Aelryinth,
Please stop.
All you are doing is repeating your arguments and insults. You are not answering to my arguments or punching holes in my evidence. You are not finding evidence of your own to outweigh my evidence.
You know I will back down if you can bring the evidence: you've seen me do it before.
In the research, as interpreted by my GM, it says under a klar that it can be used as a light spiked shield. Under a light shield it says you can shield bash. it doesn't actually say "shield bash" under the klar or the madu. Therefore my GM has ruled that I can only shield bash with a light or heavy shield, spikes or no.
By that logic I can shield bash with the klar, but not with the 1d6 slashing bit. When treated as a light spiked shield I can shield bash. Since it's already treated as a spiked shield I can't then ADD more spikes to up the damage.
Also I was told I couldn't throw a shield as a free action even though that's what it says for the Throwing Shield. My GM ruled that the throwing is a Standard action and the getting it ready/drawing it FOR throwing is Free.
Lastly I was told I couldn't throw a klar. It's not listed as a "throwing" shield. The only way I could throw a klar was to either take the Throw Anything feat or be a 3rd level brawler with the shielded brawler archetype or whatever it was.
Basically I was looking to be a grippli who could throw his shield, grab it with his tongue, put it back on his arm, then 10' charge with the device and maximize his shield damage. My GM didn't see it that way. The build is scrapped at the moment.
Well, your DM has ruled, so there you go.
Have you asked him about the Bashing Enchantment? Have a look at the description of the Bashing Enchantment, and I think you will see that the Bashing Enchantment increases the damage from all the attacks, not just the Bashing attacks. While, according to RAW, I think that all attacks ARE Bashing attacks, your DM has ruled they are different, and the RAW of the Bashing Enchantment should allow you to let that affect the Klar's blade.
The Klar is not listed as throwing. Throwing is an extra you can put on a shield. Since the Klar is a shield, "counts as a light shield with armor spikes." There should be no problem with putting the Throwing Extra on the Klar.
But your GM has Ruled, so there you go.
So, a heavy shield with the Bashing Enchantment will still do 1d8 for you, not bad for a 1 handed weapon, but you would probably do better with the combination of sword and unarmed strike, keeping your shield just for defense.
There is the Ring of Force Shield, which will let you activate and deactivate your shield as a Free Action. That's a 8500gp magic item, so you shouldn't expect to find one any time soon.
There is the Animated Enchantment for the Shield, a +2 equivalent, but putting that on a +1 shield will cost 8000gp, too.
Another 2 weapon Combination you might try with shield is the Phalanx Soldier Archetype. You will be able to use a pole arm in 1 hand and a shield in the other. Go ahead and use a Reach pole arm in one hand and a Bashing Heavy Shield in the other. One of the problems with using a Heavy Shield in a 2 weapon attack is that the heavy shield is always an off-hand weapon. And when your off-hand weapon is not Light, even when you do have 2weapon Fighting, you take a -4/-4. By making your pole arm Reach, you only use 1 weapon on any given target, so the off-hand problem doesn't come up.
When you work in a shield bashing build, it will be disappointing when you only do 1d8 with your Bashing, Heavy Shield, but the combination of Shield Slam, Greater Bull Rush, Paired Opportunist, and Combat Reflexes. You might use Pole Arms with Brace and take something like the Antagonize Feat to finesse opponents into charging you.
Then you can use Great Cleave, using your Reach Weapon and your heavy spiked bashing shield on your adjacent opponents.
Mark Hoover,
But you want to a character that throws during melee. I do have an idea for that: The False Opening Feat. It's expensive. You need Dodge, Weapon Focus with your Throwing Weapon, and Close Quarters Thrower. Then I recommend taking Snake Fang.
Close Quarters Thrower might be good enough for you. Use Spear and Shield like a Spartan, and throw the shield when you need to, no Attacks of Opportunity.
With False Opening, you do provoke and Attack of Opportunity, but you get a +4 on your AC, and the opponent will be Flatfooted.
If you get Snake Fang, you get an Unarmed Attack of Opportunity if your opponent misses.
What's that build look like, maybe something like this?
1Ranger1: Tengu, Bastard Sword, Weapon Focus Bite, Freebooter
2R1Monk1: Monk Stuff, Snake Style
3R1M2: Snake Fang, Combat Reflexes
4R1M2Figher1: Feral Combat Training
5R1M3F1: Monastic Legacy, Maneuver Training, Still Mind
6R2M3F1: Improved Natural Attack, Bite
7R2M3F2: 2weapon, Quick Draw
8R2M3F3:
9R2M3F4: Dodge, Weapon Focus Spear
10R2M3F5:
11R2M3F6: Close Quarters Thrower, False Opening
That build emphasizes the Snake Fang first, and Throwing second, but you could just as easily work the Throwing in first. Also, I'm incorporating other things like the Tengu's Bite and Bastard Sword + the Sword and Unarmed Strike. Anyway, Mark, hope this helps.
mplindustries wrote: Coolness is kind of irrelevant to me. Hook Hammers and Dire flails strike me as ridiculous. I basically assumed you'd be using a Double Sword or Double Axe (which are both also silly, but less so).
Double Weapons are objectively better because you get the benefits of dual wielding when you want them and the benefits of a two-handed weapon when you want those instead.
Double swords and Double Axes are okay, I guess, but I don't see that they are clearly the best double weapons by far, and I certainly don't see any justification for your Dire Flail and Hooked Hammer hate.
The Dire Flail, the Double Sword, and the Double Axe all do 1d8/1d8, among the 3 only the Double Sword is not available as a Racial Weapon: you must invest a feat to learn it, and in that way it's inferior. The Dire Flail is also a Disarming and a Tripping Weapon, and neither the Double Axe nor the Double Sword are. Both the Double Axe and the Double Sword are Slashing weapons. The Dire Flail is a Bludgeoning weapon. I believe that more creatures have DR vs Slashing than Bludgeoning weapons, although I'm not sure about that, but Bludgeoning weapons have the advantage that you can make them in Alchemal Silver with no penalty to damage, and that does make them better at bypassing DR. The Dire Flail seems to me the superior weapon with the same damage and more options. In any event, neither the Double Axe nor the Double Sword are clearly superior to the Dire Flail.
If you are comparing a Medium-sized Hooked Hammer to a Medium-sized Double sword, as opposed to the Gnome-sized version, most of the damage difference goes away. The Hooked Hammer does 1d8/1d6 as compared with the Double Sword's 1d8/1d8, but the Sword only does Slashing Damage, whereas the Hooked Hammer does both Bludgeoning and Piercing Damage, so is better at bypassing DR, superior in its Alchemal Silver versions, and also is a Tripping Weapon. So you do lose 1 point of damage in your off-hand attack, but you gain versatility and tactical options, so the Gnome Hooked Hammer is not clearly inferior to either the Double Sword or the Double Axe.
Likewise the Dwarven Urgosh also sacrifices -1 damage on its off-hand attack, but it is both a Slashing and a Piercing weapon, and it's a Brace Weapon.
There are other double weapons that are just as formidiable if not more so than your double swords and axes. Look at the Meteor Hammer. Like the Double Sword, it does 1d8/1d8, but it's also a reach weapon and a Trip Weapon, and it can be used to give an AC bonus.
I'm only scratching the surface, here. There are lots of perfectly reasonable alternatives to your double swords and axes, and I don't think it's good advice to be close minded about them.
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