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If going for natural attacks, going a bloodrager -> Dragon disciple is actually a lot of fun. High base stats, can grab an archetype for SR or consuming spell slots for health. In addition you gain claws (or bigger claws) and well, even better claws as a dragon.

That and a blood-raging dragon is kind of fun.


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Tacticslion wrote:
Tacticslion wrote:

phones: ugh.

Given the great advice you've already recieved, I'll just add one idea: experience its inquisitor focusing on linguistics with the traits and feats to make that happen. Great stuff!

GRRRRR

"Empiricist Investigator" not "experience inquisitor" :/

Sorry: phones.

Oh god, I played that in my last campaign.

I like being able to do more than check the lore on my opponents and occasionally hit one for the damage of a wet noodle (if I hit).

Also my DM hated me, as they should not be allowed in 25 point buy. Just... the skills get out of control real quick. Especially when I dump my feats into skill foci to get those harder to use ones (UMD).

Heck... now I wonder if investigators can use their extra skill rolls on occultist skill checks. Pick up that psychic thing and hypnotize people even sooner.


Lastly if you're medically trained you could just cripple your enemies. Cut off their hands/arms, remove their eyes and tongue, etc.

Permanently prevent them from being a threat without ending them entirely.


Philo Pharynx wrote:

I'd go with a little golden box. When you stare at it, your soul leaves your body and goes into the box. As a roleplaying idea, you could have to pull out the box when you want to make a moral decision.

Or a helmet that has no face - just a mirror.

So, what sort of price did you put on this? Does it work all day?

The helmet reminds me kind of Shadowrun: Hong Kong. Character in that had a plastic face and essentially had the cybernetic equivalent of Mind Blank on himself permanently. His brain was compartmentalized so that if he was ever captured/mind broken into it'd wipe all information regarding his clients and the previous day or so. So he could never rat out his clients.

Back on topic, Do you want negatives on the item? Perhaps as suggested you need the item to make moral choices. Or perhaps you have to carry the item while its in effect or your soul temporarily leaves your body as per magic jar.


If you could find a weapon that functions similar to a final blade (http://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Final_blade) you may be able to kill enemies that way.

Good luck though.


That'd be a pretty powerful item, and the fact anyone could use it means the process would be either dramatic or unusual.

I'd personally go with a spider/scarab that latches onto the forehead for 5-15 minutes blanking the persons mind before detaching and returning back its normal shape and recharges over 23 hours.

Another interesting thing would be a spectral or psychic blade that you (painfully) stab into your forehead for the effect. And the blade reforms slowly.

Third could be something similar to the eye of the void. You look into it, it looks back and causes the effect.

Just having an ordinary item you use periodically as a mundane appearing object seems kinda dull for a level 8 spell once a day for free.


Depends on how in control he is. He could have a job as a doctor, as you see many people suffer in such a field and he could thrive as a surgeon or battlefield medic where he deliberately avoids using any form of painkiller.

There are plenty of ways for someone to thrive off of pain and violence where you aren't the one committing it. Putting yourself into violent situations with effort to both resolve and glorify yourself in them is another way to do so.

Another thing he could do to maintain a good alignment is hunt and torture purely evil creatures. Perhaps someone who hunts vampires, bandits, or otherwise.

Lastly as VRMH said, you could channel your evil for good.


Are you looking for only arcane archers? Inquisitors make pretty good archers that can use all their class abilities in melee if need be + can cast divine spells fairly effectively. Bane is some serious damage coupled with multishot/rapid shot.


Honestly the class that fills this type of playstyle best is an unchained monk with flying kick. Teleporting is a very strong ability and you'll be hard pressed to get it early on. Ninja however might be able to 'mimic' such motions with their incredible mobility while having high damage output.


Wing Storm wrote:

Oh heck. I'm too late.

I was going to suggest a Glory domain Cleric for the Touch of Glory (Sp) power. This gives you a character that can heal and still do cha checks.

Touch of Glory (Sp): You can cause your hand to shimmer with divine radiance, allowing you to touch a creature as a standard action and give it a bonus equal to your cleric level on a single Charisma-based skill check or Charisma ability check. This ability lasts for 1 hour or until the creature touched elects to apply the bonus to a roll. You can use this ability to grant the bonus a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Wisdom modifier.

I was actually going to go a travel domain inquisitor if I went that route and grabbed the Trade subdomain.

Silver-Tongued Haggler (Su): Whenever you make a Bluff, Diplomacy, or Sense Motive check, you can, as a free action, grant yourself a bonus on the roll equal to 1/2 your cleric level (minimum +1). You can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Wisdom modifier.

It subs you inquisitor level for cleric level. But having already played an inquisitor I wanted to avoid that (Also our group lacked a caster)


If you just need to temporarily get rid of them (Remove them so you can get to next area) long duration fears do the trick. I've skipped a number of encounters using the Eye of the Void (Expensive item though) to cone fear lesser enemies into running pretty far away from combat.

Beyond that, your best option is to find things that cause true death. Letting a gravity elemental that's summoned finish off enemies with Crush is a good way, since they effectively cease to exist and might meet the criteria.

