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Hello All, long time player.

1st Edition questions here.

I'm about to start War for the Crown, was thinking of some sort of Duelist.

Of course there are countless ways and guides to Aldori Dueling.

I also know about Rondolero Dueling, which is Taldor specific.

And I know about Ustalavic Dueling.

Are there any Elven or Dwarven duelists? Any other race or regional specific dueling?

Of course the Swashbuckler does a lot of the same stuff, but they still kind of generalize things.

TL;DR

Whats your coolest/unusual dueling clasee/race combo?

A Bunch of Cool S#it

Thanks bro, I was reading a different guide and it refenced yours but didn't hyperlink it, and for some reason yours doesn't show up on Google, or maybe because I suck at interwebz I just couldn't bring it up when I did. Regardless, thank you, this info is good s#it.

On the HeroLab-specific front (just talking about programming, NOT legality for your game):
1) Under the Background tab, chose a faction from the Guilds section of ISM. (Kintargo Opera House, etc.)
2) Each time you gain fame with your guild, go to the Journal tab and put the earned Fame in Earn Box of the Prestige Award Journals section. Be sure to select your Guild in the dropdown box. Click on the "Earn" button. Add a new journal entry each time.
3) When you reach 5 total earned Fame,...

Thanks, this info is fantastic.

Are there only certain factions that give the esoteric training and eclectic training? I tried with the Arcanarium and it didn't seem to give those options...instead I got like "scholar" and "senior student" and some others, which came with benefits, but not the trainings.

The one I've seen mentioned that DID work was the Kintargo Opera House.

As this character isn't really a bard, I was thinking either previously mentioned Arcanarium or maybe the Acadamae, both for thematic and Golarion geographical reasons.

This character would be for Strange Aeons, which starts in Ustalav and such.

TIA and again for the great advice and discussion!

Hey gang.

I'm a Grognard. I do not internet gud.

Mystic Theurge questions, please be kind.

First, let me say that my Google Fu generally places me on articles that are between 5-15 years old. I'm looking for more updated information and links that work.

Second, yes, it's sub-optimal. I get it, I really really do, I promise. I still want to play one. I have for 15ish years.

Third, I'm building it using all Paizo stuff, no 3rd party. I use HeroLab Classic. I have most books/data packages. Not ALL of them, but a significant amount of them.

1) I thought I read somewhere that a "good" build would have level 9 spells for the "primary" class of the chassis, and lvl 6 spells for the secondary one. How?

2) Many of the online "guides" or "builds" ideas seem to use old info, and seem to talk about Early Entry. I am not looking to overly cheese this build. How does one make up for missing spell levels? I get how with Magical Knack that I can add caster levels to one of the chassis classes, but how do you account for the (in theory) level advances I read about?

3) I don't own the book, but somehow I have the HLClassic "Inner Sea Magic" unlocked. I read about Esoteric Training and Eclectic Training, but I can't seem to find them as options on HLC. Is that because there has been updated FAQs or modified rule changes to the MT PrC?

For design purposes, I am planning on going 3 CLR and 3 WIZ, Human. The party I am in has a tank, a bard, a swashbuckler/investigator, and me. I started life as a weird kind of cleric archetype, and I need to maintain a lot of that original concept.

Hello, it's been a long time since I posted here.

The Hellknight Order of the Vice. It technically no longer exists, there is some brief history about it, but since it's a now defunct Order, therer's very little information on it.

Because of story reasons, my GM is going to allow me to make a Hellknight Signifier that will essentially "revive" the Order.

All the other Orders have a favored weapon or weapons, and MOST of them use some kind of polearm.

My question is: What "vice-like" or flavorful weapon would you suggest for the lost Order of the Vice, soon to face a revival??

My only real idea is some sort of blunt weapon, either a Warhammer or a Maul, maybe a Lucerne Hammer for a polearm?

Any good ideas?

Thanks for all the advice and information.

My goal was to essentially build an unarmored Onna Bugeisha samurai, with some unarmed strike capability.

