EldonG's page

Ok - I'm thinking hags with a goblin chief and his unusual clan - he's a suzerain oversized goblin Sor10 with a hobgoblin slayer8 for a cohort...

I'm really warming to this! I can still use a derro or three, and even a serpentman and retinue. The hags would have a few stout ogre bodyguards - fighters, maybe. There are a lot of trees about, great for spiders and a lurking ettercap or two, and gargoyles will make for great spies and added muscle for the hags.

They'll be living in a mountainous area, high in the hills, but not on a mountain, per se. There's a crazy canyon that cuts through the village, which has bridges arching over it, and most of the buildings are decent sized multi-story affairs, in an almost gothic style, but with a fantasy flair. Some details will be worked out more once I decide on the main race - they do keep slaves, perhaps two or three races. Mongrelmen will likely be one.

The area will be for lvl 7-8 characters, so almost any monstrous humanoids (up to CR 4, maybe 5) should be possible contenders. This allows for multiples in an encounter, and class levels and/or templates as I see fit.

For what it's worth, I plan on using a ratfolk merchant npc there, so they shouldn't be too inimical to him.

I like to avoid things that will likely lead to a TPK without due fair warning. I once started a game with the invasion of a city, and the ultimate BBEG of the whole campaign showed up right in front of them. He was a very advanced devourer, far, far out of their league, and they saw him destroy the king (a pretty significant hero-king, might I add) easily - but not before one of them almost suicided.

They were obviously meant to run - and I made it very clear - they'd been told by that king that the future depended on them and their survival, even before the monster showed up, and were hurried to the escape tunnel with their mission. Sometimes, all the warning in the world won't stop one or two, but I always hope a few can get the hint.

Precise Shot for the win. The one serious archer in my game is a ranger with Precise Shot. Highly recommended!

EldonG wrote:

For those of you who think you can trust a LE character - there's a word for that.

Sucker.

A LE character may be absolutely honest. Devils always are, when they bargain you out of your soul.

This may come off as racist, and I apologize if I trigger anyone, but...

Devils aren't people.

People are complicated. People have diverse motivations and sometimes do bad things for all the "right" reasons and "good" things for all the wrong reasons. Devils do what they do for the devils. Period. They're archetypical examples of their alignment.

Just as not all Chaotic Good PCs will be compelled to start pulling pranks and breathing slowing gas everywhere, not all Lawful Evil PCs will be compelled to steal souls and burrow under the sand and breathe lightning and grant twisted wishes and be four-legged parakeets and be total asshats about it all. Comparing an alignment to its most extreme representation gets us absolutely nowhere.

Oh, I don't disagree completely - that's why they get the subtype - but a LE human can do the exact same kind of thing, if not as well. Politicians and lawyers (not all, but surely some) come to mind.

For those of you who think you can trust a LE character - there's a word for that.

Sucker.

A LE character may be absolutely honest. Devils always are, when they bargain you out of your soul.

No, more like 'there is this big ape...that was trying to kill you, just now'.

Why do you insist on making it sound like killing kittens?

EldonG wrote:

Some folks must have serious issues with animal control officers in the real world, especially when a dog mauls someone. No matter how peaceful they may seem later, they're usually put down.

Animal control officers must be evil, then, I suppose.

...not that I subscribe to that concept.

I tend to think of it as a proven safety issue.

That is not what happens where I live. What normally happens is those dogs go to an animal shelter where an assessment is made based on its behaviour with other animals and the staff at the shelter. Usually only those dogs that have been specifically trained to attack people are euthanized and then only in the most humane way possible.

The people I know who work in animal shelters are an excellent example of what it means to be a good person. Generally speaking, they regard life as precious and do what ever they can to preserve it with the limited resources they have available to them.

Killing is an absolute last resort for a good person in the real world. A good character should act the same way, even though it is a fantasy world. Killing a fleeing ape to avoid a hypothetical and highly debatable danger that may occur in the future is clearly an evil act. There may be times when killing a fleeing creature is the right thing to do, but that would be only in some rare and highly contrived circumstances.

Finally, to answer the opening post it sounds like you created a wonderful roleplaying opportunity there, I think RPGs are at their best when combat and roleplay mix together in interesting ways, well done!

...exactly what we're talking about? Well, except that it's a far more dangerous ape?

Oddly, I've always considered getting rid of a known threat to be a definite GOOD act.

Here's the players' pack:

Players' Pack

...and that first, introductory scenario.

Scenario

I'd appreciate any feedback that anybody might have for me.

PS: These were always meant to be free, so even if I ever do publish, these get given away.