I think juju oracles can do it to, trapping souls and dominating the mind. Dominate mind + Prison is a good combo.


Well Thanks for the advice! I went with psychic, grabbed a high int score and went abomination discipline so I also scale off of CHA. Grabbed some books (Book of letters, etc) trait-ed for UMD & Disguise and here in 1-2 levels I'll be hitting 22 Intellect so I'll be grabbing 2 more skill points retroactively.

http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheet.html#id=585946

Skill points are a little spread thin though, but I don't plan to keep raising the knowledge checks.

I opted for skill focus rather than persuasive because our fighter has an unbelievably high intimidate score so I won't need it as much.


Nicos wrote:
Almost All classes can be good party face with the right choice of stats and traits. Besides having good social skill what other stuff do you want to do?

Not sure to be honest, I like being useful out of combat and in combat but not being a heal bot. I prefer well rounded characters that can work well alone as well. Enjoyed unchained monk, inquisitor, & ninja when I played them. Meanwhile I hated sorcerer, rogue, lore oracle, and bloodrager when I tried those.


Just discovered this occult stuff, didn't even know it existed. Mesmerist looks like fun but I'm really liking what I'm seeing in psychic...


Turin the Mad wrote:

Cavalier fits the bill nicely.

Edit: certain sorcerous bloodlines pick up Diplomacy as a class skill. Otherwise, you're eyeballing one of several traits. If traits aren't allowed, your options just shrank by an order of magnitude.

The problem I've always had with sorcerers is they feel like worse versions of wizards. No versatility, 2 skill points a level. And outside of the impossible bloodline they don't come off as that interesting =/


I wont be able to respond for a bit... but I've got to finish making a character today and I have no idea what to go. Currently we have a fighter with 4 CHA and an alchemist with 10 & no cha skills so I'm trying to fill that void.

I know rogues, bards, and paladins can do it well.. but I've never liked sneak attacks, bards, or alignment based classes. What other options are there for a good party face?

Party will be good/chaotic for the most part, there's no firearms, but all archtypes & classes are available outside of summoners and juju oracles. We're starting level three with 25 point buy.

I know there are plenty of classes overall that possibly could, but I feel like I'm missing a few things (Like I heard there was a domain that can be used to be a party face without dumping points into it) and just want to see if there are any other options available to me.


Hey there, I'm trying to build some stuff for a campaign (I'm a player in it, not the DM) but having a hard time understanding finer points of some class effects. If anyone knows the details it'd be nice.

1. Dragon Disciple and Bloodragers. If I go Dragon Dec as a Bloodrager, would it continue the Bloodrager's bloodline or switch to the sorcerer's version?

2. Inquisitor Bane: If I built an inquisitor using a bow with rapid fire & many shot, would the bane effect trigger off every hit in a single round & still only consume one charge? I ask because the potential damage at level 7 is something like 8d6+8 from the Bane alone.

3. If you could Gestalt a prestige class, but not regular classes, what are some good combos one could think of?

4. If you multiclass from Inquisitor to Cleric, how do the domains scale? They scale together but would the cleric get the bonus spells as soon as they're capable of casting them?

5. Do Juju zombies keep the skills of the person raised? From what I can read its pretty vague, for balance sake I'm going to assume no, but I'm still unsure.

6. Is there an easy guide on how controlling/raising undead minions work? On the aforementioned juju zombie, I've considered making a juju oracle but have no idea how zombies/controlling them functions.

7. This one is random, but if I'm playing a monk and there is a regular sized explosive robot rat attacking: what is the type of check I'd make to punt it into an enemy?


Currently starting a new character in a lengthy campaign. It has a few wierd rules so I'm trying to fit the party & fit the rules but its a little quirky. Just need some general advice / ideas if anyone has any on character functionality (Lore/background are already set).

Currently, there are three primary rulesets different than normal. For one, you can gestalt... but only prestige classes. Second, everyone has the option of a DM approved 3.5 flaw for a bonus feat. Third, the races are locked to two (well, one but m/f are vastly different) different pre-mades.

Currently, the party is a Fighter with 4 CHA (But a 'very' high intimidate), and an alchemist that has no diplomacy/bluff/etc. So I'm trying to make sure I can be a party face.

Racials: (Note, these are pretty strong since we're monstrous).
+2 Dex, +2 Int, +2 WIS, +2 Stealth, +10ft Movement, +1 Nat AC, +1 Dodge AC (+2 vs Ranged), Cannot Use Firearms --- Lastly player May act as though he has the Parting Shot feat a number of time per day equal to 1 + Dex Mod, minimum once, even if he does not meet the prerequisites. If he already has the Parting Shot feat, he may make an additional attack at his highest attack bonus.

So far I was contemplating going a ranged inquisitor, using the extra feat + well rounded racials to use rapidfire + manyshot with bane reliable high ranged DPS. However given how different it is with the gestalt rules I'm having trouble making things work. was contemplating Gestalting Assassin later on, or Wayfinder.

