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I have been playing Pathfinder for a while now (and D&D for many years before that), but I've never played an arcane caster (and strangely, other players in my gaming group haven't played one either, so I have no reference). However, I'm thinking that I may play one in the future, as I'd never read the class description before now and didn't realise they now get some interesting extra abilities, eg from school specialisation etc. But I'm a bit concerned about what to do when they run out of spells. For example, assuming a 1st level wizard, with 20 int and a bonded item, you'll have 4 level 1 spells and three level 0 spells (I think). But I guess that in a typical day of game time, you'd be very likely to run our of resources quite quickly.
My question is, what does a wizard typically do to make sure that they have things to contribute to the party at all times? I don't want to play a character that's going to spend large amounts of time in each encounter doing nothing because I've either used up all my daily spells, or not doing anything because I want to save spells for later. And entering melee clearly isn't an option ;-). And things like the acid dart from the conjuration school is also limited.
So, does anyone have any suggestions / thoughts / ideas on what to do to make sure a wizard has plenty to do at all times?
Thanks :-).
Edit: wanted to add, I've had a quick look at the excellent wizard guides, but they don't appear to address this particular issue...?
At low levels, you want to keep your spell economy to ROUGHLY 1 spell a fight. If you can get a 20 int at 1st level, that will get you a total of 4 spells each day (1st level spell, School Spell and 2 bonus spells)
you want to focus on control spells that have huge effects on combat.
I think at 1st level, the most useful spells are
Sleep (at 1st level, win the fight, after 1st level, crap)
Color Spray (Pretty useful for the first few levels)
Grease (Stays useful through level 20)
Enlarge Person (Ditto)
Here is how most of my combat goes at 1st level:
GM: Captain McAwesomeSauce, it's your turn
Me: Save
GM: Whic...
Me: Will
GM: G$$+~+mit
*Rolls dice*
GM: 3 fail
Me: They're asleep
*1 Round later*
GM: Captain McAwesomeSauce, it's your turn
Me: I pull a sandwich out of my backpack, sit down in the corner and eat it delicately while I watch the rest of the party bludgeon the remaining monsters to death.
You can take a wand as a bonded object, but it doesn't get any charges for free. Once you hit the right level, you can charge it without the Craft Wand feat though.It depends on the GM's interpretation of where it mentions the wand and using its last charge. I have yet to see any GM who would argue against giving their wizard a wand, as long as the wand was within reason. Most make it limited in value.
You have to remember that a Wizard who chooses a weapon does get a free masterwork weapon at level 1
The wizard gets a wand, just a wand with no charges.
I'm basing that on the fact that no other bonded object is magical when you first take it. I suppose no other bonded object could fit in a 350 gp budget either though, but that feels like the kind of exception that would be pointed out in the text. So RAW, I'd have to say they don't get free wand charges, but it makes a reasonable houserule.
Where does it say you don't get charges? All evidence I see points to the opposite.
@Elamdri: Sounds like my level 1 Wizards... both my players and my characters...
Though most of the level 1 combats my players encounter are more of they can cast all their spells and still be alright. As all dungeons are optional.
If you can get a 20 int at 1st level, that will get you a total of 4 spells each day (1st level spell, School Spell and 2 bonus spells)
You know, I think I'm going to make a gnome wizard. And when people find out I only have a 16 INT, I wonder how many of you will have strokes over it. :-)
I think at 1st level, the most useful spells areSleep (at 1st level, win the fight, after 1st level, crap)
Color Spray (Pretty useful for the first few levels)
Grease (Stays useful through level 20)
Enlarge Person...
If you're playing PFS, keep in mind that you start with a free Spell Focus feat (rather than Scribe Scroll), which you can use to grab an immediate Augment Summoning feat. Summon Monster I, for a conjurer, can be surprisingly effective. Admittedly your summoned buddy only lasts two rounds... but can definitely put the enemy wizard or archer out of commission while it's around.
How to make your wizard good at low levels? Easy:
Half Orc Transmuter
18 str (includes racial and transmute school bonus)
14 dex
15 con
15 int
8 wis
7 cha
Comes with prof great axe. d12+6 pts of damage is good, at +4 to hit.
