Do What You Want 'Cause a Pirate is Free! [[S&S PbP]] (Inactive)

Game Master Rorrix

Found it!....

Rynjin wrote:

1.) Who came up with the Rum Ration rules for Skull and Shackles? Was it Rob McReary, someone else, or you don't know?

2.) Are there any world altering repercussions to rum being one of the deadliest poisons known to man (no save, 1d3 Con)?

3.) Is there any canonical explanation why every pirate crew, merchant vessel, and Navy ship doesn't drink itself to death within a week of setting off?

1) That's a Rob question. I suspect it was Rich Pett who came up with the initial rules, then Rob developed them into what made it into print. When we played the game (after the 1st adventure went to print, alas), he realized that having the rum do Con damage was probably too much... but that was a weird artifact/side effect of how we'd done rules for drugs to that point, to a certain effect. In hindsight, having the rations do Wisdom damage might have made more sense, or even better, simply grant a non-stacking Con penalty.

2) Yes. The rules shouldn't work that way, in large part BECAUSE it implies that rum is the most deadly poison known to humanity.

3) No, because it was an error.

Found it!....

James Jacobs wrote:

Rynjin wrote:

1.) Who came up with the Rum Ration rules for Skull and Shackles? Was it Rob McReary, someone else, or you don't know?

2.) Are there any world altering repercussions to rum being one of the deadliest poisons known to man (no save, 1d3 Con)?

3.) Is there any canonical explanation why every pirate crew, merchant vessel, and Navy ship doesn't drink itself to death within a week of setting off?

1) That's a Rob question. I suspect it was Rich Pett who came up with the initial rules, then Rob developed them into what made it into print. When we played the game (after the 1st adventure went to print, alas), he realized that having the rum do Con damage was probably too much... but that was a weird artifact/side effect of how we'd done rules for drugs to that point, to a certain effect. In hindsight, having the rations do Wisdom damage might have made more sense, or even better, simply grant a non-stacking Con penalty.

2) Yes. The rules shouldn't work that way, in large part BECAUSE it implies that rum is the most deadly poison known to humanity.

3) No, because it was an error.

Maybe a non-stacking CON penalty would be the best way to run it, as JJ suggests, or having only the drinks drunk in a single day stack. This way, you can still potentially drink yourself to death, but if you stick to one a day, you will almost perpetually have a penalty to CON, but you won't die from it. 1d3 CON penalty would be fine in such an case.

Ultimately we'll roll with whatever the Rorrix decides though. =)

That makes a lot more sense, I'm glad there was some kind of official admittance to the error. Okay, Super Duper Official Final Form of the rum rations will be as follows:

-1d3 Con, +1d2 Cha, and fatigued for 1d8 hours. Multiple drinks within the duration stack and increase the duration by 1d8 hours up to a maximum of 8 hours. If the duration would increase beyond 8 hours, you become exhausted instead. A DC 5 Frt save must be made to avoid addiction for each drink.

Does that make sense?

So for an example:

So, as we saw in this example, it took 6 consecutive drinks to kill a player with a starting con of 10. I think that's fair enough.

The reason why it shouldn't stack is just as you described. It's heavily watered-down rum. I can (and have) consumed FIFTEEN TIMES the rum in your example (since mine isn't diluted) and enjoyed myself, without even a hangover, and I probably have an 11 con at the most.

The fatigue and exhaustion seem perfect, but the con penalty stacking is excessive and crazy. Maybe add in "sickened" for 12-18 hours if you exceed a certain number of failed saves/drinks.

Also, the Cha bonus DEFINITELY needs to not stack. Not only does nothing stack with itself, +8 charisma is INSANE. That's like a 250,000gp item right there, for the cost of one gold piece worth of alcohol. And believe me, I don't get more charismatic past my second drink.

Failing the save while exhausted should make you unconscious for sure. :P

I figured at the cost of con, it'd be something to be wary about. With the penalties from Fatigue/Exhaustion on top, you're more likely to screw up on ship, which means more likely to be punished, and you're going to wish you had Con instead of Cha at that point.

I see what you mean though. There's a drinking game where the competitors literally drink their opponent to death though, so I want to find a way to retain that mechanic. Will tweak more and be back with results.

