Mean Dean's page

Based on the description I'd say it's just a container. Think about how you use a backpack in real life, it doesn't change how much you can carry, it just gives you a place to put things. Mechanically it doesn't have much of an effect except for RP purposes, the assumption being that if you weren't wearing the backpack then you'd have to either carry the items in your arms or find other ways to secure it to your body. The treasure and magic items section of the book does mention the bag of holding which is basically the same as the bag of holding in PF1 just with weight replaced by bulk

Thanks for the advice so far, this is my first real attempt at a full caster, and my last experiment with magic (a gunslinger/feral hunter multiclass) didn't last long before the character got killed

As far as spells for this build goes, I want to find good enchantment spells to benefit from Kitsune Magic and the Fey bloodline, buy also a good mix of others to handle situations where enchanting won't work. This is my first real attempt at a full caster and I'm not sure what spells are really worth it

keep in mind that your Bloodline Arcana and Kitsune Magic traits probably will not affect the DCs of your Magical Tail uses, as they are used as Spell Like Abilities (assuming my understanding is correct). From everything I have read in discussion of the subject, things that modify spell casting do not modify SLAs unless they specifically say they do. I'd love for someone to prove me wrong on this, though.

Usually, a spell-like ability works just like the spell of that name. A spell-like ability has no verbal, somatic, or material component, nor does it require a focus. The user activates it mentally. Armor never affects a spell-like ability's use, even if the ability resembles an arcane spell with a somatic component.

A spell-like ability has a casting time of 1 standard action unless noted otherwise in the ability or spell description. In all other ways, a spell-like ability functions just like a spell.

Spell-like abilities are subject to spell resistance and dispel magic. They do not function in areas where magic is suppressed or negated. Spell-like abilities cannot be used to counterspell, nor can they be counterspelled.

I know there is errata that prevents SLAs from being used for accessing prestige classes, and I've read somewhere that they can't be modified by MetaMagic, but I haven't seen anything that would to my understanding prevent them from benefiting from Kitsune Magic or the Fey bloodline arcana

You're still a full-power sorcerer, just short a few feats and FCB points. In fact, you're getting the rather (situationally) powerful Dominate Person earlier than a sorcerer normally would. I wouldn't be too worried about it being underpowered--it's not from feats that a sorcerer's greatest power flows.

Getting Dominate Person 3 levels early is a big part of why I'm planning to throw everything into getting my tails a fast as possible(that and the obvious flavor of playing a 9 Tailed Kitsune) what I'm really looking for is advice on what spells to take and good ways to boost DCs

I know, i forgot to mention that one but I did include it in my figuring

Just got my copy of the "Blood of the Beast" player companion and I'm working on building a Kitsune sorcerer using the new Nine-Tailed Heir archetype to use in Pathfinder Society once the additional resources is updated to include the new material. I'd like to get all 8 of the magical tails before level 12 and if my math is right by using the new archetype well as the Nine-Tailed Scion race trait it is just possible to get all the tails as early as level 7. I realize the feat requirements for this will leave the character slightly underpowered but I've been trying to figure out this character concept since I first got into PFS and would like some advice to figure out if there is any way to make this a viable character

Time to try and bring this post back from the dead.

I just hit lvl 2 and I was hoping for a little advice on where to go next, I'm multi-classing Pisolero with Feral Hunter (doesn't get an animal companion but can keep the animal focus bonuses active indefinitely) and need help choosing spells and skills.

Race:Human

Alignment:Chaotic Neutral

Stats:
STR:10
DEX:18
CON:12
INT:10
WIS:16
CHA:8

Spells:
lvl 0:
Guidance
Stabilize
Flare
Create Water

lvl 1:
Longshot
Cure Light Wounds

I have 7 skill points to spend and I would appreciate any suggestions for where to focus those (I was planning on the knowledge skills available to me as class skill in order to slightly increase out of combat usefulness) and if you have any suggestions for different spells that you think would work better I'd be glad to hear them

What are some suggestions for spells for the first level?

