants come over the border to get jobs because the pay is better here than in their country of origin. Make it a criminal offense to employ an illegal and send a pile of rich business owners to the klink and that market will dry up pretty fast.

Agreed. But the border still needs to be secure. In addition, so long as our nation has an unemployment rate, only those immigrants that can show a neccesary skill set should be allowed in. Let's get our own citizens working. I don't care if they don't like the jobs available. Get Americans to work first.

The problem I see with illegal immigration has nothing to do with the border being crossed. Big deal. That's like a speeding ticket. They broke the law, but it's a civil matter. Nothing to get much worked up about.

Well, if you get caught driving without a license, you get in more trouble than a speeding ticket. If you are drunk driving, eluding police, present false documentation when pulled over, iqnore traffic signs/signal, don't wear a seat belt ect...you are in more trouble. But, you still gotta get a license and register/insure the car you drive.

Let the immigrants get the valid paperwork and wait their turn to enter. I want them to follow the rules to come here and be a resident/citizen.

I am infinitely more concerned with the number of illegals who, because they are illegal are denied recourse to the authorities and thus end up slaves, sexual or otherwise, to organized crime rackets and more unscrupulous than usual 'employers'. Call me crazy, but I think slavery is more serious than crossing a meaningless line in the dirt without permission.

Give them safe working conditions,

These are horrible conditions to exist under. But if ICE was doing it's job, #1 there would be less illegals here to be used in this manner and #2 more of these abusers would be found, shut down, arrested and punished, thus leaving less of a demand for "cheap labor".

a reasonable path to citizenship,

It already exists. They just have to follow the rules and wait their turn. It should not be easy to become a citizen. A person should have to prove they want to come here and be productive and contribute to make things better for themselves and their new community.

access to law enforcement, and all these scary illegals will turn into the latest wave of Irishmen, Poles, Germans, Italians, and all the rest. Everybody wins. Except the paranoid racist scumbags, but their losing is a fringe benefit. Kind of like getting a free punch to Hitler's face. Who would pass that up?

Well, don't forget that when those folks came here, there were quotas as to how many were allowed in. And they had to work hard to become intigrated into our society. Some of these current illegals outright refuse to assimilate into our communities, keeping themselves separate, to the point of demanding soveriegn rights (keeping their own laws/language).

And was bringing up hitler really neccesary?

It's doubtful this would require a constitutional amendment. Naturalization requirements are, however, set by Congress, not by individual states. The 14th Amendment is widely interpreted to confer citizenship upon anyone born in the U.S., but this isn't necessarily so due to the "jurisdiction" clause. One could argue that an undocumented immigrant and her child are not subject to the jurisdiction of the U.S. It would be a hard sell, and, regardless, such legislation is beyond the purview of the individual states.

"...One could argue that an undocumented immigrant and her child are not subject to the jurisdiction of the U.S...."

Is it unreasonable to deny citizenship to an infant if the parent(s) were in the US illegally?

I would argue no.

Is it unreasonable to deny citizenship to an infant if the parent(s) came here specifically to create an "anchor baby" and broke the law in the process?

I would argue no.

Is it unreasonable to deny citizenship to an infant if the parents came here illegally to create an "anchor baby" specifically to get a foot hold in our country so they can swell the voting ranks and advance an agenda that may not be in our best interests (almost starts to sound like an an invasion or some sort of hostile act against our soveriegnty, doesn't it?) but benefits their "mother' country?

Again I would argue no. It would be not only reasonable but sensible, prudent and in the best interests of our nation to do so.

Bottom line, the infant would not be born here if the parents had not broken the law to be here in the first place. I would propose that the unlawful action (specifically the illegal entry into the US)of the parents would nullify any legal claim the infant has on this issue. It would not preclude the child from legally immigrating here later in life. It simply would prevent the conferring of instant citizenship based on the location of the birth.

Of course the Supreme Court will most likely disagree with me on constitutional grounds.

I just read from goodle that arizona is trying to pass legislation to deny anchor babies their rights as U.S.Citizens.