With mage armor (considering having spare scrolls, at 12.5 ea due to crafting) your AC is about what the typical low level melee guy has. Alternatively, get light armor prof, and suck up the spell failure chance.
If you need to, mage armor + shield spell + dex bonus gives you an AC of 20. Which is often higher than the starting AC of the party tank.
With half orc ferocity and 15 con, good chance at low level you can have time to chug a potion to keep in the fight.
Since this build isn't really meant to be offensively casting, the low starting int isn't a big deal (after all, herioc NPCs use this number). Gear and level points can improve this, though i would use the first one on con.
As it levels up it can still do melee (though requires extensive buffing past level 5 or so, the slow BAB is murder on to hit rolls). Perhaps this a good candidate for some sort of martial/caster multi class if you plan on going pretty far with it.
Where does it say you don't get charges? All evidence I see points to the opposite.
Just curious about the evidence. Truthfully, I could have been argued into allowing a wand of cantrips. Would you give them a magic staff if they chose "staff" as a bonded item? Rings and amulets?
Just curious.
Greg
EDIT: I really am just curious. Even if my group has been interpreting the rule wrong, I doubt any of us would change the ruling. Wizards do not seem at a loss of having nice things :P
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@Elamdri: Sounds like my level 1 Wizards... both my players and my characters...
Though most of the level 1 combats my players encounter are more of they can cast all their spells and still be alright. As all dungeons are optional.
Well, it's kinda what you gotta do sometimes at 1st level. Spell rationing is a b@&&$, but it's only for those first few levels. And yeah, I mean, I could shoot my crossbow and do some pittance damage, but to be honest I think it's funnier to role play the wizard as some lazy academic who does the minimal work possible and then relaxes while everyone else does the heavy lifting.
Also, poking the monster with a crossbow reminds it that I'm a threat. And I don't like that.
I've always assumed that they came non magical. Effectively it makes your wizard a Hollywood wizard that can't cast without his wand/staff/ring ect. If you wanted to later make it magical, sure, pay the costs.
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If you can get a 20 int at 1st level, that will get you a total of 4 spells each day (1st level spell, School Spell and 2 bonus spells)You know, I think I'm going to make a gnome wizard. And when people find out I only have a 16 INT, I wonder how many of you will have strokes over it. :-)
Oh god, the saves! THE SAVES! WHY!?
If you're playing PFS, keep in mind that you start with a free Spell Focus feat (rather than Scribe Scroll), which you can use to grab an immediate Augment Summoning feat. Summon Monster I, for a conjurer, can be surprisingly effective. Admittedly your summoned buddy only lasts two rounds... but can definitely put the enemy wizard or archer out of commission while it's around.
I think at 1st level, the most useful spells areSleep (at 1st level, win the fight, after 1st level, crap)
Color Spray (Pretty useful for the first few levels)
Grease (Stays useful through level 20)
Enlarge Person...
1: Never played PFS, not familiar with the rules. That's cool tho.
2: I just don't really like Summon Monster I for other than a temp flanking buddy for rogues.
with such a limited spell economy, I would rather put half the enemies to sleep for the encounter or grease the BBEG's greatsword for the entire fight rather than summon a monster for two rounds. But that's just me.
I ran a PFS scenario where we had a caster that rationed his spells all day, making ineffective attacks (at -4 to -8) with his crossbow, and occasionaly with a longspear (over the shoulders of another PC, penalties to hit of course) No Str bonus at all. Only a 12 dex. Final fight happens, he uses his main spell, ray of enfeeblement, on a prone barbarian in combat, behind the summoned horse and other PC. -12 to hit. with only a +1 bonus to offset it.
His other spell was mage armor, which had not been precast. Non specialist wizard too. I still don't think that player contributed anything the entire day other than blocking charge lanes and clogging combat for the actual melee guys.
My take away on this is if you are going to run a wizard, you need a backup plan. If you have a backup plan, make sure your characters stats/ability matches this plan. An elf wizard with a long bow and decent dex (16 is easy to afford), the half orc with a huge axe (though that isn't really a backup plan lol, but it makes for a good name for an axe). Also, make sure your primary plan makes good use of resources. A d4+1 MM is not a good use of a spell slot, some schools get class bonuses better than that. Choose something that is going to be a game changer like color spray or sleep.