For my spell list for my first Hunter level I was thinking something like this:
Lvl 0:
Guidance
Stabilize
Flare
Create Water

Lvl 1:
Longshot
Cure Light Wounds

If I end up taking a second Hunter level I'd add virtue and Produce Flame

A loose "Silver Bullet" (a bullet made entirely of silver) auto confirms Crits against lycanthropes and presumably bypasses DR, though the description doesn't expressly say so. An alchemically treated bullet (not entirely made of silver) only bypasses DR. They are two different types of ammunition. That's the difference in price.

That makes sense, thanks for clearing that up

Even with the discount alchemical cartridges are expensive, so at early levels this would be huge.

You're right about the cartridges being expensive, with a plain paper cartridge costing 6 gold for a gunslinger, but once I get into higher level scenarios that pay more gold it won't be as big an issue. The bigger issue will be special materials like Adamantine and Cold Iron, with cartridges costing 36 and 12 gold respectively, or loose bullets costing 6.1 gold and 2 silver. And I'm not sure how to price Silver ammo because Ultimate Combat lists loose Silver Bullets at 25 gold (before discount) but Ultimate Equipment lists Alchemical Silver as adding 2 gold to the cost of the ammo

It definitely is ammunition, it is classified that way in ultimate combat and ultimate equipment. It even goes so far as to differentiate it from other types of ammunition in respect to retrieval.
It's also not magical, so abundant ammunition should work.
I put the assumption in there because some GMs might not see it that way. Even with the discount alchemical cartridges are expensive, so at early levels this would be huge.

ultimate combat wrote:

Ammunition: Firearm ammunition takes two forms: either black powder and shot (either bullets or pellets) or cartridges. Unlike other types of ammunition, firearm ammunition is destroyed when it is used, and has no chance of being retrieved on a miss. No part of a cartridge can be reused to create new cartridges. Firearm ammunition cannot be treated with poison, unless you are using a pitted bullet.

While they aren't magical they are listed in Ultimate Combat specifically as "alchemical cartridges" which still conflicts with abundant ammunition

When cast on a container such as a quiver or a pouch that contains nonmagical ammunition or shuriken, (including masterwork ammunition or shuriken, but not special materials, alchemical attributes, or nonmagical treatments on the ammunition), at the start of each round this spell replaces any ammunition taken from the container the round before. The ammunition taken from the container the round before vanishes. If, after casting this spell, you cast a spell that enhances projectiles, such as align weapon or greater magic weapon, on the same container, all projectiles this spell conjures are affected by that spell.

(Emphasis mine)

being used as ammunition for something does not make it "ammunition"

Not really sure what you mean by this, especially since I doubt anyone would classify firearm bullets and cartridges as anything other than ammunition. At any rate the way I understand the spell it wouldn't work for the cartridges, and because of the discount Gunslingers get on ammo it doesn't matter all that much anyway

I'm not sure abundant ammunition would work, I've looked at the forums and can't find a definitive answer but I'm going to assume not since they are technically "alchemical" cartridges. I'm looking at Longshot for sure, but I'm not sure about my second lvl 1 spell or my 4 lvl 0 spells

I've more or less decided on my feats at this point, but now I need some advice on what to do when I level up. I'm planning on taking at least 1 level as a Feral Hunter as soon as I hit level 2, but I need a little help choosing what spells to take

Shield + Mage Armor is your best bet for quite a while.
Buy a wand of Mage Armor or Shield to perserve spellslots. You do lose out on your Haramaki, but the plan is that you enchant it either to +3 where you dont need mage armor anymore, or to +1 + Spell storing to store a "Frigid Touch" spell which you can use when someone strikes you.

And yeah magical tail is a drain for you, and its not that big of a loss since you gain these abilities through your spells regardless.

Later you have access to spells like cat's grace so that should help you with dex for your ranged touch spells, and your AC.

Thanks for the advice for AC boosts.