Well, the Fourteenth Amendment starts off with:

"Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws"

What are the realistic chances of replacing or changing this amendment when two-thirds of both the House and Senate, plus 38 state legislatures are required to be on board?

Is this new law constitutional? Probably not. Will such a bill get knocked down quickly by SCOTUS? Probably yes. Will the current administration spare any tax dollar or resource to knock it down? No, it will be full steam ahead on this one, and it sounds like an easy target.

I am a full supporter of arizona's previous laws that mirrored federal law concerning ILLEGAL immigration but this I will vehimatly oppose.

There has to be another way. My solution is draconic but effective, if the child is born here and the parents are not citizens then they have the option of takeing the child with them and he can re-enter when he is 18 or the parents can leave the child here to be raised in an orphange. As I said it is harsh but effective.

So you would recomend this child be taken away to a foriegn land to be raised (and indoctrinated) into a very different culture from the melting pot we call America and then at age 18 he would have cart blanche to re-enter at will and enjoy full citizenship? And sponsor his relatives entry? All without the benefit of an American education and socialization into our culture (regardless of the merits or issues that may exist in our system)?

EDIT: Remember, such a person could re-enter the US at age 18 and vote or run for office immediately. And possibly not even speak English. And without the dedication and hard work and desire to be an American it takes a legal immigrant to earn their citizenship. It's concievable that a hard line islamofacist could run for congress or president on their first day off the boat. Unlikely, but still within the realm of possibility.

Or the parents must give up the child to an orphanage to be adopted to an American family and raised as an American. Could they latter sue and claim they did not understand that they were giving up or being stripped of their parental rights? That they were giving up the right to be sponsored by that child to latter gain legal entry? What if the child, at 18, goes on Dr Phil to find his biological parents? Do they then gain any rights or access?

I am not being adversarial here, just thinking this out.

This issue is not worth changeing our constituion over.

This might be worth changing, to be honest.

Orthos wrote:

I would definitely support something like this. If it was an actual screen though I'd ask my players to take it down/lay it flat/lay it in their laps during the game though ;)

I was thinking more like a sturdy clipboard without the clip (you could use binder clips if you had to).

I like the idea of the clip board, but with the clip. Clip your Pathfinder character sheet to it. Flip the sheet up for the tables you need printed below.

Or have the board covered in the same material as the flipmatts are made from to make erasable notes there.

I have a suggestion.

Could we get a Tatzlwyrm mini?

Or three? (two different medium sized
poses and a large "advanced" version)

Please.

Is it:

A) dee-Ah-bo-list?

or

B) die-Ah-bo-list?

Choice B seems to be the norm I hear the most.

I find it highly unlikely that we would ever prove the existence of the divine. If such an event happened it would destroy the need for faith. To learn to walk by faith is one of the chief reasons that the divine placed us here, at least if you are a religious person.

I would have to disagree with the idea that proving the existance of the divine would eliminate the need for faith.

Assuming the all knowing, all powerful deity of the various Judeo-Christain faiths, knowing for an absolute indisputable fact that God exists still would require faith in said deities "divine plan"

I would go so far as to say that "proving" God exists would make it harder, not easier to maintain faith in such a "plan". It would open up more questions than it would answer. It would also make it easier for zealots amd the criminaly insane to use and abuse others in the name of the divine.

Proving God's existance would not alter the universe or the rules we live by anymore than disproving said existance.

How are they unplayable? How so gimped?

If the PCs make a 20 point party, all it means is I increase the strength of the opposition. The game ends up almost exactly the same experience for all involved, except the GM can't run the monsters off the page.

Well, Pathfinder Society uses a 20 point build and many encounters use the stock monster from the Bestiary. The Guide to Organized Play states using the 20 point buy allows one "to build a solid character at first level".

With 4-6 players at the table, seems balanced to me. I've seen many near TPK's in fact. So it's no cake walk in organized play using 20 point buy.

Do you regularly run tables of 7+ players? Otherwise I don't see a need to increase the power of the monsters.