How's this for a final form:

When you take the rum ration, you receive a +2 circumstance bonus to charisma for 1 hour, but you take a -2 penalty to constitution. For each additional drink consumed while still suffering this penalty, add another hour to the duration. You must make a DC 5 fort save. This DC increases by 2 for each drink you consume while still suffering from the con penalty. Failing this save causes you to become fatigued. Failing this save while fatigued causes you to become exhausted. Failing this save while exhausted causes you to fall unconscious after 2d4 minutes. Failing this save by five or more causes you to become addicted.

You can add special rules for the drinking game.

I like my "fail by 5 to become addicted" because it should be hard to get addicted with one drink, but easy with many drinks.

Fail by 10 or more and you take 1d3 con damage, maybe? Or take the 1d3 when you fail by 5 and become addicted.

That makes a lot more sense, I'm glad there was some kind of official admittance to the error. Okay, Super Duper Official Final Form of the rum rations will be as follows:

-1d3 Con, +1d2 Cha, and fatigued for 1d8 hours. Multiple drinks within the duration stack and increase the duration by 1d8 hours up to a maximum of 8 hours. If the duration would increase beyond 8 hours, you become exhausted instead. A DC 5 Frt save must be made to avoid addiction for each drink.

Does that make sense?

So for an example:
** spoiler omitted **

So, as we saw in this example, it took 6 consecutive drinks to kill a player with a starting con of 10. I think that's fair enough.

I'm happy with this, but I also agree that the CHA bonus should not stack. (And I'm saying this as one of the 2 characters who benefit from CHA in this party.) Only the Con penalty should stack. In fact, I'd say that after a number of drinks equal to (1+CON modifier), the drinks should start to impose a stacking CHA penalty instead (off-setting and eventually surpassing the CHA bonus), since people get LESS charismatic after too many drinks, not more. XD

Unless you're a paladin/cleric of Cayden Cailean #joking ;)

I like it, but I don't. There's no incentive to drink more than one drink other than to increase the duration, in which case a player would just wait until they've sobered up to have another. Now you're thinking with Paizo. Here's what I propose now.

First Drink
Effect: -1d2 Con, +1d2 Cha, and Fatigued
Duration: 1d4 hours
Addiction: DC 5 Frt
Pass Out: DC -10 Frt

Further Drinks During Duration
Effect: -1d2 Con (Max -4), +1d2 Cha (max +4), Exhausted if duration would exceed 8 hours, sickened next day if another drink is taken while exhausted. Upon passing out, succeed a DC 5 Frt check or die.
Duration: +1d2 hours (max 8 hours)
Addiction: DC 5 Frt (+2 per additional drink)
Pass Out: DC -10 Frt (+2 per additional drink)

Here's a qick and dirty drink to the death.

While it is very possible for the average human to drink much more than this, I don't think it's necessary to go roll it THAT many times when this takes care of it pretty well. Thoughts on this system? I feel like it gives incentives for multiple drinks, doesn't fly off the deep end like my last idea, has accruing DCs, and a chance of death by alcohol poisoning.

I like it, but I don't. There's no incentive to drink more than one drink other than to increase the duration, in which case a player would just wait until they've sobered up to have another. Now you're thinking with Paizo. Here's what I propose now.

First Drink
Effect: -1d2 Con, +1d2 Cha, and Fatigued
Duration: 1d4 hours
Addiction: DC 5 Frt
Pass Out: DC -10 Frt

Further Drinks During Duration
Effect: -1d2 Con (Max -4), +1d2 Cha (max +4), Exhausted if duration would exceed 8 hours, sickened next day if another drink is taken while exhausted. Upon passing out, succeed a DC 5 Frt check or die.
Duration: +1d2 hours (max 8 hours)
Addiction: DC 5 Frt (+2 per additional drink)
Pass Out: DC -10 Frt (+2 per additional drink)

Here's a qick and dirty drink to the death.
** spoiler omitted **...

Heh, I actually liked the part about potentially drinking one's self to death. XD

But sure, this works too. =)

If you look, the test dummy in question did in fact die at the end haha.

I can't believe I've spent precious hours of my life making up a dice system for the effects of rum. I was just trying to do a quick fix and adjust the con damage so it wouldn't destroy you in a week, and now here we are.

Ah, I missed the part about the save-or-die. Ok, I'm happy. XD

So we're now waiting for Peggy's intro and Ostarian's climb?

Yup. Ostarian warned us that he'd be busy this weekend, so it may be a wait still. I'm not too concerned as long as we get back on track afterward.

Occurs to me that obesity aside, Ostarian is as good at climbing as Ri'el is (same STR, no penalties for climbing that I can see). He should be fine...I hope!