Another alternative would be to go bloodrager and gestalt dragon disciple. I feel like my DM might hate me for doing that though.


Currently I'm in a campaign where you can gestalt prestige classes, however the DM is finding its much more difficult to make this work nicely for a caster than it is a martial or hybrid class. (Note, you can't gestalt double classes like arcane archer).

Because of this, we're trying to make an edited version of Dragon Disciple for our sorcerer that isn't a dragon, but rather fits another bloodline. To do so, we're trying to find creatures we could replace 'Form of a Dragon' with that are equivalent in strength.

Is anyone familiar enough with the bestiary to know of something we can use?


Thanks for the tips, went ahead and forwarded the advice! We're a tad worried cause the female gnoll (new pathfinder player) wants to make a 2 handed archtype fighter that plays the 'angry sister' role. (In the storyline, all the players are brothers/sisters and they have a matriarch that is level 12.)

So far it seems we got male gnoll wizard, female gnoll fighter, male gnoll unchained monk (me), and one male gnoll unknown.


So there are some homebrew things in this campaign: I don't DM myself but I'm usually pretty good at keeping things balanced so I'm helping him with design and the like.

Currently, in the setting everyone is 1 race in the party, a custom race that has different stats based on gender. Only one person is female and I believe the other 3 are male. Wwanted to get a comparison on their strengths to one another. Keep in mind htese races 'are' supposed to be a bit overpowered, so only comparing their strengths to one another.

Male:

Size: Medium
Speed: 40 feet
Racial Stats: +2 Dex, +2 Int, +2 WIS
Lanky: Male Gnolls gain a +2 Racial bonus to Stealth, and it is always considered a class skill.
Thick Hide: Male Gnolls gain a +1 Natural Armor bonus to AC.
Hunter: Male Gnolls gain a +2 bonus to attack and damage against creatures with the Animal type, and Survival is always considered a class skill.
Evasive: Male Gnolls gain a +1 Dodge bonus to AC and an additional +1 Dodge bonus to AC against ranged attacks.
Claws: Male Gnolls have two Claws natural weapons that deal 1d4 damage each.
Run Away!: Once per day, a Male Gnoll may act as though he has the Parting Shot feat, even if he does not meet the prerequisites. If he already has the Parting Shot feat, he may make an additional attack at his highest attack bonus.
The Old Ways: Gnolls cannot gain Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Firearms. Gnolls are treated as being proficient in all Martial weapons and Light armor, and once per day may ignore spell failure chance for Light armor.

Female:

Size: Large
Speed: 30 feet
Racial Stats: +4 STR, +2 CON, +2 WIS, -4 CHA
Massive: Female Gnolls cannot wear heavy armor of any kind. Additionally, Female Gnolls gain a +4 to Intimidate, and Intimidate is always a class skill.
Thick Hide: Female Gnolls gain a +3 Natural Armor bonus to AC.
Matriarch: Once per round, a Female Gnoll may, as an immediate action, grant one Teamwork feat to up to four Gnolls within thirty feet. Multiple uses of this ability do not stack, and only count the most recent use.
Claws: Female Gnolls have two Claws natural weapons that deal 1d6 damage each.
Dominant: When interacting with Male Gnolls, Female Gnolls gain a +5 Racial bonus to Charisma-based skills and a +2 bonus to the DC of mind-affecting spells.
The Old Ways: Gnolls cannot gain Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Firearms. Gnolls are treated as being proficient in all Martial weapons and Light armor, and once per day ignore spell failure chance for Light armor.

We want to keep it somewhat flexible for all classes on males, females can be a bit more polarized.


Weirdo wrote:

What's the rest of your party look like? Aside from the race being rather more powerful than usual (and I assume that's not unique to your character) it doesn't look too strong. There's a bit of Nova potential from Spell Storing + Channel Smite but with your current Cha you can channel once per day and pretty much anything will make the save for half. And vicious is a two-edged sword.

I'd watch your Deeper Darkness. Unless other party members can also see in it it'll likely get in their way.

If you can justify it IC, crafting more items for other party members than yourself will help even out the power.

The deeper darkness is for myself, part of the C/N roleplay. In a fight I know enemies can't escape I'd use it and be a one-man army. In addition our paladin is a walking light source so if the party is near them they could see.

Party consists of a fighter on a horse (Trip spam), the paladin/vitalist/cleric, a psion, and a magus


Weirdo wrote:
Charisma looks low if you're planning on actually using your channeling much. When you say you're mostly planning on using it for Channeling Strikes, do you mean Channel Smite? Remember there's still a Charisma-based Will save for half damage, plus Cha adds to your uses per day. I'd either not bother with Channel Smite or lower your Str to buy some extra Cha and take...

I didn't think about the CHA, Right now http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=1112389 is what I have (Keep in mind its partially complete and I had reworked the page from something else so some numbers might be wrong).

I still kind of want to go channel smite for the sole ground of it allowing me to use channeling (Can't use it AoE without selective channeling). I've also considered using an alternate channel since my DM said my use of spellstoring & channeling strike on a vicious weapon was a little to much damage compared to rest of the party (Me and the psionic understand the game much better than the other three, so our characters carry every encounter and out of game encounter which makes it hard for the DM to balance).

