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Split from another thread:

squirrelloid wrote:
Quandary wrote:
If I may suggest, if people's base assumptions are not compatable, than working on solutions from your own assumptions in separate threads would probably be most productive for all involved... /shrug

The proper course of action would be to discuss assumptions.

For example:

Velderan wrote:
Druid is pretty good without AC, It's not exactly awe-inspiring now that wild shape has been nerfed. And AC, if used properly (as per the fixes suggested) doesn't really overly tip the scales much.

Assumption: the wild-shape nerf majorly toned down the power of the druid.

As it did go a little way to toning down the druid, its certainly not a completely wrong assumption. What's flawed here is the assumption about the degree of the nerf. No, druids don't just get handed free physical attributes anymore - this just means they aren't SAD. Instead, good druid attribute builds will look like good cleric builds - since the cleric was already powerful despite needing to invest in attributes like strength in addition to his wisdom, this isn't the major nerf everyone seems to think it is. The druid can still take on a good appropriate form at the virtual drop of the hat and go to town.

Furthermore, the following all remain true:
(1) The Druid is still a full spellcaster with some amazingly good spells. Quick highlights: Entangle, Wall of Thorns, Shapechange. There's lots of other good stuff in there too, but I want to keep this post at a reasonable length.
(2) The wild enchantment is still poorly worded (get the benefits of armor and none of the penalties while melded leads to stupid stuff like Monk AC bonus stacking with Wild Armor + Wild Shield for a druid). While monk's 'belt' (robe?) doesn't give the full wisdom to AC anymore, dipping a level of Monk seems quite plausible, especially as you'll want IUS anyway to get iterative attacks + natural attacks (natural attacks get added on as secondary attacks after your iterative attack routine, so long as you didn't use the limb which grants the natural attack already - as monks can use any part of their body for an IUS attack...).
(3) Natural Spell still exists. Druids get the equivalent of Still and Silent for free useable on every spell.
(4) The Druid gets a bunch of other extras, some of which are amazing like *Poison Immunity*. Poison Immunity basically means you get to use Black Lotus poison with impunity (or whatever the new Paizo gold standard of poison is).

Most people would think that's more than enough for one class. Comparatively, the Bard is a 2/3 caster with a similar number of extra abilities. And we haven't even talked about the Animal Companion yet.

So, either the above makes for a weak class (If you think so, I'd love to hear your reasoning) or if we add an animal companion on top of that the animal companion has to be a non-ability, by which I mean it has no relevant effects on overcoming challenges (ie, doesn't contribute to power). At which point there's no reason to have an Animal Companion at all.

---------

So why don't the fixes work. Ok, either the AC is a relevant class feature (and is capable of doing *something*) or its not and shouldn't be a class feature at all. The Druid is capable of tracking as well or better than any AC he has (including acquiring scent via wildshape), so that's not a relevant niche. The Druid can speak with animals more effectively than his AC can. The Druid will have a better perception roll (higher wisdom score). Which leaves the only possible role for the AC as combat buddy.

To be a combat buddy, you have to be able to survive combat *at every level*. In 3.x (and 3.P is no exception) offense starts trumping defense around 5th level (and arguably true starting earlier than that). Thus, since the AC is ultimately derived from that system via the monster manual, any AC capable of surviving a level N combat is capable of contributing to that combat in a meaningful way. Which means the only 'combat buddy' possible is a relevant class ability - you can't build a creature which can survive combat at all levels and not contribute significantly to combat at any level.

Thus the AC has to either be useless or a major power boost for the Druid (who doesn't need it). The ranger otoh needs all the help he can get.

The above makes a strong case for getting rid of the AC, but the real conclusion is you have to eject something. The AC is not the only option - we could make the druid a non-caster or half-caster. Wildshape + animal companion is actually pretty potent, possibly increasing him to full BAB to reflect his role as a melee combatant. That's seriously a full class's worth of awesome without the spellcasting.

Of course, for backwards compatibility its easier to eliminate the animal companion. Druids have the ability to diplomacize animals - any NPC druids can have the animal simply befriended rather than a class feature - as the Druid's nominal CR is now level-2 instead of level, getting to count the AC's CR towards the EL may make those encounters still near the same difficulty under the encounter rules. Just count the AC as an advanced animal of the appropriate type and don't change anything. That should work just fine for adventures as is.

From an archetype standpoint, making the druid not a caster is actually the way to go. Nature spellcaster - the cleric can actually cover that. I mean, what else are those Animal and Plant domains for?

In the final analysis, the Druid just has too many good abilities, and most of those are abilities that are might as well not exist if you can't do something level-appropriate with them (notably wild shape and animal companion can't realistically be made significantly weaker than they are at present without compromising any usefulness those abilities possess - ie, reducing their value to zero and thus making them non-abilities. And as the Druid class needs to become significantly weaker, that means we have to remove one major ability).


Ok, there were some calls to run an optimized fighter through the same adventure I ran my wizard through (see here). Obviously, I’m not going to bother the DM to run this one, so this will be more in thought experiment land.

I will be assuming a cleric cohort for some consistency. Do note the cleric is far more involved this time, and what this says about the fighter’s capabilities vs. the awesome that is the leadership feat I’m not sure. This fighter would actually be fun to play, but I’ve never seen anything at all like this in a real game (whereas my wizard, while optimized, isn’t too far from some of the high-level shenanigans I’ve seen in principle). But this appears to be RAW legal, and I think this is the best I’m going to come up with. One of the things that could be taken away from this is that some of these effects are so essential to maintaining caster/non-caster parity that perhaps non-casters should be able to do them too. (I’m notably thinking of the cash-savers like GMW and MV).

Before I think my way through the adventure, I’ll leave some time for comments and suggestions on the build, which follows. But first, some notes on some of my decisions: (1) I chose TWF because THF got seriously nerfed in a number of ways in the beta, and thus is weaker than it would otherwise be. My other thought was a scythe-wielding Devastating Blow based fighter, but given just the beta it was too hard to come up with enough damage that would be multiplied on a critical to make that especially interesting. (2) I chose Light Picks because (a) its only a 2 damage less than a bastard sword on average, (b) they’re light weapons, (c) they have a x4 critical. In fact, the Light Pick and the Kukri are the only light weapons which break the typical martial x3 or 19-20 standard for criticals. Losing 1 average damage for that is a pittance, and losing 2 attack bonus to go up to a non-light weapon isn’t worth it. Further, using 2 different weapons means the WF feat only applies to one hand – boo.

The build has 3 ‘tricks’. He can melee with TWFing, he is fairly competent at archery, which it can do from the air with airwalk, and he can intimidate everyone within 30’ to make them Shaken. If he rolls high enough for it to last 2 rounds he can do it again to make them frightened (shaken + shaken = frightened), or he can just melee them. His biggest weakness is his 20’ move speed.

Fighter 15

Spoiler:
Starting: Str 18 Dex 15 Con 12 Int 5 Wis 12 Cha 10
Current: Str 27 Dex 21 Con 18 Int 5 Wis 12 Cha 10

Half-Orc: +2 Str/Wis, -2 Int, DkV 60’, Wp Familiarity Orc, Orc Ferocity, Orc Blood,

Languages: Common, Orc

Init: +5
Senses: DkV 60’, Perception +1
BAB/Attack: +15/ +31 Light Pick or +26 Composite Longbow
Full Melee Attack: +29/+29/+24/+24/+19/+19 (primary weapon varies)
Full Ranged Attack: +24/+24/+19/+14 (1st attack sends 2 arrows, ignores miss chance)
Damage: (Option: Vital Strike)
Holy Ghosttouch Light Pick: 1d4 + 11 (+2 +2d6 vs. evil) | x4
Thundering Acidic Burst Light Pick: 1d4 +11 +1d6 acid (+3d8 sonic +3d10 acid crit) | x4
Rend: 1d10 + 12 1/r
Seeking Composite Longbow: 1d8+11 | x3

Math Note: Vital Strike with the longbow averages 3 more damage than not Vital Striking. Vital Striking the TWFing averages 1 less damage than not vital striking. Both calculations assume every attack hits and no criticals occur - obviously vital strike frontloads some of that damage on the more likely attack rolls, should hitting be problematic.

hp: 153.5 = 83 (10 + 14d10) + 15x 4 (Con Mod) + 10.5 temp (heroes’ feast)
AC: 36 = 10 + 15 armor + 5 shield + 5 Dex + 1 insight +2 deflection
Svs: F +18, R +15, W +14
SR 20

[u]Active Spell Effects – See cohort for exact details[/u]
Resist Acid, Cold, Electricity, Fire, and Sonic 30.
+4 morale vs. Fear and Poison (HF)
Circle vs. Evil (Imm Magic Jar, Charm and Compulsion effects, Summoned Creatures)
Can cast Divine Favor, Obscuring Mist, and Lesser Restoration each once as if cast by cohort
+Air Walk, Freedom of Movement, Delay Poison, Endure Elements, etc…

8x Bonus Feat
Bravery (+4 vs. fear)
Armor Training +4 (+4 AC and max dex, -4 ACP)
Weapon Training +3 (Axes +3, Bows +2, Hammers +1)

Skills: Intimidate (Cha) +35
Feats: WF (Light Pick) (1), TWF (F1), Dazzling Display (F2), Skill Focus (Intimidate) (3), Double Slice (F4), Stunning Defense (5), ITWF (F6), Leadership (7), PBS (F8), Iron Will (9), Rapid Fire (F10), Vital Strike (11), TW Rend (F12), GTWF (13), Intimidating Prowess (F14), Manyshot (15)

Expenses*:
Armor + Weapons (55.5kgp): Moderate Fortification Platemail +1 (8k), Blinding Animated Heavy Shield +1 (8k), Holy Ghost Touch Light Pick +1 (16k), Thundering Acidic Burst Light Pick +1 (16k), Seeking Composite Longbow (+8) +1 (4k), +base costs of armor/weapons (~3.5k)
Other Items (142.65kgp): Handy Haversack (1k), Belt of Physical Perfection +6 (72k), Vest of Resistance +5 (12.5k), Dusty Rose Ioun Stone (2.5k), Ring of Protection +2 (4k), Winged Boots (8k), Circlet of Persuasion (2.25k), Scarab of Protection (19k), 2x ‘Scabbard’ of Keen Edges (16k), Cape of the Mountebank (5.4k)
Consumables (2850): 2x Potion of See Invisible (600), 3x Wand of CLW (2250, 150 total charges)
Other: up to 1000gp, including a bunch of arrows.
Total: 200k

*The Cohort has extensively used Craft Wondrous, Forge Ring, and Craft Arms and Armor for the fighter.

Cohort: Cleric 13

Spoiler:
For the sake of argument, assume the cohort has Extend Spell, Craft Wondrous Item, Craft Arms and Armor, Forge Ring, and otherwise doesn’t really participate in combat except to heal the fighter afterwards and do daily buffing (long-duration buffs). (Ie, more participation than the cleric assisting the wizard)

Spells cast on Fighter each day:
Endure Elements (1st, 24h)
Delay Poison (2nd, 13h)
Status (2nd, 13h)
Ext Resist Energy (3rd, 4.5h) x5 (resist 30 for each type)
Ext Magic Circle Vs. Evil (3rd, 4.5h)
Ext MV (4th, 26h) x2 (+3 Enh to Armor/Shield)
GMW (4th, 13h) x3 (+3 Enh to each pick and the composite longbow)
Imbue w/ Spell Ability (4th, until discharged: Divine Favor (+3), Obscuring Mist, and Lesser Restoration)
Ext Freedom of Movement (5th, 4.5h)
Ext. Air Walk (5th, 4.5h)
Heroes’ Feast (6th, 12h)
Greater Scrying (7th, 13h)
*Refuge (not cast every day, permanent until discharged)

Pre-adventuring buff spell slots: (of 4/6/6/6/6/4/3/2)
1st – 1 spell
2nd – 2 spells
3rd – 6 spells
4th – 6 spells
5th – 2 spells
6th – 1 spell
7th – 1 spell

We’ll also assume that the Cleric has extensively used Craft feats for the Fighter’s benefit (something the Wizard did not benefit from, but cohort as item factory is actually quite appealing to melee types). I’m going to be especially kind and not even check spell pre-requisites closely (as that would potentially require me going to the effort of specifying domains to know for sure what spells I had access to). Presumably in a party there would be a wizard who could cast the spells the cleric doesn’t have access to during crafting.

