The thing about spending the prestige for the items is that there's a significant trade off, especially at the lower levels. If you spend all your prestige on spiffy items, that's all well and good and now you've got a bunch of fancy magical items, but you're out of prestige. When you've spent all your money and prestige on gearing out your character, when you die and have no gold or prestige to come back with, then you're out of luck.
Yes, I understand most players would help chip in and bring a fellow party member back, but if someone's blasted everything they have instead of preparing for the inevitable, then I think it's important to let the group know before they start pouring out their funds to bring said character back. They decided to spend everything, perhaps that should be a lesson in learning about moderation.
And then it wasn't paid for. If you won this and still want it, email me. I still have it on my desk at work.
If this doesn't work out I would like to contribute $100 towards the stiffed charity to help make things right. Could you email/pm me or post relevant details.
If I had the expendable funds to do so, I too would've offered to purchase it, but I do hope someone claims it for the sake of the charity.
Also, I figure I should update the list of what I have available to trade.
Want: Err... I dunno? Traded for everything that was really on my wishlist.
Have:
Treasure Map
Xenophobic
Extra Trait
I no longer have the Ifrit as I've already traded it.
Going off of the call for volunteers on the local Seattle-area site (NWPFS.org), it looks like it'll just be the demos from last year, although I'll continue my usual chant of "I can run Bonekeep" and see if that turns up anything.
I, too, hold out hope that I could run a table of Bonekeep, but considering it's all going to be demos, I doubt we're gonna be doing anything but harassing people with goblins again this year.
Not that harassing people with goblins isn't an absolute blast, of course!
Interesting... Given that, I'd say it's a distinct possibility. I wouldn't say for certain as of this point, since minds may be changed down the road, but I will say it'd be dang cool if a Kobold or few became available.
While I'm not sure which would be more convenient for you at this time, there are several games that run in Redmond, Tacoma, and in Olympia that you might want to check out.
Nwpfs.org is the local site that the area uses to coordinate games and connect, so you might want to take a look.
You can also get a hold of one of the regional Venture Officers, and you can find their contact info in the back of the Guide to Organized Play.
Looking for a few race boons if you have any of the following and would be interested in trading Pm me and we will discuss if I have anything you would want.
The following are races I would be interested in:
Dhampir
Goblin
Grippli
Catfolk
Kobold
Vishkanya
I haven't seen any clarification on this, but I believe Goblin boons are tied to the PFS number of the player that achieved it in much the same way Fetchlings are, so I'm not sure they're tradeable.
There is only one Catfolk that I know of and it was part of the Gen Con charity auction, and someone paid something between $400 - $600 for it, so I doubt they're going to go trading it.
There are NO Kobolds in PFS, and I don't think there's even a one-off boon that's been available like the Catfolk was.
Ok! After some finagling and boon trading, I now have another Ifrit boon to offer up in trade for what I'm looking for. (EDIT: I'm only really likely to trade it for another race boon, unless there's a killer combo of other boons offered up that I actually want.)
Also, out of curiosity, what's the list of race/mounts again from Mounted Tradition? I only remember a few off it.
Ok, just to clarify, folks, just because I asked about what was on the boon does not mean I'm willing to trade the Ifrit boon for it. Thank you.
The Revised List:
Want:
Dhampir
Custom Order (allows for purchase of smaller batches of +1 to +2 ammunition; 10 instead of 50)
Have:
Elemental Ancestry: Fire (Ifrit) -Will only trade for another race boon at this time-
Treasure Map
Extra Trait
Spirit of the Shadow Lodge (20% discount on restorations/raise dead/resurections/etc, and allows for taking Shadow Lodge faction vanities from the Field Guide)
Extra Hours (allows for GM credit Day Job rolls)
- Holding up a vial of Antiplague and saying "It's covered!" with a lewd wink is not an appropriate way to reassure someone you are attempting to woo.
- It is not appropriate to make lewd comments to ANY Venture Captain, faction leader, or important NPC contact during a mission briefing. ESPECIALLY if they are married and/or their spouse is IN THE SAME ROOM.
- Just because the local law states that "Any thief caught stealing will be punished..." is not to be met with a "Challenge Accepted!" from the quick-fingered members of the party.
Ok! After some finagling and boon trading, I now have another Ifrit boon to offer up in trade for what I'm looking for. (EDIT: I'm only really likely to trade it for another race boon, unless there's a killer combo of other boons offered up that I actually want.)
Also, out of curiosity, what's the list of race/mounts again from Mounted Tradition? I only remember a few off it.
The List:
Want:
Dhampir
Custom Order (allows for purchase of smaller batches of +1 to +2 ammunition; 10 instead of 50)
Have:
Elemental Ancestry: Fire (Ifrit)
Treasure Map
Extra Trait
Missing Mentor
Xenophobia
Spirit of the Shadow Lodge (20% discount on restorations/raise dead/resurections/etc, and allows for taking Shadow Lodge faction vanities from the Field Guide)
Extra Hours (allows for GM credit Day Job rolls)
Ok, so now that I'm on my way back from Gen Con, I figure I can throw down a new list since I've done a little trading and receiving of boons.
