The_Ninja_Dm's Road to Kasai: A Jade Regent pbp: adventure, romance, and (maybe) comedy and music
This is an invtitational Jade Regent Game. Do not post unless I've sent you a PM.
Once the first group I've chosen respond, I'll consider other PCs.
The game will use both gestalt and Mythic rules as per the following notes.
Character generation:
No evil PCs!
Races: All Pathfinder Core, Featured and Uncommon races, all Dreamscarred Press races, and the 'example' races in the ARG. Other races by DM approval only.
No homebrew races.
Special: I will permit PCs to modify a race based on the Race Point cost in the Advanced Race Guide under the following rules: the base cost for a race is 15 RPs. If your race 'costs' less than that, you may use the difference between that cost and 15 RPs to 'purchase' racial abilities as per their cost in the ARG. If the race 'costs' more than 15 points, you must pay the difference from the point buy points allotted. These points may also be used to 'purchase' the variant racial abilities, including those Aasimar and Tiefling abilities from the Blood of... series, at an RP cost of the ability they would normally be replacing.
Stats: 25 pt buy
NOTE: No character may 'cost' more than a total of 40 points.
Classes: All Pathfinder classes, all Dreamscarred Press Psionics Unleashed & Psionics Expanded classes. All other 3pp by DM approval, must provide a copy or link to one for the GM. No homebrews.
Traits: 3; one must be a Campaign Trait. Traits may also be purchased with RP or Stat points at 2 points/trait.
You may, with GM approval of the specific trait, use RotRL or Sandpoint specific traits as campaign traits. No 3rd party or homebrew traits as campaign traits.
HP: PCs get their full HD plus their con score at first level. Thereafter they will roll for HP and add their con bonus. If the roll for HP is under PFS base, they get PFS base plus con bonus.
Gestalt House Rules
Gestalt characters essentially take multiple classes at each level, choosing the best aspects of each. The process is similar to multiclassing, except that characters gain the full benefits of each class at each level. Where the chosen classes have aspects that overlap (such as Hit Dice, attack progression, saves, and class features common to more than one class), you choose the better aspect. The gestalt character retains all aspects that don’t overlap. Class features that two classes share (such as Uncanny Dodge) don’t stack; they accrue at the rate of the faster class.
To build a gestalt character, choose two (or three) classes. The classes must be ones that could multiclass under the multiclass rules.
a: One class of the gestalt must be a Pathfinder or Dreamscarred Press class.
b: Once chosen, the gestalt combination may not be changed.
c: Players must specify one of the classes in their gestalt as their favored class. Races or Feats allowing more than one Favored Class allow the PC to make a second class in their gestalt favored as well.
d: Gestalt characters with more than one spell-casting class keep track of their spells per day separately.
e: The third class can be an NPC or prestige class. The prestige class can be used to replace the NPC class, and only the NPC class once you qualify.
f: For each save bonus, choose the better progression from the chosen classes, with the following restriction: The character must take at least one bonus from each class in the gestalt.
Other House Rules
I permit a rewrite of a character, once, at the point where the PC reaches 2nd level.
I roll initiative for everyone once and maintain that same initiative throughout the fight. After the first/surprise round a PC may reroll their initiative, but they must keep the reroll, even if it's worse.
I roll publicly to see who the opponents attack, numbering the group in alphabetical order.
I put information acquired in skill rolls in spoilers with the roll needed listed. If you have bonuses/modifiers that equal the listed roll, you get the info without rolling.
I do not use a 3 natural 20 instant death rule.
Thanks for the invite. Considering options. Will get my questions or ideas up as soon as i can. ( I'm home with my little 6 month old, so it may or may not be today... I'll try to keep a presence here until i can get my character posted, though )
Woot! I've glad to have been invited and delighted to play! I'm going to tinker with some concepts - given your generous build rules - and throw up a possible character as soon as I can. If you don't like the character - I'll be happy to trash him/her and make another one. It's pretty hard to go wrong with this many build options. :)
At first blush, I'm really tempted to try Straehan the Sorc/Monk concept.
Spiral, what are your thoughts on rage cycling?
Let me know if you'd allow it, and how it would play out.
Rage Cycling. Hm. I'd be willing to give it a try, I'm open to options. With the proviso that, if it proves to disruptive, the DM/fate/whatever can step in and remove the ability.
Still, it does sound rather ... mythic. ;)
Another quick build note: if you don't want to add to or adjust a current race, you may use those extra points for stat buy as well.
OK, help me with the math here as I don't have the ARG.