I like the Warrior Poet Archetype because of the focus on Katana and Naginata as main weapons, allowing for DEX based build.

I was going to take Order of the Cockatrice, because I tend to play face characters, I like the CHA synergy and demoralize mechanics, I like the order adding to damage, and the bonus to hit when you attack a demoralized foe.

Using a 20 point buy, with Half-Elf as race, 16 DEX and 16 CHA are all that's available, with a +2 static to throw into something else.

The problem I'm coming up against is that bonuses to AC are few and far between. I don't really have the luxury of stacking WIS too, and I didn't want to really do more than dip Monk anyhow.

The main focus on this would be to be a Samurai.

Likewise, the party makeup will be a Barbarian, an archery focused Ranger, a Rogue of some sort, A sorcerer, and a Cleric.

Not sure I would need to be a typical "tank" build samurai, with high AC, high HP, and resolve to stand in the front line taking blow after blow. Further, I think the Barb will outdamage this build, and draw the most "agro" from the DM/NPCs.

I like this flowing/unarmored build, but I do worry about the effectiveness in combat and being overshadowed in almost every way.

Awesome, thank you.

What about from the Water Dancer Monk archetype and the Warrior Poet Samurai Archetype?

Hey hivemind.

I have been toying with an idea for a Samurai build.

I intend to take the Warrior Poet archetype. Obviously, this adds CHA to AC as a bonus. This seems to be an untyped bonus. It is an [EX] type of bonus to AC.

I had intended for flavor reasons, as well as to kind of embrace the entire "Eastern" ascetic, to Multiclass into a Monk. A sort of unarmed/armed build, with a lot of flexibility.

I really enjoy the idea of a completely unarmored combatant.

I intend to choose the Order of the Cockatrice. I will have a CHA of 16 or so.

SO, looking at Monk archetypes, I come across the Scaled Fist. This guy ALSO gets his CHA to AC in place of WIS. This is ALSO a seemingly untyped bonus, and is a [SU] ability.

Do they stack?

Now, I've read the FAQ. It's still a bit of a mystery to me.

I was told that the Water Dancer Monk archetype which ALSO gets its CHA to AC as a bonus WOULD stack because the Water Dancer's bonus is listed specifically as a "dodge bonus" instead of an untyped bonus.

Now, my understanding is that untyped bonuses stack.

My understanding is that typed bonuses also stack with untyped bonuses.

What is the official ruling on this, please?

Hey gang.

My Google-fu is lame atm, and I'm having an issue.

The feat Natural Spell states that it allows the verbal and somatic spell requirements when in forms that don't allow for such things.

What if you are in a form that DOES allow for speech?

I'm playing an Elven Treesinger Druid archetype.

If I turn into the base form of Green Man which CAN speak and CAN do somatic gestures because it has hands and fingers, do I NEED to take the Natural Spell feat?

Confused. Help Obi-wan. You're my only hope.

Potions of Nap Stack make resting for 2 hours a much more likely scenario rather than a full 8.

Barricading yourself into a room is also a logical and easy to do step.

Illusion magic at mid to high levels can help.

There are various other types of spells that wizards/arcanists can cast that make small alternate dimensions for resting in, that are easy to hide or difficult to spot.

Hey gang.

I'll be playing an Elven Treesinger Druid.

Yes, I know.

Now, I have always thought Druids were the pet/companion buff masters.

Am I missing something?

What are the go to spells to make your AC (treant sapling in my case) a total bada$$ in combat??

Like, I see just a very select few buff spells.

Please give advice, O Hivemind.

This is genius!

I look forward to your write up.

I think it does help with Palaveen and his insistence on being inducted to the COT in book 1, and why he's SO horny to get there (literally).

I think I love you Draxar.

Thank you for being awesome!

I like swashbuckler goblins and barbarian biter goblins myself...

I too love a Feral Gnasher Barbarian build.

I tooled around with a Feral Gnasher Barb/Winged Marauder-Goblin Fire Bomber Alchemist build.