How about:

The Big Fat Book of Magic Spells

or

Enlightened Arcana

Can you imagine what a Walt Disney's Lord of the Rings would have looked like??

Hi Ho, Hi Ho, To The Lonely Mountain We Go......

The Advanced Player's Guide contains an entire chapter of new magic items, weapon qualities, etc. that will go some distance toward scratching this itch until we can get a Big Fat Magic Item Book on the schedule.

We know a lot of people would like a book like this and we're currently discussing the best way and time to make it happen.

As long as it's called "THE BIG FAT MAGIC ITEM BOOK"

So, the monster appeared in ??Hollows Last Hope?? and is in the current adventure path. I don't have either source at hand though.

Did it change in any way?

Somehow it got left out of the Bestiary.

Any word on if it is in the Bestiary II?

I really like this beast. I would also like to see
more on other "alternate" drakes and wyrms.

And mini's for them as well.

Any chance of seeing a mini of the tatzlwyrm soon, either as a paper mini or preferably from Reaper? I've used displacer serpents from the Giants of Legend line before, but those were ersatz at best. Besides being handy to have one or two around for Kingmaker, I think as arguably the first Pathfinder monster they deserve to be immortalized.

Agreed! For some reason they are the "iconic" monster for Pathfinder in my mind. They deserve a real (ie metal) miniature.

Ronnie James Dio died today from stomach cancer.

Wow. I thought he was doing better a few months ago.

He had a unique voice. Those shoes will never be filled.

RIP dude!

Lord Fyre wrote:

The thing is that they are claiming is about race (rightly so, in my opinion).

But waiving Mexican flags is really bad tactics. Doing so will tend to push people who would otherwise have been "on-the-fence" or indifferent towards the law into support for it.

Well, the Arizon law is really about whether or not someone is in the country illegally or otherwise breaking state/federal law.

And yes, waving the Mexican flag is a bad tactic. Whether the message they are sending is one of solidarity with the poor, down trodden, taken advantage of, illegal aliens or one of Mexican nationalism and anti American sentiment.

In either case, whichever is their true intent, I would believe it is within their first amendment right to free speach.

If all they are really doing is protesting what they see as an unjust law, I fail to grasp or understand the significance of what waving a foriegn nations flag has to do with that.

Unless they are showing support for the new Arizona law?

It's really less strict than mexican law on illegal immigration (quoted from a Washinton Times article):

"Under the Mexican law, illegal immigration is a felony, punishable by up to two years in prison. Immigrants who are deported and attempt to re-enter can be imprisoned for 10 years. Visa violators can be sentenced to six-year terms. Mexicans who help illegal immigrants are considered criminals.

The law also says Mexico can deport foreigners who are deemed detrimental to "economic or national interests," violate Mexican law, are not "physically or mentally healthy" or lack the "necessary funds for their sustenance" and for their dependents."

Go to Washington Times Article.

The thing is that they are claiming is about race (rightly so, in my opinion).

But waiving Mexican flags is really bad tactics. Doing so will tend to push people who would otherwise have been "on-the-fence" or indifferent towards the law into support for it.

Well, the Arizon law is really about whether or not someone is in the country illegally or otherwise breaking state/federal law.

And yes, waving the Mexican flag is a bad tactic. Whether the message they are sending is one of solidarity with the poor, down trodden, taken advantage of, illegal aliens or one of Mexican nationalism and anti American sentiment.

In either case, whichever is their true intent, I would believe it is within their first amendment right to free speach.

If all they are really doing is protesting what they see as an unjust law, I fail to grasp or understand the significance of what waving a foriegn nations flag has to do with that.

Most of the Harley owners I've met here are decent folks. The ones that come off as a-holes me are the ones riding around on their Japanese-built crotch rockets, speeding through residential neighborhoods on bikes that are too light for the amount of engine power they have. That's just asking for an accident.

I agree. In addition, the whinny wha wha wha of the crotch rockets is far more annoying than the sometimes overly loud pipes you may encounter on Harleys.