So if you have a 10 point race, say a Gnome - picking something off the top of my head :) - and you don't adjust it one bit. Are you saying the difference between 15 RP and the 10 RP spent (5 RP) would be applied to his Point Buy raising it from 25 to 30?
Alternatively, I can shuffle his racial build around to eat up that 5 RP so that he is built as a 15 RP race with 25 points for stats. Yes?
Yes, stormraven.
I suspect that the differences will balance out, especially after we add the Mythic tiers.
Note: That will be at a certain point near the end of the first module.
If you know the plot, you can guess when and how.
Also, you mention Mythic in your initial post. How are those rules playing into our character advancement? On top of gestalt? Or instead of gestalt?
On top of.
Part of the delay setting this up has been adapting the opponents to fit mythic.
I suspect that the differences will balance out, especially after we add the Mythic tiers.
Note: That will be at a certain point near the end of the first module.
If you know the plot, you can guess when and how.
Well, I guess I'm outta luck there then. :) I do homespun stuff myself and own none of the Adventure Paths. So you may assume I don't know anything about Jade Regent aside from what the Player's Guide provides.
thanks for the invite.
i'll have to give character design some thought, should hopefully post something soon.
OK, this may seem a bit out of the ordinary - and hopefully doesn't step on Spiral's toes - but maybe guys/gals we could chat about our preferred classes? I'd like to pick something complementary to the group that doesn't over-balance us one way or another (i.e. all stabby types or all spell-wonks). I know with gestalt we can cover all the bases easily but most people have preferences. I'm pretty 'class agnostic' so if you good folks are heavily into casters, I can fill the meat-shield role, etc.
Generally, I like to have some casting ability. I think it keeps the higher levels more interesting. But that isn't a hard and fast rule for me. So my two basic concepts are:
Slightly re-skinned Gnome Sorcerer (probably Fire) / Monk (Master of 4 Winds)
Slightly re-skinned Tian Samurai (Sword Saint & Ronin) / X (likely Fighter Weapon Master)
If you guys are inclined to go caster heavy, I'd probably opt for the Samurai.
I'm fine with you folks working out a complimentary group.
I was hoping to be able to cover all six Mythic paths as well, but I'm not going to require you to each pick a different one.
I have two ideas:
A summoner/ninja (or rogue) Fetchling
or
a monk (wanderer) / oracle (seer) human.
anything really is fine though.
further on the second idea:
He's blind. with the racial trait 'see in darkness' (+4 Racial points) to make up for it flavor wise. i know its a stereotype but i think it'd be fun to play.
Not all stereotypes are a bad thing. :)
Ca-CAW!
Question, Spiral, on the ARG stuff. At 15 RP we'd be in the 'Advanced' Power Level which gives us some stronger ways to spend RP points. Was that your intent or should we restrict ourselves to the 'Standard' RP abilities but we just have more RPs to spend?
Hey Spiral, what party size are you shooting for? You mentioned wanting to get characters in all six mythic paths. Are you going for a six-pack of character trouble?
Wow, this sounds pretty amazing. Reminds me of the Monkey King and his completely over the top companions. I'll be lurking this game. :)
skill points:
total of both classes? or just the higher of the two?
Higher of the two.
danke
and we use the skill lists from both classes?
Yup. :)
You leaning one direction or the other on your character, Corvus?
I have a ton of ideas, but am currently mostly entertaining a few front- runners.
1) Biter - Goblin bad-ass barbarian and scout rogue. Think Conan at 3 feet tall.
2) A Tiefling in one of the three following combos: katana-wielding Kensai magus/Lore Warden, katana-wielding Kensai magus/Scout rogue, or Skin-changing Scout Rogue/Psychic Warrior. All of these three share the same basic backstory; just three different cool ways of bringing it to life depending on what the others in the group want to play.
Based on the talk of front-liners from John and Eben, I'm seriously thinking the gnome sorc/monk is the way to go. He won't be a wall-flower though. He is geared to mix it up with the baddies and drop spells in the middle of a firefight.
Sorry for not responding for a bit. Finally caught the cold the rest of the family has been tossing around all week.
I'll post an example build and answer questions later tonight.
I also have a cool archer/battlefield controller as well as a whip-based group buff-type character that could be fun. :)
THERE ARE JUST SO MANY GOOD OPTIONS!
Sounds good, John.
OK, here's the promised guide, using 2 NPCs you may meet and 2 fictional concepts.
Gestalt build examples
Ameiko Kaijitsu has three classes; Aristocrat, Bard, Rogue (rake)
Shalelu Andosana has two classes; Fighter and Ranger
Old-School Eddie also has three classes; Fighter, Wizard, and Rogue (duplicating the 2nd ed fighter/magic-user/thief class.)
