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Hello all,
I have a 3rd level character (1 Fighter / 2 Lorekeeper Oracle) that I just played today and reached 4th level. I have 2 module credits saved to this character already so I immediately jumped from 4th level to 6th level so I'm hoping someone can help me with spending my gold and what feats I should take.
What is set in stone - Fight 1 / Metal Oracle 2 (Ancient Lorekeeper)
CLASS -
* lvl1 Fighter / lvl2 METAL LORE-KEEPER Oracle
RACE -
* Elf
ALT RACIALS -
* Fleet-Footed: +2 initiative racial + Run feat
* Elven Magic: +2 vs SR, +2 spellcraft to ID magic items
TRAITS -
* Fate's Favored
* Helpful
ORACLE CURSE -
* Wasting
STATS -
* Str: 15
* Dex: 16
* Con: 12
* Int: 10
* Wis: 8
* Cha: 15
LEVELS -
* 1) Fighter 1: BAB +1, Combat Reflexes (lvl 1), Bodyguard (fighter)
* 2) Ancient Lorekeeper 1: BAB +1, Armor Mastery (Rev), +1/2 Rev Armor Mastery Favored Class Bonus
* 3) AL 2: BAB +2, Power Attack (lvl 3), fcb Armor Mastery
CURRENT SPELLS -
0: Detect Magic, Read Magic, Light, Purify Food and Drink
1: Divine Favor, Liberating Command, Cure Light Wounds, Arcane Mark (from Lore-keeper)
SKILL POINTS -
* Climb 1 rank, Intimidate 3 ranks, Knowledge Local 1 rank, Perception 3 ranks, Spellcraft 1 rank, Swim 1 rank
Metal Oracle gives me some of these skills as Class Skills.
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My plan was to do the following:
* Add ALL my Favored Class Bonuses to Armor Mastery to increase Max Dex Bonus on armor. (I found out Mithral Heavy armor does not count as Medium armor for purposes of Armor Mastery. So I will probably want Adamantine Medium Armor so I can ignore the movement speed penalty via Armor Mastery Revelation.) 10th level Oracle I'll treat Armor Mastery as 15th level.
LEVELS -
* 4) AL 3: BAB +3, Dance of the Blades (Rev), +1 str for 16 total, fcb Armor Mastery
* 5) AL 4: BAB +4, Furious Focus (lvl 5), fcb Armor Mastery
* 6) AL 5: BAB +4, fcb Armor Mastery
* 7) AL 6: BAB +5, Cornugon Smash (lvl 7), fcb Armor Mastery
* 8) AL 7: BAB +6/+1, UNDECIDED (Rev), +1 cha for 16 total, fcb Armor Mastery
* 9) AL 8: BAB +7/+2, Vital Strike (lvl 9), fcb Armor Mastery
* 10) AL 9: BAB +7/+2, fcb Armor Mastery
* 11) AL 10: BAB +8/+3, Divine Interference (lvl 11), fcb Armor Mastery
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Gold currently saved up - $19,342
Items I think I should buy? Adamantine Medium Armor (Agile Breastplate maybe). Beyond that I'm not sure how I could best spend my money.
Gear I already own: Scimitar, Tower Shield, MW Lucerne Hammer, Breastplate, Wand of CLW (41 charges)....that's about it.
Character Plan - I want to be a tanky frontline fighter (LoTR Elven Warrior type). So I think a Scimitar and heavy shield may be best? I could use a Tower shield but gives -2atk penalty.
My goal was to move, strike with 1 decent blow (+divine power, etc buff spells) and demoralize via Cornugon Smash. I get 4 AoO's per turn and I can use Bodyguard to give +3 AC to adjacent allies getting attacked to hopefully keep them from getting hit. I'm starting to wonder if this is not a good idea and if I should spend feats on other stuff.
What I'm noticing - So far my damage is not great at all and my to-hit is pretty low....If I go Adamantine Medium Armor I won't have as great AC as Mithral Full Plate but MFP lowers me at least 10speed since Armor Mastery Rev doesn't apply. Also, Armor Mastery is probably more beneficial on Heavy Armor...
I want to be tanky (I have low hp) and I want to be useful in combat and I've geared my character towards melee with some casting ability to be versatile.