Want:
Dhampir
Custom Order (allows for purchase of smaller batches of +1 to +2 ammunition; 10 instead of 50)
Have:
Treasure Map
Extra Trait
Missing Mentor
Xenophobia
Spirit of the Shadow Lodge (20% discount on restorations/raise dead/resurections/etc, and allows for taking Shadow Lodge faction vanities from the Field Guide)
I previously failed to mention I also happen to have a couple copies of the Extra Hours boon, which allows for GM credit Day Job rolls.
Did the shadow lodge Recover your Body if you fell on a mission.
Then get you restored for less Prestiage?
Memory if fading... I get hit in the head alot :)
Yup. That's on the list.
But that is the one bonus that you didn't get to keep when your Shadow Lodge character changed factions; it seems implausible that it would be available to anybody this year.
Spirit of the Shadow Lodge:
Although the Shadow Lodge has officially dissolved, you firmly believe that its core principles are an ongoing project that requires continued attention and dedication. Having banded together with a few like-minded individuals, you have formed an informal coalition that embraces the true spirit of the Shadow Lodge as you have always understood it. You gain a 20% discount on all spellcasting services (rounding up the final price) you provide in their entirety to heal a fellow pathfinder or restore a Pathfinder to life. If you instead contribute gold to assist a fellow Pathfinder in purchasing such a spellcasting service, treat your contribution as though it were 20% greater.
In addition, so long as you have earned at least 6 Prestige Points as a member of the Shadow Lodge, you may continue to purchase Shadow Lodge prestige awards and boons from Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Pathfinder Society Field Guide.
Yes, it actually is allowed if you have this boon.
Ok, so now that I'm on my way back from Gen Con, I figure I can throw down a new list since I've done a little trading and receiving of boons.
Want:
Dhampir
Custom Order (allows for purchase of smaller batches of +1 to +2 ammunition; 10 instead of 50)
Have:
Treasure Map
Extra Trait
Missing Mentor
Xenophobia
Spirit of the Shadow Lodge (allows for taking Shadow Lodge faction vanities from the Field Guide)
So there was rumor that there would be wording in The Guide 5.0 about how things involving spells and effects at Seeker tables would work. I have not yet found such wording, though the updated guide may have something to say about it when it happens.
I have a feeling I already know how this works, but I figure I should ask anyway as there's the slim chance it may actually work out in my favor. It never hurts to ask, right?
So, at a recent table I played with a Seeker character of mine, we found one of the tomes of stat-plus-one-itude and during the course of the adventure, I actually had 6 days worth of time spent reading it, gaining the stat bonus before we actually hit the end of the adventure.
I asked the table about how that worked, and got the answers I pretty well expected. Still, the GM noted on my chronicle sheet that I'd read it, just in case.
My question is this: At a Seeker table, if you gain the effects of a consumable such as a Tome of something-or-other, do the effects end at the end of the scenario?
I'm assuming they do, and that to benefit from such an item you absolutely must purchase it to gain the stat boost, but I still hold out a sliver of hope that things like that might work differently with a Seeker level adventure.
I might be retraining my 14th level witch's patron from Elements to something else. Sure, having attack spells is cool and all, but... I pretty much never need them.
My 13th level magus/wizard might be swapping out an arcana, but that's it, if anything.
Beyond that, I'm actually pretty happy with all my characters' builds.
Also, I feel your pain. My 10th level Eldritch Knight already has a Magic trait. Heck, he even took the Additional Traits feat to GET said Magic trait. Ah well, c'est la vie. Maybe someday I'll make another EK and get to reap the benefits of Magical Knack.
Well, depending on how the retraining rules are laid out in the Guide 5.0, you could retrain that feat and take it again at some point to get Magical Knack since you acquired it through feat choice.
The fact that you can't retrain general traits chosen at level 1, though is a bit of a bummer. I know I wouldn't mind swapping one or two out on a few characters, but them's the breaks.
With the outrage/backlash that cropped up from just 30-some-odd Goblins being released, I'd be amazed if this ever happened.
Quote:
Race Boon prize for special (if there is some sort of winning table announced) ... Catfolk.
Already seems to be on the block for consideration according to a recent-ish blog post along with Ratfolk.
Quote:
Race Boon for GM gaining a star during Gen Con... Fetchling.
Was already given as a special boon for players that played the 12+ tier of the Grand Convocation last year and folks who GM'd it and applied it to 12+ characters.
The rest of the boons you listed, though, are definitely things to consider. :)
Based on whether or not I can get my hands on a particular race boon, I'll be making my VC's protege.
Gunslinger 5/Something... Else? the rest of the way?
Still working out the details, and the background will be based on what I determine for the other levels and possibly race boon, possibly not.
Either way, the kid's from Alkenstar and he is NOT a fan of magic. Yet he's stuck working for Golarion's Most Terrifying Librarian (14th level Witch). He is NOT a happy camper.