I think I'll just skip Magical Tail on this character and worry about the feats after I've got more of the basics set. What do I do about AC? Right now I've got my DEX set at 12(with the +2 Kitsune racial bonus raising that to 14) and I bought a haramaki to boost my AC by 1 without the spell failure chance, but what else can I do?

Some points of order. Spell-like abilities =/= spells. You can't get the benefits of your super enchanting DCs on spell-like abilities sadly.

But, relying on Magical Tails when you already have a lot of uses per day of your spells is probably still bad. Any way you slice it, Magical Tails don't make the cut on sorcerers. If they did, you would want Nine-Tailed Scion

Kitsune Sorcerer FCB - Probably obvious since you know Kitsune make good sorcerers, but this is why.

Realistic Likeness - Broken in the best possible way! Who says I have to be a furry to play Kitsune? I'll just be everyone.

I didn't realize the Kitsune Magic racial trait wouldn't affect the Magical Tails abilities, the description in the book just says the DCs are CHA based so I just assumed it would work since they're enchantment effects.

hi, I need some advice on how to build a Kitsune Sorcerer for Pathfinder Society. I know Kitsune make great Enchantment focused Sorcerers, and I was planning on taking the Fey Bloodline, but beyond that I'm not really sure how to go about building the character, I've never used a spellcaster before. I'm planning on taking the Magical Tail feats to augment my known spells since most of the spells granted by the feat are enchantments, and I don't plan on using any metamagic feats right now because I want to get a better feel for how spellcasters function on their own before I go messing around with the more complex mechanics. any advice I can get would be very much appreciated

I've only seen gunslingers use grit for quick clear. I'm a PFS gm and have had little over a dozen sessions with a gunslinger in it. So not the largest sample, but it's my experience with the class.

I see, I've used the up close and deadly deed a couple of times, I was just curious how others manage their grit to make sure they always have some available for emergency uses like quick clear

Another question for anyone that plays a Gunslinger, how much Grit do you have and how much do you use per session on average? Right now I just have 2 from my wisdom modifier, is it worth it to take the extra 1/4 Grit for the human favored class bonus and should I invest in the Extra Grit feat?

Mean Dean wrote:

I just looked up the Darkwood buckler and it's not actually a buckler, it's a light wooden sheild so I wouldn't be considered having a hand free to reload with, but thanks for the suggestion anyway.

Huh, you know I brought this up the first time I saw that. Talked to a number of PFS GMs, who all ruled it as a buckler, despite what the description text said. One even showed me in the Gamemastery Guide where it says that bucklers can be made out of wood or metal. Considered the issue solved. But googling it, looks like there's quite a bit of contention still, so maybe stick to masterwork or mithral, just to avoid table variation.

I figured that'd be the best course of action. Given that this character is going to be a guaranteed target I don't want to risk any situation where I have to choose between Armor Class or using my primary weapons

so after looking through this thread and thinking about how I want this character to play this is what my level progression and feats look like so far
1-G1: Point-Blank Shot, Rapid Reload (pistol)
2-G1/H1: Precise Shot (precise summoned animal bonus feat)
3-G2/H1: Rapid Shot
4-G3/H1: no feat
5-G4/H1: Quick Draw, Rapid Reload (Dragon Pistol)
6-G5/H1: no feat
7-G5/H2: Deadly Aim
8-G5/H3: Outflank (H3 teamwork feat)
9-G5/H4: Clustered Shots
10-G5/H5: no feat
11-G5/H6: ?????

Mean Dean wrote:

Deighton Thrane wrote:

if you're looking to trim weight, bucklers can be made of darkwood. It costs around 50 GP more, but weighs half as much. So I'd consider replacing the buckler before second level so you get the full price of the masterwork one back.

I just looked up the Darkwood buckler and it's not actually a buckler, it's a light wooden sheild so I wouldn't be considered having a hand free to reload with, but thanks for the suggestion anyway.

