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Organized Play Member. 91 posts (256 including aliases). 5 reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 19 Organized Play characters.

Grand Lodge

My Kingmaker group is nearing the end of RRR, and I'm wondering about magic item availability going forward. Normally I don't restrict magic item access much if there's a large city around and we aren't using ABP, since game balance depends on the players regularly upgrading their gear. However, Kingmaker makes this a bigger question by explicitly capping a city's base value at 16,000gp in the Kingdom Building rules.

Clearly, those rules say that a minor cloak of displacement (cost 24,000gp) will only be available if it's rolled randomly in magic item generation. However, what does this means for enhancing existing magic items? Can a player have his +2 longsword (cost 8,315gp) upgraded to a +3 longsword (cost 18,315gp) by a local vendor?

It seems crazy to say that someone in town can create a +3 longsword by random chance, but can't improve an existing sword in the same way. On the other hand, the starting items for the Big Six are all under 16,000gp, so if they can always be improved, the magic item availability restrictions don't seem to mean much.

None of my 6 PCs (currently lvl 6) have taken any item creation feats yet, nor do they seem to have any intention of doing so.

What have you done in your Kingmaker games? How has it worked out?

Grand Lodge

One of my PCs is a half-elf whose elven mother ran away from Kyonin to elope with her human father. When her mother left, she took a sword with her, which the PC inherited. I have a plotline in mind where her elven relatives appear to demand that the sword be returned, because it's a family relic and they don't see her as a legitimate part of the family. The player doesn't actually use the sword in combat (she's a witch), but I assume she won't want to return it.

My plan is for them to offer some kind of trial to prove herself worthy to keep the sword. I could homebrew something, but I'm wondering if there's any precedent for tests like this in Golarion. Something that half-elves can do to prove their dedication to their elven heritage, or maybe something that outsiders can do to gain entrance to areas normally restricted to elves.

The party also includes a couple of full elves (one from Kyonin), a human, a dwarf, and a tiefling. I'd want something that would allow them to accompany her.

Grand Lodge

I have a player interested in playing a CN rogue with a penchance for artwork trained by a guild of assassins. The Red Mantis seem too evil and don't work with his backstory for other reasons, but the Guild of Wonders sounds potentially promising. Is there any information about them beyond what's available in the Guide to Absalom?

I'm also open to other suggestions for assassin's guilds or other groups that he might have trained with.

Grand Lodge

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RRR mentions that "particularly adventurous PCs" might try to recruit unusual NPCs like Chief Sootscale and Melianse the nixie as leaders for their kingdom. My group is about to start RRR, and I suspect that this will come up - they're already talking about recruiting Perlivash and Tyg-Titter-Tut. The phrase "particularly adventurous" suggests that this should come with special risks, but it doesn't seem to give any guidance on what those risks might be, so I'm looking for suggestions and feedback. This is particularly important because they're also considering having an NPC Ruler.

I'd prefer to avoid just treating their ability scores as lower than they are, since that doesn't seem "particularly adventurous". I'm thinking that I'll customize whatever I do to sit the NPCs and the role, but some basic ideas are:

* Recruiting the NPCs in the first place may be difficult - treat their initial attitude as Unfriendly or Hostile for this purpose. Playful fey don't like the idea of paperwork.

* Small chance of generating Unrest each turn, as the humans are uncomfortable with their leaders.

* Some, like Perlivash and Tyg-Titter-Tut, may shirk their duties. Each turn they have, say, a 5-10% chance of leaving their office vacant.

* NPCs with dumped stats (not in their primary ability scores) may create problems. For instance, so far they have spared Auchs - if they give him a leadership role, they may find that he endangers the fragile peace they've established with the Sootscale Tribe.

Other thoughts or suggestions?

Grand Lodge

I'm starting a new campaign and I have a player who wants a mouse familiar. Since I haven't found rules for such, I was thinking of using the squirrel as a starting point. My main concern is that it will be too powerful for scouting, for two reasons:

1. It seems like a mouse should be Fine size rather than the squirrel's Diminutive.
2. As another thread pointed out, even if a mouse is spotted sneaking around, the enemy isn't likely to think much of it, whereas many other familiars would draw more attention.

Any thoughts?

Also, are there any methods available that would let an observer distinguish a familiar from just another animal?

Grand Lodge

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I've been trying to find more information about the prophecies of Aroden, but so far I've come up short. I know that prophecy has been unreliable on Golarion since he disappeared, but I'm wondering how detailed the prophecies were before then. For example, would someone familiar with his prophecies have known that Cheliax would split away from Taldor ahead of time, or would it have been fairly vague and the meaning would only have become clear in retrospect? Given that the Harbingers have apparently been trying to make various prophecies come true, it seems like his followers have a pretty clear idea of when certain things were supposed to happen.

I'm also curious exactly how the prophecies have failed since he died. For example, suppose that a prophecy indicates that a great darkness will fall across the land, bringing war and death in its wake, until a hero with a magic spear leads an army to victory against it. Would we expect nothing to happen, or would we expect something to happen but with an uncertain outcome? For example, would everyone be scared because some big darkness is supposedly coming and without Aroden there's no guarantee that the hero will emerge?

