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1,257 posts. Alias of Molech.


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Taking a look at everyone. (Please be patient a bit more.)

Thanks for all the interest!

And soon we'll jump on Roleplay with Marcus Phandros, Kylian Phandros, get some info back from Magnius from Lord Mayor Aberian Arvanxi, and jump to Avalia Greenheart the Halfling Wizard Bellflower Network agent.

If y'all can check out and post in the Recruitment Thread I linked to (a few posts up) that'd be great. (I like The Lion Cleric.)

Anyway, I haven't posted there in a while so if y'all could that'd be great.

Guys, deep apologies for such a long delay and the silence.

I'm still here!

It's been really bad at work, multiple issues have jumped at me and demanded my time. And in the times where I've been free, my mind has not been in the right place to come here: too much stress.

Please, please be a little more patient with me. I saw you all posted Sunday on WTF is going on with me. Apologies.

I'm coming back, asap!

Sorry, very busy at work -- back next week.

As of about four hours ago Avalia Greenheart was there. That's how long it's been.

Sorry it's taken so long to respond.

Here goes:

@ Lion Cleric,
While I don't allow Two-Weapon Feint in my Homegames, I will allow it in this PbP. You can use it. I'm excitedly looking forward to seeing your character!

We do not use Background Skills at all.


@ Dr. Maeve mac Lir,
Yeah, this character is cool. It looks like you built it specifically with this campaign in mind. ....If it seems reasonable to you, it may be possible to make Maeve mac Lir be originally from the rural County in Cheliax where we started our PbP. If you take a look at our setting background and like it, if it fits, that may work as a good starting point for your PC: Parents came from Mammoth Realms Lords to Gheradescci County in Cheliax where little Maeve mac Lir didn't get along, now she's back "home" after supporting House Thrune, when she meets the PCs and you all get called to Her Infernal Majestrix. I dunno, maybe.


@ Sodium Telluride,
I sent you a PM with your answers.
In addition, I would note that the group has a Vigilante already, and with such a small group I don't like the idea of two extremely similar character functions. But certainly make your Master Spy. the character would certainly fit. Just consider that the group has a Vigilante who by day is a pretend good guy sympathetic to anti-Chelaxian ideals but by night is the monster anti-Chelaxians in underground Cheliax are terrified of.


@ Sulli the Repulsive,
A Lady creating an Undead army sounds freakin awesome, but there's a Big 'However,' we have a Lady Master Summoner who already creates an army of Conjured Outsiders.

Nonetheless, Sulli the Repulsive sounds really cool and, at the very least, I'd love to see the Orc Race-Build (under a Spoiler tag).


@ Vulpus,
I remember your PC proposal from a few years ago. I remember liking him. (I even designed a little village in our Cheliax setting with a small population of Kitsune, Catfolk and H-Elves so Vulpus would have a good local place from where to come. I don't remember why he wasn't originally included in the group, but I look forward to taking another good look at him.

Looking at your ideas for infiltration and subversion one thing pops out at me to mention -- note that there has been some tinkering here-and-there in the official campaign setting and published canon. Hopefully just little things but expect that some published NPCs and locations you encounter will be slightly different now and then. ....Indeed, I have eliminated Mediogalti Island and Korvosa from places our PbP will go to because those two settings have seen dramatic changes from the published canon as I have been DMing them in my Homegames for the past few years and the more my home group plays in a place the more it changes from the published material.


@ Yttras,
Counterfeit Mage is Legal for play.


And tell me if I've missed one of your questions, comments or concerns!

....Back to our game--
The final Halfling, the Wizard Avalia Greenheart who can cast at least 5th Lvl Spells, has a location in a cave in the desert area around Macini (as I recall) and you guys know where that place is. She is indeed a loose end in that she knows the whole story of what happened the night of Francesco Phandros' assassination; she was there. Of course, she's a CG outlaw Halfling of The Bellflower Network so she's not going to be going to some Chelaxian noble or HellKnight Order to rat you guys out -- especially once she learns Arlo Yellowknuckle, Avarin Littleheart, and the rest of her cadre were found and killed. Now, that being said, she's still a loose end. And that can be very dangerous.

It's up to you guys if you want to take a side trek to that cave and eliminate her before returning to Gheradescci County to report to Count Vocaturo Spartaco.


The little condo House Arvanxi owns that you are using as a base in Westcrown has no servants. It has been empty for a while and Magnius assured everyone (with DM assurance) that as long as y'all don't spend too much time there -- more than a few days -- and don't make too big a wave of conspicuous action, House Arvanxi will not even realize you're using it. ....Remember Magnius wanted to keep a low profile in Westcrown because if Lord Mayor Aberian Arvanxi learned he was in town he may pressure the non-titled Arvanxi (Magnius) to help out with some of House Arvanxi's plots and gambits and conspiracies. (Of course, metagame, it happens to give us a Perfect reason to separate Magnius from the group.)


I will get to posts for Grand-Count Marcus Phandros, Kylian Phandros and the rest asap. Almost certainly Not today.