The idea was to utilize Death From Above feat, Opening Volley Feat, and then essentially dive bombing with fire bombs, leaping off the Dire Bat animal companion, and biting someone in the face and holding on until they are DEAD.

Combined with Brawler for grapple, it was pretty silly.

I've certainly created much higher damage characters, and characters that can grapple/trip with a higher CMB, but none with that much versatility.

And, frankly, the idea was very hilarious to me.

Some BBEG screaming "GET IT OFF ME GET IT OFF ME OMG ITS BITING MY FACE!!!!" while being on fire and running around whacking in the air to stop the Dire Bat just sounded like so much FUN!

Might have an opportunity to drop into a game as a lvl 10 guy.

Party make up is mostly irrelevant, and I've wanted to try one of these guys for a long, long time.

There are tricks, I know.

I've searched here, read Oterisk's most excellent guide, but I am still really looking for a lot more in depth discussion.

Any other good advice please?

Is there a definitive timeline for the events in this AP??

I've been having some difficulty with it exactly, and I was hoping that there was a bit more information or that someone had done the work for me :)

In other words, starting from the time of the Chelaxian Civil War through the Amber Privateers, to the return of Ilnerik, to the Six Trials of Larazod and so on?

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks a ton!

Been tinkering around in Hero Lab with a few different variations of the build.

Option 1 is Slayer 6, Siegebreaker Fighter 2, Slayer 4. This method gets Shield Master at level 6, so starts counting the shield enchantment bonus as a weapon bonus at level 6. Fights with 2 shields and heavy armor, does pretty respectable damage and has a high AC.

Option 2 is Slayer 6, Siegebreaker Fighter 2, Shield Champion Brawler 4. Same shield master at 6, uses a single shield and heavy armor, similar damage, 1 martial flexibility feat to play with.

Option 3 is Siegebreaker Fighter 2, Shield Champion Brawler 10. More expensive, have to pay for weapon and shield enchantments. More versatility from extra brawler levels.

Other options include things like forgetting about the Siegebreaker and Shield Champion archetypes and just going straight up Brawler, Fighter, or Slayer, and just bashing things without worrying about the bull rush and overrun shenanigans. Maybe Slayer 2 for TWF without the Dex requirement, then Fighter or Brawler 10 for the rest?

So many possibilities...

I'm being a bit dense here, but how does a Slayer get Shield Master at lvl 6?

I think one of my favorite characters ever was a Cleric of Pharasma.

This was a neutral Cleric, to a Neutral goddess, and I played that up quite a bit.

I used the feat: Versatile Channeler so that I could choose which version of channel to use.

I actually chose positive, but then could channel negative if needed at a -2 CL.

With that in mind, I then went ahead and chose a PRC that I know most people scoff at, but honestly I loved the flavor and thematically it worked GREAT. I went with Envoy of Balance.

Badass. Suddenly at LVL 10, the character can channel positive AND negative at the same time. Bam.

OF course, a phylactery to boost channel, channel feats to increase DCs and number of times per day, all that.

PLUS, you can choose to cast inflict or cure spells spontaneously.

Lots of fun.

There are plenty of Neutral gods to pick from.

Or you could, you know, be a wizard.

Remember to have all the worst monologues. And have all the other party members inform the rest of the world about how great you are and amazing to follow, but don't ever actually show that.

Have really uncomfortable messianic moments of you riding a sea of worshipping brown people, but keep up pretenses of 'freeing' them as you conscript/rule them.

When people bring up the problems with your plan based on history or a lack of foundation with your birthright, imply mass amounts of dragon fire will solve all of these. Then assure all possible detractors that you'll be different from the OTHER dragon people who ravaged their countryside for centuries.

Use your birthright to justify your claim to rule at every possible moment, but deny any connection to the history of that birthright, because that would be unfair. :(

You are now ready to go forth and 'break the wheel.'

Salty!

But, you are actually hitting the nail on the head for me.

I'm a big proponent of the book series, and have read it multiple times.