I was using a Ransuer as my weapon simply because a previous iteration had that as a favored weapon, but since we reworked the race to be less powerful & now have all martial proficiency I may change that. It'd also make me feel like I don't need to cherry pick a reach weapon god so I don't lose a feat.

The race is normal sized, and I could get a +2 cha Ioun stone with a little bit of strength budgeted into CHA.

I (thankfully) don't need to be the party face and really don't need to be the party anything since we've got a good range of classes. I still grab perception because... perception, as well as sense motive since most of the team don't use it. There isn't a crafter yet so went that route.


DM_Blake wrote:
That said, I just might, maybe, rescind my rejection and allow this character if you present it to every player and ask them how they feel about you running this travesty. If they're ALL good with it, with no objections or reservations, then I'd allow the character.

I did get permission from every person but one so far, including the GM. The role of the character 'is' to be chaotic (which I discussed with the DM). My character isn't outwardly evil, he's smart enough to know randomly killing someone pointlessly is a stupid thing to do and would piss off the party. However, he isn't above doing the more cruel acts to fix a problem (Mind reading/controlling someone for information). He also wouldn't care about the semantics of using an unholy weapon to fight a lawful creature that is opposing.

In the setting, there are lawful good/lawful neutral enemies that are being manipulated or controlled. I did in an earlier part of the campaign (levels 3-5) play a lawful evil that butted heads with the paladin often. Primarily my character was there for revenge, and he was introduced in a prison break. Afterwards he left before the paladin could bring it to a fight once the prison break was finished.

In this case, the character 'is' sane, when you consider both. He will purposefully instigate questions of morality, and/or mock a players choices he thinks are either self-depreciating or foolish in the end. He will also possibly collaborate greatly with the psionic in the group who is obsessed with forbidden knowledge (Same goal, different methods). But, in the end he isn't above breaking minds, breaking skulls, and sowing chaos for the express purpose of solving what he either deems a problem or getting what he wants. Especially since his more primal 'desires' or comments are expressed by the insane head despite what he says. For example, "I recommend we go to the artifact rather than defend the city (Yes The artifact! Power, much power! It must be ours, we will use it to crush our foes! Cruuuush!)"

I'm not expecting an easy roleplay, which is precisely why I want to play this character. I get bored with lawful dumb, and the DM knows this by how badly my RPing (And others, as only half the group can RP much at all) tanks when it becomes 'simple'.

My primary questions by bringing the topic up are mostly the optimizations of the character (Feat recommendations, etc). I may have named it incorrectly though x3

EDIT: To add, the double god thing is not for cherry picking domains. Both domains I'm considering using (Void & Madness) are in the one god. However given how similar they are I was considering using Void & Magic or Madness & Magic.


Thanks for all the feedback, I don't intend to actually make it a loot-mongering monster (As the one person commented) but a person who studies magic to create artifacts of power as well as studying those found. In addition I changed the god worshipped to Groetus from Azanoth, a little less evil and a little more 'mad'.

In terms of 'playing my alignment' I wouldn't be directly evil, however when fighting an enemy I'd be less lightly to show mercy when someone attacked, and would be outright disruptive in a fight. (Example: Void domain, part the veil. Smart head would cast something like inflict wounds, then the crazy head would shout 'Open your mind to emptiness!' and cause the part the veil effect.). Imagine the crazy head as more a crazy commentary on everything, and also providing a 'reality check' to when someone in the party says something borderline crazy themselves and it gets all excited about it.

Further example: Last session a neutral psionic got angry and started spewing spewing for the party to spare none of the enemy, at this point the crazy head would exclaim (excitedly) to murder them all while the sane head would critique their warped sense of morality.

On a secondary question: How is the ability score choices and such?


rorek55 wrote:

1-no. Paladins do not have to be murder hobos. Same as with undead, being undead doesn't make you evil (intelligent ones at least) hell there's a mythic class based around being an undead good guy.

2-also no. A paladin (especially one of sarenrea) would indeed offer the devil/demon the chance.

3-wrong he has violated no such thing.

I feel sorry for anyone playing in your games as a paladin as lawful stupid is forced on them.

That being said, I would warn against this idea whole heartedly, it will end in a fight.

How so? The character itself isn't inherently evil (Chaotic neutral). He has the goal of gaining power through creation & forging & magical artifacts (Sane head) or through madness, insanity, mindlessness, and The Void (Insane head). They're both the same person but separate at the same time. The paladin is in fact married to someone who relentlessly pursues knowledge as a true neutral, so she may keep him in line.


MeanMutton wrote:
Antermosiph wrote:

I only plan to use negative energy in the form of channeling strikes, and negative energy isn't inherently evil. Also the threat the party is facing has global implications and leads to unsavory alliances (Had a lawful evil in the party at one point).

Plus our paladin is so kindhearted he spared a demons life when it asked nicely to be banished back to its realm.