I can pick 1 arcane spell per level at 2nd, 4th, 6th, 8th, 10th Oracle level which translates to following.
1 zero level arcane spell. Takes up 1st level spell slot. I picked Arcane Mark for fun on this one so that's set in stone.
1 first level arcane spell. Takes up 2nd level spell slot. UNDECIDED
1 second level arcane spell. Takes up 3rd level spell slot. UNDECIDED
1 third level arcane spell. Takes up 4th level spell slot. UNDECIDED
1 fourth level arcane spell. Takes up 5th level spell slot. UNDECIDED
In conclusion:
#1 - Help me spend my 19,342 gold
#2 - Help me decide on useful feats on my 3/4 bab melee Oracle
Should I go the 5th Furious Focus, 7th Cornugon Smash, 9th Vital Strike route? Or is this not that great and I'm better off with some other feats? I plan on using Scimitar and Heavy Shield.
#3 - Help me decide what Arcane spells to pick
((I apologize if this format is a bit messy. Tried to make it as clean/clear as possible.))
*** This is a Pathfinder Society Character ***
So I'll try to help with what I can. First off, I don't think your stats are that good for a melee character. Also I don't see what you like about armor mastery so much that you want to boost it every level.
Your con is low, so toughness and FCB for hit-point will help there. Why does Mithral Heavy armor not work for oracle ability? Your to hit isn't great because you're a 3/4 BAB with a low str (2) so you're not really getting any help there. Furious focus isn't a very good choice, Weapon focus is only 1 less not at lv 6, and it boosts all attacks. Unfortunately since you need power attack you need that penalty. (I'd not have gone this route if I were you, your hit is way to low for more penalties) Um... get a lot of STR booster gear and bonuses to your weapon's to hit. try to flank.
Okay, I'm sorry but it's killing me. You're asking for an optimization plan for a poor choice. Vital strike and furious focus generally aren't that good for feat choices. Vital strike at best is used with a big weapon, and your little scimitar isn't going to get much out of it. On average that's a +3 to damage. And a melee character with low str and con is hurting you. Is there a reason you need to be in the front? weapon finesse will give you another +1 to your hit rolls. Go ahead and keep the shield since you don't have a str to make use of power attack.
Also your battle plan is not the best with your setup. Buff your good guys. buff your martial character in the party, do debuff spells and start boosting your cha for better DC and take spell focus and stuff? Especially since you get the wizard spells it could be good.
So here are some of my ideas for you. I hope you find useful stuff in there.
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My character is what it is. I can't redo him as he's past 1st level in PFS.
I don't think my character is as poor as you suggest.
1) Since I reached lvl 4, I can bump str by 1 to 16. So that's +3 instead of +2 without including any items to further increase Str.
2) Mithral doesn't make Heavy armor Medium, only treats as 1 lighter for purposes of movement which Medium is still -10 movespeed. Armor Mastery only allows you to move at normal speed in medium armor. Spoke with multiple people at my local PFS and Mithral will not work for Armor Mastery.
You become more maneuverable while wearing armor. You can move at your normal speed in medium armor that is made of metal. This does not grant proficiency in armor. At 5th level, whenever you are wearing metal armor, you reduce the armor check penalty by 1 (to a minimum of 0) and increase the maximum Dexterity bonus allowed by your armor by 1. At 10th level, and again at 15th level, these bonuses increase by 1.
3) Armor Mastery was specifically for Full Plate Armor. Not sure if I should invest anymore than the 2 levels I already have, especially since Medium Armor is looking more attractive (Only 1k more for Adamantine Medium Armor instead of Mithral Platemail)
4) My Con is low, mostly due to being an Elf. Not much I can do there, at creation I went 14 (-2 racial).
5) I have Fate's Favored trait and later Divine Power (or Divine Favor) spell. 1 round to cast but at 9th level Oracle that's +4atk, +4dmg, +9 temp hp, +1 attack during full attacking.
6) I have access to Divine and Arcane spells to increase my melee ability (whether mirror image, displacement, or some kind of dmg/str increasing spells for options.) Would love to hear some suggestions on spells I should grab.