And what's cool (for me at least) is that the Player in the new Recruitment Thread who mentioned The Shackles is one of the Players who submitted a PC proposal three_+ years ago but didn't play (I forget why.) and more to the point, the Baron in southern Gheradescci County who Count Vocaturo Spartaco also sent to hunt down the Bellflower Network assassins -- Valsecchi -- was only designed and added to Gheradescci to be part of that Player's backstory. The Player, showing up again after a few years of not playing, has returned with his character proposal from back in the day.

Skull & Shackles is a sad reminder to me -- though I eagerly welcome ideas and gambits from y'all that use The Shackles once you start on Sargava -- because it is the AP that forced me to temporarily turn off my Charter Subscription for six months. I really don't like pirate stuff and ocean adventures. So I turned off my Charter Subscription for the duration of that AP before turning it back on. (In addition to the 'Pirates are Stupid' AP I also briefly turned off my Charter Subscription for the 'Space Ships-Robots-and-Lasers-ARE NOT-D&D' AP.)

I think I covered all my metagame questions in the NPC Gameplay post. Feel free to roleplay it out.

The curious question of Winnow's refusal to submit to Hell's Law may not yet be knowable, the question regarding what to do with the Oberigo girl, however, is one you can answer. The night sky over the Parego Dospera in Westcrown grows darker. Will you ferry to the Parego Regicona to present her to Lord Tiam Oberigo? Or to his matriarch, Countess Tanith? Will you send Magnius Arvanxi to his uncle Lord Mayor Aberian Arvanxi? And then, after the baby girl is done and the boy done too, will you answer GrandCount Marcus Phandros about the Halflings of the Bellflower Network, and then find one of the Bastards from his House, Kylian, to trade the information that Winnow was in Westcrown purchasing slaves, looking for the next generation of disciples to The Midnight Lord?

Does anyone have any questions about the Houserules? Consolidation of the Knowledges (mine predate PF Unchained by a couple years), or the nerfed Threat range of weapons or such?

leinathan wrote:
Does Cheliax have a formal spy/assassination branch of their military?


Yes and there's certainly a good backstory for a PC who 'used to be' part of such a group -- either the HellKnight Order of the Cipher, or Queen Abrogail Thrune's (or some other noble's such as Archduke Kettermaul Charthagnion the 'ArchHeathen') personal cadre of spies/assassins. But having it as part of your PC's past is appropriate over his or her present. At present, Her Infernal Majestrix is looking for independent operators. But someone who used to be an apprentice in the Order of the Cipher who then became one of ArchHeathen Kettermaul Charthagnion's (the Archduke) spies and assassins would certainly be someone Queen Abrogail is looking for.

One of the PCs is a former Darklight, for example.

The Pathfinder Wiki is a good starting point if you want to know a little bit more about certain places. Purchasing the Inner Sea Guide is a much better idea.

The Lion Cleric wrote:
I'd rather begin by understanding the area, and see what can be exploited


This is of course a critical note. In any Sandbox game (of multiple PCs) the DM still has to give a pretty full setting description otherwise the PCs may not get anywhere cuz they just don't know what the place has. In our case, at least we have the campaign setting that we all know at least a little something about (part of the draw to you to this was the name 'Cheliax' and the other names at least a little). So you know at least a little about the setting. But the specific NPCs and general social climate has to be described.


Of course, then I just need creative players.

I think the ideas so far are strong, and many are playable. Of course, since I've never done a campaign like this I do have uncertainties. But we're gonna give it our best shot and work together to make a great campaign.

(And as a side note, my six day absence from this Recruitment happens in Gameplay too. I typically try to find availability to post the late mornings of Monday through Friday, often not Monday or Friday limiting it to Tue, Wed & Thu. And when work gets busy, I miss a day or two and all the sudden a whole week goes by -- just like it did here. We are slow paced.)

I like both sets of ideas from Lion Cleric & Simeon regarding ideas on how to take on Sargava, Rahadoum, etc.

Note that you won't be able to involve Orders of HellKnights or the Chelaxian navy or other conspicuous enterprises of Cheliax. Queen Abrogail Thrune will make it clear that you're on your own -- Cheliax can not risk Absalom, Taldor, Andoran or Osirion finding out about this infiltrating/ corrupting/ subverting mission.

. . . .

I've had this campaign idea in my head for several years but was never able to make it playable. You know, it's not as though you can build a game around Diplomacy (or Intimidation) checks: 'Go there and roll Diplomacy; then go there and roll Diplomacy.' It just doesn't work. And I struggled with how to design it for years into something playable.

Finally, a few years ago I came here and proposed it as a Sandbox-style PbP and put the onus on the Players to come up with a way to actually play this campaign.

And we gave it a try.


@ Lion Cleric:
So,... is it a playable design to go, like you said, to Sargava and start making the pirates look bad -- both to the average Sargavan Commoner and to the various merchant lords? Can you see some adventuring Roleplay there? (Beyond a Diplomacy check: 'Pirates are charging you too much, and a Bluff check: 'Pirates kidnapped that young girl that went missing'
I'm confident that it IS playable -- but the onus is on the Players to come up with these gambits, true Sandbox style.