1 - Rationalize it how you want, negative energy is the very substance that fuels undeath and is a key power of the clerics of all the gods of evil, a paladin that is okay with it isn't long for being a paladin.

2 - The line that the paladin walks is a narrow. They don't get moral gray areas - it doesn't matter the greater good, paladins don't truck with evil. Period. No gray area.
3 - Your paladin should be an ex-paladin right now. He/she has clearly violated his/her oaths in allowing a being of pure evil to return to a realm of pure evil.

At best, you're looking for a character that will blend in while the other players ignore their character's beliefs in order to metagame their way through. At best, you're looking for a character that will clash with the others.

In our setting gods don't have as 'direct' an influence on the world as base pathfinder. In addition most of the strict class rulings are exempt (He's a hybrid of a cleric, a vitalist, a paladin, and something else) and worships a god of mercy. Demons are also capable of being neutral in extreme circumstances in our setting.

But that aside, the character is chaotic/neutral and not chaotic/evil and uses no undead creation abilities. The negative energy stems from the psycho head, while the other head is more level-headed and is the reason it isn't a chaotic evil entity. I'm trying to build the character to being able to kill the enemy, use powers of madness, but not deliberately be completely mindless about destruction. One half is, the other half is guiding that power.


I only plan to use negative energy in the form of channeling strikes, and negative energy isn't inherently evil. Also the threat the party is facing has global implications and leads to unsavory alliances (Had a lawful evil in the party at one point).

Plus our paladin is so kindhearted he spared a demons life when it asked nicely to be banished back to its realm.


For starters, going a reach/bad touch cleric. Its 25 point buy & I'm a negative energy cleric. Its starting at level 10 (My previous character left the party so I'm switching) and is using a custom made race.

The homebrew aspects of it is that the character has two heads, and as such is worshipping two gods. For flavor one is Nethys and the other is Azathoth (One head is pretty much completely insane).

Race stats open up some options, they get martial weapon proficiency regardless of class, can See in Darkness, and have ability scores of 2/-2/4/0/2/-2

I was looking at taking the madness domain for sure, but I'm unsure on a second domain (Magic looks fun for dispelling punch if I get domain strike). Right now I have my ability scores (with bonuses from leveling and race) as 18/12/18/12/18/7 & I can precraft magic weapons & wonderous items due to working to be the party's crafter.

Are there any tips on what I have so far? Don't want to go 'to' evil since my party is mostly lawful good & has a paladin, new party member is there on recommendation from old.


claudekennilol wrote:

Almost. A spiked gauntlet is an armed attack. If you were using an unarmed attack then it would be a legit combo. But since it's armed you can't use Domain Strike with it.

Also this belongs in the rules forum, not the advice forum.

I remember reading up some debates on it, the spiked gauntlet is considered an armed attack just like having improved unarmed strike is considered an armed attack. However it is still considered an 'unarmed strike' for purposes of feats and everything else. But since its not using a monk weapon or close quarters weapon it can't be used with flurry of blows or brawler's flurry. In addition it'd be separate from other unarmed strike buffing enchantments (Amulet of mighty blows.)

If it turns out that I am incorrect in this, could I do the same combo utilizing a regular gauntlet that has been enchanted with spellstoring?

Edit: Oops, sorry about the wrong forum. I didn't even see that as one of the forums to choose from so I thought it might be something of advice.


Sweet, in addition I believe I can enchant both gauntlets separately with spell-storing & use either when making the punch correct?

Unleashing a stored spell is a free action, domain strike is a swift action. Voices of madness might have my DM banning it from being used with domain strike however.


Since I got a little feedback on it, I wanted to doublecheck if this is something I could do.

At start of round, I am wielding a Ranseur (Reach weapon) that I am using for AoOs. Someone has stepped into adjacent of me and attacked me in the previous round.

To retaliate, I take my right hand off my weapon (Free action), and punch him in the face with my fist as a standard action.

This fist is currently covered by a spiked gauntlet & said gauntlet has spellstoring. In addition I am a cleric of the madness domain at level 10.

Upon striking the enemy with the punch, I unleash the domain power 'Voices of Madness' via domain strike as a swift action, selecting 'skills' and lowering their saves & attack by 5 while increasing all skills by 5. Then, as a free action I release blindness and/or bestow curse that was stored inside of the gauntlet. Then I put my hand back on the Ranseur and take a five foot step back.

Is this a legitimate combo?


Chess Pwn wrote:
2) domain strike only works with unarmed strikes, no stored spell in a weapon with this one.

I enchanted a spiked gauntlet with spellstoring, which is still considered an unarmed strike (but armed at the same time so not usable with flurry of blows which doesn't apply to me).


Anyone for any of them? :<


Yea, there are other spells as well. Can put cure severe wounds into armor and tell your allies to touch you in combat if they need healing and you can't on your turn. There's also inflict wounds and other touch range spells that are nice for it.

Depending on GM rulings extended murderous command is good for it as well.


I personally love spellstoring & Comfort for heavy armor. Nothing like putting bestow curse or blindness into a spellstored armor.