Well there's already a level of preferring GMs for boons. My friend got a racial boon a while ago for GMing a single game at a con where I played at all tables I could. He got a nifty boon for tian races. I... got a few things but nothing I really wanted and certainly no race boons or anything that was game changing.
Also, a minor comment on this...
As you noted, your friend GM'd one slot and got a boon, while you played all of them. Consider the fact that if you had also run a slot, you too would have gotten that boon if that was the setup of the con.
Maybe thats a bit childish, but without those of us that are at the games every week, playing and gming, I dont care how many cons you have, there would not be much of a PFS.
Its a little childish but pretty understandable I think. Weird that you can come and play every week at the local store, but its that guy that started playing last week who gets a race boon you really wanted. I mean, I want everyone to be happy, but its a little off.
I do fully understand that frustration, and I do agree that rewarding the loyal masses that make this game and organization possible is important. However, it's been my experience that just broadly opening up a race as accessible to everyone is never viewed as a "reward" and is nearly always viewed with a sense of entitlement.
"Ok, cool, now everyone has access to <insert race here>. Neat. But I want something different. I want something unique that I can show off as being different from everyone else. I demand a boon of <insert different race here>."
MrSin wrote:
Well there's already a level of preferring GMs for boons. My friend got a racial boon a while ago for GMing a single game at a con where I played at all tables I could. He got a nifty boon for tian races. I... got a few things but nothing I really wanted and certainly no race boons or anything that was game changing.
I mean absolutely no offense in saying this, but there's good reason for giving a bit more of an incentive to GMs. I've met countless players that absolutely refuse to GM for one reason or another. While I understand not forcing players out of their comfort zone, I as a GM would, ya know... Occasionally like to play. I GM far, far, more than I tend to get to play because there's been a severe shortage of GMs in my area until the last few months. Convincing some of our regular players to consider GMing is something akin to pulling teeth with a few blessed exceptions.
Offering more GM incentives tends to make enticing more experienced folks to step behind the screen a little easier, which is something I'm very much in support of.
I've also seen other options, such as granting a different race boon at each GM star earned, though I'm a little wary of such an option simply because I think that someone should be GMing because they want to make PFS awesome, not because they want shiny races. I'm not saying it wouldn't work and that it shouldn't be implemented, just that I'm not sure how well it'd work.
I've seen an option proposed that maybe a player could earn a race boon for getting a character to a certain level (generally 12+), which would allow players who aren't comfortable GMing to get one that way. Again, not sure how I feel about that either, as it could encourage players to focus too heavily on leveling a character to the point of demanding they only play their highest level, rather than playing other characters. Not saying this'd be a widespread problem, but I can see it potentially happening. That, however, would fall to said players GM's/coordinator/VO's to work out, not necessarily PFS on the whole.
At this point I would just be happy with more races available for play in PFS. Though if I had to pick two it would be Kitsunes and Androids.
EDIT: I forgot to state it due to mobile posting but thanks for the well thought out posts Jack. Love to see the more people like you with an open frame of mind on more diverse selections.
Also didn't see that blog post. Here is hoping there are more ways to open up race selections rather than attending cons we can't make due to all the reasons stated in other posts.
Just because my personal preference is to more strictly adhere to the campaign setting lore for game immersion reasons doesn't mean a more casual gamer who wants to play an exotic race because it's nifty and they're having fun because of it... Who am I to deny them their enjoyment?
I can be more of a setting "Nazi" in homegames. PFS needs to be as open and accepting as possible.
At the same time, I think that Race Boons are a great compromise. It lets the occasional player have something nifty and unique, while keeping the vast majority of characters well within the setting.
That said, I do agree that there should be opportunities to get race boons outside of spending money to go to a convention. I'm of the mind that the races offered at conventions and as prize support for events should stay as such, but that other, different, races should be released in a manner that there's more opportunity for others to get them.
That way, folks that can't attend cons and events still get their special characters while those that do attend the cons still get something unique that can't be gotten any other way. That way the boons are still special and a good draw for folks to go to the cons.
All characters except the monk that has a class feature Flurry of blows, only throw one weapon, or with two weapon 2 with -4/-4 to the attack because are the same size..
If you want throw 2 without many penalties you need a Monk.
A character can make a full attack with thrown weapons provided they can draw them as a free action. Specifically shuriken are treated as Ammunition in regards to how they're drawn and used (much like arrows), allowing a character to make a full attack with them at no more penalty than an archer firing arrows from a bow. There's a specific Ninja Trick that also allows a Ninja to burn a ki point to let them throw a couple extras.
Flurry of Stars (Ex) wrote:
A ninja with this ability can expend 1 ki point from her ki pool as a swift action before she makes a full-attack attack with shuriken. During that attack, she can throw two additional shuriken at her highest attack bonus, but all of her shuriken attacks are made at a –2 penalty, including the two extra attacks.
As a side note, I'm about to pass out, so I'll return to this thread when I have some time free tomorrow. Ciao, all!