Mandy Multi-mage is a Cleric, Psion, Wizard (a concept I've always wanted to run somewhere, sometime)
Hit Dice Choose the larger Hit Die.
Ameiko's classes have the same hit dice so her gestalt HD is a d8.
Shalelu's classes have the same hit dice. Shaleu's gestalt hd is D10
Eddie's classes hit dice are: Fighter d10, Wizard d6, Rogue d8. Eddie's gestalt hd is d10.
Mandy's classes hit dice are: Cleric d8, Wizard d6, Psion d6. Mandy's gestalt hd is d8.
Base Attack Bonus Choose the best progression from the gestalt classes.
Ameiko's classes have the same BaB rate. Her BaB is slow.
Shalelu's classes have the same BaB. Shalelu uses the fast BaB progression.
Eddie's classes vary: Fighter fast, Wizard slow, Rogue slow. Eddie uses the Fighter's fast BaB.
Mandy's classes all share the slow BaB. Her gestalt BaB is slow.
Base Saving Throw Bonuses For each base save bonus, choose the better progression from each of the gestalt classes, taking at least one bonus from each class in the gestalt.
Ameiko: An Aristocrat's best save is Will; a Bard's best saves are Ref & Will; a Rogue's best save is Ref. This means that Ameiko will have to use the Aristocrat's Will save, the Rogue's Reflex save, and the Bard's poor Fort save. (One save from each class.)
Shalelu: A Fighter's best save is Fort; a Ranger's best saves are Fort and Reflex. Shalelu will use the Fighter's Fort save and the Ranger's Reflex save and will have a poor Will save.
Eddie: A Fighter's best save is Fort, a Wizard's best save is Will, and a Rogue's best save is Reflex. Eddie has three good saves.
Mandy: A Cleric has two good saves, Fort and Will, a Fighter's best save is Fort, and a Psion's best save is Will. Mandy has the Fighter's Fort save, The Cleric's Will save and the Psion's poor Reflex save.
Class Skills Take the number of skill points gained per level from whichever class grants more skill points, and consider any skill on either class list as a class skill for the gestalt character.
Ameiko: Aristocrat (4 skill ranks), Bard (6 skill ranks), Rogue (8 skill ranks). Ameiko gains 8 skill ranks per level.
Shalelu: Fighter (2 skill ranks), Ranger (6 skill ranks). Shalelu gains 6 skill ranks per level.
Eddie: Fighter (2 skill ranks), Wizard (2 skill ranks), Rogue (8 skill ranks). Eddie gets 8 skill ranks per level.
Mandy: Cleric (2 skill ranks), Wizard (2 skill ranks), and Psion (2 skill ranks). Mandy gets 2 skill ranks per level.
Class Features A gestalt character gains the class features of both classes. Class- and ability-based restrictions (such as arcane spell failure chance and a Druid’s prohibition on wearing metal armor) apply normally to a gestalt character, no matter what the other classes are involved.
At first level:
Ameiko gets Sneak attack +1d6 and Bravado’s Blade (Ex) [replacing trapfinding due to her archetype] from the Rogue, Bardic knowledge, bardic performance, cantrips, countersong, distraction, fascinate, and inspire courage +1 from the Bard, and no specials from the Aristocrat.
Shalelu gets a bonus feat from the Fighter and 1st favored enemy, track, and wild empathy from the Ranger.
Eddie gets a bonus feat from the Fighter, Arcane bond, arcane school, cantrips, and Scribe Scroll from the Wizard, and Sneak attack +1d6, trapfinding
Mandy gets the Cleric's Aura, channel energy 1d6, domains, orisons, spontaneous casting, the Wizard's Arcane bond, arcane school, cantrips, and Scribe Scroll, and the Psion's bonus feat, detect psionics, a discipline, and discipline powers. However Mandy can still only cast one spell or manifest one power per round.
Prestige classes If you have a three PC class gestalt, you canot take a prestige class later. If you have a two-class gestalt, you can add a prestige class you qualify for. If you have a three-class gestalt with at least one part being an NPC class, you can replace that NPC class only with a prestige class.
Neither Eddie or Mandy can take a prestige class. They have 3 PC classes and cannot replace any of them.
Ameiko can, at a later time, stop taking levels in Aristocrat (and ONLY in Aristocrat) and start taking a prestige class.
Shalelu can add a prestige class once she qualifies.
