Did you also learn it can suck for PCs to miss out on party buffs like Haste due to their spell resistance? :D
(Or since you're all drow do all the party casters just have Spell Penetration anyway)
Did you also learn it can suck for PCs to miss out on party buffs like Haste due to their spell resistance? :D
(Or since you're all drow do all the party casters just have Spell Penetration anyway)
Not yet.
Last game's battle more or less had us all fighting hounds of Tindalos one-on-one. As a bard, my power grows with each ally I have handy, so I quickly dimension doored into my sister's room to help her fight her bad dog, but since none of us really trusts each other and we're all pretty violent, there actually hasn't been a lot of this silly namby-pamby "let's help each other with spells" yet.
Although my spell resistance DID kick in after Alistriyx (or whoever was running the show in my body while I was possessed—hard to tell) started killing my sister's handmaidens, in that it prevented me from being hurt by her cone of cold or boneshatter spell or whatever it was she tried in vain to use on me.
Creative Director
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A bit of a more serious, game related question ...
Is any of this giving any insight into the good and the bad of higher level play that might translate into future rules, most notably Epic rules? Are there plans to try these characters out at closer to levels 18 - 20?
The purpose of this game is mostly so folks can get some experience at how high level play works. It makes no sense to jump headlong into epic rules if the high level rules need more adjustment and work or whatever, or before we're all nice and familiar with how high level play works.
Actually, the trickiest part is that since we all jumped in at 13th level, we don't have the benefit of 12 prior levels of familiarity with our own characters or each other's tactics. That's more disruptive to smooth play, I think, than any level of rules complexity.
I believe Sean's plan is to level us up fast for a few levels and then settle into "normal" leveling, though. This is as much for fun as it is for work, after all.
I have a question for the players:
How do your expectations of how high-level play would go compare with how it is actually playing out?
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Creative Director
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I have a question for the players:
How do your expectations of how high-level play would go compare with how it is actually playing out?
I've actually played in a LOT of high-level games, so I'm probably the wrong person to ask... but there's a lot of character sheet searching and pauses for math calculations, for the most part. There's also a LOT of side-chatter, but I don't think that's as much a problem with high level play as it is with chatty players (YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE!).
I suspect that had we reached this level organically from 1st level, the character sheet searching and tactics decisions would go a lot faster—that's how I've seen it work on other long-running campaigns that ended up reaching 20th level seem to do, at least...
But despite that, the game's quite fun!
Mmmmm, Starbucks Dark Cherry Mocha...
No, no, no. Must...stick...to...skinny...vanilla...latte...HAH HAH!!! Sound like me!
But at least the skinny lattes are good... have you tried their skinny caramel?
I have tried the skinny caramel I believe, but not recently. My local Starbucks store makes a really good skinny vanilla so I stick with that. I tried the Dark Cherry Mocha when I was up in Seattle earlier in the year, though. Damn it was good!
I'm curious to hear more about the high level, evil PC play and how it plays out over the long run. I'm imagining the reactions to powerful groups in the vicinity to this new power base. Good PCs are often constrained in their "reach" by their creeds. A band of evil PCs may not have such qualms, and as such a band of powerful, evil PCs could really cause some consternation amongst existing power groups. Neat!
Its threads like this that make me want to work at Paizo. My day job is nowhere near as fun.
Wayfinder, PaizoCon Founder
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I have a question for the players:
How do your expectations of how high-level play would go compare with how it is actually playing out?
Unlike James, I have NEVER played above 10th level. So, this is a real treat for me.
The main reason for the searching on the character sheet is that there are SO MANY options now. I play an inquisitor/assassin. So, I have to keep all my judgements in order, organize my spell list, make note of all the noble drow abilities, not to mention the class abilities, plus keep tabs on my feats and such, and make special note of the enhancements I get from my own magic items, as well as any granted by other players.
WHEW!
Yes, I do tend to get a little bit lost from time to time.
However, my main expectation was how incredibly hard fights would be. That is, until I went up against a Hound of Tindalos buck-naked. The host of spells and abilities that my character put up left him virtually untouched (and literally untouched for 6 rounds, thanks to sanctuary). I'm not saying that fights aren't going to get hard (oh, no no. SKR is bound to prove me wrong on THAT!). I'm saying that I had no idea on how incredibly powerful our characters could be at 14th level.
Now, here are my hindrances in the game thus far....
1) Being evil. In the other campaign I play in (Shadows under Sandpoint) I play A PALADIN. This is about as flip-side as one can get from a noble drow inquisitor/assassin of Abraxus. We are all trying to get our evil game face on, it seems, but there's generally too much cooperation and (gasp!) loyalty going on for true evil right now. It's a bit more Chaotic than evil at this point. Truthfully, I have some difficulty pulling off pure evil. I fear that if it did go full out, the party would just kill each other.