Some years ago, I started writing a series of scenarios for an elven group, from the same village. I was discouraged by an industry veteran, and a few people that just wanted to suggest, "But what if I don't wanna play an elf?"

I still have everything I'd written - the first scenario - very much an intro scenario for 1st level elf adventurers, a players' pack, and the beginnings of scenario 2 and 3. I'd sketched out the entire campaign, and still have all of the notes.

Is anybody interested in seeing it?

I love Rich Parents - not because it's particularly powerful, but it allows for a creative backstory. I had a dwarf who was from a small hold that had been destroyed while he was away, deep in the mines - when he returned, he took things that reminded him of those he'd lost, the donkey left alive in the stables to carry it all - and his father's breastplate and MW longhammer, and strove to fill his father's shoes, as a Stonelord.

His parents are gone, now - but I wouldn't retrain the trait...wouldn't even suggest it as possible.

You can still roleplay your character's motivations and enjoy the game in an evil AP. It is usually called "getting into character", it doesn't mean you are evil in real life.

Evil people can still have heroes.

YOU can. Not everybody can. The experience of roleplaying is subjective, and we are all individuals. For some, evil acts leave them uncomfortable.

Who are you to tell someone else what they can enjoy?

DM_Blake wrote:

So, if the rod "confers the FEAT on the fly 3 times a day, and the FEAT says they have to be prepared on the fly (because Rod) that way" - how do you reconcile that without ignoring "on the fly"?

It doesn't say that. That language is clear. What it does say is that it confers the ability to use the feat.

I get the specific trumps general idea. If your reading is correct, there is no point for the sorc time penalty. If the other reading is correct, the sorc time clause makes sense, and there is no specific. The general fits.

Just wondering, are you familiar, at all, with the phrase 'on the fly'?

Did you note that it's actually in the wording?

BretI wrote:

kyrt-ryder wrote:

You have to understand 90% of people don't play a character who starts with less than +4 to their prime stat [if not +5]

This then becomes +5 at either level 4 or 8 depending on whether they started with 18 or 19, then becomes +6 with a +2 item, then becomes +7 with a +4 item [which is high on my list of things to acquire by level 10.]

+7 is 'not impressive' because it's 'standard.' +8 is a bit above standard.

I don't have a single character with a +4 modifier in their attribute. Many of them are at +3.

I sincerely doubt your figure that 90% of people do that.

There certainly are groups that do this, but I have no reason to believe they are in the majority.

You may be right. I'm basing my information on forum discussions I've read/seen and every game I've ever participated in.

I've never actually SEEN somebody not start with an 18 or better in their primary stat at the table. Ever.

Wow. Seriously? I've seen dozens.

I built a tanky character that, as soon as he achieved his ability to return an attack every time he was attacked in melee - was hardly ever attacked in melee, anymore. It had taken me 4-5 feats to set it up just right, and magic items, to boot. I still fought well, but it sucked that the GM decided I didn't deserve to shine.

I'd just love an explanation as to how this plays out with any given adventuring party.

The group joins together. There's a fighter, with a big axe and shield, and he says he can fight, and protect the others. There's a cleric, with his holy symbol and spells, and he heals and does amazing divine magics for the party. There's this wizard, and all are amazed at the arcane possibilities he presents...and then there's the town baker. He can...sell cookies.

...or is he this vigilante, who never goes into 'baker' mode?

Now, there are some niche games where the vigilante has his place, but they are few and far between. Niche.

As an NPC class - pure flavor-wise - it has possibilities...if it's not just plain weak. I'd love to see some straight builds that can stand up to good builds of other classes, though. I'm not terribly convinced that it's strong enough to hold its own - all for the value of a good disguise.

I did just stumble into one thing that I think might be of value, though - why not open up all the special talents to any Vigilante? Why compartmentalize so much when you could build so many more concepts if it was just more open?

EldonG wrote:

Ok, I'm looking at building a cult leader using the Zealot specialization, but it's just not grabbing me. I had envisioned a BBEG of maybe 9th, with his mook followers to challenge a party of 5th-6th level characters, but I can't seem to find anything unique to the Vigilante that actually makes it work.

Of course, there would be plenty of buildup using dual identity, but I could do that with disguise and/or a Hat of Disguise, and have a more powerful boss.

*sigh*

Anybody?

Dood, that is why this is a playtest; create, test, back to the drawing board if neccessary.

Yes. I get that. I was starting into the *create* part, when I realized that my Zealot would have to use almost all of his talents to simply have sub-par casting, and was at a loss as to HOW to create anything viable.

So I came to ask if anybody had any ideas. This is a bad thing???

Yes, if everything melees 1v1 in open areas - IOW, if everything is perfect for the feat - it's OP.

Otherwise, meh.