7) I picked Feats that I was hoping would allow me to Power Attack and not take penalties since I'm already 3/4 BAB so my Power Attacks hit for Cornugun Smash. I'm asking for suggestions for better Feats. If there's better choices I'd really like to know to make him better.
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Things I'm needing help with:
* Need help spending my 19,342 gold
* Need help deciding on useful feats for a 3/4 bab melee Oracle
* Need help deciding what Arcane spells to pick
You're case isn't hopeless, just difficult. Any limits on how you spend your money? Belt of giant's str +2. scimitar+2 headband of cha +2 armor+1 shield+1 that's 18000+base for gear. the belt and sword are most important to make you able to hit better. weapon focus will give you a + to hit. you can take furious focus if you really looking for any way to boost your to hit. lets see. BAB 4, str 4, weapon 2, weapon focus 1, power attack -2, divine power 2, total of +11 to hit.
Damagewise you can get a STR item, but not much else you can do, so I'd go with the belt as Chess says. Once you can afford it, switch to the STR/CON items for boosting hp simultaneously.
A magic weapon is a must-have, had to check again that there wasnt one :)
I would also drop the tower shield in favor of a normal one, because the -2 penalty on all attacks is too much for a 3/4 BAB in low levels.
Arcane spells to pick:
1st level
- Enlarge Person: there is your reach and a small damage boost
- Ray of Enfeeblement: weaker enemies are always good
- Shield: I wouldn't, but it carries a +4 shield bonus
- Shocking grasp: only good if you have Combat Casting or use it for the first attack, but it is additional damage and grants +3 to hit
2nd level
- Flaming Sphere: costs a move action to direct, maybe it works for you
- Glitterdust
- Mirror Image: my choice for this level
- See invisibility
It depends on campaign and DM if you need countermeasures to invisibility.
3rd level
- Displacement: 50% miss chance on all attacks is a solid defense
- Fireball: not a buff, but my all-time favorite
- Haste: extra attack; might be superfluous with Blessing of Fervor on 4th
- Heroism: unfortunately a morale bonus
- Rage: although a morale bonus and has a handicap, works on more than one
- Stinking Cloud: not a combat buff, but seriously consider it
4th level
- Confusion: when you face several opponents, this will help
- Fireshield: I couldnt care less about damage shields myself, but this one is also a protection spell
- Globe of Invulnerability, lesser: useful to must-have depending on campaign
- Invisibility, greater
- Stoneskin: DR 10/adamantine, should help with the HP
I stayed with the CRB and picked those which benefit a melee. Fireball and Stinking Cloud are not helping your melee power, but they will up your DPR and debuff the enemy. Assuming you don't want to cast in melee (I don't see Combat Casting among your feats), they are possible choices to cast before entering melee.
Many buffs are morale bonuses, including your divine arsenal, so arcane spells might not do it for you there.
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@Chess Pwn - Divine Power atm is +3, I think you forgot to add in Fate's Favored.
I'm not really that interested in a +2cha headband as I don't see it giving me much in return (most of my spells are either going to be buffs or heals with very few CC or Dmg.)
Should I be going for a +2 Scimitar or a +1 with Keen on it or some other magical effect? I guess the higher the + the better chance I will be hitting. Is the Scimitar probably my best bet for a 1 handed simple or martial weapon?
A Jingasa of the Fortunate Soldier would give me +2AC (Fate's Favored) and 1/day negate critical. Seems pretty good but I'm not sure if I should pick it up right now or around lvl 7 or 8.
Also, does Adamantine Agile Breastplate seem like a good choice? would be like 9.5k but that's DR 2/adamantine.
I agree a heavy shield is probably a better option. I did enjoy deploying my tower shield in front of doors though so people couldn't enter or retreat lol...but heavy shield it is.
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1st - Enlarge Person
2nd - Mirror Image, Cushioning Bands, Stone Call, Touch of Idiocy
3rd - Displacement, Ablative Armor, Resinous Skin, Strangling Hair, Elemental Aura, Twilight Knife, Fly, Vampiric touch
4th - Stinking Cloud, Black Tentacles, Monstrous Physique II, Volcanic Storm, Ball Lightning, Stone Skin, Elemental Body I (Earthglide, Swim, Fly? yes please)
False Life and Greater False Life are options.