@ Simeon:
So,... is it a playable design to go, like you said, to Sargava and start convincing the Commoners that their lives will be much better if they re-embrace Chelaxian rule. Can this be done in some roleplay adventure beyond just a few Diplomacy checks? I think it can-- but you guys will have to come up with the ideas to get it done. Providing food and medicine to the poor is a good way to do it, absolutely, but is that fun gaming (for devil-loving Chelaxian PCs who are high level?)

@ Leinathan:
What are some ideas you have for Serena in a Sandbox such as this?

Now, obviously I'm throwing in a number of dynamic facets to the locations, a beast in the near-Mwangi and a few chaotic pirate captains for Sargava -- maybe a corrupt Sargavan politician you can blackmail or extort. ....Another beast in the mountains below Rahadoum that the locals fear and even an underground religious cult operating there you can expose and blame or destroy or what have you. Several little things. But ultimately, you guys have to be creative and think of gambits you can run that are actually playable.

That's the campaign.

Asmodean Advocate is allowed. All posts in the Thread I started, as well as both a player in my homegame and a player in my PbP have agreed it is balanced. That is conclusive and Asmodean Advocate is legal for play, as is.

Alrighty, so you can begin posting roleplay with the kids.


When we finish that I'll post a good description and resolution with Kylian Phandros regarding your delivery of intelligence on Winnow. You can let me know then what exactly you want to tell him.


We will also roleplay the discussion with GrandCount Marcus Phandros, giving him the information on the Bellflower Network assassins that you eliminated.


Then, all leveled-up, we'll head back to Gheradescci County to reconnect with Count Vocaturo Spartaco -- and of course his niece, Baroness Stella Spartaco. I'll repost some descriptive material introducing (and re-introducing since it's been a while) these NPCs and the situation there and then move quickly to Azlain's quest. ....Once everyone has a handle on the state of affairs in Gheradescci County.

We will do an abridged version of Azlain's quest -- a brief description of the journey to the site and then roleplaying the exploration of the ruins.

And when we've settled on all that, tying up all the loose ends in Westcrown, there's one more thing:

When you all go to Gheradescci County together--

-Yaos to give Count Vocaturo Spartaco information on the Bellflower Network Halflings who assassinated his niece's betrothed Francesco Phandros,

-The Bogeyman to expand his fearsome reputation (or Lucius Difax to 'flee' Westcrown for being 'sympathetic' to the Bellflower Network),

-Azlain to research the lead he has on an incredible archaeological discovery (this is a PFS Scenario),

--Do you want to play out Azlain's adventure west of the Badlands between the Eismonts and the Anferita (like we originally planned), or do you want to segue that as well so that thereafter, when Queen Abrogail Thrune calls you to the capital, will come sooner rather than later?

I'll re-post this later when we are leaving Westcrown, so we can decide then.

You can Level your PCs to ninth.
A few things to discuss:

What do you want to do with the kids -- more to the point, how much time in Gameplay do you want to spend on Roleplaying what you do with the kids?

Should we try to segue it by you guys telling me what you want to do and then I give a couple posts on how it all pans out?

Or do you want to take the time and post each part of roleplay with this-and-that NPC in House Oberigo? Lucius Difax has an 'in' with Countess Tanith Oberigo. You can use that to get an audience.


On the same token, do you want to segue the resolution of Yaos' deal with the Bastard, Kylian Phandros, with whom she made the arrangement to gather intelligence on Winnow?

Or do you want to spend time roleplaying it out.?


And finally, do you want to segue your report to Grand-Count Marcus Phandros -- with whom The Bogeyman (and I think Azlain) talked to about the Bellflower Network Halflings who assassinated his nephew -- and who you tracked down to kill?

Or do you want to roleplay that?


....I would prefer if we completely segue the purchase of magical items as you buy gear with your loot. Normally it's fun to introduce a merchant or two and do some roleplay but I think in the medium of PbP, it'll be better for our group to segue that completely.

Under the assault of Magnius Arvanxi and Yaos' various summoned legions, Winnow falls unconscious, bleeding out from his various wounds.

It is up to you if Yaos stops the Conjured army before they completely kill Winnow so he can be revived -- or if you let them tear him to shreds.

And after reading your post I feel as though I've read Balzac!

The Bogeyman wrote:

Knowing that Winnow will quickly recover from his terror and heeding the advice of his companions outside, The Bogeyman retreats back into the shadows.

On his way out of the abandoned building, he keeps an eye on Azlain and attempts to place him in position to make an opportune attack if ever Winnow returns


From this post I have The Bogeyman outside in the Shadows near Azlain and Yaos. And outside The Bogeyman intends to Ready an Action to attack 'if ever Winnow returns.' And you rolled a Stealth check.
....This is why I questioned why, in the next moment, you posted that you whisper something in Winnow's ear. ....But you're outside with Yaos & Azlain hiding in shadows; Winnow is inside.
....I wonder if the confusion came from my earlier post of Winnow's Actions, when he first had the Frightened Condition. He did not run outside the house with the Frightened Condition; he ran further in. But that was initially left open to interpretation on my first post -- I just said he flees. I made it clear in the Initiative post.