FWIW, I know some folks that claim on the highways the loud pipes are a way to let the cars around them know they are there. The theory being those in cars and trucks don't pay attention to their surroundings and put the biker at risk.

Emphasis mine. I would never intend to insult your family by referring to them as "the lucky ones" or anything so gauche, but I will say that rising above the challenges put in ones path when you are an ethnic or racial minority is, in many ways, to effect change with respect to the ethnic or racial majority. Just because it was not mentioned at family gatherings is not to say it didn't happen, I'm sure your ancestors had to deal with- and stand up to- all sorts of short-sightedness at the very least, as well as written and unwritten discrimination. This law, while intended to stand up to illegal immigration, has caused those who immigrated legally to stand up for themselves and those who share their ethnic background in protest, which is something I feel your ancestors(and mine, perhaps) had to do as well at least once or twice. These are the things a people have to do for themselves that often gets lost under the "making a better life for themselves" fiat.

Keep in mind that we are talking well over a hundred years of family history here. And I am sure they did face all the same problems and prejudices most immigrants face. But the stories I heard growing up didn't mention those problems. Were they lucky? I am sure some members of my family could be called lucky just as some would be termed unlucky. As all families experience. I did hear about learning english and getting an education. And I know the successes worked very hard for that success. But when they came here, they left the old country and their allegience there behind.

I work with many Portugese in my field (construction laborer). Watching the three generations (more or less) I deal with one can see generational divisions pretty clearly. The older generation still has trouble with english, but can get by. They are also the hardest physical labor workers, old school if you will. The middle generation is also hard working, with many buisnessmen in the mix. Usually fluent in both english and portugese, sometimes to the point you might not hear an accent (depending on where they went to school). The youngest generation, fluent in english, usually (though not always) speaks some portugese. However, their attitude towards work is very American. They are not intersted in dad or an uncle getting them a union book. They are going to college and becoming investors, lawyers and doctors.

So my point is every group and every individual in that group faces these challenges and has to work to succeed in spite of them. I think this is a normal progression, from what I understand of history.

Tom Carpenter wrote:

Freehold DM wrote:

Your thoughts on the overwhelming discrimination experienced by Irish citizens in this country(Irish need not apply statues for businesses, being pressed into military service upon arrival)?

To be blunt, it was no different than what most every other minority group that has immigrated to the United States has had to deal with. The Irish had the double whammy of being (for the most part) Catholic as well.

My great grandfather worked on the railroad. When he died the family moved to Paterson and worked in the textile mills. From their they dispersed across the US and Canada. They never had it easy. But they had opportunity to make a better life.

Was the discrimination right? No. But at least they had the legal opportunity to come here and work hard and assimilate and become Americans.

Thats the same legal opportunity the Mexicans crossing the border illegally in Arizona have, by the way, but choose to not excersise.

You leave out a part of your original post above that states that your ancestors embraced the culture here and did not attempt to change it, nor ask for special treatment. Is this to say that they meekly accepted the prejudice they encountered?

I honestly fail to see how embracing America as your new home and assimilating to the American culture by an immigrant is the same as meekly accepting prejudice.

They learned english. They worked hard at whatever jobs they could get. Yes, at first, like most immigrants they lived in communities of their fellows. And as time went on, they built better lives for themselves and their families.

I never heard stories at family gatherings regarding any special instances of abuse or prejudice. I did hear that the children were all required to learn and speak english (more applicable to the Hungarian side of the family) growing up. I do know of relatives who are well off, successful in buisness, politically conected, served honorably in the military, etc.

Obviously whatever challenges they faced they chose to face and rise above rather than meekly accept. They clearly did not retreat into an insular migrant community. They became Americans.

Unlike those who come here illegally, the ones the Arizona law is intended to deal with. btw.

Your thoughts on the overwhelming discrimination experienced by Irish citizens in this country(Irish need not apply statues for businesses, being pressed into military service upon arrival)?

To be blunt, it was no different than what most every other minority group that has immigrated to the United States has had to deal with. The Irish had the double whammy of being (for the most part) Catholic as well.