40k of the Cohort’s 110k gets spent on a Ring Gate (can you tell I really love this item?) – we’re going to rig it so that the ring gate sits where the cleric can reach through and touch the fighter easily – seeing is not desired (the cleric can scry for that). The Cleric also shells out for a wizard to cast telepathic bond and make it permanent between the two of them. The rest of the cleric’s cash is spent on personal items like +6 enhancement to wisdom, +competence to various skills (see below), and pearls of power or other useful items.

In terms of build, the clerics attribute priorities are Wis, Int, Cha. Invests heavily in knowledge skills and perception. Keeps tabs on the fighter with Greater Scrying and Status.

For the sake of sanity, it is assumed the cohort does not take leadership to get an 11th level wizard cohort (more buffing fun, spread out the buffing load), and recursively again to get a 9th level druid cohort (yay Longstrider and Barkskin, among other effects). Cohorts being able to take leadership is silly.

Basically, the fighter uses Leadership to acquire a Heal/Buff/Craft Bot and tactical support caster. Remember The Matrix? The cohort is the guy in the ship who gets the phone call and goes ‘uploading Blackhawk helicopter program now,’ done D+D style.


Over levels 1-20 the fighter gets 21 feats in beta. It sounds like an awful lot, but the relevant metric here is the number of 'tricks' the fighter is capable of.

Consider TWFing. The basic TWFing trick requires 3 feats to be viable at all levels (TWF, ITWF, GTWF). (Really, it requires a 4th, Supreme TWF, but that's not in beta/core). However, at that point you're not a very good TWFer, you need to add some enhancer feats - probably all of Double Slice, TW Rend, Vital Strike and IVS. You just spent 7(8) feats on 1 trick. That's *1/3* of your feats from levels 1-20, and we haven't talked about anything like Weapon Focus/Specialization and their greater counterparts, or feats for a ranged option, or out of combat abilities, or really anything beyond making a full attack with two weapons. Do we really want the fighter to be the class that can do 3 things reasonably well or ~5 things marginally well?

For comparison, the 20th level wizard has 36 discrete 'tricks' (spells) with durations ranging from instantaneous to all day, plus 3 specialist abilities and 18 SLAs/day, +1 spell through the Arcane Bonded item. Sure, those tricks are all one use, but an adventuring day encompasses 3-6 encounters, meaning the wizard can use 9+ tricks per encounter without being in danger of running out. Given the durations, some tricks will apply in more than one encounter and won't take actions, but even so that's more available tricks/encounter than the wizard will actually get actions to use during those encounters. And we haven't even counted his feats yet (all 15 of them). And all of the wizard's tricks are amazing when used in the right situation.

So it really matters if feats are staying mostly as-is, or if they're getting compressed. For example: TWF becomes one feat which gives you as many attacks with your off hand as with your primary hand. If feats were streamlined so tricks + enhancers cost 1-3 feats, the fighter is looking at ~10 tricks instead of 3, and we can feel a lot better about the fighter class as its written.


What will follow will be a series of adventures featuring one PC (a wizard). The following were adhered to:

(1) Only publicly available adventures have and will be used. Reproducibility is key. (If there exists an adventure you'd like me to play through for a party of level 15 or higher, feel free to link it).
(2) The PC and his cohort each received starting cash equal to WBL and were free to spend it however they saw fit.
(3) All material is 3.P Beta or from the SRD unless it explicitly occurs in the adventure.
(4) The PC was built avoiding degenerate rules exploits like arbitrary wealth or chain-binding creatures. Non-degenerate tricks are considered valid - this is high level play after all, and a certain amount of crazy is to be expected.
(5) The player (me) and the DM did not look at any of the modules before creating the character (me) or issuing any rulings about character creation (the DM).
(6) No houserules were used. All rules were interpreted exactly as written to the best of our ability to determine otherwise (#2 is a voluntary decision on my part). When there was a rules issue that came up and the RAW wasn't clear, I will outline the issue.
(7) Similarly, the adventure is taken at face value. For example, time constraints are not imposed unless the adventure specifically calls for them or fails to make sense without them. (I'm avoiding the 15-minute workday because of 2 anyway).
(8) Despite only having one character, the adventures are all (theoretically) designed for parties of characters his level or higher.
(9)Treasure and experience are accrued normally from each adventure. The wizard may use his treasure as he sees fit between adventures. If the wizard should die during an adventure, he begins the next adventure as he began that adventure.

Each adventure will receive its own post. Any outstanding issues or problems encountered will be listed at the top. Following that I will post a commentary (based on discussions between myself and the DM) about the adventure and how well designed we think it was. I will then give a synopsis of how the adventure was run. Finally, any adjustments to the character will be posted at the end of the adventure.

If an adventure was failed I'll discuss alternate strategies or tactics which may have worked, but for obvious reasons re-running the adventure leads to player bias in terms of responses.

Finally, this is the character I'm running:
Erephestos, CN Elf Wizard 15
General:

Spoiler:
Options: Universalist
Starting: Str 7 Dex 15 Con 10 Int 20 Wis 11 Cha 7
Current: Str 7 Dex 21 Con 14 Int 29 Wis 11 Cha 7

Elf: +2 perception/appraise, LLV, +2 vs. enchantment, imm sleep, +2 vs. SR, WP:longbow, shortbow, longsword, rapier

Languages*: Common, Elven, Draconic, Sylvan, Gnome, Goblin, Orc
*speaks all languages because of permanent tongues

Init: +9
Senses: Darkvision, LLV, Perception +5, See Invisible, Detect Magic Auras
BAB/Attack: +7 / +20 Hand of the Apprentice'd Rapier +4 or +12 ranged touch
hp: 110.5 = 85 + 15.5 temp (false life) +10.5 temp (heroes feast)
AC: 21 = 10 + 5 armor + 5 dex + 1 insight
Svs: F +13, R +16, W +15, +2 vs. enchantment
SR: 18

Arcane Bond (Ring of Mystic Prowess)
Cantrips
School Powers: colorspray 8/day, false life* 1/day, major image 1/day, greater invisibility 1/day, teleport 1/day, true seeing 1/day, greater shadow conjuration 1/day
Hand of the Apprentice
Metamagic Mastery (8/day)

Skills: Spellcraft +23, Kno (Arcana) +23, Kno (Dungeoneering) +23, Kno (history) +16, Kno (Nature) +23, Kno (Planes) +23, Kno (Religion) +23, Fly +20
Feats: Scribe Scroll (b), Improved Initiative (1), Extend Spell (3), Spell Focus (Illusion) (5), Craft Wondrous (W5), Spell Penetration (7), Quickened Spell (9), Heightened Spell (W10), Leadership (11), Greater Spell Focus (Illusion) (13), Greater Spell Penetration (15), Widen Spell (W15)

Spells:

Spoiler:

SPD: 4/7/6/6/6/6/4/3/2, Save DC 19 + spell level (+2 illusion), CL 16, +24 vs. SR
Spells Typically Prepared**:
0th: read magic, ghost sound, light, prestidigitation
1st: charm person, silent image, unseen servant, grease 3 slots open
2nd: protection from arrows*, web, detect thoughts, command undead, false life, knock
3rd: clairaudience/clairvoyance, greater magic weapon*, slow 3 slots open
4th: ext. magic circle vs. evil, ext. heroism*, evard’s spiked tentacles of forced intrusion, greater invisibility, enervation 1 slot open
5th: cloudkill, wall of force, overland flight*, heightened phantasmal killer 2 slots open
6th: greater dispel magic, undeath to death, flesh to stone 1 slot open
7th: summon monster VII, ethereal jaunt 1 slot open
8th: mind blank*, polymorph any object

*cast at beginning of day
**Generally, spells will be prepped specifically for the day’s adventure or activities as appropriate, but if he’s just traveling this is a fairly standard spell load. For information gathering he focuses on Contact Other Plane, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance, Scry, Greater Scry, and Detect Thoughts (and uses his divine buddies for Scry, Divination, and Augury). For combat-intensive days he’ll tailor his spell load to what he knows. If attacked by forces he is somehow incapable of dealing with he has plenty of evasion and escape options to rely on.

Spellbook

Spoiler:
Cantrips: All
1st: shield, grease, mage armor, unseen servant, charm person, sleep, colorspray, silent image, ray of enfeeblement, expeditious retreat, reduce person
2nd: arcane lock, protection from arrows, glitterdust, web, detect thoughts, see invisible, invisibility, mirror image, blindness/deafness, command undead, false life, knock, ropetrick
3rd: magic circle vs. X, protection from energy, arcane sight, clairaudience/clairvoyance, tongues, heroism, suggestion, tiny hut, displacement, major image, halt undead, blink, fly, greater magic weapon, secret page, slow, waterbreathing
4th: stoneskin, dimension door, evard's spiked tentacles of forced intrusion, solid fog, scrying, charm monster, wall of ice, greater invisibility, phantasmal killer, bestow curse, enervation, fear, elemental body I
5th: break enchantment, cloudkill, wall of stone, contact other plane, telepathic bond, mind fog, wall of force, persistent image, teleport, overland flight, permanency
6th: anti-magic field, greater dispel magic, globe of invulnerability, summon monster VI, wall of iron, true seeing, contingency, permanent image, programmed illusion, shadow walk, eyebite, undeath to death, disintegrate, flesh to stone, move earth
7th: banishment, summon monster VII, greater teleport, power word: blind, greater scrying, mass hold person, mass invisibility, greater shadow conjuration, simulacrum, control undead, waves of exhaustion, ethereal jaunt, limited wish
8th: mind blank, protection from spells, summon monster VIII, moment of prescience, power word: stun, mass charm monster, greater shout, greater shadow evocation, scintillating pattern, polymorph any object

Expenses:

Spoiler:
Ring of Mystic Prowess (30kgp): +6 intelligence (18kgp), Constitution +4 (12kgp)

Scrolls* (1325 gp): Cloudkill (612.5gp), wall of ice (350gp), waterbreathing (187.5gp), knock (75gp), false life (75gp), invisibility (75gp)

Other Magical Gear* (122.25kgp): Handy Haversack (1kgp), Blessed Book (6.25kgp), Eyes of the Eagle (1.25kgp), Robe of the Archmagi (37.5kgp), Dusty Rose Ioun Stone (2.5kgp), Orange Ioun Stone (15kgp), Ring Gate (40kgp), Belt of Dexterity +6 (18kgp), Wand of CLW (750gp)

Additional Spells known (15,750 gp):
(1st, 50gp) reduce person
(2nd, 1000gp) arcane lock, protection from arrows, glitterdust, see invisible, invisibility, blindness/deafness, command undead, knock, ropetrick
(3rd, 1950gp) protection from energy, arcane sight, clairaudience/clairvoyance, tongues, heroism, suggestion, tiny hut, displacement, major image, halt undead, blink, greater magic weapon, waterbreathing
(4th, 1800gp) stoneskin, dimension door, solid fog, scrying, charm monster, wall of ice, bestow curse, enervation, fear
(5th, 1750gp) break enchantment, wall of stone, contact other plane, telepathic bond, persistent image, overland flight, permanency
(6th, 3300gp) anti-magic field, globe of invulnerability, summon monster VI, wall of iron, true seeing, contingency, programmed image, shadow walk, eyebite, disintegrate, move earth,
(7th, 3150gp) banishment, summon monster VII, greater teleport, power word: blind, greater scrying, mass invisibility, control undead, waves of exhaustion, ethereal jaunt,
(8th, 3200gp) protection from spells, summon monster VIII, moment of prescience, power word stun, mass charm monster, greater shout, scintillating pattern, polymorph any object

Other Expenses (28.5kgp): Simulacrum (self, 7HD) – 3.5kgp, Permanencied Spells: Arcane Sight (7.5k gp), Tongues (7.5k gp), see invisibility (5k gp), Darkvision (5kgp)
Standard Gear (up to 1825 gp): mirror (1k), rapier, spell component pouches, clothes, other typical stuff.
Total: 200kgp

*All items crafted when possible. If I’ve accidentally forgotten a spell or two I need, I can easily afford it with the ‘standard gear’ cash which is far more than adequate. Keep in mind my cohort can supply some of the spells.