Well at least I have an excuse for not being part of the conversation up on the crowd nest apart from being busy the long weekend. Did get my request for cook's aid though, lol.

Well, Ri'el was intending to ask for it and didn't hear you asking for it, and you're now unconscious and can't take the job... XD

On the plus side, you get to skip a few days of work. If I have any goodberries left at the end of this day I'll feed them to you. Are you preferring I heal you to consciousness the next day, or would you prefer to stick things out for abit?

Also, I'm starting to see why the GM said this ship has plenty of ways to kill us without us needing to go into combat!

@Ri'el: You didn't get to the nest until your 17th roll. Ostarian fell on his 9th. You wouldn't make it in nearly enough time (make it to the nest, chat with folks, cast spell, climb down). I'm hoping for an npc to step in with something.

Also, this fellow is built for cook. He even has the profession.

Argh I'm so conflicted! See, what I would normally do in this situation would kill Ostarian. And the NPC wouldn't know better that he's a Dhampir. I'd hate to put Ostarian on bedrest for a few days, because that means he essentially can't play, and that's no fun either. Give me a bit to figure out how the hell to handle this.

Hmm...I was working off Peggy's post, in which she said hi to Thali (i.e. near the end of Ri's conversation with the others), then went 'yikes look he fell'.

I suppose we could chalk it up to you stalling abit to talk to Plugg whilst the rest of us started climbing, and so only had your second fall afterwards, in order to keep the flow of events consistent?

Also, I suppose you could have an in-character conversation with Ri'el when you regain consciousness and ask to take over the cook's assistant position if you want?

Argh I'm so conflicted! See, what I would normally do in this situation would kill Ostarian. And the NPC wouldn't know better that he's a Dhampir. I'd hate to put Ostarian on bedrest for a few days, because that means he essentially can't play, and that's no fun either. Give me a bit to figure out how the hell to handle this.

GOOD POINT! I completely forgot about that! Aren't we lucky I didn't prepare a CLW instead of goodberry! XD

In any event, Ostarion, you might want to roll a few stabilisation rolls first. We can sort out the cook thing later.

Also Ri'el, you only got an 8 at 37.5ft.

Lol. I forgot about that myself. Good point about the delay. Ostarian was taking his time.

I'm ok with bed rest. A few days off won't kill me (I am busy, just lucky to find time to post). And maybe a "when he wakes up, put him with the cook, he'll be good for nothing else."

I guess it's good it's the first day not the second. Hedonism would've given me a -2 (and if I had been able take bloatmage initiate feat at first, it'd be another -3).

One more thing, Ostarion: it might be a good idea to let Ri'el know in-character about your aversion to positive energy earlier rather than later, because if I have a CLW handy and need to heal you, I will certainly cast it on you if I don't know any better... Not intentionally of course, but Ri'el has no idea what you are at this point.

Also Ri'el, you only got an 8 at 37.5ft.

Yep, those were my checks for climbing down. I kept my elevation the same for that roll for not having made progress.

So I rolled a 14 to get to 37.5ft, rolled an 8 to say at 37.5ft, then rolled a 10 to get to 30ft and so on. =)

I don't fall unless I roll under 5, right?

Ostarion, don't forget the goodberry I fed you. You'd be on -3.

Oh whoops yeah, sleepy-reading is fun. You're right, no fall.

It's okay guys, I've got a plan! Writing up a saving grace as we speak.

I'll wait on the berry in case Rorrix tries to kill me off early. I did roll a 20 (edit oops 19) on that last roll, so long as the cure spell doesn't kill me outright, he'll live (and everyone will know of his weakness).

Also he can become conscious sooner with a decent roll (although it might be difficult if he's on the edge of death) EDIT: or smelling salts.

Gotta go now though so no more posting likely today

That's a whole lot of assumption that I am not about to give the answer to. :3

Was conjecture at hypotheticals and wasn't expecting any answer.
Just letting you know how I will react and letting you shape the events accordingly. =)

I'm almost wishing I'd taken the life dominant soul feat instead of spell focus, let me tell you. This presents much greater hardship in the near term, lol.

I'm also intending to have my wandering spirit as the life spirit most of the time, but it'll probably only be for out-of-combat healing since I don't have enough feats to spare on selective channeling... But I guess you'll be missing out on that in any event. =(

I guess the long and short of it is that you will need to stock up on castings of infernal healing and pearls of power... But yeah, Damphirs are cool and all, but a pain in the butt to heal.