My great grandfather worked on the railroad. When he died the family moved to Paterson and worked in the textile mills. From their they dispersed across the US and Canada. They never had it easy. But they had opportunity to make a better life.

Was the discrimination right? No. But at least they had the legal opportunity to come here and work hard and assimilate and become Americans.

Thats the same legal opportunity the Mexicans crossing the border illegally in Arizona have, by the way, but choose to not excersise.

Tom Carpenter wrote:

If you plan to come to this country the law says there is a legal way to do it. Follow the law. Whether it's for a vacation or to immigrate.

It's really simple.

America is a melting pot of many different cultures and ethnicities. Many people belonging to these groups are struggling to keep their cultural heritage alive as it is. Typically by 2nd-3rd generation, people don't even speak their parents language (if it was something other than english) and that's sad. Policies like this are discriminatory and, let's face it, single out one group of minorities more than any other.

Yes America is a melting pot as you called it. All the ingredients blend together to create a stew.

If one flavor overwhelms the others, the recipe is ruined.

My great grand parents came from Ireland and Hungary. My mother has gone back through the government records and found the ledgers they signed when they came through Ellis Island. Legal Imigration

Guess what? They assimilated to the culture they found here in the United States. They embraced the culture here. They did not try to change it. They did not demand special treatment. They took what work was available, worked hard and raised their children not as citizens of another nation but as Americans.

Am I aware of my heritage? Yes.

But I am an American. No hyphens here, thank you

There are times when the majority doesn't know what's best and it's the responsibility of elected leaders to do the right thing, even if it's unpopular.

No. It is the responsibility of an elected official to represent the wishes of his constituents. Those elected to public office work for those that elected them.

They serve the people. The people do not serve elected officials as you state.

It is, however, the responsiblity of the Supreme Court to review the laws passed by the elected officials and ensure they are in keeping with our constitution. Note: not in line with their personal views, but in line with the constitution.

small town, with no tourism.. is understandable such short sighted ideas.

WOW. That was such an insulting statement I don't know how to respond.

The fact is, it should be federal law in the USA every government document should always be only in the english language.

It is common sense, as is Arizonas new law allowing their law enforcement officers to enforce existing law.

If you plan to come to this country the law says there is a legal way to do it. Follow the law. Whether it's for a vacation or to immigrate.

It's really simple.

Hmmm, not sure how I feel about last night's season finale.

** spoiler omitted **

There was so much COOL build up, the ending seemed underwhelming.

But, yea, the Cthulu angle is always cool if it happened. My guess:

Or we all get tentacles..........

Cleric of Caffeine wrote:

One of the-if not THE greatest fantasy artist all time.

I highly recommend a pilgrimage to his museum in New Jersey. Viewing his work with the natural eye is breathtaking. Prints & copies can't match the texture & vibrance of the pieces.

He'll always be one of my inspirations.

*cough*Stroudsburg, PA, NOT New Jersey*cough*

Unfortunately, the museum in Marshalls Creek PA (Near Stroudsburg) has been closed since the public rift between his children that started a few months ago. (If you are interested google The Pocono Record newspaper. There were several front page articles documenting the soap opera. Quite sad, and a little bizzare.)

Originally housed in the old Masonic building in East Stroudsburg (that also contained a golf store and a costume store run by his two sons), a state of the art museum was built to house the paintings after a fire several years ago (none of the original works were damaged at the time, to my knowledge).

It seems Frazettas four children sat down with an arbitrator and their lawyers and ironed things out right before he passed. The last word on his collection was they may be put on the road as a travelling collection so more folks will be able to see them.

I hope eventually they will reopen the local museum though.

Will the retired Scenarios still be available for purchase?

It was previously stated no.

But if you had already purchased them they would remain in your downloads. You would not lose your purchase.

I'm actually working media response for the oil spill right now, and I've come across a few theories sent in by people, which blame meteors striking the oil rig, Obama's administration and a North Korean torpedo attack. The worst one so far was from a guy who insinuated the 11 missing rig workers had something to do with it.