Comfort just means you never have to remove heavy armor, which is convenient for extended campaigns/dungeons.


So I'm currently building a cleric and I'm primarily using a touch/reach cleric using spell storing (My character is entering at level 10).

I normally play casters so I've never actually worked with AoOs or most martial combat, so some of the things I'm trying to do I have no idea whether they work.

1. With Channel Strike, it says it is a swift action: Can I do this on an AoO?
2. Domain Strike is a swift action, unleashing a stored spell in a weapon on contact is a free action. Can I choose which order they occur and if not which occurs first?
3. How many swift actions can you take a round? I'm assuming one but want to be sure.
4. The spell murderous command has no duration, but implies a one round duration. If I used the extend metamagic feat on it via magical lineage would it be considered a 2 round duration spell?
5. The item 'Eye of the Void' is odd, do I have to make the save as well when I use it? Could I in theory have it somehow built into a piece of armor/a weapon or hanging in sight on my person and still activate it?
6. Is there any particular reason to raise spellcraft if we have a psionic in the party?
7. Lastly, does the item Stormlure affect bullets?


Currently homebrewing a race for PC characters: bit higher bonuses than regular races. However, the race has two heads (Each with its own personality) and I'm having a huge time thinking of a racial bonus that makes sense with it. So far I have:

+4 concentration checks (Harder to inturrupt two heads from a spell cast).
+2 Will saves (Same as before only with willpower)
Roll every round to act normally during a compulsion (Battle for control between heads)

Are there any others folks can think of? The race will primarily comprise of clerics, fighter classes, and the tougher classes.


Enemies similar to starcraft 2 immortals are good if they have that sort of effect. Where any damage taken exceeding X are reduced to only dealing X damage. This promotes 'death by papercut' style of killing those enemies.


SmiloDan wrote:

OK, are you going for battlefield control? Buffing? Pure damage? De-buffing?

I once played a druid that used Improved Counterspell to trade prepared flame strikes to cancel out opposing fireballs and lightning bolts. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure light wound wands. ;-)

If you are a summoning cleric, I bet you would really annoy opposing healers by countering cure spells with your prepared summons. Maybe not super effective, but fun and annoying.

By the way, a two-headed ogre sounds super awesome and fun!!! I love that they bicker about their different deities. :-D

Counterspell? I"d have to look into that! I'm most likely going to go a reach build, possibly increase my size with a spell & use combat reflexes. With the mixture of domains I was considering Catastrophe & (Void i think?) Subdomain. This way if I can't get in range (Ogre race we made has 20ft movement) I can summon something each round I'm out of range. Exact 'racials' of the race are:

See in Darkness
Medium Sized
20ft Movement Speed
+2/-2/+4/-2/+2/-2
Dual-Minded: Members of this race gain a +2 bonus on all Will saving throws.
Fiendish Resistance: Members of this race gain cold resistance 5, electricity resistance 5, and fire resistance 5.
Natural Armor + Improved Natural Armor: +2 Natural AC
Hard to Inturrupt Two Heads: +5 to Concentration Checks (Homebrewed)

Its also 25 point buy, but the GM said he'd prefer it if I kept the ogre thematic with a low CHA/DEX so it makes sense.

EDIT: Redid ability scores, after adding level 4 & 8 scores its now 18/12/18/10/18/7 Would this be better for a reach debuffing/summoning cleric?


SmiloDan wrote:
If you want to be an "annoying" cleric, you could be a reach cleric that uses your AoOs to sunder or trip (but check to make sure that's a legal use of an AoO). You might want to use your bonus feats to get Teamwork feats, and position yourself in combat to grant flanking bonuses to your allies--and yourself.

I would do that, but the fighter we have literally specced into cavalier, rides a horse, and does nothing but trip people en-mass. Our other three people are a paladin/vitalist/cleric/something else pure healer, a psionic with something like 26 intellect, and a magus. Both magus and psionic are pure damage builds.


Sorry for the delay: I was looking at playing a more disruptive cleric. One that relies on spellstoring weapons, powers, and summons to overall be an annoyance. The character's background mostly prevents unarmed combat so the one bad touch cleric build I reviewed seemed difficult to recreate.

I don't need to be damage (everyone in party is that) and the group has two healers already so I'd most likely end up being negative energy for purposes of inflict spells.

Domain wise, one is free but the other one I have to choose dark tapestry due to how the character's lore is set up. So overall alot of mind altering effects or severe debuffs. AoE is a plus given most combat situations have 10+ enemies. Most of these are humanoids or constructs.

Overall the character is a stark contrast from the party. A low intelligence two headed ogre where each head worships a separate god (and they argue with one another) allowing me to pick one domain from each god, which is GM allowed. Dark tapestry is a must because the one head is chaotic evil & personality wise it fits best (other one is chaotic good). Given the incredibly high strength I start with I figured use a 2h weapon would be preferable, but even reviewing the bad touch build I'm not apt to really design it perfectly. I was considering using spiked gauntlets with spellstoring + 2h weapon with spellstoring and when things get hairy can have blindness in the gauntlets to punch someone (If this is even possible).