I've not watched the TV series that much, but I have seen a bunch of highlights on Youtube and such, I've followed the plot along. I like Emilia Clarke, but the character.

This is Pathfinder. This is for the AP Council of Thieves.

I cannot wrap my head around a build, nor can I wrap my mind around why this character would be in Westcrown in Cheliax trying to fit into the plot.

My first question to the player was "What do you envision your character doing?" and when he couldn't really answer so well, I told him that she basically talks smack and gets raped. It's harsh, but true.

I don't know. I'm really struggling with this, and I hope that the player isn't blowing in the wind on this one.

He mentioned playing a Brood Master Summoner (to have 3 dragons, like Daeny) but man does that nerfbat the crap out of the Eidolon. Normally, I'd be against that, but I know from playing a Summoner that the Eidolon is basically the most dangerous part of the class. My beef with that is that Daeny doesn't cast magic.

There really is no class for her that is Pathfinder oriented, with perhaps the most basic concepts of cavalier, although she doesn't really fight at all.

No, not me you silly nannies.

I have a player wanting to play a Daeny type character for Council of Thieves.

I have a few ideas, but I'd like to see what you folks can come up with.

Assume:

20 point buy
All common races/some uncommon up to 15 RP (player leaning towards Human)
4th Level
Paizo only, no 3rd party and or 3.5

And go!

I like the Chicken/Rooster at 1st level.

Playing a future Bloat Mage wizard, Thassalonian Specialist, and with his CON of 16, max HP at 1st, and his familiar, 12 HP to start is pretty sexy.

Also, it's a black rooster. His "big black c**k". I may be 43 years old, but I still giggle like a 12yo when we say that.

At 7th he'll get an Imp. Game on!

Keep the Feat, imho.

Am I reading Limp lash correctly? If they stay in my range they are going to get owned as long as I make my ranged touch attack? If I miss my ranged touch attack is the spell lost? Do you use this spell much? This spell seems like it could work well with the opponent entangled via your Rime suggestion or even with Web Bolt they can't move.

They have since nerfed Limp Lash horribly because the target just needs to step out of range now.

Until that, it was AMAZEBALLS.

I used my witch to typically cast Ill Omen, then Ray of Enfeeblement, then Limp Lash. They weren't busting out of that at all.

My last few characters have been, in no particular order:

Halfling Witch (Gravewalker) to lvl 3
Lizardman Barb (hurler)/Oracle (Ancestors) to lvl 16
Gnome Sorcerer (Fey) to lvl 12
Tengu Rogue (Swordmaster/Scout) to lvl 17 Mythic 9
Human Wizard (Sin Mage/Thassalonian Specialist) to Level 3
Oread Summoner (Shaitan Binder) to lvl 3
Gnome Wizard (Illusionist)/Veiled Illusionist PRC) to lvl 13

I play in 2 very regular games, and then sometimes in a 3rd if the chance permits. Sometimes we start APs and decide we don't like them, or to take a break, thus the varying low levels.

For me, it's more about the flavor of the character, and what I'm trying to get it to do mechanically. I tend to play a variety of "traditional" and "out of the box" characters.

I've written a novel set in the Pathfinder campaign setting! What should I do with it?

Due to legal concerns, we cannot read unsolicited novel submissions. Please note as well that, due to intellectual property laws, fiction featuring Pathfinder content cannot be sold by any publisher other than Paizo. You can, however, share your Pathfinder story for free through our great fan fiction communities like Pathfinder Chronicler or Wayfinder!

Aha! he says!

Where are these communities?

Please assist with URLs or some other means to visit!

Shrouded Casting.

Wizards LOVE being Sorcerers for 1 school.

I like the spell.

The movement of the sphere is decent, it can jump over things, it can go vertical, lots of movement options.

The wizard can stand still and use his move action to direct the sphere. Then he can use his standard action to cast a different spell.

Reflex saves aren't usually the best save for a cleric or other wizard, so it's a great way to do damage to an enemy spellcaster or healer.

Is it the end all/be all of damage spells?