If you haven't already been pointed toward it, I recommend checking out the official Guide to Organized Play. Please note that this particular document will be updating in the next couple of weeks, so keep an eye out for when that happens as only the newest and most recent version of the guide is correct and legal.
After that, when you're reading through your source material trying to take inspiration and ideas from things you like, make sure to check the Additional Resources page and look up the particular entry for the product that you're looking at the material from. That will let you know whether or not what you're wanting is currently legal in PFS Organized Play.
If I wasn't falling asleep at the keyboard, I'd do a proper write-up here, but as it is I need to go pass out.
However, I shall try to return and add my own advice and tips to the pool when I wake up in the morning. Ciao!
I appreciate both choices. I find it ironic that Rakshasa bloodlined Tieflings are allowed in PFSOP when I'd expect them to be as evil or more than a Drow (Rakshasa from what all I've know have always been evil creatures). But I don't want to make that a focal point.
I think I'd be more interested in staying with a Core race as I'm not too sold on playing Aasimar or Tiefling and not sure I'd want to buy a book that's pretty much just on them and not much else. I've played a Tiefling in the past but it was a difficult and interesting campaign with a Paladin in the party.
The difference between Rakshasa-blooded Tieflings and Drow are that Drow exist within their own society, where the Tieflings are outcast from both their fiendish relatives and (generally speaking) their Human relatives. And, while their blood is tainted by the corruption of their fiendish ancestors, they aren't all raised in a specific society, so there's a lot more variation from Tiefling to Tiefling. No two are necessarily going to be the same. They can be a lot of fun if you've got a concept you like (I have one Tiefling character and he's a blast to play), but I do very much understand wanting to steer clear of them for now.
There's also absolutely nothing wrong with wanting to play the core races. I, personally, enjoy the heck out of the core options.
I actually think that a build off of a Half-Elf could be extremely functional for your desired character, putting that racial feat Skill Focus to good use by picking Stealth as your skill for it. Then you could start aiming toward feats like Hellcat Stealth (out of Cheliax, Empire of Devils) that lets you stealth while in normal or bright light, even while observed.
Quote:
So I'd be best off going 12 levels of Ninja then? (Assuming a Shadowdancer is mainly melee?)
Well, that depends. I think Shadowdancer has it's pros (Hide in Plain Sight while in/near shadows, and the Summon Shadow ability can utterly break encounters in some cases), and cons (no Sneak Attack progression, requires several feats to qualify for).
If you don't want to have to focus a lot of effort on increasing your ki pool points to use Vanishing Trick every round or two of combat, having the options of being able to stealth to get your Sneak Attacks off is going to be invaluable. Especially if you're intending to focus most of your feats on things like Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, and working your way toward Snap Shot. Ninja don't get a lot of feats, so I think it's a good idea to focus on what is really core to your character concept.
Quote:
I guess it's not really 12 levels of ninja either then, as only 11 levels are playable and then the character retired.
Don't be discouraged by the concept of a character hitting retirement. You'll still be able to play them in special events at conventions and in coordinated games outside the usual game days for PFS. You just likely won't get to play such characters as often as the ones pre-retirement.
Now, they're not available to everyone (a point of much contention on the boards, I assure you), so the only way you'll be able to play one is to get your hands on a boon. This means attending a convention, special event with prize support, or asking (NICELY!) around the boards or checking with people in your area to see if they have an extra they might be willing to donate to a new player. However, don't be too disappointed if nobody wants to just fork one over as they are a bit of a special prize sort of thing.
You'll need to be tactful about how you go about asking as some folks get pretty bent out of shape over these things on the boards if they think you're begging and whining about not getting your way. Also, none of the above courses of action guarantee you actually getting that boon. I've only gotten one race boon that wasn't tied to me GMing a special event or playing in a special (high level) event in two years of attending cons.
There are, however, other options.
One that I think would fit your character concept and aesthetic appeal is the Rakshasa-blooded Tiefling. It's a variation on the Tiefling base race that's specifically tied to having the influence of a Rakshasa in their bloodline. They're presented in the Player Companion: Blood of Fiends, though other legal Tiefling options are also listed in the Advanced Race Guide. Should you decide to play as one, you'll need to have whichever product(s) you're using material out of in a physical copy, or a digital copy watermarked with your name (or that of an immediate member of your family/household) when you play that character so that you and your GM can easily reference the material if they have any questions.
The Rakshasa heritage gives you +2 Dex/+2 Cha/-2 Wis, which lines up rather well with the Ninja class as it'll improve your ability to hit (assuming ranged or weapon finesse) and your ki pool (Cha based for Ninja). They also have an animal-influenced flair that you can choose your favorite flavor of (Cat-like, Fox-like, Squirrel-like, Snake-like, and so on), though only the half-human variety of Tiefling (or Aasimar) are allowed in PFSOP. That means you can't have a Tiefling descended of Gnome parents or Dwarf parents. That is clarified in the Additional Resources entry for the material.