His Simulacrum

Spoiler:
Simulacrum – Duplicate of Erephestos (Elf Wizard 7)
Str 7 Dex 15 Con 10 Int 23 Wis 11 Cha 7

Elf: +2 perception/appraise, LLV, +2 vs. enchantment, imm sleep, +2 vs. SR, WP:longbow, shortbow, longsword, rapier

Init: +6
Senses: LLV
hp: 44.5 = 7d6 (21.5) + 12.5 temp (false life) + 10.5 temp (heroes' feast)
BAB/Attack: +3 / +5 ranged touch or +9 Hand of the Apprentice’d rapier
AC: 16 = 10 + 4 armor + 2 Dex
Svs: F +2, R +4, W +5, +2 vs. enchantment

Arcane Bond (Ring)
Cantrips
School Powers: colorspray 8/day, false life* 1/day, major image 1/day,
Hand of the Apprentice

Skills: Spellcraft +16, Kno (Arcana) +16, Kno (Dungeoneering) +16, Kno (history) +16, Kno (Nature) +16, Kno (Planes) +16, Kno (Religion) +16, Fly +12
Feats: Scribe Scroll (b), Improved Initiative (1), Extend Spell (3), Spell Focus (Illusion) (5), Craft Wondrous (W5), Spell Penetration (7)

SPD: 4/6/5/3/2, DC 16 + spell level (+1 illusion), +11 vs. SR
Spells Typically Prepared:
0th: detect magic, resistance, mending, prestidigitation
1st: mage armor, ray of enfeeblement, silent image, grease, expeditious retreat, reduce person
2nd: protection from arrows, invisibility x3, see invisible
3rd: magic circle vs. evil, fly, tiny hut
4th: solid fog, enervation

Spellbook
Uses Erephestos’s

Gear (0gp): ‘non-magical’ semi-real equivalents of gear worn by Erephestos, including a rapier

His Cohort:
Valderash, CN Human Cleric 13 of Lamashtu [Chaotic] [Evil]
General:

Spoiler:
Starting: Str 7 Dex 10 Con 14 Int 9 Wis 18 Cha 14
Current: Str 7 Dex 10 Con 20 Int 9 Wis 27 Cha 20

Human: bonus feat, +1 rank/level, +1 martial proficiency, favored class: cleric

Languages: Common

Init: +4
Senses: DkV 60’, Perception +8
BAB/Attack: +9 / +10 unarmed strike +3 (1d4 +1)
hp: 137.5 = 62 + 65 con + 10.5 temp (heroes’ feast)
AC: 27 = 10 + 11 armor + 5 shield +1 insight
Svs: F+18, R+9, W+21,

Aura [Chaotic] [Evil]
Channel Negative Energy 8/day, DC 21
Spontaneous Inflict
Madness Domain: vision of madness (su), aura of madness (su) 13r/day, lesser confusion 6/day, touch of idiocy 1/day, phantasmal killer 3/day.
Chaos Domain: touch of chaos (su), chaos blade (su) 13r/day, protection from law 6/day, align weapon (chaos) 1/day, chaos hammer 3/day.

Skills: Spellcraft +15, Diplomacy +21, Sense Motive +24
Feats: WP: Falchion (b), WP: Unarmed Strike (b), Improved Initiative (b), Spell Focus (Necromancy) (1), Greater Spell Focus (Necromancy) (3), Craft Wondrous (5), Extend Spell (7), Craft Rod (9), Heighten Spell (11), Spell Penetration (13)

Spells:

Spoiler:

SPD: 4/6/6/6/6/4/3/2, save DC 18+spell level (+2 necromancy), CL13, +15 vs. SR
Typical Spells:
0th: create water, guidance, mending, virtue
1st: bane, doom x3, shield of faith x2
2nd: align weapon, death knell x3, delay poison*+ x2
3rd: bestow curse, deeper darkness, magic circle vs. evil*, magic vestment** x2, protection from elements
4th: death ward x2, dimensional anchor, Ext (rod) freedom of movement*+ x2, greater magic weapon*
5th: commune, slay living, wall of stone, heightened bestow curse
6th: heal, heroes’ feast*, summon monster VI
7th: summon monster VII x2

*cast at start of adventuring day
+cast on Erephestos at start of adventuring day

Gear:

Spoiler:
Weapons and Armor (10.65kgp): Platemail (1500), Animated Lg Shield +1 (9150)
Other Magical Gear (91.25kgp): Handy Haversack (1k), Headband of Mental Prowess (wis/cha) +6 (45k), Cloak of Resistance +5 (12.5k), Belt of Con +6 (18k), Dusty Rose Ioun Stone (2.5k), Rod of Extend (5.5k), goggles of night (6k), Wand of CLW (750)
Mundane Gear (up to 8.1kgp): usual stuff.
Total 110/110kgp
Gear is crafted whenever possible


Wait, what's a candle of invocation?
Its a crazy consumable item. It provides three abilities while it lasts (4 hours). The first one is ok. The other two are not:

Clerics can memorize spells as if they were two levels higher
Use Gate once (CL 17), which extinquishes the candle

So, what's the big deal?
It costs 8,400gp. Which means it (1)starts showing up with *medium* magic items. Ie, sometime around level 8. (2) Its trivially available to 10th level characters.

What the heck are you talking about Squirrelloid?
Gate is crazy. Absolutely control an outsider of up to 34HD that you call in? Like a Solar, Balor, Chichimec, or Titan (all SRD). At 10th level? For 8.4kgp? Ew.

And that's actually the less broken of the two abilities. Memorizing spells as a cleric of two levels higher sound kind of tame? Its not. Consider this lovely line from the item: "He can even cast spells normally unavailable to him as if he were of that higher level, but only so long as the candle continues to burn."

I still don't get it, this is worse than gate?
Take a gander at the skill Use Magic Device. Among other abilities, it lets you emulate a class feature, such as 'spellcasting'. When you do so, your effective level with that feature is your UMD check -20.

Now, consider an *unoptimized* (for UMD) rogue who is decent at UMD (ie, the "Face" rogue). He has 22 Cha at 10th level (18 start + 2 level + 2 enhancement). He has max ranks in UMD because UMD is awesome. His UMD check is +19 (10 ranks + 3 in-class + 6 cha). The expected d20 roll is 10.5 - we'll call it 10 - which lets him emulate cleric spellcasting as a level 9 cleric for the purpose of using a magic item.

Now, the Candle of Invocation specifically allows him to prepare and cast spells 'normally unavailable to him', which would be all of them. So for 4 hours he can cast spells as an 11th level cleric (9+2 for the candle). At 10th level.

And we haven't even considered a UMD optimized rogue, who might have skill focus UMD and an item of +competence bonus to UMD. Hitting cleric level 20+ with this trick isn't that hard.

So either Candle of Invocation needs a serious rewrite, or the item needs to be axed. And I'm honestly fine either way.

-------

Aside: I know I keep posting this theoretical stuff. This is the stuff I run into just building a level 15 character for a playtest. It jumps out at you. I wasn't even looking for Candle of Invocation, but I remembered the 3.5 problems with it, and so when i ran across it I took a gander - and ew, no apparent change.


There are a lot of ways to get arbitrary wealth in 3.5, most of them spells. This creates obvious problems, because PCs are not meant to have arbitrary wealth.

Demonstration
Wall of Iron conjures a permanent non-magical wall of iron. That iron can then be melted into bars and sold. In fact, its a wonder anyone would ever bother to mine iron, because getting someone to cast the spell is ultimately cheaper than paying workers to mine the same quantity of iron, not to mention lacking the other costs (feeding/care of miners, generally far from major cities, loss of life or work time due to injury or death from accidents, etc...). Plus, 3.x has no real economy rules. PCs can always sell items for 1/2 their normal value. That's a hard and fast rule, and any alteration is a houserule - and thus not the subject of a playtest.

Even if we want to talk about houserules, world consistency solutions only work if the world is actually written assuming that people are using Wall of Iron as the primary source of iron in the world. The problem is that published campaign settings do not do so. They assume miners. So the PCs are clearly the first ones in the world to think of such a thing. (And even in a homebrew you have to accept the kind of industrialization that such a theory of 'mining' leads to. Most people don't want the kind of world this creates. People want medieval with magic, not magic as technology... for the most part)

Worse yet, its not the only way to create wealth repeatedly with a spell. The other usual canonical example is Flesh to Salt, which is non-core, but I can dig up many many more. (As was pointed out, planar binding a lantern archon leads to arbitrary wealth exploits).

Further, Flesh to Salt introduces another problem - splatbooks are highly likely to introduce more spells which lead to infinite wealth exploits. Basically, any spell which creates *lasting wealth* in some way, shape, or form is problematic.

Root Issues and Solutions
Problematic how? The real issue is that wealth is directly convertible into power via magic items. Arbitrary wealth -> arbitrary magic items.

Given the virtual guarantee that there will continue to be new and varied infinite wealth exploits as additional material gets released, fixing individual spells is clearly not the answer. There are only two places this general phenomena can be attacked.

(1) Magic Items don't increase power.
If it didn't matter that you had arbitrary items, then it wouldn't be an issue. Unfortunately, in addition to the pain of having to rework the very nature of magic items, much less rewrite every single one, it also completely breaks backwards compatibility. Barbie dress-up syndrome is here to stay.

(2) Wealth cannot be transformed into arbitrary items.
Some items can just not be had for any amount of gold. Rather, creatures possessing them require inherently valuable planar currencies or other magic items that can also not be had for gold. One good place for this cut off is about 15k gp. Any item worth >=15k gp can be bought for gold. Thus, about the time most arbitrary wealth schemes become available, you can get a few plausibly helpful items, but nothing that will knock your socks off.

Benefit: Arbitrary wealth exploits can exist - we don't have to watchdog for them continuously, and new ones won't ruin anything.
Benefit: Dragons can have enough gold to sleep on. We don't have to worry about it.
Benefit: Players can own castles, raise armies, and live luxuriously without having to worry about it decreasing their effectiveness as an adventurer. Ie, wealth actually gets used for roleplaying purposes, like it used to be back in 2nd edition.
Benefit: Coolness value - DM's who limit availability of items may have the players track down a Yugoloth merchant in Sigil, but he'll only take Souls. Ie, this creates a system with houserule/roleplaying potential. (It can of course be played fine with 'i have enough planar currency, i find a vendor and buy it' style playing as well.)

Proof of Backwards Compatibility:
Define some planar currencies (Solar Tears, Liquid Schwartz, Souls, whatever). These things have real inherent value, and are the basis of exchange of more valuable magical items. You can list their value in gp, but you can never trade for them with gp. (gp are useless in the planar economy because gold is easily acquired).

Crafting items worth >15k requires the crafting cost be paid in planar currencies or other magic items worth > 15k (which are destroyed during crafting and valued at their sell value). We just assume actual materials can be had without much difficulty, its materials which contribute to the magical essence that are of real value.