Also, wasting 1/2 or 1/3 of your starting resources for mage armor is not good. Buy/write a scroll at first level and deal with it until you have so many spell that spending one on a session long defensive buff (that shouldn't be needed if you are good at positioning) isn't a big deal.
Where does it say you don't get charges? All evidence I see points to the opposite.The wizard gets a wand, just a wand with no charges.
I'm basing that on the fact that no other bonded object is magical when you first take it. I suppose no other bonded object could fit in a 350 gp budget either though, but that feels like the kind of exception that would be pointed out in the text. So RAW, I'd have to say they don't get free wand charges, but it makes a reasonable houserule.
There's no actual rules text either way, but all other bonded items start out as nonmagical (but of masterwork quality). I would expect any exceptions to that to be pointed out.
Now a masterwork weapon is the only option worth much, but it's also mechanically the worst choice (no two-handed or ranged weapons and no free proficiency, IIRC).
The wand's also pretty unique too since it's the only time a non-magic wand has any real use and it's the only bonded item that gets used up (though not completely like a normal wand would).
Again, it seems like a reasonable houserule, but I can't see how it would be RAW. The only thing to suggest otherwise would be interpreting the line saying it doesn't get used up completely to imply that it begins with charges, except that's in the middle of the section on later enchanting your bonded object.
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I ran a PFS scenario where we had a caster that rationed his spells all day, making ineffective attacks (at -4 to -8) with his crossbow, and occasionaly with a longspear (over the shoulders of another PC, penalties to hit of course) No Str bonus at all. Only a 12 dex. Final fight happens, he uses his main spell, ray of enfeeblement, on a prone barbarian in combat, behind the summoned horse and other PC. -12 to hit. with only a +1 bonus to offset it.
His other spell was mage armor, which had not been precast. Non specialist wizard too. I still don't think that player contributed anything the entire day other than blocking charge lanes and clogging combat for the actual melee guys.
My take away on this is if you are going to run a wizard, you need a backup plan. If you have a backup plan, make sure your characters stats/ability matches this plan. An elf wizard with a long bow and decent dex (16 is easy to afford), the half orc with a huge axe (though that isn't really a backup plan lol, but it makes for a good name for an axe). Also, make sure your primary plan makes good use of resources. A d4+1 MM is not a good use of a spell slot, some schools get class bonuses better than that. Choose something that is going to be a game changer like color spray or sleep.
Also, wasting 1/2 or 1/3 of your starting resources for mage armor is not good. Buy/write a scroll at first level and deal with it until you have so many spell that spending one on a session long defensive buff (that shouldn't be needed if you are good at positioning) isn't a big deal.
Ray Spell was his 1st mistake. At 1st level, you're going to have a garbage to hit, probably a -3 at worst and a -1 at best (From firing into melee). I know it's against touch AC, but you figure many mobs will probably have at least a 10 touch AC, so you're already looking at worse than a 50/50 to hit.
Compare a Sleep Spell with a DC of 15. Many monsters at 1st level have bad will saves, some in the negatives. That means they have a less than 25% chance to succeed.
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You think it's a tough question NOW? I would wonder how you would have managed in old first edition AD&D when you had ONE, count them... ONE spell per day. Period... no bonuses from attributes or any of that... just ONE single measley spell.
Lazar, we were a different breed of gamer back in the day. We were used to the Gygaxian style of adventure - PC death was the norm, not the rare exception with raises easily available. BTW, remember the old Red Box with the Caves of Chaos adventure? The clerics of old had NO spell at first level - just a Mace or Staff.
1st level wizard PC's in Pathfinder should look at the cantrips for creative, useful repeat effects, keep a crossbow handy and carefully look at the specific abilities of the arcane schools. An initial level of sorceror or rogue might give wizard PC's some versatility as well at the sacrifice of a level of wizard.
I'm afraid you ARE very much mistaken. A 1 round casting time does not mean it goes off the next round, it just means that it takes you an entire round to cast, with the effects going off in that round.
Where does it say you don't get charges? All evidence I see points to the opposite.Just curious about the evidence. Truthfully, I could have been argued into allowing a wand of cantrips. Would you give them a magic staff if they chose "staff" as a bonded item? Rings and amulets?