Oh, and a delayed reply to the Advanced level abilities question. You can add one with my approval. There are a few I just don't want to see...there's makes other characters fall for you and rush across the room to kiss you for example. [For personal reasons I don't want to discuss, except that I got very lucky, I can guarantee that once the effect wore off, the victim would be trying to kill the perpetrator.]
# of players. Ideally I'd like 6, however, I only sent 5 invites. I can add the missing paths to some of the permanent NPCs you'll be collecting, so it's not that big an issue.
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I came up with a few other elements for the character concept. I'm thinking to go with the Guardian mythic path, and take either vulnerability to silver (antithetical to the ordered ascetic mind) or required food/drink as a mythic weakness. I'm also toying with adding Expert as a third class; I don't anticipate taking any prestige classes, but it'd be nice to have the option if DSP comes out with something reasonable for soulknives, and another couple of skill points and class skills is no bad thing. One other thing--I'm still thinking about whether this would fit with the character concept, but would you allow the Fast Advanced trait for a human?
I'm a bit too tired to search properly, John. What does the Fast Advanced trait do?
As far as Advanced feats go... I wasn't looking to game the system or had some insidious combo platter of powers in mind. I was thinking about the 'basics' of the ARG system. For instance, is the 'Advanced' Ability Score qualifier in play or strictly off limits?
The 'Standard' (0 RP) is "+2 to one physical ability, +2 to one mental ability, and -2 to one other ability."
The 'Advanced' (4 RP) is "Pick either mental or physical ability scores. Members of this race gain a +2 bonus to all of those scores, a +4 bonus to one score of the other type, and a –2 penalty to one other ability score of the other type."
That will substantially boost anyone's stats. And then, depending on how you view things, someone could go hog wild and toss on 'Advanced CON' (4 RP) or the like for an additional +2 to that stat.
It just seems like it might be reasonable to set some limits on the base Ability Score Modifier Quality to prevent the scores from getting too lopsided.
So, there's no reason NOT to take a third class if you don't plan on taking a prestige class, huh? Or, if you do want to take a prestige class, there's no reason not to take an NPC class as your third.
Just want to fully understand before i go too far down a path. :)
@stormraven: I'm going to say no on the ability score adds. There will be sufficient opportunities to improve your stats. ;)
@Eben: Pretty much.
@John: Fast Advanced trait is OK.
So, there's no reason NOT to take a third class if you don't plan on taking a prestige class, huh? Or, if you do want to take a prestige class, there's no reason not to take an NPC class as your third.
Just want to fully understand before i go too far down a path. :)
Unless Spiral is changing the standard you can only improve two classes at each level up. With a 3rd class, you are splitting your levels. Thus:
Gestalt Level 6 = 12 total class levels
Fighter 6 / Bard 6
Fighter 5 / Bard 3 / Aristocrat 4
@stormraven: I'm going to say no on the ability score adds. There will be sufficient opportunities to improve your stats. ;)
That's fine with me. I'm not a rampant optimizer, I just like to ensure a level playing field. :)
So then the Ability Score 'base' for any created ARG race is assumed to be 'Standard' (0 RP) or 'Human Heritage' (0 RP) or possibly 'Flexible' (2 RP) for folks taking something like an Aasimar.
So, there's no reason NOT to take a third class if you don't plan on taking a prestige class, huh? Or, if you do want to take a prestige class, there's no reason not to take an NPC class as your third.
Just want to fully understand before i go too far down a path. :)
Unless Spiral is changing the standard you can only improve two classes at each level up. With a 3rd class, you are splitting your levels. Thus:
Gestalt Level 6 = 12 total class levels
Fighter 6 / Bard 6
Fighter 5 / Bard 3 / Aristocrat 4
This is not what Spiral Ninja's examples (or her answer to me) indicate. Her example of Mandy the Multi-mage shows her gaining the class features of all three classes (cleric, wizard, and psion). Such a character is limited in that he/she cannot take any prestige classes (ever). So any character not really interested in taking prestige classes can take 3 classes at once, according to the example and Spiral's follow-up answer to my question.
Spiral, obviously let me know if I'm wrong on this.
I do see the gestalts advancing in all classes at the same time.
I also have a balancing mechanisim I've been considering.
It works like this:
A two class gestalt advances at the medium xp rate
A three class gestalt advances at the slow xp rate.
So, if you want to take a PrC, you're better off taking an NPC class as a third class. If not, then a two-class gestalt is better.
That's an interesting variation.
OK, so here is my Half-Elemental Gnome race/stats for consideration. He'll be using the same basic Straehan story with which you're familiar. It'll be visible for this avatar but ignore the crunch. I'll update it all after you've given a 'yay' or 'nay' on the race and build.