Nope, but it's useful.

I also like using the spell as a readied action to ram it into an enemy spellcaster, forcing a concentration check.

Well, clearly we already know that 2 wongs won't make a wight.

If I were a 10th Lvl Wizard, I'd leave a note telling them where I was and then teleport away to that location.

I'd do that every day.

Let them walk around to find me, marching, using resources and dying of all the problems that foot soldiers die of on the regular.

Wanna kill me?

Come get me.

Good luck with that.

I think he was looking at doing that whole "Tankard/Rapier" combat style, but for some reason I can't find out that much about it.

I meant he was a Varisian Human, straight Cleric I believe, but open to retraining that.

I like the swashbuckler class dips personally, but am open to other suggestions. We want to try and keep the channeling because he's used that in game, but again, willing to overlook it.

I don't think he's planning on being the stoic steadfast healer guy, nor the divine blasty super caster guy.

Per the header.

Player in CoT AP, he's got a Human Varisian Cleric 1/ Swashbuckler 2, about to ding lvl 4.

20 point buy, typical feat choices.

Allowing him to reroll/retrain to better fit.

I suggested 3 level dip into Swashbuckler, the rest into Cleric.

The party consists of Human Brawler/Hellknight Armiger, a Human Bard, a Tiefling Psychic Sorcerer, and a Human Medium.

NECRO!!!

My players named their team the "Protectors of the Night"!

Their sigil a minted coin/coaster with the full moon, and the traditional crest of Westcrown on the face of the moon, with a crown (reminiscent of the crown of pre-Thrune Cheliax) resting atop it.

They are working on their hero-costumes.

What Jeff isn't telling you is that Dreyvynn has caught the eye of Tarvi, the red-headed Wizard NPC.

Dreyvynn has been instrumental in the game, helping the team come up with their new name, the Protectors of the Night, and their sigil.

Dreyvynn was helping Gorvio with the horses when they encountered Thesing, and has earned the ire of such a noted Opera singer, but Dreyvynn has fueled the fire by writing a parody song that he performs in the various Inns in the Crua and Spera.

I'd encourage Jeff to post it here :) It's quite fun!

Another really fun choice, if you get to be a bad guy, is the Tiefling racial Archetype Fiendish Vessel .

This thing is amazing, you twin channel to heal evil people and harm good people all at the same time.

You get a planar familiar at lvl 3. Imp or Quasit or Cacodaemon. At lvl 3!!

This is also VERY flavorful and fun to play, but you are pretty much super evil.

I'll second the Envoy of Balance PRC.

I know, I know, PRCs typically blow chunks.

This one tho, OMG.

One of my favorite characters is a Human Cleric of Pharasma, Neutral.

Pumped Wis, Cha. 10s in all other stats.

Guided hand feat. Dagger, shield. AC solid.

Versatile Channel feat. Chose to channel Negative as "primary".

Typical "Channel" feats, raise DC, Channel Smite, Extra Channel.

Take PRC at 6th. By 10th, the Twinned Channel power takes effect and from there it's VERY, VERY solid.

Is it the MOST powerful?

Nah, not even close.

But flavorful? Man, its a trip.

Biteface the Goblin.

Biteface is an Unchained Barbarian Feral Gnasher / Alchemist Goblin Firebomber and Winged Marauder.

You could multiclass a 3rd in there, Brawler, say, or something if you wanted.

The idea see, is that Biteface likes to bite people on the face.

But, being a Goblin, he's too short to bite big people on the face.

Thus, he tamed a Dire Bat (named Batty) and learned how to make explodey fire bombs that he could drop while Batty got him into position.

Once in position, Biteface leapt from Batty and fell through the air to land on the persons face and then bite them.

On the face.

With feats like Opening Volley, and then maxing your grapple (Raging Barbarian Grapple even as a Gobbo is pretty chill) and you can be kind of surprising at how much damage you can do this way.

Factor in mutagens and it's even more silly.