Initiative wrote:

Round 4:

Winnow 19: Frightened and Shaken, runs away into the house's interior

Sorry for the confusion.

Winnow is inside; The Bogeyman is outside. The Bogeyman can't take an AoO on Winnow as he attempts to cast Plane Shift.

I've started a Thread here asking for Advice on the Asmodean Advocate. Feel free to further its posts.

Meanwhile, please be patient with me as it takes time to ponder your ideas and respond with the appropriate consideration.

I have indeed opened up a Recruitment Thread to get another PC in our group. Who knows, maybe even two.

I'll post a Link to it so you can go take a look at prospective Players and their PC proposals and participate in our Recruitment discussion.

You can also shoot me a PM if you feel strongly about one of the PC proposals.


Currently, I'm trying to find time to consider one Player's request to run a Cleric with the Asmodean Advocate Archetype. It trades away one of the Domains for a Familiar (that becomes an Improved Familiar at the higher Level), and also allows Profession Barrister checks to be made for both Diplomacy and Bluff checks.

My gut tells me that Trading the Domain for the Familiar and, er, I guess getting one extra Skill -- all Bluff OR Diplomacy rolls -- with Profession: Barrister is reasonably balanced, but probably not both.

@ Yaos,
I assume your Air Elemental, Aerial Leopards and new Aerial Serpents are Readying to attack Winnow -- as the Ormyr has successfully been Gated back to The Shadow Plane by Azlain (via the Nightglass Mendacius stole).

Magnius is also moving up to Winnow to Ready his attack if Winnow doesn't surrender.


I will get to Winnow's Rd 5 Action asap -- it's too late tonight (I'm dead from exhaustion.) and my Friday morning schedule is brutal!

But Winnow will attempt to Plane Shift (almost certainly) in some way to lessen the Concentration DC with Magnius, and Air Elemental, Aerial Serpents and Aerial Leopards all bearing down on him. (DC's like 10 + Damage dealt, right?!? Maybe 15 + Damage dealt! ....Zoinks!

But I'll look at his stat block in case there's some trick he can do (in his Shaken condition -- and taking Twisting Fear damage as well).

You can both do that in Rd 5 but your Rd 5 Actions come after Winnow's turn.


Yaos still has Rd 4 Actions she can take after only talking to the girl -- and Magnius can go.

We'll give Yaos time to get to the PbP -- she can think of something.

Plus Magnius -- his best bet is likely to Move to Winnow and Ready an attack if Winnow doesn't surrender.

Irksy uh'ohs, guys....

In Rd 4 The Bogeyman went outside and hid using Stealth. I'm not sure but I assume the Twisting Pain on Winnow was auto-damage, not requiring a Standard. ....So The Bogeyman has a Standard and Swift to use in Rd 4 -- but going back inside and manacling Winnow is not something he can attempt until after Winnow takes his 5th Rd Actions.

Now, Magnius has a Full Round of Actions to take in Rd 4 -- and all Yaos did was Free Action talk to the little Oberigo girl. So maybe she can get into the house and do something before Winnow takes his Actions at the top of Rd 5?

Check the posts in Initiative and make sure I'm not missing something -- but I think your chance of preventing Winnow from Plane Shifting the Hell out of Dodge (pun intended), is in Magnius Moving into where Winnow is and Readying a Standard Action to attack if Winnow tries anything other than surrender. Then, if Winnow starts to cast, Magnius' attack (& Damage actually) will make Winnow's Concentration DC go way up.

....So, check if I missed something in Initiative -- but then see if anyone can still do something at the bottom of Rd 4.

You gotta see if you can prevent Winnow from escaping before you put him him manacles and whisper sweet nothings in his ear!

Hey Lion Cleric, I look forward to seeing what you have in mind.

@ Simeon,
It's an interesting thing to look at. The Archetype trades one Domain for a Familiar (that becomes Improved at the Level the Domain dramatically improves), and it gets to use Profession for two additional Skills with a different Ability mod, CHA instead of the normal for Profession.

In our current group makeup we have a PC already with Profession: Barrister who has used it on a few occasions to solid effect. We've also got some good group Diplomacy. As far as I can recall, none of my PCs have yet gone bonkers on Bluff, something the campaign could certainly use to nefarious exploit.

Go ahead and design your PC leaving this one element fluid and I'll start a Thread in an appropriate Forum and get some feedback there. Obviously I'll post a link here and let my current group know about it (one of whom has already found our new Recruitment Thread -- welcome Yaos, The Red Widow!)

@ Simeon,
I can't wait to see what you've come up with.

The one alteration to the Cleric Archetype I would want to negotiate with you is this: Allow the 'Devil's in the Details' feature to use your Profession for either Bluff or Diplomacy instead of both (chosen at 1st Lvl).

Do you think that's a fair ask for Balance (especially in a campaign such as this)?