Wow, did you not present the rest of the wording of the feat:

For example, if you would have taken 6 points of damage, you would convert that into 6 feet of movement. You immediately move in a straight line in a direction of your choice this number of feet (rounded up to the nearest 5-foot-square), halting if you reach a distance equal to your actual speed. If this movement would make you strike an object or creature of your size or larger, the movement immediately ends, you take 1d4 points of damage, and fall prone in that square. This involuntary movement provokes attacks of opportunity normally if you move through threatened squares, but does not provoke an attack of opportunity from the creature that struck you in the first place.

You are staggered for 1 round after you attempt to use this feat, whether or not you succeed.

Makes a HUGE difference.

Wait - the fighter isn't allowed to excel, even in a mythic game?

I'll bet some of you also b#@*~ about how weak fighters are.

Talk to your GM. Be willing to take his criticisms, but explain your position - all the while, recognizing that your position is not the only legitimate one to take. Are your characters just numbers on paper, or do they have a story? Is there a background there just to justify your numbers, or is it something the GM should be happy with?

Apparently, he's not happy with your characters for a reason, or more than one, so be willing to hear him out. As to helping others optimize, I'd talk to the GM first.

Just my $.02.

Making it even worse is the simple fact that most people don't even have the elite array, while some of these characters have fairly epic stats.

As has been discussed, the Mountain has unreal strength and con, and a decent dex, to boot.

I would argue that Jamie Lannister, Khal Drogo, Ser Barriston, Bronn, and most of the big-name characters likely have better than even the elite array - probably 20 points or better - and that makes a huge difference when most people are stuck with the NPC array and NPC classes.

Given good armor (masterwork full plate, in the case of someone like Ser Barriston) and weapons, a well-statted 5th or 6th level fighter (or cavalier, or what have you) can walk through droves of peon NPCs of 1st-3rd levels. Before breakfast.

Expecting men to be scouring the inhabited lands, Carroc heads for the highlands, unafraid, welcoming the mountain peaks ahead. He only wishes he still.had his bow. It would make for easier hunting.

Not that he needed it.

Survival: 1d20 + 10 ⇒ (12) + 10 = 22
Survival: 1d20 + 10 ⇒ (1) + 10 = 11
Survival: 1d20 + 10 ⇒ (16) + 10 = 26
Survival: 1d20 + 10 ⇒ (2) + 10 = 12
Survival: 1d20 + 10 ⇒ (4) + 10 = 14
Survival: 1d20 + 10 ⇒ (3) + 10 = 13

Four events! Woohoo!

He DEFINITELY had Combat Expertise...had...such an operative word...

The folks at Angelsword and Cold Steel probably understand MW pretty well.

This is a sample map of mine...its a full city, and took maybe 30 hours...Wild Roc Roost

Saladin could be interpreted as a paladin easily enough .

A recent quote from my Stonelord: "Apologies to yer children!"

Something he almost said: "I grieve fer yer widda!"

...hey...he's a dwarf.

Incidentally, regarding children and their sexuality...western society is a bunch of morons with no memory. I was an exceptionally horny 8 year-old...not that it started then. :p

Blood! BLOOOOOD!!! BWAHAHAHA!!! WOOHOO! hehehehehe...

The huge, booming voice fills the chamber, reverberating...

I started one campaign with loud, resonating thunder...an a rift opening on the sky...a form flying through, arcing through the sky, and plowing a trench where it hit...

It was the death of a god, and the pcs were some of the closest witnesses...

Most useless lich? Scarred Witch Doctor. I'd like to see someone make that viable. :p

The difference between 14 INT and 18 INT is 2 skill ranks until level 7.

But the "cost" to do that is 8 build points(40% of my total (more if I wasn't an elf)). For a negligible benefit that doesn't show for six levels.

The difference between 14 INT ans 20 INT is a bit bigger. Three skill ranks and an additional level 1 spell.

But the "cost" here is even bigger- -15 build points(75%). That's a significant amount of STR or CON- -even for an elf.

Not true...it shows up immediately... bonus spells. Don't forget your initial allotment.

Reason to have a half-elf baby?

They're so cute it's crazy, and they stay that way for at least 10 years? Mind you, that's a lotta diapers...

My latest creation.....

The Monktopus!!!
Alternately, Monkthulu as suggested by BadBird

Half elf, human, half orc, whatever... just something with a str bonus. Level 12 (20 pt)
Druid 4, Monk (Master of many styles) 3, Barbarian 5
(seems weird, but follow me here. Take Monk first.)

