Goblin Squad Member
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...if I got at least a one in each of my role's orisons/cantrips/etc. and skills, I would improve my stat. Heck of a lot cheaper than buying ranks at all the crafters.But, for some, more confusing, because one ends up with a ton of slottable Feats without tooltips, so one has to move them in and out of one's hotbar one-at-a-time to make comparison, or--once again--head for the spreadsheets. It became easier, taking advantage of this being Alpha and high-experience-rate, to buy all the passives one could get one's hands on, and not to worry, yet, about developing one's character as one will choose in Early Enrollment.
I agree. Buying a ton of feats that I never plan on using just to increase a stat is completely counter-intuitive. I really do not like the way they are handling attribute increases. Feats should have attribute prerequisites, that is fine, but they should not also increase attributes. I would like to see that handled with a separate system.
What I suggest is this:
As you gain levels in Roles, you gain attribute training points, which you can use to increase your attributes. Different races cost different amounts to train attributes. So for example, to increase Strength, it would cost less attribute training points for a Dwarf than for an Elf.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Alpha 7.1 was my first entry into the game. I was a bit stunned for the first hour with all of the decisions I needed to make to build a character.
I started as neutral/tolerant of the attribute/stat mechanism. After running around for a day or two I actually liked the mechanic. Yes, I had to make decisions as to what secondary skills I'd buy for stat increases, but those decisions seemed to me to adds breadth to the character.
Would I be a miner who could also help in the smelter and tannery, or would I be a miner who is also a buffed, high-hit point fighter, or some combination of the two? Or would I be a good miner with the barest smattering of a lot of abilities that I would never use (because I min-maxed and used the very cheapest Con:XP gains I could find)? Decisions, decisions...
I am really looking forward to EE, and its promise of decisions, work, and social interactions that will matter in the long term game.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I agree. Buying a ton of feats that I never plan on using just to increase a stat is completely counter-intuitive. I really do not like the way they are handling attribute increases. Feats should have attribute prerequisites, that is fine, but they should not also increase attributes. I would like to see that handled with a separate system.
What I suggest is this:
As you gain levels in Roles, you gain attribute training points, which you can use to increase your attributes. Different races cost different amounts to train attributes. So for example, to increase Strength, it would cost less attribute training points for a Dwarf than for an Elf.
I had a similar thought with relation to the difficulty training personality for crafters. Maybe we could chose to put XP into an attribute, which could then be absorbed by appropriate skills? (Pulling out of thin air: 1000 xp lets me buy personality 11, 2000 more lets me buy personality 12, 3000 more lets me buy personality 13, then I can use that pool of "personality points" toward skills and feats that are personality tied, rather than finding the right combination of personality tied things in order to get it up so I have a pre-req I need.
Then, instead of getting "Need personality 11.727/12 [so go find some random skill mix that will boost it by .273]" I'd get "Your personality isn't high enough to purchase that skill.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Albadeon: are you maybe using the same item in more than one slot? I've tested that and the interface was unclear enough to file a bug on it.I'm not sure and have no way to check now, but possibly that might be the problem. For most slots I had multiple options and tried several variations, but for one slot I could only use one resource. I thought maybe that was where the problem was, as that had a count of 0, but would still let me add it. But other recipes where I added these count 0 ingredients have worked just fine. It seemed to be mostly stuff dropped by killed enemies, and since I did that quite a lot, I figured that 0 may be something like "100+"
I ran into some of the 0 materials, too.
Has anyone gathered more than 100 of anything and used it in a recipe? Did it show up as 0?
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Goblin Squad Member
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I had over 300 iron ore at one point which didn't seem to be a problem. I did notice that a single tigereye showed up as 0 when crafting, and more than one showed up correctly. No idea why.
I would really like, to echo some of the above comments (bluddwolf I think), that we really need to know which spells are wand and which staff along with which of those are main hand and off-hand. In the alpha there was enough XP to just buy 1 rank of everything and test by slotting but in EE that is not a viable approach. Expecting players that have not played in Alpha to understand the system and know what to do seems like a recipe for disaster.
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Goblin Squad Member
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With regard to the bugged recipes.
I experimented with this and found a couple of things.
- transferring them to another player they stayed bugged.