Though I posted it earlier I want to reiterate, this is Cheliax of pre-Council of Thieves, pre-Hell's Rebels and Hell's Vengeance.

I'm avoiding Spoilers from those three APs hoping to one day play in them.

leinathan wrote:
When it comes to causing strife and conflict inside of a country so that another country can swoop in and take control, the idea is to destabilize everything.


I think that destabilization could be a quite playable strategy -- especially in places such as Sargava and Rahadoum. I can see lots of Player-Driven plots and machinations with that stratagem. Maybe in Isger? Diobel has Absalom to fall on, though, and Nisroch has The Midnight Lord and Pangolais. ....Still, 40% of the campaign could use this.


"leinathan wrote:
I'd want to build my character as an Int-based rogue Gish type character.

INT-based is good. Especially if you jack up a couple Knowledge Skills in addition to Diplomacy. Rogue/Gish is good too. We don't have a Rogue-build and a bit extra magic always helps.


"leinathan wrote:
What kind of ally is the group looking for right now?


You mean PC? ....
-We have a Master Summoner who is a Roleplay master of talking with NPCs in order to get info and make allies.
-We have a Vigilante whose day job is to pretend to be a 'good guy' (helping Bellflower Network Halflings) but whose alter ego is a hunter of chaotic, anti-Chelaxian menaces. With an Intimidate of like, +72 or something.
-We have a Wizard (and sneaky, pilfering Imp Familiar) formerly of The Darklight Sisterhood who is a master at creative problem solving and troubleshooting.

So, pretty much anything is good.

....As a heavy roleplay (intrigue, guile, manipulation, negotiation, etc.) campaign, Skills such as Diplomacy, Bluff, and Knowledge are excellent. But a clever Player can think of how to use anything.


"leinathan wrote:
Where are likely places for them to receive such an ally? Where is the party likely to go first?


You will either begin in Westcrown (less likely as I'm pretty sure we're leaving soon), or rural Gheradescci County in SW Cheliax, probably via Corentyn.

Mendacius, rather disconcerted about having to inside the house alone with the Ormyr and Summoner/Priest of Zon Kuthon and try to steal a sacred Nightglass of The Midnight Lord, nonetheless obeys as her Lawful obligation requires.

Magnius Arvanxi notices a look on Mendacius' face as she flies by him toward the Ormyr and Winnow. Was it a look of goodbye?


Winnow, writhing in terrified agony and no longer with his shadowy Eidolon's protection, is an easy mark, a shell of his former self. The Nightglass is hers.

More importantly, the Ormyr floating above can not reach her from is lofty place in the air above Winnow.


Flying back with her prize, unnaturally cold to the touch and telepathically whispering to her to look inside its glossy surface, Mendacius must struggle against the susurrant draw.

WILL SAVE DC: 14 to not look

@ Azlain,

It doesn't surprise me when Players take more innovative actions; I'm spoiled with a homegame group of veterans such as myself. (Two of us started in '81, another in '90.) And since we don't use a mat at home and because I give a bit extra XP for innovative actions to encourage it further, we have crazy fun encounters somewhat regularly.

My favorite thing as a PC is Bluffing to the villain that I'm also a villain, pretending to be the new high priest of the demon lord or evil dragon king or whatever. And once the bad guy thinks I'm also a bad guy, the way is paved for me to manipulate the encounter in all kinds of ways. Then I betray the bad guy after gleaning every bit of intelligence I can (and because the other Players wanna get on with the fight). But I use all kinds of shenanigans: make an illusory wall identical to the dungeon wall but about 12 inches out -- and hide behind it, or even have unseen servants (or more expensive Conjured folks) stand in the squares in front of me and use them for battlefield tom-foolery.

One of the things that's so great about playing with new Players is seeing all kinds of tricks like this. I've not seen a pilferer like Mendacius since, I dunno, probably 2nd Ed (when so many still wanted to be Tasslehoff Burrfoot). The CMB builds I've gotten used to in the past ten years have all been Bull Rush or Sunder or Grapple or Disarm. (I made a Dirty Trick PC but he died pretty early in the Campaign.)

It's really cool to see a Familiar that steals my gad-DAMN STUFF -- stop that you pesky cheater! ....It's great.

Yaos wrote:
The way Winnow was mistreating children made it predictable that the players would decide he was scum that needed to die.


This is the mistake I made. I wanted the description to be disturbing and I obviously went too far. Further, I've always told my Players that while there are innumerable encounters in the entirety of the Campaign World that are too powerful, I'll make it obvious when the PCs approach the encounter so they'll not pull the Dragon's tail. Like for us, when y'all meet Queen Abrogail Thrune and her Pit Fiend Adviser/Bodyguard Gorthoklek, um, I gotta make sure you know that if you pull that particular Dragon Tail that there's, er, nothing I can do to save you.

