Chaleb Sazomal

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I've just started a new campaign in second edition, which I'm also fairly new to. (I try to keep up with the books and reading but this is my first REAL game with the system)

As the title states, I've been attempting to create a conversion of the Cipher class from pillars of eternity (basically a Psychic Gish that builds energy [called focus] for spellcasting by dealing damage with weapons) for use in this campaign, but I'm having some difficulty converting some major portions of the class.

Base proficiencies and progression are simple enough, as this is, at a glance, an occult version of the Magus, to which end most of the proficiencies would likely match up (Master in Unarmed/Simple/Martial weapons, Master in up to Medium armor, and Master in Occult spellcasting.) Saves could be argued, and skills would likely be of a similar amount depending on the key ability score.

The challenge in my eyes starts with the first mechanic of the class, the Soul Whip. In the video game, Soul whip is a buff that applies to all your weapon attacks while you aren't at full focus, granting roughly 20% increased damage and converting a portion of your damage dealt directly into focus points, which are then spent to cast spells. Obviously the percent damage is right out, as that would just get annoying and the typical damage numbers in 2E don't justify it's use, but I'm not really sure what to use in it's place. There are a good number of class based damage buffs to draw inspiration from, but none of them is a perfect fit for the nature of the ability. Ideally it would be something that adds a noticeable but not overwhelming amount of damage to weapon attacks, that ideally would scale up the more damage your weapon dealt. The least mind-wracking idea I had here was a flat damage bonus that scaled with the number of damage dice your weapon dealt. This would keep damage fairly in line with other melee-type mechanics, and also provide a fairly direct way to generate the points for spellcasting, which could be as simple as "gain an amount of spell points equal to the damage dealt by your soul whip."

Next, and perhaps even more challenging, is the nature of the spellcasting itself. A "mana" system is quite separated from the way normal spellcasting is done in 2E, but I think the focus on spell levels as the scaler for spell power rather than caster level provides a fairly simple place to start; simply present a point cost for each level of spell (something like 5 per level, going from 5-50.) This system would preclude the use of actual spell slots, simply allowing for a highest level of spell as levels increased and likely working off a spell repertoire as an alternative form of spontaneous caster.

Another way to do this, and a way that perhaps appears more thematically coherent, is focus spells. Especially as focus points are a term used by both the class and 2e itself, trying to blend them together could certainly be an effective and efficient way to streamline the conversion, but not one that doesn't have its own issues. Focus spells, as written, don't really have a way to scale in the way cipher spellcasting is supposed to, as they automatically heighten to half your level and always cost 1 focus point each. In addition, trying to jury rig soul whip to generate 2e focus creates a whole wave of issues relating to focus spells from other classes now being rechargeable simply by hitting stuff. With all that in mind, focus spells seem like the wrong way to go.

There are absolutely more parts to the class to consider in converting, but these stood out to me as the most fiddly ones. If anyone has any advice or suggestions for making this, please let me know!


A while ago I noticed that my as of now favorite character, and my account name based off of them, used to look a lot like Zerthimon from forgotten realms until I changed it up a bit, even though the way I got to the name had nothing to do with the gith or forgotten realms.

Which leads me to ask, have you (or perhaps anyone at paizo) created something (name/place/class/etc.) that ended up being very similar to something else even though they have nearly nothing else in common? Sorry if this is a weird question to answer, I’m not really sure how else to put it.

Thanks as always!


Hello James,

After finally reaching the end of this thread (only took 40 years) and seeing all that’s transpired around Nocticula and her redemption/ascension, I was wondering: were/are there any plans to go one step further into Chaotic Good, or was chaotic neutral always the end goal of her story?

Thanks!


So I was looking at the divine decree spell on page 217 which reads as follows:

"You utter potent words linked to your faith. Choose an alignment
your deity has (chaotic, evil, good, or lawful). You can’t cast this spell
if you don’t have a deity or your deity is true neutral. You deal 7d6
damage to creatures of that alignment in the area; each creature
must attempt a Will save. Creatures that match the alignment are
unaffected. Those that neither match nor oppose it don’t suffer
effects other than damage and treat their result as one degree better."