Any of these spells seem like must haves? Remember, the Wizard spell takes up a slot 1 higher than normal but that also increases the DC by 1 so the spell better be worth it taking up a higher level spell slot. (Example, 1st level Enlarge Person is a 2nd level Divine spell for me.)
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Feel free to make some suggestions based off the items I mentioned and since PFS only lets you sell items back for 1/2price, swapping to str/con belt later is probably a bad idea.
Also, let me know what spells you think are great in the list I provided. I tried to pick offensive spells that had No Saves, or really strong defensive/buff spells.
Is enchanting the str belt to A str and con belt is like taking a plus over two a plus two? Just osu the difference? Also isn't divine power 1 per 3 caster level. You're a 5th lv caster so only one there. Trait makes it a two. Your caster level is your Oracle level. Also your ac seems pretty good while your hit is bad so focus on hit
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In PFS you can only progress a belt to higher versions of itself, so a +2str belt has a certain name and it can only go +2, +4, +6. The Str/Con belt is named something else so you can't convert a belt to a different belt. You have to sell the one and buy the other.
You're right on +2 at 5th caster level. I was thinking 6th caster level, sorry about that.
I think Weapon Focus is good, but it restricts me to 1 weapon. I'm fine with that but should I go with Scimitar? Taking Weapon Focus still leaves me with 2 free feats to spend, suggestions?
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I could use Favored Class Bonuses for
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That may be a good choice to bump up with FCB's. I'd reach 15th level Oracle only by 12th level though..but I could have whatever weapon, whenever, proficient with that's Adamatine and +1 by like 8th Oracle level. (3 away)
Still curious on the spells. I listed some really good Arcane ones. Would like to hear if anyone agrees with them or thinks they are bad choices.
It doesn't seem that people are that interested in building your character for you. Like I don't understand what else you're wanting from us.
Stuff you can do still is:
Look up guides to oracle, cleric or intimidating. See their feat suggestions.
Look up wizard guide for your spells.
use your gold to boost what you want to boost. boosting hit? boosting AC? boosting skills? there are easy items to pick up to boost what you want. You just need to decide on it.
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Arcane spells for a melee character is not common and won't be in a wizard guide. Most wizard guides focus on CC and some save or suck spells. I'm looking for Arcane spells that compliment self buffing/melee. I provided a bunch of spells, just wondering if any of them are bad choices or if any of them are "must gets".
I will look up some guides for fighter/cleric/oracle and see if I can find anything on melee feats. Was just hoping someone had some good feat ideas because 90% of the guides are outdated, since there's been a lot of new books/feats out since.
Just wondering what others would spend the gold on because I really don't have much gear wise. I like some of your suggestions earlier but I never got a response back on if Adamantine Medium Armor was a reasonably good choice, or if helmet of jingasa was a solid buy atm.
Hopefully this makes sense. I'm trying to increase my character's AC, to-hit chance, and damage mostly but willing to hear other neat suggestions.
I've looked up wizard spells, I've looked up feats, I've read reach cleric guides in the past, and I've looked through the magic items section on Core and Ultimate Equipment...but I understand that often it's better to have others take a look and suggest things as it's VERY EASY to miss things.....especially when I'm jumping from 3rd level to 6th. I just want to make sure I don't advance 3 levels and really screw stuff up by making bad choices.
The reason there's not much in way of buff spells is it's kind of easy to tell the buff spells. Bulls str, haste, enlarge, divine power. The adamantine armor DR will help your health, but is way to expensive. The jingasa gives AC to help not being hit in the first place, but is way to expensive. the armor is half your gold and the jingasa is a fourth. I think it'd be better to get lots of useful stats with your gold now. A +1 to your armor and shield costs 2000 and is more AC than the jingasa. I still stand by my recommendation earlier. If you don't want the headband yet that's fine, that gives you some money to put elsewhere, but the other stuff I feel is the best use of your money for what you want.
Now it might be useful to pick up a weapon that has multiple damage types. Like a morningstar or something. having the bonues for weapon focus being restricted to 1 weapon isn't really that bad, you mainly use your main weapon anyways, like you only really enhance one weapon anyways.