In our encounter with Winnow I totally missed the thought that it would even be considered a combat encounter. Totally missed it. I immediately nerfed the Nightwalker that was Winnow's bodyguard and figured y'all 8th Level guys could handle 11th Level Winnow even though the Ormyr had shown up as well. What I further didn't realize was just how high Winnow's numbers were compared to y'alls' but didn't feel it would be appropriate to further nerf him when I figured you still may be able to win, or, heck, just run away.

In any event, I erred by not even thinking that that would turn into a combat.

As I told Monkeygod in a PM, I felt responsible and apologetic to his frustration -- but his absolute refusal to take any Actions in Initiative (especially in a tough fight) made me decide to ask for him to leave. I admit my mistake, but refusing to play bothered me. I didn't know how to move Initiative forward without Magnius taking his Actions.

Anyway, I'd really refer to move on.

Holy Zszhit Mendacius that was Badd Ass!!

Can't wait to get to work Tue morning and look at my stats to see if that just worked!

Simeon wrote:
Serve to dispel the many nasty rumors that nonbelievers have spread about (Asmodeus's) faith and bring new converts into the fold.


Now we're talking!

I'll get an update of Rd 4 in Initiative asap -- remember that talking for a few seconds is a Free Action so Move and Standard Actions may still be taken.

@ The Bogeyman,
I'll put in the Twisting Fear damage on Winnow in Initiative.

A UMD check would be required once you have the NightGlass.

There is NO "common" language for humans.

Your "common" language will be appropriate to the land from which you come-- Chelaxian in all likelihood. (PCs with backgrounds from places not Cheliax can ask me ('Chelaxian' from Andoran; 'Taldoran' from Absalom & Taldor).

With each Rank in Linguistics you can select an additional Language that must be a 'Human' Language.
(1 Rank for Draconic & Varisian, or 1 Rank for Goblinoid & Osiriani, or perhaps one Rank for Varisian & Osiriani -- Not one Rank for Draconic & Goblinoid)

It takes FOUR Ranks in Linguistics to know Azlanti. It takes FOUR Ranks in Linguistics to know Thassilonian (and four ranks for the other ancient, long dead languages -- only two for Ancient Osiriani).

"Undercommon" is a silent form of Sign Language.
"Rogue's Cant & Innuendo" is an additional choice to the list of Languages on page 251 of the Inner Sea Guide.


And for the areas in this campaign:
Rahadoum = Osiriani (ancient, native languages may still exist in Rahadoum)
Diobel = Taldoran
Nidal = Shadowtongue & Chelaxian
Isger = Chelaxian
Sargava = Chelaxian

SKILLS (HouseRules):


is more powerful than the book indicates. You can know how injured another PC is with this, and even many monsters to a lesser degree. You can also heal more than just a few pitiful HP with Heal as well.

Knowledge Skills:

Geography, History & Nobility are Combined (making this one Skill closer in strength to the ‘monster’ Skills). This is called “Knowldege: Society.” It includes history, cultures, society, nobility, customs, lands, terrain, people, legends, laws, personalities, traditions.

Religion and Planes are combined. If it has to do with Cosmology (gods are Outsiders, too) this is the Skill. It includes rituals, customs and dogma of the Outsiders, as well as geography and history of the Planes.) This is called “Knowledge: Cosmology.” It is for monsters that are Outsiders, for all things Inner & Outer Planes, the Astral & Ethereal & Elemental Planes, for Gods, Demon Lords, Arch Devils, to recognize Holy Symbols (& Profane), ecclesiastic dogma, ritual & tradition, religion and cosmology ....(Planes and Religion w/out Undead)

Arcane now also includes knowledge of Undead. Religion no longer does. (This makes Arcane on-par with Cosmology.) It is for monsters that are Dragons, Magical Beasts, Constructs, Undead (other 'Arcane' things that can also be gotten with Spellcraft)

Nature and Dungeoneering are now combined. (I’m still working on ways to make it stronger.) For monsters that are Fey, Monstrous Humanoids, Plant Creatures, Aberrations, Oozes, Vermin (other 'Nature' things can be gotten with Survival)

Local is for PC-playable Class and Race information. Class Features and power levels are included in these rolls. All races that advance “By Class” can be learned about through Knowledge: Local.
....Knowledge Local is a Class Skill for every PC Class. All PCs can know about PC Class Features and PC Race Features. (An NPC Expert, Adept, Warrior or Adept, however, may not have Knowledge Local as a Class Skill. For 'monsters' that are based on Class features, and NPCs' 'power levels' (CR interpretation) -- and for Racial features of Humanoid races-- races that advance by Class Level

Engineering is a Profession

Other Misc HouseRules:

If you roll a 20, you Crit. It’s as simple as that.
If you Threat on lower than a 20, you still have to Confirm the Crit.
I will NOT allow Threat ranges to go below 18. (So if you have a Scimitar, there’s never any point in getting Keen. And a Longsword with Keen only Threats from18.

Adamantine can only be found in-game, not purchased.

The Elven Curved Blade is an Exotic Weapon – EVEN for Elves (Weapon Familiarity be damned). Weapons with a Race-name are not auto-proficient for members of that Race, in other words.

Everyone has One Hero Point and these are somewhat stronger than the published version.