Half-Elemental Gnome
Goes with his storyline - Father of unknown origin but hinted at by Strae's Sorcerous Bloodline (Elemental Fire).
Type: Humanoid (Gnome)
Size: Small
Speed: Normal
Ability Score: Standard (-2 Str, +2 Dex, +2 Cha)
Languages: Standard
Feat and Skill Racial Traits
- Skill bonus (Perception)
- Skill bonus (choose one Craft or Profession)
Magical Racial Traits
- Arcane Focus
- Pyromaniac
Offense Racial Traits
- Nimble Attacks: Weapon Finesse << Advanced (1 allowed)
Senses Racial Traits
- Low-light vision
Total: 11 RP (of 15 allowed)
Adding 4 extra RP to the 25 point build...
29 Point Build
STR 12 (-2 racial)
DEX 16 (+2 racial)
CON 12
INT 12
WIS 14
CHA 18 (+2 racial)
I'll be going with two class gestalt - Sorcerer (Fire) / Monk (Master of 4 Winds)
@Straehan: looks good to me.
Cool. I might raise his WIS a little bit at the cost of... I'm not sure what yet. :) But otherwise, I'll build him out under this avatar. He'll be all purtied up over the weekend.
Okay, I get it now. I'll be sticking with 2 classes. Really don't want to live on a slower xp path. :)
The character I'm really liking at this point, both from a background and mechancial standpoint is a tiefling scout (Rogue and Egoist Psion).
Here's my attribute point buy and racial point buy.
dex 18 :: 10 (+2 racial)
con 13 :: 3
int 16 :: 5 (+2 racial)
wis 12 :: 2
cha 8 :: 0 (-2 racial)
-- dropped Fire resistance to pick up a bite, then picked up Fast advanced movement trait
+2 Dex, +2 Intelligence, -2 Charisma (standard)
Native Outsider (includes Darkvision 60)
Medium
Normal Speed
-- Fast
Skill Bonus x2 (bluff, stealth)
Claw (claws)
-- Bite
Scaled Skin: +1 natural armor
Prehensile Tail
Languages (standard)
IF these are good, I'll go ahead and build him out.
NOTE: Anyone know a quick translation of "little one" in chinese or japanese (that does't rely on the chinese/japanese characters)? I'm looking for ideas for this guy's name. :D
@Eben: the character looks good.
As for names, here are a few translations, courtesy of Google translate
Chinese: Xiǎo yī
Japanese: Chīsana ichi
Vietnamese: chỉ một cái
Korean: eolin-i
And do we know or care whether Ameiko's family's rots are Japanese or Chinese equivalent?
Yes. Her family's roots are in Minkai. In fact, Kasai is it's capitol.
Road trip!
And, yes, Minkai is Japanese influenced.
Also, Tien and Minkaian are separate languages, Tien being the Tian Xia equivalent of common.
I think i'll be sticking with the monk/oracle gestalt then, since we have a rogue.
I'll post a stat block as soon as i can just to make sure i gots it right.
If you'd prefer the other character, let me know. I can switch to another concept easily enough, Corvus.
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Re traits, would you allow the Centered trait from Faiths of Balance?
ETA: Here's a rough of the character:
Ikshvaku “Vak” Charayana
Fighter (Unbreakable)/Soulknife
LN Vudrani Human Male
Standard human (9 RP) +1 RP for +10’ movement speed
30 point build
S 14
D 18
C 16
I 13
W 12
C 10
Skills: Acrobatics (+8), Autohypnosis (+5), Climb (+6), Perception (+6), Knowledge (Psionics) (+5), Swim (+6), Profession (Merchant)(?) (+5)
Feats: Weapon Focus (mind blade) (L1), Dodge (Human bonus), Endurance (L1 Unbreakable bonus), Diehard (L1 Unbreakable Bonus), Two-Weapon Fighting (L1 Soulknife bonus), Wild Talent (L1 Soulknife bonus)
Traits: Friend of the Family, Armor Expert, Centered
Vak is the son of a pair of Vudrani merchants based out of Magnimar; they’re the far north end of a trading route that extends all the way back to Vudra, and they frequently travel to Sandpoint and other towns in Varisia. For reasons too complicated to go into, they’ve long been friends of Niska’s, which is how Vak comes to be in a position to take the caravan north.
He is a tall, well-built young man with the beginnings of a dark beard; he is quite an ascetic, though, devoting much of his time to the martial and mental disciplines of his almost-forgotten homeland.