So, not sure exactly where to ask this on the forums, figured this is the best place.

I'm currently making a level 10 cleric for a campaign that is homebrewed a bit different than a regular cleric. It cannot channel energy or cast ranged touch spells, but instead has full BAB & one bonus feat at 1st, 5th, 10th, 15th, and 20th levels. In addition my ability scores are 16/8/20/8/18/8 (With 2 points to spend).

I'm very unused to playing divine spell casters, especially one like this. I was considering going a dark tapestry & catastrophe domain combo with spell-storing weapons.

Any tips or ideas to capitalize on this template?


1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.

I've been working at making a steel hound investigator for a campaign I'm in, but one of the aspects of it is described as followed:

d20pfsrd wrote:

Shot in the Dark (Ex)

At 4th level, a steel hound gains the following deed. This deed works and interacts with grit the same way as gunslinger deeds, but only the steel hound can use it. If the steel hound also has levels in gunslinger, he can spend grit points from that class to use this deed.

The problem is I can't find out what it actually does or find that deed on the gunslinger page.

I'm a little tired and still a bit new to DnD, where can I find out what it actually does?


So, for my campaign my DM is letting me change characters (previously one was lawful evil in a neutral good party and we went seperate ways). For the new character we realized we could have a little fun with a lawful good character that wields a blade that has a forgotten god trapped within it. The blade would be based on pride and gain in power the more powerful the wielder while simultaneously draining their willpower.

Anyways, I've been making a number of effects to them. Things that aren't specified I haven't gone over with the DM. We're trying to balance the penalties with the strengths while keeping it still a dangerous thing to have in a party. At the moment we're considering it cause the wielder to become mind controlled at 0 hit points instead of unconscious, but not entirely. In our setting of note gods are not as powerful as in the normal pathfinder world.

Anywho - here is what we have so far:

1) The blade marks its wielder, upon being marked the target will be warped over a course of 72 hours. If at any point the wielder loses contact with the sword for 24 hours (which delays the 72 hour period until retrieved) this process is required to start over and the individual is no longer marked. Only one person can be marked at a time. The marked individual will have its entire body warped by being controlled by sword, changing its racial traits and stats. It loses all racial abilities and changes its ability scores to 4/2/2/0/-2/0 Any feats or skills it had gained from being of that race remain.

2) The marked owner of the sword, upon death, is doomed to wander inside the sword with the nightmare housed. Due to this the wielder can never be resurrected, reanimated, or saved from the sword. This occurs even if the sword is lost from possession. Resurrection is not possible even through a deity unless the deity has possession of the sword and simultaneously releases the being trapped inside.

3) Upon touching the blade, A lawful good person must make a will DC 10 save or be manipulated by the blade. This save increases by 5 and must be made again for every 4 hours the sword is in their possession. The individual does not have to be marked for this to occur and the influence of the blade will magnify their strongest trait among one of the following - Chaos, Pride, Doubt, Sorrow, Anger, Hatred - This save DC is increased by 10 for every alignment step beyond good, and by 5 for every alighnment beyond lawful, becoming a DC 40 for a chaotic evil to resist. The person realizes what is if they pass the save, and gain immunity for 24 hours on a natural 20.(For lore purposes the wielder of this sword is somewhat immune to this affect. She was a monk & spent most of her life in training to guard to blade only to become its wielder when the seal cracked)

4) Anyone wielding the sword suffers from violent hallucinations, these hallucinations can oftentimes be memories, horrors, or terrors. These are purely visual and have no affect on a blind individual. The sword will also whisper telepathically to the wielder, and other people within 40 yards rarely. This usually occurs in combat.

5.) If the wielder of sword is a living being, it can no longer be healed by positive energy. If the wielder is chaotic evil, it is hurt by positive energy, healed by negative energy and suffers -2 to all saves against lawful or good effects. If the wielder is any other alignment it is considered one step towards chaotic evil for purposes of alignment based effects. This only occurs if the weapon is held.

6.) When entering combat, the wielder of this weapon must make a DC20 will save or be driven by violence to use the sword. If failed, the wielder also gains +4 initiative. This save must be made again after 10 turns to draw the sword. Once it is drawn it cannot be sheathed or disarmed until combat ends.

7.) If marked by the sword, the immunity to positive energy is permanent. They are simultaneously immune to negative energy unless chaotic evil, which then they are healed by it.

8.) The blade is treated as a normal Katana in combat, but cannot be sundered or disarmed. The blade is considered an evil weapon in combat, dealing 1d8 bonus damage against good targets. When striking evil targets the blade instead can easily penetrate their minds and find weak points in their movements granting it a crit range of 18-20. This does not stack with any other crit range increasing affects.

9.) The blade cannot be enchanted, but is considered masterwork and increases in power with the strength of its wielder. It gains +1 enhancement bonus per 4 HD of the wielder. At level 4 the blade additionally gives +1 AC to natural armor. At level 8 the blade heals its wielder for one hit point anytime it deals damage. At level 12 the blade deals an additional 1d4 fire, acid, ice, and lightning damage simultaneously. At level 16 the blade grants the wielder a permanent 20% concealment stacking with other concealment affects and heals for 3 hit points anytime it deals damage. At level 20 the blade allows the wielder to devour souls, causing every critical strike to make the target make a DC20 will/fortitude save (Whichever is lower) or die and be doomed to as if they were marked.

