Animal Companions and unarmed strikes?


Rules Questions


Simple enough question, but I can't seem to find an answer anywhere.

Is an animal companion capable of using unarmed strikes with its natural attacks? As in doing a unarmed strike / bite / claw / claw as a full attack action rather than just bite / claw / claw.

The penalties would be heavy unless you have multiattack, of course, but the idea of a kung fu panda is kinda awesome.

Grand Lodge

Expect table variation.


177cheese wrote:

Simple enough question, but I can't seem to find an answer anywhere.

Is an animal companion capable of using unarmed strikes with its natural attacks? As in doing a unarmed strike / bite / claw / claw as a full attack action rather than just bite / claw / claw.

The penalties would be heavy unless you have multiattack, of course, but the idea of a kung fu panda is kinda awesome.

Yes.


Would the unarmed strike have to come from a specific limb?

By that I mean, would the unarmed strike iteratives replace a claw attack?


Yes, unless they're a monk (and they aren't).

Scarab Sages

Raw, yes. PFS, no.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
177cheese wrote:

Simple enough question, but I can't seem to find an answer anywhere.

Is an animal companion capable of using unarmed strikes with its natural attacks? As in doing a unarmed strike / bite / claw / claw as a full attack action rather than just bite / claw / claw.

The penalties would be heavy unless you have multiattack, of course, but the idea of a kung fu panda is kinda awesome.

Natural attacks are NOT unarmed strikes.


I'm pretty sure they already knew that.

As for the second question, any creature can perform an unarmed strike as a punch, kick, or headbutt.


Avoron wrote:

I'm pretty sure they already knew that.

As for the second question, any creature can perform an unarmed strike as a punch, kick, or headbutt.

Is there a ruling on this somewhere? I know monks can do unarmed strikes with their heads, shoulders, toenails, etc, but there isn't a whole lot of unarmed strike information for non-monks.

Sacrificing two claws for two weapon unarmed fighting with an AC's low BAB wouldn't be that great, but if you could throw in some monk-like unarmed strikes it might be interesting to build that way.


From the combat section of the Core Rulebook:

"Unarmed Attacks: Striking for damage with punches, kicks, and head butts is much like attacking with a melee weapon, except for the following"


Avoron wrote:

From the combat section of the Core Rulebook:

"Unarmed Attacks: Striking for damage with punches, kicks, and head butts is much like attacking with a melee weapon, except for the following"

Awesome! Thanks.


Be prepared for table variation on this. Remember that by both RAW and RAI you don't explicitly control the actions of your animal companion, you only give it commands via handle animal and the GM is supposed to determine how the companion behaves as a result. I would expect many GMs to say that the Attack trick is for the natural attacks only.

This is supported by the blog and Ultimate Campaign:

Quote from Ultimate Campaign

An intelligent animal is smart enough to use tools, but might lack the ability to manipulate them. a crow could be able to use simple lockpicks, but a dog can't. Even if the animal is physically capable of using a tool, it might still prefer its own natural body to manufactured items, especially when it comes to weapons. An intelligent gorilla could hold or wield a sword, but its inclination is to make slam attacks. No amount of training (including weapon proficiency feats) is going to make it fully comfortable attacking in any other way.

Second quote from blog:

Another aspect of intelligent animals is tool use. There are a number of feats that convey an understanding and the proper use of weapons and armor. Generally speaking, these feats are off-limits to animals, but when their intelligence reaches 3, the rules state that they can use any feat that they are physically capable of using. Some people take this to mean that they can equip their animal companion in chainmail and arm him with a greatsword given the correct feats. While you could interpret the rules in this way, the "capable of use" clause is very important. Most weapons require thumbs to use properly, and even then, few animals would choose to use an artificial weapon in place of the natural weapons that have served them all their life. It's what they were born with, after all, and virtually no amount of training will change that. In the end, the GM should feel free to restrict such choices if he feels that they take away from the feel of his campaign. The rules themselves are left a little vague to give the GM the latitude to make the call that's right for his campaign.


177cheese, to answer your question:

A normal animal will only use its natural attacks unless you have special rules to allow you to do otherwise.
---------------------

* An intelligent or player controlled creature with an animal body can make unarmed strikes using the normal rules, despite their form. They function in all ways as a humanoid using unarmed strikes, including needing the Improved Unarmed Strike feat to prevent AoOs.

* They cannot use natural weapons for these unarmed strikes. The damage is of type Bludgeoning and deals damage based on the creature's size, and will be nonlethal unless you're trained to deal lethal, per normal unarmed strike rules.

* You can combine unarmed strikes with natural attacks. Perform your unarmed strikes, based on your BAB, as normal, then perform any natural attacks you have at a -5 penalty. While you can't use the same limb for the unarmed strikes and the natural attacks, this is generally a non-issue as you can just pick another body part to perform the unarmed strikes with.

* The Feral Combat feat allows you to apply effects or feats for unarmed strikes to your natural attacks, but this doesn't allow you to use your natural attacks AS unarmed strikes. A monk with this feat can use a natural attack INSTEAD of an unarmed strike during a flurry of blows. (note, a monk can't add natural attacks on top of their flurry because it is specially called out)

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Rules Questions / Animal Companions and unarmed strikes? All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.