Str: 22 (+2 race, +2 levels, +2 belt)
Dex: 14 (+2 belt)
Con: 16 (+2 belt)
Int: 10
Wis: 19 (+1 levels, +4 headband)
Cha: 8

Feats:
Monk:
1: Dragon Style, Imp. Unarmed Strike
2: Dragon Ferocity
3: Weapon Focus (Tentacle)
Druid
5: Feral Combat Training
7: Shaping Focus
Barbarian:
9: Monastic Legacy
11: Power Attack or extra rage

Gear:
+1 impact amulet of mighty fists
+2 ring of protection
+1 Brawling leather armor
+2 belt of physical perfection
+3 cloak of resistance
+4 headband of wisdom
+3 bracers of armor
Monk's Robes
everything else is butter.

Features:
Fast Movement +20 (barb and monk stack)
Rage
Rage Powers: Superstition +3, Reckless Abandon +2 to hit, -2 AC
Uncanny Dodge
Trap Sense +1
Improved Uncanny Dodge
AC Bonus +3/+4 wisdom
Unarmed Strike
Stunning Fist
Evasion
Maneuver Training
Still Mind
Spontaneous Casting
Nature Bond
Nature Sense
Wild Empathy
Woodland Stride
Trackless Step
Resist Nature's Lure
Wild Shape, as level 8 druid, 3/day

So here is the schtick... your form of choice is a Giant Lake Octopus... it still has a 20ft. land speed, so you can move around just fine.

With monastic legacy you count as a level 7 monk for unarmed strike damage, and with monks robes, you count as +5 more for total of level 12. So your unarmed strike damage is 2d6. When you shape, you are huge, so it becomes 4d6. With your impact amulet, it becomes 6d6.

You are also getting +3 ac from monk levels and +4 from wisdom, so that is bonus. The extra weirdness here is that brawling armor property still functions while you are shaped, but you are technically not wearing armor because it merges, so you get...

Umm... what alignment does this monstrosity have?

Fighter Thread #2345 or so. Anything different this time?

Not really. I like fighters, you don't, blah, blah, blah. You know what's really boring?

Fighter threads.

Roleplaying is boring.

Well, if you have that attitude walking into it, none of the other stuff matters.

If you embrace it, it can be every bit as exciting as whitewater rafting.

If you really have to question it like that, it's not for you.

Goblins that always use good tactics are smarter, wiser...and vastly more organized than trained human soldiers. That is all.

I'd go scarred witch doctor. There simply is no more survivable pure caster out there.

I can see a paladin owning slaves.

In a strongly lawful, caste organized society, 'freed slave' could easily be worse than owned slave...and I can see a paladin doing his best to help as many as possible, even if that means buying them.

Come to think of it, there is a place for an Arcane Trickster. I'd put one in the Worm's lair. It's a ratling witch/rogue with a quasit as its improved familiar. (If you missed it, ratlings are the horrible little ratlike dudes with half-human faces, little handlike paws, and evil intelligence. They're Lovecraftian too, so that fits.)

I'd make the ratling something like a Rog 3/Witch 3/Arcane Trickster 4. That only makes it CR 10 or so... but it runs around under the floor, constantly going invisible, throwing spells and launching sneak attacks and summoning rat swarms and stealing small useful items from the PCs and giggling horribly (witch's cackle). Trust me, it won't take long before the PCs utterly hate this guy.

(He's friends with the Worm. They get along great, actually.)

Doug M.

lol...how...'Rats in the Walls'... ;)

Centaur Hunter...either sex.

Mythic makes a huge difference with a conjuration specialist...

Frankly, some of the worst metagamers I've ever seen are DMs. Tell me I see a troll, and I'll assume my character understands what that comprises. Tell me I see a large, brutish humanoid.... and I'll make no assumptions.

Well...you mentioned paladin... with a paladin, your choices are limited... but a Magus can do it, and you can make him LG and fluff him how you like.

WBL?

I offer appropriate treasure per encounter. That is all.

If you squander, you squander. If you make millions by careful deals, good for you. I still control the availability of magic items, within reason. I don't care to make the game a balancing act.

Thugs...mutters Garold...but hired by who...why? Her?

Why is 'fair' an issue?

Point buy is NOT 'fair' to monks. If one guy regularly rolls 15-20 at the table, and I roll 1-5, it's not fair.

Life...is not fair.

I bet if you read your favorite fantasy book, it's not always fair.

*shrug*

I like variables. I might want a total wicked fighter, but only get a 15 Str (I use the grid method)...but if he has a 16 Dex, a 14 Con...and a 15 Int, I can still make him a wicked fighter...and have a blast with him. Wiz with a 16 Str? Cool. Sorc has a 7 Con, but 15 Dex and 16 Int? I can work with that.

Would I have built any of them with point buy?

Ummm...I doubt it.