You purchase items with planar currencies when those items are worth >15k gp.

Basically, this system can be overlain on top of the existing system with no issues. All the current prices are compatible because there is an 'effective gp price', its just you can't actually use gp for that purchase.


I'm trying to find item slot affinities or any rules regarding them or creation of custom items. Or confirmation that 3.P beta does not include such rules (and therefore the appropriate reference is the SRD). Thanks for the help.


I'd like to also point out that the Planar Ally and Planar Binding spells are unchanged from the SRD. Thus, wizards are still chain-binding efreeti for free wishes. That they've made wish *useless* for stat pumping just means you need to use it to craft books of +stats instead, because that way you don't penalize your stats.

(Seriously, having to reduce an attribute for Wish is a really stupid design decision. The problem was never Wish granting inherent bonuses, the problem was being able to do it early and cheaply via Planar Binding - in fact, the need to cast all of the wishes sequentially should also be removed - the game expects you to have a few +5 inherent bonuses by 20th level, making this stupidly hard to do helps no one).

Yes, wish can't create any item ever anymore. It can't even create wealth as a standard ability (which is really weird in the context of djinni given stories like Aladdin). But it can duplicate virtually every other spell in existence, which is a lot of power potentially available. And I'm sure people can figure out uses for free wishes beyond item crafting.

SLA'ed spells still don't use components, so the efreet requires no diamond to use his Wish ability.

--------
Crafting Tomes at 13th level:

So, the Tomes of inherent abilities are 5000/plus overcosted for xp now for crafting because it doesn't cost xp anymore to cast wish, it costs 25kgp of diamond (which you don't care about because the Efreet is providing the spell). So a +5 Tome costs 6,250gp to craft (+125kgp for diamonds if you're actually casting Wish yourself - the Paizo web enhancement has this wrong, for some reason it just halves the market price when most of that is the cost of material components that you *need to spend*, as per the rules for Craft Wondrous).

Technically, the SRD is wrong and Paizo doubly wrong. You must expend the spell each day of crafting (ie, wish), and it takes 7 days to craft one. Thus, you actually use Wish 7x (not 5), making the market price actually 187.5kgp in either system. This is totally irrelevant if you are not the one supplying the Wish spells, however.

3.P no longer requires a minimum caster level, just the use of the right spells. We have a source of Wish (bound efreeti) and thus at 13th level you can chain-bind efreeti to craft Tomes of Attribute +5 in Paizo.

Obvious broken is still obvious.


Ok, an elven wizard will quite likely be getting 5 bonus languages. The elf section lists 6, many of which are not very wizardly. The list is clearly insufficiently large to offer any real choice for high-int characters.

Should classes also open up some bonus language options for starting characters. I mean, Celestial, Abyssal, Elemental, and Infernal would all be great wizard languages for dealing with summoned creatures, and are things a starting wizard (or cleric) should be able to know irrespective of race. Or perhaps make a general 'anyone can select these as bonus languages' section.

Further, halflings get Abyssal on their list for some totally unknowable reason. Really? If elves (who are the pre-eminent wizards, in theory) don't get access to it, why should halflings?

I'm honestly not sure why there are restricted lists for bonus languages anyway. I know, we've had it since 1st edition. But why not just let anyone choose any language - the mechanics as they exist now are generally ignored and can only get in the way of fun. They contribute nothing positive at all.


I realize this is likely to get a lot of discussion, but this is really a request of someone with power to do things (likely Jason).

What balance point is 3.P aiming for? The best possible way to do this is to name a class which you believe is the paragon of balance. For example: Rogue. Then we know what we're comparing other classes to, and which ones are too powerful or lacking.

Without that information, one of the two conclusions are possible:
(1) The balance point is whatever the most powerful class is, and everything below that is lacking (because that's the balance point you'll find through play - ie, people will gravitate to where the power is).
(2) Feedback is useless because there is no metric by which to evaluate abilities. I can't tell you if feat X or spell Y is over or under powered, because we don't even know what those concepts are.


I couldn't find an appropriate board for this, so I suppose General is as good a place as any.

I DLed the beta, but when I unpack the zip it gives me an empty folder. I'm pretty sure I DLed the full file, as the zip is the appropriate size. Help?


I discovered this while playtesting a Wizard at various levels (1,4,7,10) in 3.P.0.2 rules, which don't seem to have changed notably for wizards in 3.P.0.3.

The problems:
(1) The wizard was already really good, it didn't need the help

(2) The versatility of grabbing any one spell you have in your spell book is crazy good. Its like always having the right spell for any situation. This vastly increases a wizard's power at low levels by making them less reliant on careful planning, and lets them basically have a free floating spell slot at higher levels which, while less important to their overall power, means they can focus their spell selection more than otherwise.

(3) The ability to craft at *half normal crafting cost* (1/4 market price) is obscene. Even in the worst case scenario (secondary unrelated ability in the wrong slot), it only costs ~.56 the market value of an item of that ability. (1.5*1.5*0.25 = 9/16 ~= .56) A wizard need never learn an item crafting feat with that kind of deal - the savings in cash are insignificant. Instead, she can just overload her arcane bonded item with abilities. (A fine covering of Explosive Runes and Drawmij's make it unstealable at 11th level, and most situations which would involve a precious bonded item being stolen would also involve all the wizard's gear being stolen, so the risk of putting all her enchantments on one item isn't really larger than spreading it out amongst her equipment).

Don't get me wrong, Wizards can already go to crazytown in the rules pretty easily. But with arcane bond it starts happening even earlier and easier than normal.


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Design Statement
The fighter should be a tactical battlefield commander who can control the flow of combat. Unlike the barbarian, he excels through skill and tactics, not just by repeatedly hitting it with a big weapon. And while he's capable of dealing some punishing blows, his bigger contribution to the party is controlling when and where a monster strikes.

Notes:
Abilities which aren't described below are exactly as described in 3.P.0.3.

Some inspiration was gained from the Races of War fighter by K and Frank Trollman. However, the world is apparently unready for that, and what inspiration was gained has been toned down quite a bit. But credit where credit is due, and those familiar with Races of War will surely recognize the source of some abilities.

This is a draft and isn't yet playtested extensively.

The Fighter
I've seen this type of Xornling rush before, its a distraction, and the real threat will come from the skies

1 Bonus Feat
2 Bonus Feat, Bravery
3 Surprise Lunge, Armor Training
4 Bonus Feat
5 Expert Defender, Weapon Training
6 Bonus Feat
7 Parry, Armor Training
8 Bonus Feat
9 Rapid Reactions, Weapon Training
10 Bonus Feat
11 Tactical Genius, Armor Training
12 Bonus Feat
13 Perfect Moment, Weapon Training
14 Bonus Feat
15 Ranged Parry, Armor Training
16 Bonus Feat
17 Stunning Combo, Weapon Training
18 Bonus Feat
19 Armor Mastery
20 Bonus Feat, Weapon Mastery

Skills: 6+int mod/level. Add Knowledge(Dungeoneering), Knowledge(Geography), Knowledge(Nobility and Royalty), Perception, Acrobatics, and Diplomacy

Surprise Lunge (ex): As an immediate action the Fighter may treat his threatened area as 5' farther than usual, and any interrupted action which would then trigger an attack of opportunity does so. The fighter moves 5' such that the creature now triggering this AoO would be within his normal threat range, and then resolves the attack of opportunity. His threatened area then returns to normal.

Expert Defender (ex): All squares the fighter threatens are treated as difficult terrain by enemy creatures.

Parry (ex): As an immediate action a fighter may make an attack against any creature he threatens in response to an action they are about to take. If he deals damage with this attack that action is thwarted and lost.

Rapid Reactions (ex): Whenever the fighter gets an attack of opportunity he may also take a 5' step either before or after making the AoO.

Tactical Genius (ex): The fighter receives an extra immediate action each turn.

Perfect Moment (ex): The fighter can take a full round action as a readied action.

Ranged Parry (ex): The fighter may Parry against any creature within 30' so long as he has a ranged weapon in or immediately at hand (drawing a thrown weapon from a belt is ok, stringing your bow is not). In all other respects this ability works exactly like Parry. The creature must be within range when it starts the action - entering range after the action is started doesn't allow the use of this ability.

Stunning Combo (ex): Whenever the fighter successfully deals damage with an attack of opportunity he may also immediately perform a combat maneuver of his choice against the same opponent. The Fighter gains a +4 bonus on this maneuver due to surprise.

Armor Mastery (ex): as 3.P.0.3 except the fighter gains DR 10/-

Weapon Mastery (ex): When wielding a weapon that belongs to a group with which he has weapon training the fighter may take a full-round action as a standard action. In return he loses the benefit of Tactical Genius until the start of his next turn.


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Design Statement:
The monk is intended to be a highly mobile martial character who inflicts debilitating conditions on his opponents rather than dish out massive damage. Ultimately this means he's a support character, although given enough time he may be able to finish some foes on his own. He could make a good substitute for the rogue in an iconic party or act as a decent 5th character. A monk should be able to harass and effectively hinder casters and ranged attack monsters

Notes:
In the interests of back-compatibility, 3/4 BAB is maintained.

Given the 3.5 definition of alignments there is seriously no reason monks need be Lawful. Similarly, there are no ex-monks.

Any abilities without a section below should be considered identical to the text of 3.P.0.3. Similarly, unarmored speed, unarmed damage, and the flurry of blows progression are identical to 3.P.0.3.

Wholeness of Body needs to be worthwhile or it should just be axed. I almost gave the ability I did as a swift action, but decided it would be playable as a move. Anything worse than that is simply insulting.

The Stunning Fist feat doesn't exist anymore. Similarly, the Scorpion Style feat, while plausibly useful for non-monks, is no longer a bonus feat and exceeded by Crouching Tiger Paw.

Medusa's Wrath is amended to also work when the opponent is Nauseated.

This is a draft, and not rigorously playtested yet. IMHO it is unlikely to be too powerful, and should have useful things to do at all levels. Which means that even if its underpowered the player can still feel like he's contributing.

Monk
1 Bonus feat, flurry of blows, unarmed strike, AC bonus +4
2 Bonus feat, evasion
3 Maneuver Training, Ki Maneuver (Rising Sun)
4 Ki Pool (Magic), slow fall, AC bonus +5
5 High jump, purity of body, Ki Maneuver (Crouching Tiger Paw)
6 Bonus feat
7 Ki Maneuver (Coiled Cobra Thrust)
8 Wholeness of Body, AC bonus +6
9 Improved Evasion, Ki Maneuver (Broken Rabbit Defense)
10 Bonus feat, ki pool (Alignment)
11 Diamond Body, Ki Maneuver (Monkey Shock Attack)
12 Abundant Step, AC bonus +7
13 Diamond Soul, Ki Maneuver (Part the Moon's Veil)
14 Bonus feat
15 Ki Maneuver (Blossoming Lotus Touch)
16 Ki pool (special material), tongue of the sun and moon
17 Timeless Body, Ki Maneuver (The Halves Become Whole)
18 Bonus feat, Empty body
19 Ki Maneuver (Solar Eclypse)
20 Perfect Self

BAB: 3/4
Saves: all favored

HD: d8
Alignment: Any, although many monks are Lawful

Proficiencies: Any weapons previously designated as monk weapons and all simple melee weapons are considered monk weapons. A monk is proficient with all monk weapons. A monk gains no armor or shield proficiencies, and loses his flurry of blows, AC bonus, and fast movement abilities when wearing armor, using a shield, or carrying a medium load or greater.

AC Bonus (ex): When unarmored and unencumbered the monk gains a bonus to AC equal to 4+wis modifier. This bonus increases by 1 for every 4 levels. This bonus applies even against touch attacks and when the monk is flat-footed, but not when he is immobilized, helpless, wearing armor, using a shield, or carrying a medium or heavier load.