I think I had him down at lvl 6 or so, and he was close to +20 on his CMB to remain grappled while doing auto damage by...

Biting you in the face.

He would literally chew people to death.

Biteface and Batty.

Pretty weird.

Yedinci the Illusionist found her way to stave off the Bleaching was to dedicate her life to Sivanah, and take up the way of the Seven Veils.

As a Veiled Illusionist, she could trick anyone almost any time in any place by being someone one day and someone completely different the next.

It's easy to stave off The Bleaching when each day you are someone, and something, different.

Look man.

I don't want to be that guy, but I'm about to.

I disagree with the vast majority of posts that tell other players that they are doing bad wrong fun. I really, really do.

So please understand me that while this sort of silliness might be good for your game, and if your group has fun with it, then please go ahead and do it all day long.

But I don't get it.

I just don't understand.

Who looks at a great sword, or a great axe, or a bastard sword, or whatever enormous piece of weaponry you are wanting to use, and says to themselves "Now then, I wish to use this one handed....because......"

and that's where I draw the line. I cannot fathom that anyone would have an answer for what lies beyond the "because" part.

And yes, I know, anime.

Which is also something I don't get.

I don't mind you young whippersnappers walking on my yard. Too much.

But dagnabbit, get off my lawn!

DOT

Better build than what I came up with, and solid fun :)

I hate to be the BADWRONGFUN guy, but really??

Make a few linguistics rolls. Have some funny misinterpretations. Next level, put a skill point in it, now you speak it, maybe with a funny accent or they can peg you as a non-native speaker.

Otherwise, just go game.

Punishing people for having the skill and trying to be really REAL about language while having flying dragons and damage resistance to swords and axes and fireballs and stuff is only making it harder for some people.

Punishing the spell casters by FORCING them to have to save a spell slot or two on Comprehend Languages or whatever is garbage too.

We are playing Pathfinder ffs, not "how can I make it harder for epic guys who slay dragons to have fits trying to talk to the people that need the dragon slayed".

Now, get off my lawn.

I mirror the Skald suggestion, they are just so much better than a standard Bard and frankly, I'm a Bard enthusiast.

Necro'd with a hearty THANK YOU.

Amazeballs.

Look, I'm all for having a good time and I try hard to not tell someone they are doing things in a "badwrongfun" sort of way...

BUT...

If you take the mauler chicken and don't name your character "The Colonel" I will forever disown you on these forums.

Thanks for the advice, I appreciate it.

Ironically enough, between my first post and this one, the shift did maybe occur to go with Hell's Vengeance and my buddy running that one.

I game a lot, see.

Group A started Hell's Vengeance, but it is kind of flaky and not very reliable. The GM of group A is in the other group B.

Group B is the one finishing up Jade Regent. Group B is the group that is considering Council of Thieves.

Since Group A is very iffy (6 games scheduled, 3 games played, lots of extraneous out of game drama), the suggestion was maybe letting group B play Hells Vengeance and finding something else for group A to do.

Dunno, we'll see what happens. Thanks for the infos!

Probably going to be starting this, and as soon as the "Chel...." got out of my lips, I had like 3 players immediately bonering up to play a Hell Knight.

One of the players has the new book that details the Hell Knights and their orders.

So, is it possible? Can the PCs in CoT either start off as, or end up taking the PRCs for Hell Knights?

Most excellent, and thank you!

My group is about done with Jade Regent, and we have decided this will be the next AP to run.

I get the lucky spot as GM, and will have at least 4, and maybe a 5th player.

I tend to run "as is" and let the chips fall where they may, but I really enjoyed your suggestions on how to change things up.

Bueno, mi amigo and bon travail, mon ami!

Or you could just fireball them.

Google-fu and mad rush designing a character, can someone please advise?

Let's say I'm playing a Rogue Thug archetype.

If I get an Intimidate off on him, and then a Brutal Beating, would the Sickened Condition and the Shaken Condition stack?

Would he cut a deal with a Devil?

Necromancer sounds ripe for a visit from an Imp with an offer he can't refuse.