Well, a couple things here. First for the feats, point blank shot is actually one of those feats in a feat tree that isn't usually a feat tax. Gunslingers don't quite need the extra accuracy, but it never really hurts, and you're almost always going to be shooting from less than 30 feet unless you're a musket master, and it looks like you're going pistols. And even if you get precise shot for free, point blank shot is still a pre-req for rapid shot. So you'll likely want to take it as soon as you can. So personally, I would likely still take feats as such:

lvl 1 point blank shot, rapid reload
lvl 2 precise shot
lvl 3 rapid shot
lvl 5 deadly aim, quick draw
lvl 7 clustered shots

Then whatever you want after that. Improved critical is always nice on firearms though.

Second thing, if you're looking to trim weight, bucklers can be made of darkwood. It costs around 50 GP more, but weighs half as much. So I'd consider replacing the buckler before second level so you get the full price of the masterwork one back.

EDIT - Also, out of curiosity, are you planning on going mostly gunslinger levels, or taking the usual 5 levels and multiclassing into something else, like taking the other 6 in hunter?

Thanks for the tip about the darkwood buckler, I'm planning on doing just the 5 levels of gunslinger so I can add my dex to damage. I do plan on taking point blank shot at some point, and I may still grab it for one of my first level feats, but I decided against rapid reload at first level because it's weapon specific and I don't want to use up too many feats on something that limited at low levels, I want to get a double barrel pistol and use rapid reload for that, and I might take it again for a dragon pistol when I get one, but for now it would just use up a feat slot that could be used for something that would have more utility at low levels, I already use cartridges so my loading time is already down to a move action and that should be able to keep me shooting most rounds anyway for now

Thanks for the advice so far, I've been looking through my books and working on my overall plan for the character, and I've taken a couple of the suggestions I've gotten. I've upped the con to 14 and lowered int and cha to 12 and 10 respectively, I've also traded the criminal trait for adopted I could take elven reflexes to boost my initiative. While I was working on my leveling plan I decided to take my first Feral Hunter level at lvl 2 so I can immediately get the benefits of Feral focus and the ability to cast hunter spells, plus precise shot as a free feat without needing the pre-recs, that frees up my two level 1 feats for quick draw and something else, I haven't decided on the second one yet

I originally took the 12 cha to get a little more use out of skills like intimidate, but I guess I can afford to trade that for 12 con. I really don't want to lower int if I can help it, the last scenario I played was very rp heavy and as it was my character was all but useless with the limited number of skill points and the low bonuses on all the charisma based skills, and I don't want to limit that even more. The darkleaf cloth armor looks good, I'll definitely buy a set when I can afford it. The Far Strike Monk looks like an interesting idea but I'm more of a "screw the rules and get things done my way" type player so I wouldn't really work in a lawful aligned class

Hi, I'm looking for some advice for using my Gunslinger character, I've already used it twice and I'm fairly happy with how it plays, but I just want to make sure I've got him set up good before he hits lvl 2 and everything gets lock in place. I'd like advice for any changes you think would be good for the ability scores, as well as any suggestions for gear that I should buy. I'm using the Pistolero archetype and plan on taking 5 levels in that before taking levels as a Feral Hunter, also I need advice on general combat strategies to stay alive when faced with a GM that has a less than stellar attitude towards Gunslingers (since this is a very combat oriented character I don't mind being a target, but in my last scenario I barely avoided getting pushed off a bridge and this GM is not likely to back down from his "kill the Gunslinger" crusade)
anyway, here are my stats:
race:Human
str:11
dex:17 (+2)
con:10
int:14
wis:14
cha:12
weapons:
masterwork pistol
dagger pistol
feats:
point-blank shot
precise shot
traits:
muscle of the society (basic:combat)(taken to improve carry capacity despite the low strength)
criminal:sleight of hand (basic:social)
current armor:
masterwork chain shirt
masterwork buckler
I currently have 201 gold to work with as well as 2 prestige points and 4 fame, my current light carry load is 58 and with my current gear I'm at 51.7, I want to avoid getting into medium encumbrance until I have enough fame and gold to buy a set of muleback straps. thanks for any help or advice you can give