Flurry of Blows (ex): As 3.P.0.3 except 'Special Monk Weapons' includes all simple weapons as well.

Ki Pool (su): At 1st level a monk gains a pool of ki, spiritual energy created by the body which he can focus to great effect. A monk's ki pool is equal to his class level plus his wisdom modifier. Ki may be spent as per the second paragraph of Ki pool in 3.P.0.3, and is regained as per the 3rd.

At 4th level a monk with any ki remaining in his ki pool may treat his fists as magic for overcoming damage reduction. At 10th level he may also treat them as one alignment he possesses, chosen when the monk first gains this ability (true neutral monks may choose any alignment). At 16th level he may also treat his fists as any one special material, which he may alter once per round as a free action. These traits apply for the purposes of bypassing DR and hardness.

Ki Maneuver (su): At 3rd level and every 2 levels thereafter the monk acquires a ki maneuver. Unless otherwise noted, each ki maneuver is activated as a swift action after dealing damage to a foe with an unarmed strike or monk's weapon and requires 1 ki to activate. The DC for all saves is 10 + 1/2 Character Level + Wis Mod

Rising Sun (3rd level) - The target must make a Fortitude Save or be blinded for a number of rounds equal to the Monk's wisdom modifier.

Crouching Tiger Paw (5th level) - The target must make a Reflex Save or have its movement restricted to 5' in all modes. (Flying creatures with maneuverability less than perfect may stall and fall and will need to make an appropriate Fly check to stay airborn).

Coiled Cobra Thrust (7th level) - The target must make a Fortitude Save or be nauseated until the end of the Monk's next turn.

Broken Rabbit Defense (9th level) - The Monk spends a ki point and announces he is activating this option as a swift action at the end of his turn. Until the start of his next turn all attacks against him which miss cause the creature who attacked him to become fatigued. Fatigued creatures who become fatigued become exhausted as normal.

Monkey Shock Attack (11th level) - If the monk connects and deals damage with 2 or more attacks against one opponent he may activate Monkey Shock Attack as a swift action against that opponent at the cost of 1 ki. The opponent must make a fortitude save or be Stunned until the end of the Monk's next turn.

Part the Moon's Veil (13th level) - As a swift action, immediately after moving due to a teleportation effect the monk may spend a ki point to gain one attack, which must be taken immediately.

Blossoming Lotus Touch (15th level) - As a swift action the monk may spend 3 ki points after dealing damage with two or more attacks against the same opponent. That opponent must make a fortitude save or take an additional 10 damage/character level of the monk.

The Halves Become Whole (17th level) - The monk receives a second swift action each round, which may only be used to activate ki maneuvers. The monk may never activate the same ki maneuver more than once in a given round, but may activate two different ones.

Solar Eclypse (19th level) - As a swift action, immediately after moving as part of a teleportation effect, the monk may spend 3 ki points to gain a full attack action that must be used immediately.

Slow Fall (ex): At 4th level the Monk is treated as having a permanent non-magical effect identical in all other respects to feather fall. He may suppress this ability if he wishes.

Wholeness of Body (su): At 7th level or higher a monk can heal his own wounds as a move action. By spending 1 point of ki he heals Wis Mod x level hp.

Abundant Step (su): At 12th level or higher a monk can slip magically between spaces, teleporting 400'+40'/class level as a move action which costs 2 ki points. This is a teleportation effect.

Diamond Soul (ex): As 3.P.0.3, but SR = 11+character level.


So, all the poisons now have a level associated with them, but if a character wanted to buy them how much would they cost? I can't seem to find such information with the poison listing in 3.P.0.3.


The advanced talent Feat lets rogues gain *any* bonus feat. Like the 3.5 rules before this, a rogue can still select feats they don't qualify for, which is bizarre. Text to the effect of "may gain any feat they qualify for as a bonus feat" would limit this abuse, and would be a simple fix to make.


Versatile Rage
Prerequisites: Rage class feature, at least one Rage Power
Benefit: You gain a rage power of your choice for which you otherwise qualify. This works exactly as if you had gained a new rage power as a class feature.


This is what I noticed on a quick read - obviously I have not elaborated on the new classes. This is mostly a note of changes in things that were otherwise in 3.P.0.2 that have changed so people can find them easier. If you noticed something I didn't, please post. (Otherwise lets try to keep this post free of discussion so its a useful reference).

Halflings now get +2 Cha instead of +2 Int. Favored Classes now Rogue and Bard.

Elf Favored Classes now Ranger and Wizard.

Gnome Favored Classes now Bard and Sorceror.

Barbarian:
Rage Powers had some alterations in point cost.

If you imagine rage powers were costed as Nx3 before, they're now costed as Nx2 (2/4/6/8). Yes, they are all cheaper.

For the most part the powers' text has not changed. The exception is Terrifying Howl, which references an actual power as a prerequisite now instead of "Hunters Cry".

Added Bard

Fighter
New ability: Bravery - a bonus to Will saves against fear. 2nd level (scales every 4 levels)

Armor Training also increases the max dex bonus of the armor (at the same rate as other abilities)

Added Monk

Paladin
Substantial changes to the Lay on Hands mechanics.

Some text cleaning on the Divine Bond rules, but seems to be equivalent mechanics

Remove Disease now functions by using uses of Lay on Hands.

New Ability: Remove Curse. 9th level.
New Ability: Break Enchantment. 15th level.
New Ability: Heal. 18th level.

All of these function off the new Lay on Hands mechanics.

Added Ranger

Sorceror
Bloodlines add a skill to your class skill list.
Bloodlines give out bonus spells.

Touch powers that deal damage have become rays.


Apologies for the double post - i thought it ate my first one.

It should also be noted that the new point buy is completely incompatible with 3.5 point buy.


Exact Targeting contains the following line that is highly problematic:

"You cannot select a target with total cover or concealment".

Consider the following situation - a creature moves and then casts invisibility. Everyone knows where it is - it ended its turn by casting invisibility. Everyone else can target the square(s) its in as usual, and accepting their 50% miss chance. Assuming the text works as intended, the person with exact targeting can't even try to hit them because of this feat - creatures who are invisible have total concealment.

More ridiculously, someone with a large piece of fabric and wood crossbeams could hold it up between you and them (gaining total concealment) and you couldn't shoot at them. Its on par with rogues getting total cover from tower shields so they can hide, which incidentally hides the tower shield as well!

Of course, technically, the rules prohibit you from attacking any creature with total cover or total concealment at all. In the case of total concealment you attack into their square. At which point that line of text does absolutely nothing.

So if you assume the line of text is supposed to mean something, it leads to non-intuitive behavior where the skilled targeter is prohibited from doing things other characters can do. If you read it literally, it means absolutely nothing in the context of the rules, and thus only causes confusion.


So, the problem that has plagued martial classes in D+D ever since they stopped being seen as expendable mooks is that there has never been a clear goal stated for what they should accomplish.

Let's look at the alternatives for a moment. We know the rogue is supposed to be able to deal with traps, and his mechanics do, in fact, help him do that. He's also supposed to be able to deal a lot of damage in the right situations, which given a decent build and some intelligence basically means he's a DPS machine. This means he's great at killing monsters with relatively low hp or who try to get by with superior defenses rather than offenses.

Whatever the intention with wizards was, wizards are awesome against tough monsters. These monsters tend to have boatloads of hp but often have low Will saves, and wizards have a plethora of ways of taking advantage of this to win combat (effectively, if not in actuality). Further, as levels increase the wizard gains good spells that target other saves, meaning that if trading damage isn't a great idea, the monster would be much easier to just drop a save-or-lose spell or two on it and make combat trivial for the party. Ie, the wizard has a clear combat role in combat. (They are also kings of combat flow control, fwiw).

So, the problem for melee characters has always been 'oh, we'll hand him a sword, and we'll give him some things to do with it' but never a clear idea about what monsters he should really shine against. Even ranged martial classes or builds are in an analogous boat - feats look well and good, but no one seems to be thinking about how these are supposed to add up to beating different types of monsters that are level-appropriate challenges.

So, what monster types should the Barbarian shine against? The Fighter? The Ranger? Monk? Paladin? We know what their schtick is, what we don't know is how they're supposed to be going about it.

For example, the barbarian could be the 'blows through magical protections and offenses to kill casters and casting monsters' class where you shrug off every spell the mage tosses at you and bring your axe down on his head. But if he's supposed to do that he needs abilities that are tailored to do that and actually accomplish that at all levels. Similarly, he could be the 'gets monsters to attack him and can take the damage' class, but he needs abilities to force monsters to direct attacks at him instead of the juicy casters, and level appropriate abilities to withstand damage.

Basically, the melee class fixes proposed in alpha 2 are just incremental adjustments that don't really give these classes a true place to shine. To make them competitive at every level we need to have a benchmark for level appropriate. And that means each one of them needs a design statement that defines this metric.

So Jason - What types of foes should Barbarian's shine against?

Similarly, fighters, monks, rangers, paladins, et al.

Because once we know what the design goals are, we can actually see if the classes meet them rather than arguing about what they should be doing and whether they are doing it or not. And I'm honestly curious where you see them going and if you have any benchmarks you're using to test your finished designs against your goals.


Notes:
(1) This is primarily a rewrite of Rage powers to both remove or adjust some truly awful powers, and to introduce some useful high level powers. Any power not listed should be assumed to have been removed. A few other abilities were also minorly adjusted (notably Indomitable Will was rewritten).
(2) The goal of this rewrite is to make the barbarian more competitive with the Rogue and caster classes. This rewrite is not, in itself, necessarily sufficient to the task. Feats, especially Paizo's combat feats, need to be carefully examined.
(3) Barbarians start gaining access to a number of supernatural abilities around 9th level and beyond. That's what high level characters do. If you don't believe in supernatural martial classes, please only consider the powers available at 8th level and below in your comments. Comments that 'supernatural powers don't belong here' are not appreciated and not constructive - That represents a fundamental difference in opinion on the power level and nature of the classes in D+D and this thread is not the place for that discussion.

Barbarian Class
1 Fast Movement, Rage
2 Rage Power, Uncanny Dodge
3 Indomitable Will
4 Rage Power
5 Improved Uncanny Dodge
6 Rage Power
7 DR 3/-
8 Rage Power
9 Irresistible Force
10 Damage Reduction 6/-, Rage Power
11 Greater Rage
12 Rage Power
13 DR 9/-
14 Rage Power
15
16 DR 12/-, Rage Power
17 Tireless Rage
18 Rage Power
19 DR 15/-
20 Mighty Rage, Rage Power

BAB: Good
Saves: Fort and Ref favored
Skills: as per 3.P.0.2

Un-specified abilities (but not rage powers) function as per the SRD or 3.P.0.2.

Rage (Ex): As per 3.P.0.2 pg 8-10, except a barbarian gains 4+con modifier rage points every level.