Just curious.
Greg
EDIT: I really am just curious. Even if my group has been interpreting the rule wrong, I doubt any of us would change the ruling. Wizards do not seem at a loss of having nice things :P
It specifically calls out that once a wands charges are used up the wand becomes non-magical but can be used to craft a new wand. What I am getting at is make it reasonable say a 0-1st level wand.
I would say if the amulet/staff/ring is under the value of say 300gp then it is fine but it loses it's magic if the Wizard changes his bonded item.
After all it is possible for them to get a mwk weapon for free. That is a minimum value of 300gp if they got a club.
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If i'm not mistaken, the sleep spell has a casting time of one round- thus the spell will not go off until the wizard's second round. This raises the possibility of it being interupted and fizzling. It also only targets up to 4 hit dice worth of monsters/foes with the nearest/weakest effected first. Excess hit die worth of monsters in the area of effect are not affected. Also, certain monsters are immune to sleep/ mind affecting spells. This doesn't mean it's not useful- just be aware of the potential drawbacks.
Oh it's absolute garbage at 2nd level, but at 1st level, nothing wipes out a bunch of goblins quite like sleep.
nothing wipes out a bunch of goblins quite like sleep.
This is so true it is absolutely ridiculous. It even works well at higher level encounters that are in the vain of "Turner's Kobolds"
This is so true it is absolutely ridiculous. It even works well at higher level encounters that are in the vain of "Turner's Kobolds"
nothing wipes out a bunch of goblins quite like sleep.
I think you mean "in the vein of Tucker's Kobolds".
I think you mean "in the vein of Tucker's Kobolds".This is so true it is absolutely ridiculous. It even works well at higher level encounters that are in the vain of "Turner's Kobolds"
nothing wipes out a bunch of goblins quite like sleep.
Thank you... I really hate my phones auto-correct...
What does a 1st level wizard do when he runs out of spell? The same thing a 1st level rogue always do: use mundane weapon and try to help your fellows by flanking, using the aid another action, fighting defensively, etc. A wizard with mage armor on will probably have an higher AC than a rogue and his chances of hitting will probably be only 5 to 15% under those of a bard, cleric, druid, monk or rogue.
Surprisingly weapon finesse is a good feat for Wizards who want to use melee touch spells. That is if you use the old 3.x ruling of it applies as your hand is a natural weapon therefore a Light weapon.
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At first level, take mount instead of Summon Monster I. If you do get Spell Focus (Conjuration) and Augment Summoning at first level, you can make an extra tank on the battlefield in the form of a horse or pony. Augmented, a horse has 19 hit points and has two attacks that can each do 1d4+3 damage. Granted, they won't hit tremendously often, but he will at least get between you and the bad guys and can provide a flank and cover, and with two attacks, will at least hit with a bit of damage. Plus, it lasts for two hours, instead of one round, so you won't feel like you wasted a spell.
Some GMs rule that a mount gained from the spell is just that -- a mount, not trained for battle, so casting it in the middle of battle means your riding horse just ran off for the hills instead of being a meat shield or an extra attacker.
The key phrase is 'serves you willingly' -- yes, serves you willingly as a riding mount. Not a warhorse.
You dont need high level spells if you have Prestidigitation, endless fun for a true wizard.
While casting this ultra powerfull spell you can for example curse the enemie into becoming a rednosed raindeer, starting with prestidigitationing his nose red...
Then if that doesnt impress him use prstidigitation to curse him with smelly farts...
The spell is also usefull outside of danger... When the wether is cold change water into hot chocolate milk with only prestidigitation...
Dont have dry fire wood, well with prestidigitation you have,...
Hmm help i sound like tell sell
I'm really gonna have to read that spell ain't I...
Simple solution to low level Wizard problems... play a different class, once you reach level 3-4 get your character killed and then bring in a Wizard of that level. (Kidding)
Seriously though an easy way to survive is get a good DEX score a dagger and then get weapon finesse just so long as you didn't dump STR you should be perfectly fine.
Use all your spells in the first 2 encounters now the next step is important you need to find an orc barbarian and charge it with your dagger. If all goes according to plan the orc should have a brand new spell book to burn. Wait what was the question again?