You could also go with an Aasimar, which is the polar opposite (heritage-wise) of Tieflings. And, just like Tieflings, Aasimar have their own lovely splat book (Player Companion: Blood of Angels), which similarly outlines variant heritages with different stat bonuses/spell-like abilities/skill bonuses, etc. Also, they obviously have material in the ARG.
And I assume I can play my character till he hits level 13 then he's retired?
Woops, missed addressing that in the last post.
As soon as your character hits 12th level (33xp), they reach the status of "Seeker" and are considered to be retired. However, there are still ways to play that character beyond that point, though they require special coordination between you and other high level players in your area (or at conventions and the like) to be able to play. Most routine PFS days at your FLGS aren't going to include much, if any, in the way of offerings for 12+ characters as that is the minority of the level range in Organized Play.
Don't despair, however! In the last two months, I've been able to play two of my retired characters multiple times with a local group of lunatics... err... I mean my friends... In modules and other fun things on weekends outside the normal gaming routine. It's just not something you should expect to be a regular thing.
I'll go ahead and start reading through the two guide sections you posted to get up-to-date. Thanks :)
I'm always happy to help when someone's willing to accept the offer. Especially when they're open-minded and willing to adapt. :)
Kysune wrote:
I agree, maybe going Ninja first would be easier. I've played campaigns of d&d 3.5 but only played 2 sessions of Pathfinder that I'll be transferring to my new character (so after next session I should hit level 2).
I pretty well guessed as much considering the vast majority of the folks that ask about playing Drow (specifically) are fans of the various D&D novels and campaign settings, especially Forgotten Realms. First and foremost, Drow in Golarion are not the same Drow you know and love from the Forgotten Realms. They are irrevocably evil in the Golarion setting as it's written, and while some exceptions may apply, those are never likely to be seen within the scope of Organized Play.
However, don't let that get you down. There are plenty of awesome alternative options at your disposal!
Kysune wrote:
What are your thoughts on going straight ninja 12 levels or going prestige to Shadowdancer? (I'm thinking maybe Shadowdancer after level 10 ninja? And I assume I can play my character till he hits level 13 then he's retired?)
There are pros and cons to both the straight-classed Ninja, and the Ninja/Shadowdancer routine. I have recommendations on both, though what I delve into will depend entirely on what you want to get out of your character.
Ninja will give you the ability to do all the crazy battlefield maneuvering you had mentioned wanting to do through clever use of class features, feats, equipment, and skills, while giving you some nifty abilities on the side.
Shadowdancer, while undeniably cool (I helped my mother build a Ninja/Shadowdancer that's a real combat beast), is generally better suited to a build for a melee character. Mind you, I'm sure there are some killer ranged builds out there for them, but I have yet to fully explore them.
There's also the question of race. Were you specifically wanting some oddball flavor that sits outside the usual core races from the CRB, or are those races just fine provided they fit what you want to actually do?
It seemed that Drow had the ability to create darkness (especially with the one feat to create greater darkness at-will) to allow for sneak attacks easily.
Tengus look a bit ugly and I'm not sure I'd be willing to buy a pdf JUST for Tengu. They didn't seem that great or appealing to me.
Drows are pretty interesting, mysterious, and I'll be playing a low Charisma based character unless I must for Ninja as I'll play the "silent and mysterious" character in parties. Assessing the situation but not really being the face or being very tactful with my words.
If all shurikens deal sneak attack damage then this could be a big reason to go Ninja, Rogue, Shadowdancer or whatever to get sneak damage. I'm not sure what works best and what would be great to fling mayhem at enemies in battles while avoid melee combat.
Edit: As a main point though, Drows allowed for easy access to darkness/concealment for sneak attacks and they also had the extra added flavor of being mysterious and being brash and direct (probably not entirely true but I would think most interactions with a Drow and an above-ground dweller wouldn't go over the best unless a Drow was flattering a female character for their dominance or something...)
I have some ideas that I think you might like, and I'd be more than happy to discuss them with you. :)
However, I think I'm going to move said discussion over to the PFS boards, rather than trying to split it between two threads, unless you'd rather hold said discussion over Private Messages.
EDIT: Or we could continue in this thread. I just think it best to consolidate the back and forth to one thread rather than two in different forums.
First and foremost, let me just say welcome! Welcome to PFS Organized Play!
Before you start getting into the specifics of building a character, might I recommend familiarizing yourself with the official Guide to Organized Play. Please note that this particular document will be updating in the next couple of weeks, so keep an eye out for when that happens as only the newest and most recent version of the guide is correct and legal.
After that, when you're reading through your source material trying to take inspiration and ideas from things you like, make sure to check the Additional Resources page and look up the particular entry for the product that you're looking at the material from. That will let you know whether or not what you're wanting is currently legal in PFS Organized Play.
My first recommendation to anyone that's new to PFSOP is to stick with a build you fully understand and think you're going to have fun with. If that means making something simple at first to get a feel for how Organized Play works, then you can save a more complex concept character for the next one. If that means cracking out your concept character right away, make sure you're clear on how the class and rules work before showing up to your first table.