Rage Powers: As per 3.P.0.2 pg 10 in general, but replace all the rage powers as follows:
Animal Fury(ex): The Barbarian gains a bite attack with his full base attack bonus in addition to any other attacks he may make this round. The bite deals 1d6 damage for a medium creature and scales normally per sizing rules, plus the barbarian's strength modifier. If the bite hits the barbarian gets a +2 bonus on grapple checks against the target of his bite until the start of his next turn. (6 rage points)
Increased DR(ex): The Barbarian improves his existing DR by 3 for every 3 rage points spent on this power, to a maximum of 9 points spent (and 9/- added to DR). The Barbarian must have DR as a class feature to select this power. The effects last until the start of his next turn, but may be reapplied. (3,6,9 rage)
Elemental Rage(su): The Barbarian transforms her attacks into powerful elemental strokes. Damage from every attack this round is converted into elemental damage of the barbarian's choice (fire, electricity, acid, cold, sonic). The barbarian must be character level 9 or higher to select this power. (6 rage)
Guarded Stance)(ex): as per 3.P.0.2 pg 10.
Taunt(ex): As an attack action, the Barbarian makes a disparaging comment about her foe's mother, or otherwise insults him. The foe must pass a Will save (DC 10 + 1/2 character level + cha mod) or be unable to take any actions aside from moving directly towards the barbarian and attacking the barbarian with a melee or ranged weapon on that foe's next turn. This compulsion only lasts one turn, and is a mind-affecting effect. (Sharing a language is unnecessary, gestures and tone convey the message sufficiently) (3 rage)
Knockback(ex): The barbarian may make an immediate bullrush check against each foe she hits this round, and that foe moves back the full distance without the Barbarian moving with them. In addition, add 5' to the distance moved, even if the Barbarian's check result was otherwise insufficient to move them. (6 rage)
Mighty Swing(ex): As per 3.P.0.2 pg 10.
Moment of Clarity(ex): As per 3.P.0.2 pg 10 except it only costs 3 rage.
Powerful Blow(ex):As per 3.P.0.2 pg 10.
Battle Sense(ex): The barbarian has blindsense 30' for the round. (3 rage)
Battle Mastery(su): The barbarian gains blindsight to a range of 5'/character level for this round. This power requires character level 11 and Battle Sense. (6 rage)
Rolling Dodge(ex): As per 3.P.0.2 pg 11.
Roused Anger(ex): As per 3.P.0.2 pg 11, but append 'the barbarian may unlearn this power and replace it with another one upon acquiring Tireless Rage.
Strength Surge(ex): as per 3.P.0.2 pg 11.
Surprise Accuracy(ex): as per 3.P.0.2 pg 11.
Swift Foot(ex): as per 3.P.0.2 pg 11.
Greater Taunt(ex): The barbarian's taunting is incredibly hard to ignore. As Taunt, but a foe who fails his will save must make a new will save each of his turns (excluding the first) to master his anger, or continue to be compelled as per taunt in that turn. A barbarian may not take this rage power until character level 9. (12 rage)
Mass Taunt(ex): The barbarian may taunt all foes within 30' as per the taunt ability. This power is a mind-affecting ability. You may not take this power until 9th character level and it requires Taunt. (9 rage)
Howl(ex): The barbarian lets out an animalistic yell. All enemies within 30' of him my make a will save (DC 10 + 1/2 character level + cha mod) or be panicked. This is a mind-affecting ability. (6 rage)
Terrifying Howl(ex): The barbarian lets out a bloodcurling shout, causing fear as the fear spell except in a 30' radius around the Barbarian. The save DC is 10+1/2character level+cha mod. A barbarian may not select this ability unless he has the Howl power. (12 rage)
Howl of Lost Souls(su): The barbarian lets out an otherworldly keening which chills enemies to the bone. All enemies within 30' must make a Fort Save (DC 10 + 1/2 character level + cha mod) or die. A successful save makes that enemy immune to this power for 24 hours. This power is a mind-affecting ability, and cannot be selected by a character under 17th character level. Selecting this power requires the Terrifying Howl power. (21 rage points)
Battle Leap(su): The barbarian makes a mighty jump, rapidy covering the distance to his enemies. He uses strength instead of dexterity on his acrobatics check, takes no ACP, and may replace standard high jump DCs with twice the DC for a similar distance in long jumping. He also receives a +30 rage bonus to his jump check. He does not provoke AoOs during the jump. A barbarian of character level less than 9 may not select this power. (3 rage)
Cleave the Earth(su): The barbarian stomps the earth as a standard action hard enough it quakes. This duplicates the effect of an Earthquake spell within a 30' radius of the barbarian (although the Barbarian is immune to its effects), and the DC to remain standing is 10+1/2 character level+str mod. This power requires character level 13 and the Strength Surge power (18 rage).
Improvised Weapon of Legend(su): In his rage the barbarian can use almost anything as a weapon. When activated, the barbarian may proficiently use any object that vaguely approximates a weapon he is proficient with and up to 1 size category larger than he could normally wield per 3 character levels. For example, a tree could be used as a club or maul approximation given sufficiently many levels. The weapon deals damage appropriate to its size. If the object is bolted or rooted in place, the barbarian may generally be assumed to be able to tear it free if he can use it in this manner unless it is magically held, and picking up the weapon requires a move action. This power may not be chosen before 9th character level, requires strength surge, and each use of the power lasts for one turn. (9 rage points)
Stone Thrower(su): When activated, the barbarian can throw rocks and catch rocks as a giant of CR = his level (choose the closest when there isn't one at his level). This power lasts until his next turn. Requires Strength Surge and 9 character levels. (6 rage)
Everything Turns Red(su): The barbarian may activate this power as an immediate action to ignore one mind-affecting effect that targets him before making his save. He need not save against it, it simply has no effect on him, even if it normally allows no save. This ability requires a character level of 11. (12 rage)
Berzerker(su): The barbarian doesn't just attack like a savage animal, he literally begins to transform into one. Instead of his weapon attacks he gets two claws (2d6 damage for a medium creature, primary, treat them as manufactured weapons for iterative attacks). He also benefits from the two weapon rend feat with these claws. This power lasts until his next action. Requires character level 9 and the Animal Fury power (12 rage).
Chill of the North Wind(su): The barbarian takes a great breath and exhales a freezing wind. This breath affects everything within a cone 5'/character level long, and deals 2d6 cold damage/character level to all creatures in that line (reflex save DC 10+1/2 character level + str mod for half). It also has all the effects of a Gust of Wind spell. Activating this power is a standard action, and it has duration:instantaneous (although it effects creatures immediately as per gust of wind despite being shorter in duration). Choosing this power requires a character level of 11. (18 rage)

(I'm sure other useful powers could be created. Consider these examples, not yet playtested but closer than what currently exists to being right I'm sure).

Indomitable Will (ex): While raging, 1/round the barbarian may elect to re-roll a will save he failed between his previous turn and this one. The results of the new will save replace those of the old.

Irresistible Force (su): While raging, whenever a barbarian encounters a magical barrier he may attempt to break it. He makes a caster level check using his character level. Success means the barrier is broken (dispelled). Ultimately what qualifies as a magical barrier is up to the DM's discretion, but spells like Wall of Force and Force Cage certainly qualify.

Greater/Mighty Rage: as per 3.P.0.2 except they each only cost and require 1 rage point to enter and maintain each round. A barbarian may choose to enter a lesser rage when he rages if he wishes.


So, in 3.5 everyone cared about Negative Levels. Classes who actually wanted to hit things lost effectiveness linearly, and casters lost spell slots. The second of those no longer happens.

This means that casters really don't care how many negative levels they acquire until it kills them, which markedly changes the game casters are playing against level-draining undead. Contrast this to melee types for whom negative levels are really painful because it does reduce their effectiveness.

Ultimately, the point of negative levels is to make you perform like a lower level character. It works against characters who care about making d20 rolls. It doesn't work against characters who spend their time making their *opponents* make d20 rolls (saves) at present, because their level-appropriate abilities are tied up in their spells, which they can cast at full effectiveness. This asymetricality is a failure of design.

I'm not saying old negative level rules are the right answer, but something needs to be done which makes negative levels equally bad for all character types.

(Flaw discovered in playtesting here, see second page level 7 analysis).


EL 1 Challenges

A locked and trapped door
A 20' deep pit trap
A pair of Orcs
Three Celestial Dogs
An Elf Wizard 1
A Lemure
A Ghoul
A pair of human zombies
A pair of stirges
A spider swarm

A Locked and Trapped Door
The wizard sits there and burns the door with acid splash repeatedly. As acid ignores hardness, he eventually succeeds in getting through... (Doors with obvious latches, locks, hinges, or other such things can simply have those splashed)

Even 'fight'. It takes awhile, although the wizard doesn't make notably much noise in the process.

I'm noticing the trap doesn't much matter unless the character plans on actually unlocking the door...

A 20' pit trap
The wizard uses her hat to cast Feather Fall, thus taking no damage.

Certain Win.

A Pair of Orcs
I feel pain coming on. !Xou'aktl is walking around in the dark either in a dungeon or outside, which means she's got a torch out, and the orcs totally surprise her. With an average of 6.5 damage, one javelin hit could be curtains. Fortunately, they only hit 40% of the time, for an expected (2*.45*6.5) 5.85 damage, which will kill her a little less than half the time... during the surprise round. Fortunately, if she does survive long enough to make an initiative roll she has a 7 pt advantage on initiative, meaning she goes first most of the time. She hits them with a sleep spell, which has a DC of 14 against their -2 will save. They make it 25% of the time, but if either does she probably dies.

This is looking like a pretty even match, running some test runs.

Battle 1:
Both orcs miss on the javelin throws, which is honestly pretty impressive. Round 1 starts up, and !Xou'Aktl wins initiative, dropping a sleep on them after moving towards them to get them in visual range. They both blow their save and !Xou'aktl can coup-de-grace them at her leisure.

Battle 2+3:
One orc hits for 8-9 damage, killing !Xou'aktl.

Looking reasonably even with a little bias towards probable loss.

Three Celestial Dogs
Surprise is unlikely for either side, which means initiative is important, and !Xou'aktl has a 4 point advantage. They have will +1, so they pass a will save 40% of the time, meaning one sleep spell is probably insufficient. This would look pretty even if it wasn't for the fact that they have SR 6, which makes it unlikely !Xou'aktl will get off a sleep spell targetting multiple of them. But if she can sleep 2 of them in round 1, she has a chance.

Probable Loss

Elf Wizard 1
Its almost a mirror match up, except the halfling has better saves! However, the elf is immune to sleep, but likely has 1 fewer hp. !Xou'aktl fails a save vs. sleep 50% of the time, and a crossbow shot isn't nearly that good.

Probable Loss, but only because the example is an elf. (Sleep has a ridiculously long range, and being immune to it while being capable of casting it at these levels is brutal in a mage vs. mage matchup).

A Lemure
Its mindless (no sleep), resistant to acid, but its as slow as we are, and we have expeditious retreat via hat. Its crossbow run+gun time. Its also got only a +0 initiative, so !Xou'aktl probably goes first. (And even if it gets to attack, +2 attack for 1d4 damage? Whatever...)

Certain win.

A Ghoul
Wizards really don't have good options against undead at 1st level, its actually kind of annoying. It also has stealth capabilities. If it doesn't surprise !Xou'aktl, we use the hat for expeditious retreat and run+gun it to death with the crossbow. If it surprises her, she dies a reasonable fraction of the time (paralyzed or just outright takes enough damage if it hits - 45% of the time).

Even fight.

A pair of Human Zombies
Zombies are slow, which means hat for expeditious retreat and Disrupt Undead for the run+gun (Finally something that can't charge her if she's at 25' and then moves away).

Certain Win.

Pair of Stirges
Ambush monsters, whee. Surprised, drained of some con in the surprise round. If she beats them both at initiative she can try to sleep them, but that doesn't sound terribly productive as she'll catch herself too. They fly off after sating themselves.

Certain Loss. Not dead, but not happy (-8 con) and no foes even killed unless she gets lucky clubbing one with a staff.

Spider Swarm
The real problem is it almost certainly ambushes her, which inflicts 1d6 damage and forces a fort save. If she doesn't die outright, she likely wins initiative, hats for exp retreat, and run+guns it to death with acid splash. Losing 1d3 strength doesn't especially bother her, so the save isn't immediately scary.

Probable win. 1d6 damage only kills her 1 in 6 times, and more often than not she gets the initiative. Once the run and gun starts she's got it made.

Review:
Certain Win 3
Probable Win 1
Even 3
Probable Loss 2
Certain Loss 1

Which is a 5.75 out of 10, right in the sweet spot of balance. Given that some of those are possibly a little generous, I'd actually call it a 5/10.