Grand Lodge

Interposing Hand reads as follows:



Interposing hand creates a Large magic hand that appears between you and one opponent. This floating, disembodied hand then moves to remain between the two of you, regardless of where you move or how the opponent tries to get around it, providing cover (+4 AC) for you against that opponent. Nothing can fool the hand–it sticks with the selected opponent in spite of darkness, invisibility, polymorphing, or any other attempt at hiding or disguise. The hand does not pursue an opponent, however.

An interposing hand is 10 feet long and about that wide with its fingers outstretched. It has as many hit points as you do when you’re undamaged, and is AC 20 (-1 size, +11 natural). It takes damage as a normal creature, but most magical effects that don’t cause damage do not affect it.

The hand never provokes attacks of opportunity from opponents. It cannot push through a wall of force or enter an antimagic field, but it suffers the full effect of a prismatic wall or prismatic sphere. The hand makes saving throws as its caster.

Disintegrate or a successful dispel magic destroys it.

Any creature weighing 2,000 pounds or less that tries to push past the hand is slowed to half its normal speed. The hand cannot reduce the speed of a creature weighing more than 2,000 pounds, but it still affects the creature’s attacks.

Directing the spell to a new target is a move action.

Both Forceful Hand and Grasping Hand say that they behave like Interposing Hand, except that they can attack the opponent in certain ways. The question is, how far can they move to do that? Clenched Fist specifically says that it can move up to 60 ft. per round and still attack, but the other spells don't mention a speed limit, and in fact Forceful Hand specifically says:

The forceful hand gets one bull rush attack per round. This attack does not provoke an attack of opportunity. Its Combat Maneuver Bonus for bull rush checks uses your caster level in place of its base attack bonus, with a +8 bonus for its Strength score (27), and a +1 bonus for being Large. The hand always moves with the opponent to push them back as far as possible. It has no movement limit for this purpose. (emphasis added) Directing the spell to a new target is a move action.

So it sounds like an opponent can outrun a Clenched Fist, but not a Forceful Hand. What would you say about outrunning an Interposing or Grasping Hand?

Grand Lodge

What happens if an object that is the target of a Daylight spell is destroyed? Does the spell dissipate, or do the pieces of the object continue to shine?

Grand Lodge

Suppose a wizard wants to pretend to be an Aspis agent. To make his bluff more convincing, can he use Silent Image to create a fake bronze Aspis badge before he approaches his target? Let's assume he's seen enough badges to create a convincing image - can he make the image move with him in a convincing way? I feel like it would take at least enough concentration to negate any bonus he would get, but I'd like to know what other people think.


Grand Lodge

The following situation recently came up in a game:

The PCs are about to fight a wizard. He hears them coming, so he turns invisible and creates an illusion of himself (major image, I think). The cleric PC casts bestow curse and tries to touch the illusion. Does he expend the charge? I know that if he misses he keeps it, but is the illusion real enough that a hit consumes the spell? Does it matter if he makes the save to disbelieve?

The description for mirror image specifically says that hitting an illusion consumes a charge, but that seems to be specific to that spell.

Grand Lodge

I'm working on building a spiritualist, and I'm having trouble with some of the details. For example, I was considering taking Ghoul Touch as a known spell to be delivered by my phantom, but the wording of the spell raised some questions:


Ghoul Touch

Range: touch
Target: living humanoid touched
Duration: 1d6+2 rounds
Saving Throw: Fortitude negates; Spell Resistance yes

Imbuing you with negative energy, this spell allows you to paralyze a single living humanoid for the duration of the spell with a successful melee touch attack.

A paralyzed subject exudes a carrion stench that causes all living creatures (except you) in a 10-foot-radius spread to become sickened (Fortitude negates). A neutralize poison spell removes the effect from a sickened creature, and creatures immune to poison are unaffected by the stench. This is a poison effect.

If I deliver this spell through an ectoplasmic phantom, does it have to make saves to avoid being sickened? Or does it count as "me" for the purposes of being exempt?

Alternatively, is it protected because it isn't a "living creature"? I mean, they're specifically described as being the spirits of the dead. I know that phantoms have the outsider type, and I would normally call outsiders living creatures, but that's true of negative energy elementals as well and I'm hesitant to say they're "alive".

Grand Lodge

Death Ward states that it allows a save against a death effect even if a save wouldn't normally be allowed, such as against Power Word Kill. However, it doesn't seem to say whether the new save is Fort, Ref, or Will. Is there errata on this somewhere? If not, what would people suggest?

Grand Lodge

Ordinarily casters can use cure spells to deal positive energy damage to undead creatures like ghosts. Can an alchemist with the Infusion discovery use cure extracts offensively in this way? Technically the ghost wouldn't be "drinking" the extract, but given that you can pour holy water on a ghost it seems reasonable enough. I could also imagine that the alchemist drinks the extract himself and then uses a melee touch attack to deliver the magic to the target - there are other extracts like Touch of Slime that seem to behave that way. Thoughts?