And now, the official cause is a huge cloud of gas was released and engulfed the platform. It then exploded at the same moment a celebration of the platforms 7 year safety history was taking place.

I suppose this is the new websters definition of irony.
-------------------------------------------------------

In keeping with the thread, perhaps Cthulu conspired to fart at that exact moment, his minions having arranged the celebration.

Anyone out there in Central/Southern New York or Central/Northern PA? I'm trying to get some interest going to run PF at Mepacon, in May. If you haven't been to Mepacon, its a great mid-sized con. If you have been, lets get PF going at Mepacon!

The NAGA crew will be running Pathfinder Society at Mepacon May 21 - 23 in addition to Legends of the Shining Jewel and some other stuff.

First, though, they have to get that damn leak under control.

Absolutely right on that point.

I don't know how flexible the pipe was that brought the oil from the ocean floor to the drill rig, but I imagine the cabling that allowed monitoring of conditions there and control af valves on it's length would have been damaged/destroyed as well.

I am suprised that there is no submersable unit (either manned or robotic) for inspection and maintenance down there. But given the volume of oil spewing out, that would be a difficult if not impossible solution.

I could envision drilling threaded rods into the bedrock and then lowering a concrete cap with open valves on top (to relieve the pressure). Once bolted down, the valves could be closed to seal off the oil flow (and possibly tapped into later to allow the pumping of more crude from that well). Whether the technology exists to pull that off.........

The offshore rig is from BP, meaning that the Administration would have to had a conversation with them or being using them for their own needs. We also have to wonder, if such a thing did in fact happen, then why? Is it to still have some sort of negotiation ability in the middle east? Is it to follow some plan to change us all to a one world government????

To be clear, I believe this was an accident. But the coincidences are to juicy to pass up (especially after all the stuff said by the Rosie crowd regarding the WTC).

So on to the speculation:

In my conspiracy theory, the Obama administration is manufacturing a crisis to push their political agenda.

#1 The amnesty for illegals is heating up a bit to much for them. They need to stear the nightly news off of that topic and distract the right wing.

#2 They want a nice background for the Cap-n-Tax/climate legislation. So they announce they are looking into offsghore drilling (with no promises either way, but a limited scope of study). This puts the right wing on the defensive - Hey, that's our issue!

Many left wingers in congress would rather hit Cap-n-Tax before the November elections rather than amnesty. The administration knows without the votes amnesty will supply in November and 2012, none of it matters.

#3 Gas prices have quitely slid back to 3.00/gallon. Folks are not complaining as the hit is not as bad as when it went over 4.00. But don't forget Obama said he would like to see 5.00 + a gallon. (of course he envisioned a slow increase of federal gas taxes/vat createing that artificial price point, not capitalist speculators. He's pissed that the speculators are effectivly cutting off that tax stream).

#4 Since he wants it to look quite in the Middle East (so his "draw down" in Iraq looks effective) he can't stir things up to much over there, he can use a storm to create the smoke and mirrors when his secret ops take out a drill platform in the Gulf of Mexico.

By allowing the oil to destroy the ecosystem in the Gulf, the public will rise up and scream for more environmental controls. If they don't, so what, just claim it's public outcry.

The congress will quickly pass a bill on climate control and quitely pass an amnesty bill in a midnight vote.

#5 The South American states with oil interests are gonna get real nervous, the speculators will drive up prices and several small hot skirmishes will break out.

President Obama will announce the countrys oil refineries and storage/transport concerns are now under the "protection" of the federal government until this "threat" passes. Several more "miltias" will be arrrested and "detained".

#6 Although politically nuetered until 2012, when the illegals are allowed to vote in 2012, El Presidente for life Obama will declare martial law, devalue our currency and surrender control of our economy to the Chinese (who now control South/Central America anyway through treaties with Venezuela, Cuba, a new communist regime in Mexico and ownership of the Panama canal).