The Leadership Feat is not allowed.

Item Creation (except for Scrolls & Potions) Feats are not allowed for this campaign.

We will not be using a grip map for combat.

Character Generation Guidelines:

8th Level

26 point buy for Ability Scores (show your math)

2 Ability points gained every four levels, to be used however the Player wants (instead of just one)

Max HP every Level

40,000 GP – no single item may cost more than 16,500gp

Select three Traits.
Please list the mechanical effect of the Trait for me, not the name.
Further, since a Trait is half the strength of a Feat, you can make up Traits pretty easily: +2 to one Skill; +1 to two Skills; +2 Initiative; +1 to a Saving Throw; +2 to Concentration checks; +1 Spell Penetration; +1 to attack rolls vs a Type of monster – that kind of stuff. I’m pretty easy here.

Select one extra Feat.
Taken at 8th level.
Feats may be selected from the Core Rulebook and the APG. Feats from additional sources may be allowed – please send me a PM for specific requests. Some few of these others, such as Fey Foundling in the “Inner Sea Guide,” are approved with some Houserule modification.

ALL Races shall instead conform to the “Standard” Ability Score Modifier Quality as defined in the ARG chapter four:
Pick one Physical stat for a +2 / Pick one Mental stat for a +2 / and pick one of the other four stats for a -2.

(This hopefully encourages the Player to select Race based on racial Fluff rather than Crunch: If you want a Catfolk Cleric or a Dwarven Sorcerer, for example, then you can do so without crippling your PC at creation. Further, it makes the Aasimar more balanced, forcing it to take a -2 to one score. Note Humans are also +2/+2/-2).

In the ARG, almost all material from Chapter 1: Core Races, is allowed.
Much of the material from Chapter 2: Featured Races, is allowed. (Prehensile Tail is NOT.)
A tiny bit of the material from Chapter 3: Uncommon Races, is allowed – often with Houserule modification.

Option: You may build a Race using the ARG under the following

Race-Builder Houserules:

1) You have 13 points to spend.
2) You may only use “Standard” Traits.
3) You may not have ANY Trait costing four points or more – also, the Spell Resistance, Greater Trait is disallowed.
4) You must still use the “Standard” Ability Score Modifier Quality as mentioned earlier for ALL Races.
5) You must work with the DM on Background and History for the Race, which is ultimately subject for DM approval, revision or refusal. –As a note, I am more likely to accept Races that are defined as a mix-race or a little-known ethnicity: a Nidalese Halfing, a half Dwarf/Gnome,…. What DO you get from an Aasimar parent and a Tiefling parent?....

All Core Classes accepted.
All APG Base Classes (and many APG Archtypes) accepted.
The Base Class in the UM is accepted (You may request other UM material – Feats, Archtypes, Spells, Equipment, etc. via PM.)
The Base Classes in the ACG are accepted. (You may request other ACG material – Feats, Archtypes, Spells, Equipment, etc. via PM.)
The Base Class in the UI is accepted.
The Base Classes in New Paths Compendium are accepted.

A good rule of Thumb for character creation:
The CORE is okay.
The APG is okay.
Some stuff in the UM is okay.
Some stuff in the ACG is okay.
Some stuff in the ARG is okay.
Some stuff in the ‘New Paths Compendium’ is okay.

House Rules, Acceptable Sources, PC-Generation Guidelines:

As this is an ‘Evil’ campaign, please note that no PvP will be allowed and that, moreover, PCs must be able to work together as a team -- sharing treasure, considering everyone’s opinion and playing together in common cause.
Further, please include in your background some detail on YOUR interpretation of Alignment for Your PC -- explicitly agreeing that others may have a slightly different view of the same Alignment that works for their PC.

For ALL of the NPCs, Alignment works as such:
Good and Evil are Moral alignments
Lawful and Chaotic are Personality alignments

Sorry about the delays, guys. And THANKS for your interest.

PCs are 8th Level at the beginning of the campaign. We have spent a few RL years of Roleplay – very slow paced – IN Cheliax, building up character backgrounds and, more importantly, making contacts and resources in Cheliax. Soon the current three PCs will be ninth Level and Her Infernal Majestrix, Abrogail Thrune will send for them to begin this quest.

I’m not sure how long Recruitment will go and when I’ll introduce your PC; you may be ninth Level at the start.

We began in the Homebrew GHERADESCCI COUNTY in SW Cheliax, north of Corentyn on the edge of the Anferita Wood and the rugged Badlands under the Eismonts. We have also spent time in pre-Council of Thieves Westcrown. The NPCs of Gheradescci County, as well as Westcrown and even Corentyn have been developed as resources and allies through nearly three years of Roleplay so that they can serve as contacts and resources once you go abroad.

The PCs and I are all quite anxious to get out of Cheliax and get the ‘Agents Abroad’ Campaign started. But we’re having fun and the game is moving forward. I’m usually able to post a couple times Mon-Fri during the late morning (NY time) but there are plenty of times when several days go by before I can get to the Boards to post.