I highly recommend talking with your local game coordinator and GM's as I'm sure they can all give you a good idea of how things tend to run in your area.
As for what I would recommend (based off your previous posts), I'm thinking a straight classed Ninja would be the safest, simplest, and most solid bet. Multiclassing can make some of the weirdest concepts fly beautifully, or it can leave you wondering why your character is so ineffective compared to the non-multiclassed ones around. It all depends on your play style and how number crunchy you want to get.
Curses! I really wanted a character that worked well in a team and was fun to RP with a bunch of nerdy gamers!
... Oh. Wait.
I already have seven of those... :D
In all seriousness, though, I believe it's possible for everyone to find a character that they can enjoy playing and have a good time with everyone, even if it's not their number-one-top-pick-bestest-best-favoritest-race/class/whatever-combo character in the world.
Generally speaking, those are best saved for homegames where you can do everything you could do with the approval and support of your group and GM.
Also, I thought sneak attack only worked on the first object to hit? So wouldn't that mean that 4 shurikens hit the enemy but only one deals 3d6 sneak attack dmg?
I believe there has been a recent clarification of the rules on this, though my search-fu has failed me at this ungodly hour of the morning.
As far as I know, all attacks you make immediately after breaking stealth/invisibility all count as being made against a creature that is denied their dex bonus to you (barring special circumstances like Improved Blind-Fight, Uncanny Dodge, etc).
Also, as I asked over in the thread in the PFS General Discussion forums, what was it specifically that drew you to wanting to play a Drow? Was it just the purely mechanical reasons you were mentioning earlier in this thread, or was there some roleplay aspect that you were wanting?
Due to the lore of Golarion and the nature of the Drow that live within it, they are highly unlikely to be allowed as a playable race in the scope of Organized Play as anything short of a very rare, one-time deal, special event, sort of boon at a major convention.
However, I certainly wouldn't hold my breath for it to happen.
That said, what was it that drew you to the Drow in the first place as a character choice? Perhaps there's a way to modify your idea to fit a legal race choice so that you can still make your character (albeit a bit different than originally conceived) in such a way that you'll still get the flavor you want out of it.
EDIT: Also, I might suggest changing the title of the thread if you're still able to, to something along the lines of "Help needed for building PFS legal character". The PFS boards can get pretty unpleasant when the topic of oddball races pop up with the differences of opinion held by the people that frequent them.
First off, welcome to PFS Organized Play, Heritage 367!
As several posters here have already pointed out, your first stop when it comes to questions about the legality of material in Organized Play, should be the official Guide to Organized Play. Please note that this particular document will be updating in the next couple of weeks, so keep an eye out for when that happens as only the newest and most recent version of the guide is correct and legal.
If you don't find your answers after a careful read through of that product, then you can move to the Additional Resources page and look up the particular entry for the product that you're looking at the material from.
Commentary on board etiquette:
pathar wrote:
Jiggy wrote:
Posting under that alias is a bit un-called for when addressing a newbie, don't you think?
I wouldn't use it on a newbie who is saying, "I am a newbie please tell me where to start." But I'm comfortable using it when someone is asking for specifics without having read the basics. (The first paragraph of "Step 2: Race and Class" in the "Character Creation" chapter qualifies as pretty basic reading IMO.)
Heritage367 wrote:
I was reading up on the Uncommon Races and discovered the vishkanya, which seems like a cool race for a witch, but I can't seem to find if it's a playable race or requires a boon. I'm a total newbie, so this is my first encounter with the concept of racial boons. Are they available to play, and if so, do I need a boon to play one?
Emphasis mine.
Unfortunately, not everyone who is introduced to PFSOP is given all of the information they really should be when they first start. That being said, as a community, it's really our responsibility to kindly guide them in the proper direction when they pop up with questions rather than being rude or harsh with them.
It's one thing if you're dealing with someone who's been playing for several months to a year and they come here asking questions after they've likely been pointed at the guide and simply ignored it or failed to read through it.
It's a completely different scenario when someone is new, admits they're new, and is simply asking for clarification.
I see kitsune boons getting handed out like candy at <insert any given corporate driven holiday>.
What's that sound like anyway? Anything like it is in my head? "Hey, you look foxxy! Have a kitsune boon!"
Heh, something like that.
Quote:
Playing in a homegame is the best way to get what you want sometimes, not the worst suggestion so long as you don't force it and say it like it excuses anything in PFS ever.
I really, really, hope my suggestion didn't come off sounding that way, and if it did, I apologize.
TL;DR:
The goal is to allow folks to play a character they'll enjoy in PFSOP, but the fact of the matter is that some character concepts I've seen just don't fit with the spirit of the game, and I've seen people stir up a veritable s#$+storm because they can't play their item-crafting, chaotic evil, drow vivisectionist alchemist/synthesist summoner in PFSOP. When I see characters like that, my best suggestion is to find a home game, because what you want there is railing so hard against everything set forth in PFSOP that even modified, you're not going to be happy and you're going to complain about it at every possible opportunity. Nobody wants that.