10.) The blade drinks and heals its wielder based on the emotions around them. For each powerful emotion not caused by the wielder within 120 feet the wielder will gain 1 fast healing for the duration. This includes effects based on the previously listed emotions. Fear spells, Barbarian rage, or story elements based on GM discretion can trigger this.


Kysune wrote:

IMO, Assassinate is where it's at. If you were ever to reach 20th lvl that's a 10 + 10 (1/2 Ninja lvl) + 5 (assuming 20 Charisma) = DC 25 fortitude save or die. If the person saves, you have an insane stealth check, fast movement, wall climbing, walking thru walls, air walk, hidden master, clones, mirror image, and a few other tricks to escape and try again tomorrow. Albeit a little cheap, but that's what Ninjas do. They track their enemy down and strike when they are weak, and getting captured is not an option.

Also, if your Race has a favored class bonus that allows you to get 1/6th of a Rogue Talent. You can start taking it at 4th level and by 10th level you get a free Rogue Talent and at 10th level can choose from the list of Advanced Talents. I'm doing this with my Ninja and getting Invisible Blade and Evasion at 10th level.

When you talk about dipping into scout what do you mean exactly? Is scout an archtype for another class?

I'm considering the build you mentions (scout/ninja) since it seems to perfectly fit what I'm looking for.


blackbloodtroll wrote:

Slayers can get Ninja Tricks.

Stygian Slayer can go full invisibility(not Vanish).

I highly suggest Slayer over Ninja, for better hit points, saves, and versatility.

Still, above that, I suggest Urban Barbarian.

Hrm, Slayer does seem more versatile. However if our campaign hits level 20 ninja final ability coupled with light step and walking through walls seems very excessive at making anything die. Seriously just reading it I don't know how anyone could combat that unless they already saw it coming.


Kysune wrote:

Honestly, just go straight Ninja. Seems like you're trying to game the system with multiclassing a bunch. Ninjas are fine by themselves, don't use magic, wear light or no armor, and have lots of skills. I currently have a level 4 Half-Orc Ninja, (16str, 14dex) that focuses on 2handing a katana. Took "Wall Climber" and "Vanishing Trick" for my two Ninja Tricks are I've been having a lot of fun with my character. I've done upwards of 26-34dmg on a single attack with a crit and I'm able to vanish at will or climb practically anything (except glass or similarly smooth surface) to get where I want, when I want. This character is played in PFS and I've not felt lacking one bit so far, I know things do change a bit after lvl 8 for Rogues in general though.

Human is a solid choice, Ninjas have access to some monk'ish weapons or you can take a Ninja Trick for unarmed combat. You'd have a high bluff with a 14Cha, and most likely a 12Wis so your Sense Motive and Perception aren't horrible, plus they are both class skills.

EDIT: Getting Sneak Attack is pretty easy also. Ninja CAN LEGALLY be combined with the Scout archetype, anyone that says otherwise glances at the Ninja/Cavalier text and draws conclusions before actually trying to understand what it's really saying. So as a Ninja/Scout, you can Vanish and Sneak Attack, flank and Sneak Attack, Charge and Sneak Attack, move 10' and Sneak Attack (Combine with Spring Attack for hit/run tactics). Only issues you run into are Swarms, Constructs, and other other rare cases. The Charge Ki shuriken trick helps deal with swarms though.

That does sound like a lot of fun! There are a good number of constructs this campaign (One boss we fought was a construct with near 400 health) but I think I could try something like that. Our rogue just got kicked from the group for constant afking so it'd also fill the niche we need.

Do you think it'd be possible to use a reach weapon as a ninja? I'm still new to DnD (but not new to gaming in general) so I'm unsure of the specifics on sneak attacking.


yazo wrote:

Play a Slayer, Good skills, Studied target, Sneak Attack, and rogue talents, and ranger combat style, use the 2 Handed combat style.

Str: 16
Dex: 14
Con: 14
Int: 12
Wis: 12
Cha: 11

Never really looked into that class, That does seem like fun to play. My only qualm is that it is light armor. Think there'd be a way to build it without armor at all? Going for a character thematically similar to Sara from samurai champloo.

So far though slayer looks like exactly what I was looking for since I can't use styles. if I could use styles (May try to convince DM again) would you still recommend slayer?


blackbloodtroll wrote:

What about the Urban Barbarian's Controlled Rage?

What is the point buy?

What races are allowed?

What does your DM mean about "weapons equipped"?

What skills are looking to be good at?

All content is available minus third party, some third party can be used if I can sweet talk the DM.

25 Point buy

All races, but planning to go human

No weapons. Maybe some monk weapons.

Sense Motive, Perception, Bluff

...also for some reason I can't respond to things. Made an entire new account just so I could get responding to work.