Edit: Adjusted some numbers and re-evaluated the ghoul fight.


Level 4:

Str 15 -> Str 16 (level pump) -> 18 (item)

BAB: +4
Skills: Perception 4, Acrobatics 4, Climb 4, Survival 4
Class Features: Rage (+4 str/con, +2 will, -2 AC, 22 Rage points), Fast Movement, Uncanny Dodge, Trapsense +1, 2 Rage Powers (Strength Surge, Powerful Blow)
Feats: Power Attack, Overhand Chop

Character wealth: ~5.4k gp
Equipment: Greataxe +1, Composite Longbow (+3), Chainmail +1, Belt of Strength +2, 50' rope, grappling hook, portable ram, 3 bags of caltrops, flint and steel, 5 vials of oil, 40 arrows.

Combat Statistics:

Senses:
Perception +9 (+11 taste/touch or stonework traps)
Darkvision 60'
Initiative: +1

Mobility:
Move: 30'
Climb +8 (incl. -3 ACP, +2 rage)
Acrobatics +5 (incl. -3 ACP)

Defenses:
HP: 43.5
AC: 17 (15 rage, +4 vs. giants)
CMB: +8 (+4 vs. bullrush/trip, +2 rage)
Fort +6 (+8 rage) / Ref +2 / Will +3 (+5 rage)
+2 vs. spells, poison

Offenses:
Great Axe + 9 (1d12 + 7) (+2/3 rage)
Composite Longbow +5 (1d8 + 3)
CMB +8 (+2 rage)

Option: Powerattack (-4 attack, +4 damage)
Option: Overhand Chop (x2 Str instead of x1.5, full round action)
Option: Rage (22 pts)
Option: Strength Surge (3 Rage for +4 to CMB for one check or to one strength check)
Option: Powerful Blow (6 Rage for +4 damage on one hit)

EL 4 challenges
A Water-Filled Room Trap
An Aranea
A Five-Headed Hydra
A Centipede Swarm
A Pair of Blink Dogs
A Pair of Huge Monstrous Centipedes
A Pair of Quasits
An Elf Wizard 4
A Sea Hag
An Endless Sea of Rats (ok, not endless, but a freaking huge number of them)

A Water-Filled Room
Ok, this thing has a delayed onset of 5 rounds, which means the doors slam shut and we know something bad is going to go down. Now, this is a CR 4 trap, so they better be decent doors, like stone (break DC 28, hardness 8, hp 60). Even raging we can't break 28, so we've got 5 rounds to hack at this thing while raging. Its a door, its hard to miss, meaning we just deal damage while power attacking overhand chopping and raging (because our life is seriously over if the room fills with water while we're in it). That's five swings at 1d12 + 18, or an average of 24.5, subtract 8 for hardness and multiply by 5 swings = we break through on round 4.

Honestly, he can strength surge on the break DC check or use Powerful Blow, but its not needed and he'd rather burn just 4 rage points.

Almost certain victory. (And probably a soaked dungeon, but we like slip'n slide.)

An Aranea
Found in forests, it also has darkvision and Baughdvnleob actually beats it at Perception, but it has low-light which means its taking fewer penalties at spotting things. Its also like to get the drop on him from a tree. It casts a small number of spells which typically includes sleep - unfortunately that means Baughdvnleob's a valid target. And if the Aranea gets surprise or just first action (likely with its initiative advantage), we've only got +5 against a DC of 13, which is a 40% chance to just be dead. Fortunately that's its only great offensive option, but it can also toss a web that will force Baughdvnleob to burn a round or two breaking it (and burning some rage points), likely buying time for it to try to sleep him again (admittedly at a lower success rate, because we start raging and our will improves). Of course, to actually melee the aranea we have to get to it, likely in a tree, though we can try shooting arrows at it. Fortunately, once it runs out of 1st level spell slots its got nothing threatening it can do. Its poison DC isn't scary and poison takes too long to kick in, and it doesn't hit remarkably often dealing otherwise low damage. It also has a weak 22 hp - we can one-hit kill it on average without burning excessive rage points. And its AC isn't especially exciting either. But we have to make it passed 5 sleep saves, up to two of which could be before we act (we'll assume one for simplicity). With a 40% chance of failing the first and a 30% chance of failing each subsequent save, the odds of making all of them are .6*.7^4 = .14406. If it wasn't for the web ability we could likely reduce the number of sleep spells the Aranea could get off, but its web virtually guarantees it'll get to cast all 5. (It gets 6 webs per day which act as a net, prevent movement, and have a break DC of 17 which takes us an expected 2 rounds to break without strength surge, and 3 rounds per 2 webs with strength surge - and we don't have enough rage points to break all 6 with strength surge even if we break every one on the first try.)

Almost certain loss.

A Five-Headed Hydra
Lets not kid ourselves, this is a straight out slugfest. Its got approximately equivalent senses, better mobility in its native habitat because of its swim speed, and is wicked in close combat. While we're faster than it, it can move and attack with all its heads, and it can cut across pools of water we'd drown in. So we might as well just brawl. We're going to rage, bringing our AC down to 15, which it needs a 9 to hit for an expected damage/head of (.6*8.5) 5.1, and thus 25.5 expected damage per round - killing Baughdvnleob in 2 rounds. This means Baughdvnleob gets at best 2 actions before death. We've got to burn the rage points on Powerful Blow and since we've only got one attack/round anyway, we're going to overhand chop. Power attack is less clearly beneficial. Of course, even adding power attack to that and assuming we hit both times we expect to deal insufficient damage to kill the hydra. (1d12 + 21 is 27.5 expected damage given a hit, which is just enough to kill the hydra, but we haven't taken into account that we miss 40% of the time while power attacking).

Certain loss. The hydra is much more efficient at dealing damage.

A Centipede Swarm
Baughdvnleob runs from this, because he can't do 31 points of non-weapon damage. Fortunately, he's faster than it is.

Certain loss.

A Pair of Blink Dogs
Blink dogs are ambush monsters, which means they're going to try to surprise Baughdvnleob. Unfortunately for Baughdvnleob, despite low Hide and worse perception, they live on the plains, which means LLV dominates perception checks because they suffer fewer negative modifiers at long distances. And Dim Door as an 8th level wizard is a long distance. Blink dogs pop in and get a surprise round. Of course, they have a relatively weak attack at a low attack bonus, and so expect to deal (.4*3.5) 1.4 damage per attack, while Baughdvnleob dispatches the pair in 4-5 rounds of combat fairly trivially.

Certain win. Blink dogs deal insufficient damage to be worrying. They just don't have quite enough punch to make their great defenses pay off.

A Pair of Huge Monstrous Centipedes
Baughdvnleob and the centipedes probably notice each other simultaneously, so no surprise. Distance is within 60', meaning either side can charge. The centipedes miss 55% of the time, but deal a noticeable 11 average damage per hit for approximately (.45*11) 5 expected damage per attack, and additionally inject poison with a DC 14, which isn't notably threatening but losing 1d6 dex could be a big deal. They also take 2 hits on average to drop each, which means ~3 rounds per centipede, over which time the centipedes expect to inflict 45 damage if Baughdvnleob doesn't rage, and more if he does, which would kill him either way. Baughdvnleob probably expects to fail one or more poison saves from this.

Even - good rolls on Baughdvnleob's part make this a win, he barely loses on average.

A pair of Quasits
These demons will get splatted if they get hit in close combat. Unfortunately, they almost certainly get surprise (Hide +17! and invisibility, of course), have a 50' fly speed, and initiative +7 for likely going first in round 1 immediately after their surprise round. They can cause fear 1/day, with about a 15% chance per Quasit of making Baughdvnleob run like a little girl. They also can choose to melee with a +8 claw attack that has a DC 13 poison with decent stat damage, and their armor class is good for their CR. Assuming Baughdvnleob doesn't run like a little girl, he probably beats them in close combat, but he may fail a poison save or two.

Probable win, although if he's unlucky at saves he could either run away or get his dex dropped to zero - either of which is a loss.

An Elf Wizard 4
If Baughdvnleob can get the drop on the wizard, he's in great shape. But that's not an especially likely event. And a 4th level wizard in a forest setting can introduce Baughdvnleob to the joys of Web (targets his weak save), glitterdust, Hideous Laughter, Blindness, or just levitate with Protection from Arrows and plink him with her own longbow. And the wizard can always surprise Baughdvnleob using Invisibility, or be harder to hit due to spells like Blur. Not to mention 1st level spells like Colorspray and Sleep still work. The elite-array elf's Int is 15+2 race + 1 level = 18, giving her a DC of 16 on 2nd level spells, which is enough to make failing a save a real problem for Baughdvnleob, and levitate or expeditious retreat makes meleeing the mage exceedingly difficult.

Almost Certain Loss.

A Sea Hag
With a low AC and low hp, the hag isn't a real melee threat, but she has a speed and maneuver ability in her environment (aquatic), and competitive sensory abilities. If Baughdvnleob fails the save vs. the Hag's horrifying appearance (~20% fail rate), he's in for even a tough melee because of the massive 2d6 str hit. She also has 3 death gaze attacks at Fort DC 13, meaning the chance he fails one of these fortitude saves is reasonably decent (.8^4 = 41% chance of passing all 4 saves), and that's not accounting for the DC 13 will save to avoid being *dazed* for three days, which is also instant death. As the hag can unleash all this from 30', an encounter in her element leaves Baughdvnleob hoping he can deal 19 points of damage before he fails a save, not a likely occurrence. (Baughdvnleob's expected damage output per attack with the bow is .6*7.5 = 4.5 damage per hit, or 5 rounds to kill the hag).

Almost Certain Loss.

An Endless Sea of Rats
So, we're actually talking about ~30 rats here. Each one needs a 13 to hit and deals 1 damage per hit, so .4*1*30 = 12 damage/round. There's simply no way Baughdvnleob can kill them fast enough (in fact, even cleave is insufficient). Baughdvnleob's best option is to run away and set fire to whatever they're in. Seriously.

Certain Loss.

Performance Review:
Almost Certain Wins:11
Probable Wins: 1
Even:1
Probable Losses:
Almost Certain Losses: 111111

Ouch, performance really tanked and its *only 4th level*. Not promising for this barbarian rendition, and we're looking fairly underpowered. Despite Dwarven bonuses to saving throws, Baughdvnleob is still vulnerable to spell and spell-like ability spam and poison attack spam because he'll eventually fail one, usually before he can kill the opponent. Its especially bad against creatures like the Aranea or a wizard who have options to either limit his mobility or massively improve theirs to the point where Baughdvnleob cannot melee them. And he notably falls short of the best of the bruisers the MM has to offer.


So, some of this material probably belongs in one of the other threads, but I felt it belonged here because I went through and recorded my comments on everything in the pdf. It seems better to keep everything together rather than engage in thread multiplication. Without further ado:

General Notes:
A lot of abilities use class level. If we want characters to be able to do level appropriate things, character level is a far better number to use because it insures that the effect is appropriate to the character's level. The disadvantage of multiclassing should be that you didn't get whatever the next ability(ies) your main class offered, not that you are also worse at everything than a straight class character. Otherwise multiclassing completely fails unless you only take levels with abilities that implicitly scale.

Artwork:
The artwork is often far far better than WotC's 3e and 3.5 artwork style. I absolutely love the cleric drawing, though ones which are similar to the WotC style are less appealing to me.

The art on page 54 also appeared on an earlier page.

The art on page 102 is similarly recycled.

Barbarian:
Rage Powers:
Increased DR: 1-3 DR is useless. It should be 5, 10, and 15, then it might actually matter.

Elemental Rage: +1d6 elemental is really weak. That's like a 3 rage point power. Should convert all the barbarian's damage to elemental damage.