On the other hand, saying you'd like to play a character that's completely in the spirit of the game aside for one little thing like the race you want, for example, I think that you should be allowed to come to the boards and explain just why you want to be allowed to play the race and have your voice heard. If you make your case in a civil, well thought out, post that explains the ins and outs of why you want to play said race, then maybe campaign staff will see and consider your plea.
However, if you come onto the boards whining and b!+$+ing about how life's so unfair and you demand they release the race you want right naow!1!!! most of the posters on the boards aren't going to give you the time of day, and I doubt campaign staff will see it as much more than a childish tantrum.
As I've stated before, I'm fairly indifferent about allowing different races as boons or as an open opportunity for everyone to play. While my personal preference is to limit unusual races to special boons given as rewards to con attendees, gm's and volunteers that help make PFSOP possible, and the occasional prize for just doing something cool, etc, I also recognize that the desire for having access to those things is a pretty widespread thing. I would also like to note that just because I prefer to see race boons limited does not mean that I feel my opinion is any more or less valid than the opinions of those that want their favorite options opened up.
Disclaimer:
That said, I'm not trying to say that EVERYONE that wants/gets/uses a race boon is defining their character solely by the race they picked, nor do I believe that having a character made unique by personality/quirks, and a character made unique by the race they chose, are mutually exclusive deals.
If you can make a cool character based off of more than just an oddball race, I would absolutely love to see you at a table while you make the PFSOP experience a better place by making things fun for everyone.
I understand that many people are unable to attend cons, which is where the most race boons are made available. That really stinks, and I know how much of a bummer it is to not be able to go to a con due to funding/health/life/etc reasons. I also feel that boons (of any kind) really shouldn't be the only reason someone should have for attending a con. On the other hand, boons are a great incentive to draw people in by granting them something cool and special that they can't get anywhere else, aside from the general experience of playing with the awesome people at a con.
No matter what it is that's offered at a convention (race boons, unique items, special access to classes, etc), someone, somewhere, is going to complain that they can't have it because they can't go to a convention. It's no more fair to deny the people that can't attend access to cool boons than it is to take away that special element of getting something cool and unique to the people that do attend the cons. It's a very sharp edge that Paizo has to try to balance on with this.
As of a somewhat recent-ish blog post, it's obvious that campaign staff recognizes that their fanbase wants access to race boons and is considering testing out a new system to distribute them to a wider selection of people, and not just those that can attend big events.
yeah, there is a lot of fun that could be had with this. potential volatile interactions, I would love to see her paired up with a paladin or something.
As the whole mess earlier previously cautioned, just make sure you do so responsibly and I see no reason why that couldn't be a lot of fun for everyone.
I personally have a "Paladin" of Asmodeus (Lawful Neutral Magus/Wizard) that is just all sorts of hilarious to play in a party with characters devoted to good gods. Especially characters that are actually Paladins.
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that's exactly what I was thinking. give her a properly sized weapon (although a largish one, she is a barbarian) but flavor it as something else. I just didn't know if that was going to cause problems if she pulls out her "cleaver" in a fight.
Expect table variation on this one because you might run into someone who's a diehard rules-lawyer that objects. Before the start of the game, check with the GM and make sure they're cool with it (you'll probably find most are gonna be a-okay with it), and when you run into the one or two that don't like it just accept that you have to call it an axe for the scenario and roll with it.
The dreaded R word:
Reskinning (there, I said it), as a topic of discussion on the PFS boards has a sordid history of heated argument and general unpleasantness, so tread with a certain amount of caution.
For the most part, I don't see it causing any problems as the two objects in question are very similar things, and worst comes to worst you could always describe it as a "Small-sized greataxe that looks suspiciously like a meat cleaver."
Honestly, you could even go with a character that has what is obviously a greataxe but the character insists that it's a cleaver while the player explains out-of-character that it's not and that the character is a bit crazy.
On a side note, if you'd like any help working out the build, feel free to PM me and I'd be happy to give my input and advice to help make the character work and feel the way you want it while staying within the Organized Play guidelines. :)
I appreciate the thought :) Who knows, Maybe i'll dig one up somewhere, or when i'm done with the last book I could try to trade off the full Pathfinder Books one with the Permanent boon.
It has been my experience, in the area that I game and the circles I associate with, that if someone you know gets a boon that they don't intend to use, if you can give a good pitch, many people will actually hand off a boon just to let you do your thing.
I see kitsune boons getting handed out like candy at <insert any given corporate driven holiday>.
If you have something to offer, be it boons, services such as painting miniatures or drawing characters, or even just eternal gratitude, I suggest heading over to the Boon Trading thread.
Semi-related Tangent:
The other option, which I'm sure I'll catch flack for merely mentioning, is to try to find a home game where you can play what you want.