We began with a Campaign of four but one PC mysteriously disappeared after a couple months into it, never to be seen on the Paizo Boards again. So for a couple years we were just three PCs. About a year ago a second PC left because we were just too slow paced for his preference (two years and hadn’t even left Cheliax!) At that point I introduced two new PCs who have been with us for a good eight months. And this past holiday we lost another PC as he and I had a problem we could not seem to reconcile. ….So we are now three PCs and I’d like to add one more (maybe two).

(I also foolishly tried to do two PbPs with two different groups, even managed about 6-8 months – by my work schedule just did not allow it and we shut down the second PbP table.)


This Campaign takes place after the events of Curse of the Crimson Throne and Shattered Star, but prior to the events of Council of Thieves, Hell’s Rebels, and Hell’s Vengeance. Please NO Spoilers from these (as your DM is hoping to one day play in those three APs).


In the meantime, think about some character background for a loyalist Chelaxian with the experiences of an 8th Level PC – and think of ideas you think would be fun to play as an Agent of Cheliax Abroad.

I don't have anything at present for this specific Ormyr. I thoroughly designed Winnow (The Ormyr's testing the kids was part of Winnow's (Fluff) design.) If y'all want to try to turn this into a non-combat somehow I'll have to come up with a name and background for this particular Ormyr -- though it doesn't have many rounds left before it gets sucked back to The Shadow Plane through Winnow's Nightglass. (Please note your PCs don't know that and may assume it's more like a Gate and the Ormyr's here permanently.) ....In any case, I'll start thinking of a specific personality and background for this Ormyr when I get some time. Whether y'all decide to do something extraordinary to talk to it now, or for sometime way later when the Ormyr is able to return to the Prime Material to, heh, try to enact vengeance upon you.

(Or you could try to kill it now and I can just use his Crunch stat block.)

(Or you can continue to run away and I'll have plenty of time to design the Ormyr personally.)

Hmm, I guess it's a bit metagame but,... one could just note that Winnow has an "NPC" title where the Ormyr has a "Creature/ Fiend/ Monster" title. Y'all talk to this Ormyr and all the sudden it'll start getting the title of "NPC."

(Incidentally, do y'all find my nomenclature to be helpful when (if) you go back and look through Gameplay posts? When you check out previous posts for "NPC: Winnow" or "NPC: Kylian Phandros" or even previous posts for "NPC: Count Vocaturo Spartaco" or "NPC: Baroness Stella Spartaco"? Does it help that there are posts under "Initiative" and posts for "Treasure," etc.?

Absolutely you could take 10 on that Profession check -- but Winnow's 27 is sufficient and the post now in Gameplay ought to be good enough for now.

If you guys can kill the Ormyr (or wait for it to get pulled back in Winnow's NightGlass), you can make further Skill attempts while actually studying the paperwork Winnow says he has. (Now that Winnow's Eidolon is gone he's a squishy 11th Lvl guy with a low CON and taking him is easy if he survives the Ormyr's punishment. ....But getting past the Ormyr--?)

Looks like The Bogeyman Ninja'd me in Gameplay regarding 'The Charter.'

The last part of the previous post mentions Profession: Barrister (lawyer, what have you) (DC 10) and Knowledge: Society DC 20. Or even Sense Motive with a tricky DC.


I'm pretty sure I got everything in correct order -- some oversight of course is welcome.

But here's my math:

Rd 3:
Unsure of fighting or running, most PCs Hold; Magnius backs out.
Azlain gets rid of Winnow's Dispel on the Glitterdust; Mendacius Cures Azlain.
Yaos has the kids & is Invisible outside.
The Bogeyman makes Winnow Frightened, a 1 Rd Condition that makes him run away on his Turn -- this will Provoke from The Bogeyman & the Air Elemental. (But check to ensure the Large Elemental has Reach.)

Rd 4:
Winnow runs in fear, provoking.
The Ormyr is now really pissed -- mostly at Winnow for being more afraid of Y'ALL rather than The Midnight Lord. The Ormyr Moves to Winnow deeper in the house and casts Dismissal on Winnow's Synthesized Eidolon. Moving provokes from the two Leopards Flanking the Ormyr -- as well as the Air Elemental IF he either has Combat Reflexes (I think it does.), OR if he doesn't have the Reach necessary to have taken his AoO on Winnow one second prior when Winnow provoked. (But I think the Large Air Elemental does, and would have taken the AoO.)

Now it's y'all's turn.

Note that Magnius was in Hold until after The Bogeyman went and thus his order in Initiative has changed. ....I feel that's the most accurate way to have unfolded that.


Azlain has started a Diplomacy -- which takes three Rounds to attempt (a 3-Rd Free Action) -- but Winnow's initial response indicates one of innocence!
....I forget which PC has Profession: Barrister -- I think it was Magnius (It may have been Alfred Ensbridge??) ....But having "The Charter" seems to be a reference of er, 'diplomatic immunity(?) mixed with some other legal stuff. Assuming the PC with the correct Profession -- or Knowledge: Society (or even Sense Motive I guess), can get what Winnow is saying.

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