IIRC, there are some ways (spells/feats/items?) to convert positive energy to temporary hit points? Might be worth looking into.

Yeeeeaaahh I know Iogorian's kind of more of a hack-and-slash sawbones than a "doctor" at the moment...damn Wisdom... :P However, at level 3 he gets to use Knowledge (Nature) in place of Heal, and that will make a lot more sense! (If we survive that long, of course.)

Yeeeeaaahh I know Iogorian's kind of more of a hack-and-slash sawbones than a "doctor" at the moment...damn Wisdom... :P However, at level 3 he gets to use Knowledge (Nature) in place of Heal, and that will make a lot more sense! (If we survive that long, of course.)

I dunno, I actually like the idea of Iogorian going around calling himself a doctor and doing amputations whilst Ri'el cringes/shudders/face-palms in the background. XD

Dark comedy gold right there. ;)

PS, once you get your tasks, you're able to take the following daytime actions while performing your tasks.

Daytime Ship Actions
Work Diligently: Gain a +4 bonus on any one check for a job’s daily task

Influence: Make normal checks for a job’s daily task and attempt to influence a single NPC

Sneak: Make normal checks for a job’s daily task and briefly explore one area of the ship (the PC can make a single Perception check or other skill check with no chance of detection)

Shop: Take a –2 penalty on all checks for a job’s daily task and visit the quartermaster’s store (area A9)

Shirk: Take a –2 penalty on all checks for a job’s daily task and take time exploring one area of the ship. The PC can take 10 on a single Perception check or other skill check, but must make a check to avoid being discovered.

Well, I suppose I'm going to influence Sandara, then make a normal check for my daily task. XD

And sorta get to explore the galley for free. =p

Can we take ten on daily checks? There's both pros and cons for that, heh.

And what NPCs are there to influence? (No need to tell us their names yet, just a description will be plenty.)

I'll go ahead and say that you can take 10 as long as you aren't shopping or shirking.

I'll let you know what NPCs are around when you head off to your duties.

Ok, sounds good.

What areas of the ship can we choose to explore?

Or do we need to explore to find out? ;)

Sorry I haven't commented on the rum thing yet.. anyway, the last set of rules look good. Another way of meta-ruling the drinking game would be that, whilst the rations are "Grog" (i.e. watered down rum), the drinking game is the neat rum... which could probably be expected to be somewhat more concentrated than standard rum since it's intended to be drunk watered-down. (just a thought)..

Anyway, would it be possible to stick the drinking rules and the Daytime actions into the campaign info tab for easy reference?

Also, seconding Jack's request for a general description of what areas we can explore. Maybe a map in the Info tab too?

The ship's map is available on the Campaign Map link at the top like I said, but I'll put it in the campaign info too. I actually prefer the loss of saves instead, so I think I'll do some variation of that, thanks for the idea.

Areas you currently know of are:
A1: Foredeck
A2: Poopdeck
A3: Main Deck
A4: Officer's Quarters

A6: Middle Hold

I'll update the campaign info with that as well. As soon as I get everyone shuffled around to their positions, I'll add more, like the Galley. For the rest of the areas, you know that there are doors/stairs leading there, but you don't know what those doors/stairs might lead to. You can explore them, but at your own risk. Let me get all the the jobs and such sorted out before we start working with ship actions though.

Now that I look at it, there's a map error in retrospect. You're not supposed to have gone through the officers' quarters, though that's the only way up to the deck. I'm going to put stairs somewhere that just go to the hold and not through the officers'. Pretend you never even saw that room.

Now that I look at it, there's a map error in retrospect. You're not supposed to have gone through the officers' quarters, though that's the only way up to the deck. I'm going to put stairs somewhere that just go to the hold and not through the officers'. Pretend you never even saw that room.

Too late, I already saw the Tarrasque hiding in there I mean, um, room? What room? XD

On a more serious note, and with relevance to my latest gameplay post, does this ship even have a sickbay for Sandara and myself to take Ostarian to? I mean, apart from the shark-infested ocean around us?

She'll just take him down to the crew's quarters. Don't worry so much, I got this, you handle Ri'el and I'll handle the game haha.

Righto, sorry, wasn't worrying, was just curious as to where Sandara and I were carrying him off to. XD

Well that sounds like something Ri'el should be wondering, not his player asking OOC. =P

Ha, was almost certain she was a bard. XD