At first this made no sense to me, as the creatures of the alignment you were targeting would be unaffected entirely. This would make more sense if it read: "You deal 7d6 damage of that alignment in the area" The spell makes sense and there's no issues. so is this a typo or am I just reading the spell wrong?


Mokshai wrote:

Which is the archtype that allows weapon focus with weapon groups?

Or is there one.

I mean, there's an advanced weapon training that eventually lets you apply all weapon specific feats to all weapons of its group?


Deadmanwalking wrote:
mdt wrote:

Now granted, I come at this from my own homebrew, so it doesn't help Pendagast's issues, but, I thought I'd comment and put in my own favored weapon/deity combos.

I agree that in general, most gods in D&D have had either hard to justify favored weapons (healers with polearms) or else just boring ones with no backstory (Mace, just Mace).

Now, it sounds like the PF deity healer with a glaive has a backstory for it, so that's cool. I tried to be a bit less pedestrian or give backstories for the weapons.

Well, let's see for the Golarion dieties:

Erastil: Longbow - God of Hunting (among other things)
Iomedae: Longsword - Actually used as a mortal.
Torag: Warhammamer - Forge God (among other things)

Sarenrae: Scimitar - Presumably used when she was an angel, culturally appropriate.
Shelyn: Glaive - Carries her brother's cursed weapon out of a pure love and devotion for him. Yeah, this one's real good.

Cayden Cailean: Rapier - Actually used as a mortal.
Desna: Starknife - Goddess of the stars, among other things.

Abadar: Light Crossbow - No real explanation, though as a god of trade and other non-warlike pursuits it makes some sense.
Irori: Unarmed Strike - Was a Monk as a mortal.

Gozreh: Trident - God of the Sea (among other things)
Nethys: Quarterstaff - Was a Wizard as a mortal.
Pharasma: Dagger - No explanation.

Calistria: Whip - Godess of lust and retribution. Yeah, that works.
Gorum: Greatsword - God of War, and specifically metal weapons.

Asmodeus: Mace - Symbolizes a scepter, given his self-proclaimed Kingship of everything (Not sure where I read this, but sounds right)
Zon-Kuthon: Spiked Chain - Basically possessed by a Cenobite. This makes sense.

Norgorber: Short Sword - Probably a Rogue as a mortal.
Urgathoa: Scythe - Goddess of Undeath. Not sure why her and not Pharasma, but does make sense.

Lamashtu: Falchion - Her actual favored weapon, personally. Symbolizes a fang (fitting her associations with animals and monsters).
Rovagug:...

I always thought is was because she's was a midwife as well as a "reaper" so the dagger was representative of a tool that could help bring life into the world, namely cutting the embilical cord, as well as take it out, with the murdering and such.

Oh, and while in the topic of Pharasma, RISE, thread! Your necroverlord commands it!


Fromper wrote:
Thewdragon wrote:
Matt2VK wrote:
I'm trying to figure out a way to upgrade my number of Fervor uses per day. Is there any feat or items out (That's not 3rd party) the can be used to increase my daily use of Fervor?

Yes. The Vestment of war from Melee Tactics Toolbox acts as a divine focus, and gives two additional uses of fervor, among other things for paladins and channelers. It really seems like a strong contender for the body slot on almost any warpriest, besides sacred fist.

At 14,000 gp, that's not something most people will be able to afford until level 8-10, at least, but still seems totally worth it. And it's PFS legal, so I'll definitely grab it on my PFS warpriest when he eventually gets that far (about to hit level 3). Thanks for pointing it out.

Yep. NP, man.


Matt2VK wrote:
I'm trying to figure out a way to upgrade my number of Fervor uses per day. Is there any feat or items out (That's not 3rd party) the can be used to increase my daily use of Fervor?

Yes. The Vestment of war from Melee Tactics Toolbox acts as a divine focus, and gives two additional uses of fervor, among other things for paladins and channelers. It really seems like a strong contender for the body slot on almost any warpriest, besides sacred fist.

EDIT: Necro'ed, sorry.


But Can't the Qinggong Monk basically do all of this with Mighty fistr of the earth as well? it has a similar range to a hadouken, does unarmed strike damage, counts as a ki strike, and only costs one ki point to use. and if the ki cost is too high, you can always take the extra ki feat.