Lowlight/Night sight: These powers make no sense. Why does the barbarian suddenly get to see in the dark because she's raging? Not that it couldn't be explained, but it isn't.

Renewed Vigor: This needs to scale with character level. Remove the d8 and make it Con Mod x level.

Terrifying Howl: Requires 'Hunter's Cry', which doesn't exist.

Rage Powers are an interesting idea. However, rather than being class features, why not make them feats that require Rage, and give the barbarian a bonus Rage Feat at those levels?

Mighty Rage: Typo - text says Greater Rage in the entering/maintenance sentence.

DR: 5/- at 19th level is useless. 20/- should be considered a minimum for this level of play.

Clerics:
Spells:
Not being able to prepare spells aligned with other ethos is a pet peeve of mine - a cleric should be able to prepare such spells, it should just count as an act of that alignment and the DM should take that into consideration with respect to the character's alignment. (Ie, casting an [Evil] spell once probably won't be overly detrimental to a good cleric, casting many is taking the spiral path downwards.) I can expand an explanation of what I think should be going on here if people are interested.

The cleric really needs a limit on the number of spells he has access to. Access to the whole list leads to splatbook dumpster diving writ large.

The more wizard-like spellcasting progression is good for balance, but I don't see Clerics being especially useful at a healing role with such limited spell selection. This will only encourage hyperspecialized clerics who refuse to cast Cure spells - which may be ok with you (it is with me).

Channel Energy:
This paragraph should either describe the effects of channeling energy more fully or provide a reference for where to look for the full rules, probably the latter.

Orisons:
Finally, no more keeping track of 0-level spells!

I'm not convinced Cure Minor needs to be removed though - infinite healing outside of combat should be a default assumption of the game, or healing should be nigh impossible. pseudo-limited healing just means players who understand the game will find ways to get virtually infinite healing outside of combat (1st level wands are cheap), and penalizes newer players.

Spell Ethos:
See comment above - i think accessing powers from opposed ethos should be allowed with alignment implications.

Ex-Clerics:
Shouldn't there be some provision for switching deities in this paragraph? Seeking atonement from your old god shouldn't be the only way to regain your powers - you should be able to switch sides.

Deities:
Rather than random 1-dimensional deities (which is fairly typical of RPG deity lists), why not just use real world mythologies? This gives you a deep mythos to draw on with well developed deity personalities. If people want 'fantasy deities', they can write their own in 15 minutes or grab their sourcebook of choice from whatever company they want.

Druids:
Why is the druid wearing metal armor in the picture?

Spells:
See notes on spell ethos under cleric. Its less important here though.

Bonus Languages:
The 'secret language of the druids' is and always has been one of the most idiotic ideas in D+D druids (and that's saying a lot for a class which completely ignores what real druids actually were). In a world where Comprehend Languages is a 1st level spell, secret languages don't work. Its really that simple. A 7th level wizard can write a teaching guide to Druidic using Tongues and Comprehend in combination. The idea that 'only druids know this secret language' fails utterly, and there's no good way to fix this other than dropping the idea.

Nature Bond:
The animal companion advancement chart does not make early availability companions worth keeping over the long term. While for story reasons I think we'd really like a Druid to grow old with her first companion, she's almost always better upgrading. The chart needs a serious ramp-up of at least Str/Dex adjustment, and possibly ramp up the bonus HD as well. It should also be made clear if the bonus HD provide feats (which they probably should and technically do right now). I consider this a serious design issue with Animal Companions as written.

Wildshape:
(See relevant spells)

Fighter:
Skills:
The fighter gets pitifully few skills for a class which isn't going to have anything class-related to do outside of combat.

Weapon Training:
The bonuses should scale regardless of which order he took them in. Ie, all groups should receive the highest bonus, even if he just learned it. Otherwise organic characters suffer relative to other characters (and there's really no balance drawback to doing this, as balance testing needs to assume the fighter always gets the highest possible bonus)

Double weapons are a funny group - shouldn't each weapon be in a group related to the weapon type?

The warhammer is a type of *axe* which does piercing damage. If any writer of D+D actually bothered to look at a historical warhammer this would be obvious. (It would be nice if this was finally fixed after over 20 years of being wrong).

Armor Mastery:
DR 5/- is utterly forgettable. At 19th level anything less than 20/- is a slap in the face.

Weapon Mastery:
This ability would be almost worthy of being a 15th level ability - iff it applied to all weapons the fighter had training in. Limiting it to one weapon doesn't really help balance and just gimps an already struggling class.

Overall this fighter is better than the 3.5 fighter, but not sufficiently better. High level fighters in fiction are characters like Superman, Thor, and Captain Marvel. Thor calls bolts of lightning from the sky and flies under his own 'power' (his hammer and him are basically inseparable). Captain Marvel is *omniscient*, super strong, and nigh invulnerable. Superman has x-ray vision, heat rays, icy breath, super strength and speed, and has DR infinity/kryptonite. And Superman *maybe* qualifies as a 17th level character - i'm not convinced. There is no 'fantasy' fighter who tops 10th level in any literature anywhere - keeping fighters to non-supernatural feats is made of fail in higher levels.

Paladin:
Spells:
A Paladin's Caster Level should just be equal to her character level. Anything else is punitive. Her reduced casting ability is reflected in her spell list, reducing her caster level basically says paladins can't do level-appropriate things with magic.

Divine Bond:
The Paladin shouldn't have to choose - she should get both.
Calling her mount should have a caster level = character level.

Remove Disease: While flavorful, this is a non-ability.

Aura of Faith: This is a 5th level ability, tops.

Holy Champion: 10/evil is a joke. This needs to be in the ballpark of 30/evil or higher.

Code of Conduct:
Why not generalize the Paladin? Let the Paladin be any corner alignment, and the player and DM need to agree on a suitable code of conduct. (With some minor rewriting of other abilities to allow appropriate alignment like Smite Good). At its root, the Paladin is a fighter with minor clerical abilities who serves an ideal - why restrict it to only one of the possible variations thereof?

Its also not clear the Paladin's code as written accomplishes lawful or good aims. Legitimate authority needs definition, acting with honor is more about not killing nobles than about good or law. And what exactly is an innocent - is a C/E drow baby an innocent?

Multiclassing: Why prevent Paladins from multiclassing freely? This only hurts organic characters, and is a nonsensical restriction. As long as you're rewriting the rules, eliminate senseless legacy rules from 1st edition.

Mount: Any rules which don't allow a Paladin to eventually end up riding a Dragon as a Special Mount are a failure, imho. This is a fantasy world, horses are for 1st-4th level characters.

I am unconvinced of the Paladin's viability, especially as a high level single-class character.

Rogue
Sneak Attack:
Concealed targets should be able to be sneak attacked given a suitably impressive listen check or similar. You can tell where a creatures head, heart, and lungs are by heartbeat and breathing - a sufficiently awesome rogue should be able to do this.

The leg has a great target for sneak attack in humanoid creatures - an achilles heel so to speak. (There's an exposed artery there, and cutting it can easily cause a creature to bleed out in minutes.) Only being able to reach limbs doesn't mean there aren't vital spots that could be hit.

Rogue Talents:

Major Magic: The caster level should equal character level or at least rogue level. Its still probably woefully underpowered, even without considering it has a prereq.

Minor Magic: Useless. Utterly useless.

Rogue Crawl: Fairly useless.

Stand Up: Can be accomplished with tumble without provoking an AoO. Useless.

Advanced Talents:
Defensive Roll: Should be allowed whenever the rogue is hit for damage, not just when it would reduce him to 0 or below.

Dispelling Attack: should have caster level = character level.

Master Strike: DC should be 10 + 1/2 Character Level + Int Mod, so it continues to scale into epic levels.

Sorceror
Bloodlines:

Arcane: eh, not being able to freely use Quicken Spell until 20th level is a serious disadvantage. Admittedly most sorcerors will probably need to solve that problem with a feat.

Celestial: Heavenly Touch should be holy damage if you want it to do anything to demons or devils. This bloodline is substantially worse than the others.

Draconic: Breath Weapon damage should be 10 + 1/2 character level + Con mod.

Elemental: Air and Earth have clearly superior movement modes - the speed should be reduced to compensate.

Fey: fists of thorn DC should use character level, not sorceror level. DR 10/Cold Iron is a joke at 20th level.

Wizard
Arcane Bond:
Item 'familiars' seem to be strictly superior to animal familiars.

Skills
Sleight of Hand is unchanged, meaning a literal reading of sleight of hand still gives you quickdraw with but 1 rank. This should be a high priority to change.

Acrobatics seems incredibly overloaded. Perhaps split it into Acrobatics (Balance/Tumble) and Athletics (jump/climb)?

Perception seems similarly overloaded. Search is probably still justifiable as a separate skill, both because it is a necessary component of trapfinding (and so receives a lot of use) and doesn't just represent noticing something but meticulous care in implementing a search. You can be great at searching and suck at noticing random things.

Feats
Skill-related feats are still woefully underpowered.

Combat expertise has been completely gimped. Requiring two things (one of which is intelligence) to determine your bonus means the feat is useless without heavy investment in it. Its also less useful because its a binary decision rather than choosing within a range - the old combat expertise was better.

Power attack is much less interesting as its a binary choice rather than choosing any number within a range. The old power attack was a better feat. (Deadly aim should work the same regardless).

Arcane Strike is virtually useless in this write-up. At least the old version was interesting. Anyone who can cast arcane spells is going to drop a Greater Magic Weapon on their weapon hours ago. +1 damage is not worth a feat.

Cleave has been substantially nerfed. Its an ok low level feat and becomes virtually useless thereafter.

Improved Vital Strike doesn't make it clear whether you multiply bonuses from other sources, such as magical enhancement bonuses.

Did spring attack really need additional text limiting its utility?

Weapon Swap should make it clear that you are using Two Weapon Fighting rules with one weapon - at least I think that's what you're doing...

Combat Maneuvers
The DC for performing a combat maneuver is prohibitive, especially given the inherant advantage that aggressor should have in some of them (notably Bull Rush, where momentum should be important). As it stands, Conan the Barbarian probably can't bullrush a midget with advanced muscular dystrophy, which is kind of sad.

Spells
Find the Path could also require any number of the following:
(A) The path must be unobstructed or the spell just fails. Ie, the lost city that is totally enclosed in rock has no path to it.
(B) The caster must possess an object from the target destination. Basically, have the spell work under a sympathetic magic theory where the caster uses the object to pull him to the destination.
(C) Have the spell instead provide the caster with visions of critical points along the journey but not actually show him how to get there.

Mindblank should also give you a saving throw against mindeffecting spells which don't allow one, like Irresistible Dance.

Wish states that inherent bonuses are capped at +5 but the Demonic bloodline for sorcerors grants a +6 inherent bonus to strength.
I'm unconvinced making the inherent bonus from wish a trade-off with another statistic is good for the game - it turns wish from 'free power' into 'lets make the game more like rocket launcher tag' at high levels. And as high levels are *already* rocket launcher tag, this strikes me as a bad thing.

Magic Items
The reason 'cool magic items' got passed up for stat increase items is not because they shared the same slot, but because those stat increasing items are *necessary* for a number of characters to continue to compete. Even with stats like Dex having their items moved to belts, characters will seriously pay someone to make them an item that occupies a different slot so they can get all of strength, constitution, and dex items because those items are vital to their survival. The only viable alternative is to just hand out enhancement bonuses every so often as standing magical effects because a character of level N is just that awesome, otherwise characters will find ways of putting stat items in sufficiently many slots they can use all the ones they need. Your 'fix' just makes the problem worse by making these items harder to acquire because the standard forms are insufficiently diverse. Basically, items which don't directly increase a character's survival chances are dross, and no amount of changes are going to fix that unless all magic items which do notably and directly increase survival get removed. (And then PCs can't compete against level-appropriate monsters as written).