I've wanted to play a Kobold since the dawn of my gaming career, and I have NEVER been allowed to do so for varying reasons. It'll never happen in PFS, and I recognize that, so I've just kept the idea in the back of my head for when the opportunity presents itself. And, lo and behold, a friend of mine is about to start GMing one of the AP's and gave me the thumbs up on playing one! Woo!
If you have an awesome character concept that won't work with the current rules set of PFSOP, you can present a case as to why you think you should be allowed to do so, but don't whine if you don't get your way.
Save the character idea for a home game, or adapt it in a way that you can actually play.
As far as I can tell, it's a Herolab mistake, as I don't find that deed anywhere in any archetype (legal or not) in any of the resources I have available.
Here's hoping for getting a ratfolk boon. Ratfolk are cool.
Or an android witch with a sheep familiar.
hmmmm so then do Androids really dream of electric sheep?
(that's the joke)
But how would you make it electric?
But, as far as race boons, I happen to know of a couple folks that would love to see Androids as a playable race in PFS. Me, I'm fairly indifferent.
Tangent:
I already have 3 boon race characters, one of which no longer requires a boon to create, and there's really only one race boon I'm interested in right now and that's just because of a hilarious character concept I've had.
If I don't manage to get that boon, however, the character will likely end up a Human or Half-Elf.
Personally, I think that creating new roleplaying shenanigans is a fantastic idea! I, for one, would certainly consider making a monk character of your order just for the opportunity to help build a collaborative story within the PFSOP setting.
I happen to know there's a particular pair of new Venture-Captains (in game) that will be sharing a lodge (once the primer becomes legal) that's based on a ship owned by one of the two. Their poor protege's have to deal with trying to track down the lodge from port to port just to report in and get their assignments! Hilarious!
There's no mechanical benefit. There's no change to the overall world setting. But there is the added element of having some new pathfinders complaining about the wacky lodge they've been assigned to.
Oh, also, I have a character who happens to be another character's mentor of which I still have yet to personally meet either the player or the character XD (though I hope to at a con in the future!).
I agree. As stated I enjoy playing up and enjoy the rewards (challenge and treasure) for such. My complaint and many others, is this reduced gold for playing Out and Up (totally coining that phrase as it relates to this). But I'm not sure it's going to fix the problem. Those that game the system to gain more gold are going to find ways to game the system anyways. It's the problem about reactive changes made to things. Those that are truly concerned with gaming the system are going to find a way. Simple as that. Thus, I don't see the need to reduce the reward to those who just enjoy playing up.
One bad apple spoils the bunch, unfortunately. That's why there's no item creation allowed. That's why modules were changed to require you pay for your deaths and reduce the the exp/prestige per death. That's why nobody can play evil characters.
Just because I can be a responsible adult and play an evil character that is not only a fantastic team player and an asset to the team while making sure everyone has fun doesn't mean that Joe Shmoe with his CE Ranger is going to do so responsibly as well.
Unfortunately, those that do game the system will always find ways to do it, regardless of the rules changes made, but sometimes it's the best that can be done given the circumstances to try to curb it somewhat.
I, too, will miss the magnificent rewards for surviving a scenario at a higher tier, but I was always doing it just for the fun of the challenge. In all likelihood, I will continue to vote for playing up, even if I'm getting a lesser reward than before because, hey, I like the challenge!
When I lost my lowbie character at that table of higher levels that left me for dead, I was upset. I lost a character, and that kinda sucks at level 3, but I wasn't absolutely broken hearted over it. What upset me was the attitudes of the people that forced me to play up and then threw me under the snarling, tooth-filled, bus. Yes, I could've gotten up and walked away, but at that time I had much less of a backbone and willingness to stand up for myself in a group campaign setting like this than I do now.
Tangent Time:
Recently, I was "forced" to play down at a table during Paizocon '13 due to the social pressure of a particular player at the table. I could've just walked away and saved myself the heartache of missing out on Waking Rune Hard Mode with the character I REALLY wanted to play through it with, but the player in question was my mother.
She'd just recently started her battle with quitting smoking (and she's still doing a great job!), had lost her wallet that morning, and hadn't gotten much sleep so she was pretty stinkin' cranky. If I had walked away, I would've been hearing about it for weeks afterward if it had gone poorly for them. As it was, not only did we play down, but we ran out of time to finish and failed by default. I got 2k gold on my level 11 retiring character.
But ya know what upset me about that? The lost gold? Nope. The lost prestige? Ehh. The fact that that cowardly Runelord escaped his explosively-shocking-grasp-crit-fest death? Ooooh, you betcha.
The fact of the matter is simply that we're going to have to wait to see what the final ruling really is. At this point, we're really only arguing over the principle of the thing and not how the execution will really pan out. As far as I can tell, the change in the play up/down reward level is really only going to have an effect on those that play out of tier regularly, and this should help encourage people to try to stay in their own subtiers as often as possible. If it's only once in a blue moon, why complain about it?
If you're only playing up for the challenge and the fun, then don't complain about the reduced reward.
If you're stuck playing down on a regular basis, perhaps you should consider making a new character or few to give you the option of playing with others of a closer level.