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Bulls str does not stack with Str enhancement items like the +2str belt you suggested so that spell is of no use. Haste does not stack with Divine Power, it's stated in the description. Enlarge is a pretty easy selection as there's not a ton of great spells at first level (there is Feather Fall which is great but you can buy a ring of it or Boots of the Cat to take minimal damage). Divine Power is a Divine spell so that's not even an option for Arcane.... So out of those 4 suggested, the 1st level spell is obvious... That leaves me with 2nd, 3rd, and 4th which I've mentioned multiple spells and no comments on. Hopefully you see what I'm saying, it's not that simple.
The main point of the Jingasa, which I mentioned earlier, is that it negates 1 confirmed critical hit on your character. So with my low hp, if something crits me I can turn it into a normal hit. The +2 AC is icing on the cake. That is why I asked if it was worth it to buy now at 6th level with the gold I have or to wait a level or two when I get a little extra gold.
I wanted to make sure I'm going with the right armor, Adamantine Medium or Mithral Heavy, or etc first before buying +1 armor that I have to sell later because it's not as helpful later on as one of the previous I mentioned. Just wanting to make sure I'm not wasting money. If going with +1 armor now, then I guess Agile Breastplate would be it. To be clear, whatever I decide on now is probably going to be the armor I use for the REST of my character's PFS career to lvl 12.
I do like your suggestions though so don't think I'm knocking them. Just wanting to make sure you know how PFS works and that if I buy something it can't be altered to mithral, adamantine, etc later on. And that name specific magic items can only be upgraded to higher versions of itself that are explicitly stated in the book.
If I pick up the "Iron Weapon" Revelation then I can summon any metal weapon I'd like and automatically be proficient with it and by 8th level Oracle the summoned item would be Adamantine +1, lasts for mins per Oracle lvl. So that's an option if I need versatility in a pinch. Not 100% sure I'll grab this Revelation but there's not a whole lot to choose from after getting the 2-3 really good ones.
The jingasa is a +1 AC. And if your AC is high enough they wont confirm the crit anyways.
I'd say just get normal armor and +1 it. 10,000 for adamantine is a ton of money. So unless you want to sink all that money now and have more time where you can't hit things, I don't know if adamantine is worth it.
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Jingasa is +1 AC but due to it being a Luck bonus, the Fate's Favored trait bumps that up to a +2. So it's a little better due to the trait.
I think you brought up a great point that if I'm dumping the 10k on the armor that I'm delaying improving my weapon, which lowers my damage output. I think you got me convinced there that I should just go with a +1 Agile Breastplate.
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Spending 19k I'm thinking of buying the following -
1) +1 Agile Breastplate
2) +1 shield. Is it only bucklers and light shields that allow casting with that hand also?
3) Scabbard of Vigor - for extra +atk bonuses when needed.
4) Cloak of Resistance +1
5) Helmet of Jingasa - +2ac due to Fate's Favored and negate 1 crit a day.
6) +2 Scimitar
7) Belt of Giant's Strength (or I could delay some other items and get Belt of Physical Might for 10k now)
8) Boots of the Cat - take minimal fall dmg and not fall prone. (no need for boots of haste, doesn't stack with Divine Power)
I'm not worried about increasing my Charisma as I'm more melee focused, I'll probably pick up a headband later down the road though. Any items I may be missing?
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In PFS you can only progress a belt to higher versions of itself, so a +2str belt has a certain name and it can only go +2, +4, +6. The Str/Con belt is named something else so you can't convert a belt to a different belt. You have to sell the one and buy the other.
You're right on +2 at 5th caster level. I was thinking 6th caster level, sorry about that.
I think Weapon Focus is good, but it restricts me to 1 weapon. I'm fine with that but should I go with Scimitar? Taking Weapon Focus still leaves me with 2 free feats to spend, suggestions?
----I could use Favored Class Bonuses for ** spoiler omitted **
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That may be a good choice to bump up with FCB's. I'd reach 15th level Oracle only by 12th level though..but I could have whatever weapon, whenever, proficient with that's Adamatine and +1 by like 8th Oracle level. (3 away)Still curious on the spells. I listed some really good Arcane ones. Would like to hear if anyone agrees with them or thinks they are bad choices.
I'd like to apologize for the false information. I just discovered that you can upgrade belts and headbands to existing ones with additional stat scores. Posting link for details: Here