So, how's that for a theory? (At least entertaining, I hope)

Ah, I see what you are saying. I don't feel it is necessary to have current administration involvement for something to be a conspiracy. Wealth private individuals and corporations could play those parts as well. And of course as Aberzombie suggests foreign governments could also be involved.

Your right, it does not have to be "the administration" (meaning any US government involvement, past or present). I was using that as a "for example". Not an indictment. It could be, as you say, any power group.

The reason I took that angle, however, is because the Obama administration had recently announced a program of some sort to look into off shore drilling. This given the opposition to such activities by many of his supporters. So to have an "accident" of this magnitude and timing happen was just to much coincidence to not speculate on.

I would still maintain that a "conspiracy" would need more levels to it to qualify. A single group acting on it's own falls more into a "terrorist" plot. Or perhaps simply criminal.

See, I'm not so sure an enviromental group, by itself, would have the resources to pull something like that off. However, if they were to receive some government assistance, as in a foreign government, then maybe it'd be doable. I can certainly see it in the best interest of Cuba or Venezuala to have this happen to the U.S.

And it wouldn't be without some precedence. If I remember correctly, some ex-KGB dude from waaay back admitted that they use to pay off some of the 60's radicals to stir up trouble here.

Of course, sadly, my money's on accident.

If your thinking a group of idealistic college kids, in my opinion, not possible.

If however, you had some hard core folks who had real construction experience and some under water marine biology types with access to the right materials I'd imagine this could be done with a LOT of luck.

I don't think the Venezuelens or Cubans ( or whoever ) would waste their time with cats paws in this case as it would be a lot easier to just send in thier own opperatives.

Accident does sound like the most likely suspect in this case.

Oh, I never said that the current administration was involved.

Well, ok, true enough.

My conspiracy theory is based on a radical eco-terrorist group. The environmental damage occurring now is just what they want to send as a message. You can't make a tofu omelet without harvesting some soybean after all.

But that strikes me as a straight up terrorist attack rather than a "conspiracy".

Not unlike, for example, 9/11. ( The bad guys plot and plan and attack to achieve a political, religious or social change)

A conspiracy, to me, would go a step further. It would need to include something along the lines of "the current administration" had a hand in planning, or purposly instigating or at least passing intellegence to the actual plotters.

For example, if President Bush had a directive from the Bilderberg group from his last meeting in Saudi Arabia to have VP Cheney form a secret ops unit under direction of Rumsfeld to wire the world Trade Center with explosives and fire Cruise missles into the pentagon etc....

EDIT ...and then bin ladens folks fly some planes around and take credit. The true goal is not to achieve the world wide supremacy of islam but create an unstable financial market where the true players may suck the bulk of the real money out of the economy and leave the huddled masses with fiat money, wothless when the crash comes under the next administration that is put in place to achieve that phase.

That would be a conspiracy.

Thoughts?

And the device that was suppose to close the pipe is some how not functional. Makes me think of the Beastie Boys.

Well, given all that I would guess went wrong in this particular instance, it makes sense that that malfunctioned as well.

It IS possible to install an inline valve in a leaking pipe. I saw it done with a water main that needed to be shut off and the shut off valves were no where to be found. That took half a day in good conditions. I can't even begin to imagine what it will take to plug that oil line that far under water with that volume of oil spewing forth.

If that were an intentional attack by the current administration and their allies/cats paws in the enviro-nut job movement, they purposly and maliciously screwed the local ecosystem more than big oil could at their worst.

Would that scenario fufill Sebastians postulate:

Most conspiracy theories seem to be predicated on the idea that a person/entity/etc. creates a self-inflicted wound which either (a) justifies a counter-attack or (b) rallies public opinion to their side.

And if so, what was the original intent?

pres man wrote:

one attack on the off-shore drilling.

I found this one odd, especially that it happened only days after Obama announced plans to expand Off Shore drilling in the Gulf.

Well, as one who despises the Rosie Odonnel school of "what happenned on 9/11", I am hesitant to even think of the possible connection.

But yea, one hell of a coincidence.