2) Being a male drow. No matter how kick-ass my character is, drow society makes him less. So, when we've got 4 female drow nobles in our party, the males' place is perceived to be in the back. It's a challenge to play, for sure. I keep myself in check several times a game, and make it a point to "serve" the house as much as possible.
So, when we've got 4 female drow nobles in our party, the males' place is perceived to be in the back.
As I will point out yet again fellow brother of Abraxus, our house reveres a MALE demon. We male worshippers of the Demon Lord of Forbidden Knowledge must recognize the hierarchy established by Abraxus's very existence! If Abraxus wanted our house to venerate females above males, he would've created himself as a woman!
Unlike James, I have NEVER played above 10th level. So, this is a real treat for me.
Actually the real treat is not playing above 12th level in 3rd edition - what a mess, I suppose you will find that out after a while, but it probably helps to have a very knowledgable DM.
High level fights tend to spike the needle either "deadly" or "boringly easy", in my experience.
Although milquetoast "evil" drow doesn't scream fun either.... Then again put me in the drow = "cheese" camp. :)
So here's to hoping Paizo can do something about the rules bloat and unweildiness of high level play.
So, when we've got 4 female drow nobles in our party, the males' place is perceived to be in the back.As I will point out yet again fellow brother of Abraxus, our house reveres a MALE demon. We male worshippers of the Demon Lord of Forbidden Knowledge must recognize the hierarchy established by Abraxus's very existence! If Abraxus wanted our house to venerate females above males, he would've created himself as a woman!
Yet, in turn, Abraxas is a pawn of the Mother of Demons, Lamashtu. He knows his place. And I can say that. Being his mouthpiece and all.
I play an inquisitor/assassin. So, I have to keep all my judgements in order, organize my spell list, make note of all the noble drow abilities, not to mention the class abilities, plus keep tabs on my feats and such, and make special note of the enhancements I get from my own magic items, as well as any granted by other players.
WHEW!
Yes, I do tend to get a little bit lost from time to time.
*nods*
One of the other players in the game I'm in recently playtested an archer Inquisitor briefly at 11th level, and also noted that it was a lot of work keeping track of the various Inquisitor abilities and the bonuses they grant. I think he described it as quite effective but "one hell of a b&@++ to run." ;) So I don't think you are alone there.
I play an inquisitor/assassin. So, I have to keep all my judgements in order, organize my spell list, make note of all the noble drow abilities, not to mention the class abilities, plus keep tabs on my feats and such, and make special note of the enhancements I get from my own magic items, as well as any granted by other players.
WHEW!
Yes, I do tend to get a little bit lost from time to time.
*nods*
One of the other players in the game I'm in recently playtested an archer Inquisitor briefly at 11th level, and also noted that it was a lot of work keeping track of the various Inquisitor abilities and the bonuses they grant. I think he described it as quite effective but "one hell of a b##%* to run." ;) So I don't think you are alone there.
Hmm, I could look into automating their functionality some in the character sheet, like what I've done with attack options and PC conditions (or the upcoming magical effects). That way you could "flip a switch" and the sheet would recalculate for you.
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Wayfinder, PaizoCon Founder
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Hmm, I could look into automating their functionality some in the character sheet, like what I've done with attack options and PC conditions (or the upcoming magical effects). That way you could "flip a switch" and the sheet would recalculate for you.
Unfortunately, this would only work if I had a computer in front of me at the table. I'm sure this would ROCK for those that DO do that. ;-)
Honestly, erian_7, the only thing that urks me about your sheet is having to re-enter everything all over each time you update the sheet and make it better! Although....it does cause me to "test" it more, and find the wonky stuff for you...all part of your master plan, I'm sure. ;-)
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Wayfinder, PaizoCon Founder
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Love the drow nobles!
Maybe I missed it but what are the classes in the group of PCs?
All shall be detailed over in the journal thread.
Once I catch up with the entries for The Shadow Under Sandpoint, I will be writing up Phyxafein's take on events.
I suspect that had we reached this level organically from 1st level, the character sheet searching and tactics decisions would go a lot faster—that's how I've seen it work on other long-running campaigns that ended up reaching 20th level seem to do, at least...
I've seen the same thing.
It's especially noticeable at a mixed table, when I have a new player sitting in at an experienced table.
I almost always recommend that the new players be a fighter - even that's complex at the high levels, because of all the special powers piled on due to insane numbers of feats.