- the bug seemed to actually be they became "transparent" . If you right clicked on them to learn them you actually could select what was underneath them in the user interface.
Another annoyance:
some items such as goblin weapons disappeared when you transferred stacks
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Goblin Squad Member
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If there were an exception, maybe it should be limited to crossbows - give them a purpose. Standing up with a 6 foot long bow and taking a shot would be more visible than a crossbow that could be fired prone or near-prone.
If you're using realism as the basis I think this idea gets nixed when you have to stand up and hold the crossbow down with one foot while you turn a squeaky crank to reset the string.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Albadeon: are you maybe using the same item in more than one slot? I've tested that and the interface was unclear enough to file a bug on it.I'm not sure and have no way to check now, but possibly that might be the problem. For most slots I had multiple options and tried several variations, but for one slot I could only use one resource. I thought maybe that was where the problem was, as that had a count of 0, but would still let me add it. But other recipes where I added these count 0 ingredients have worked just fine. It seemed to be mostly stuff dropped by killed enemies, and since I did that quite a lot, I figured that 0 may be something like "100+"I ran into some of the 0 materials, too.
Has anyone gathered more than 100 of anything and used it in a recipe? Did it show up as 0?
I put in mass batches of steel wire with stacks of iron and coal over 200 each and they displayed correctly in the smeltmill.
Where I ran into crafting bugs was putting in dwarven plate at the tail end of that big steel wire run. The steel wire progress bar turned into dwarven plate and steel wire was gone. Turns out the mill spit out steel wires and dwarven plate like it was supposed to, it just wasn't showing me the progress bars queue correctly.
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Goblin Squad Member
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If there were an exception, maybe it should be limited to crossbows - give them a purpose. Standing up with a 6 foot long bow and taking a shot would be more visible than a crossbow that could be fired prone or near-prone.
If they did something like that for the crossbow, hopefully for just one shot from stealth. A crossbow would require you to be standing to reload, except maybe the hand crossbow.
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Goblin Squad Member
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If there were an exception, maybe it should be limited to crossbows - give them a purpose. Standing up with a 6 foot long bow and taking a shot would be more visible than a crossbow that could be fired prone or near-prone.If they did something like that for the crossbow, hopefully for just one shot from stealth. A crossbow would require you to be standing to reload, except maybe the hand crossbow.
If you want them to be historical you need crossbows to be better than bows when the individual has limited skills but very quickly become impractical.
I am not aware of any extensive use of crossbows beyond the range equivalent of massed pikeman or maybe the WWII basic trained Rifleman squad.
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Goblin Squad Member
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...except maybe the hand crossbow.Curiosity: has there ever been a lethal hand crossbow, historically, or is it an invention of the role-play community?
People still argue over whether historically they were genuine weapons or were just toys.
See here: Ballistrino.
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Out of personal experience many years ago I had the chance to play around with an archer-collectors X-bow collection for a few hours. I test fired i think about a dozen different models but by FAR the one I liked most was this simple, homemade (Or commissioned rather, don't know the manufacturer) hand-sytle x-bow. It was about 8 inches tall, by 11 inches wide uncocked, and seemed if anything to be MORE powerful and accurate due to the fact it weighed about half as much as the larger kinds I tried out. As for how deadly it was, all I can say is that I was able to hit a target laminated wooden 50 feet away reliably and the bolt always stuck no matter the size of the implement. It also looked the bow-portion was made of layered wood and carbon-fiber epoxied together, and the "string" was some kind of leather. The things were terrifying to be quite honest, I'd much rather be shot with a pistol anyday.
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Goblin Squad Member
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...except maybe the hand crossbow.Curiosity: has there ever been a lethal hand crossbow, historically, or is it an invention of the role-play community?
I don't really know. But in literature, hand crossbows were ideal for rogues and assassins. The bolts were also usually coated with some type of poison.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Once they're banked they're no longer objects that reside in particular places, they're abstracted to the global financial system.Considering banking pretty much has been around since the first Templars realized that escorting 20 bags of gold from Rome to Paris and meeting half way another bunch of Templars coming the other way escorting 20 bags of gold from Paris to Rome for a different customer was an exercise in futility I think it is historically pretty accurate to have centralised money.
Whether other items such as raw materials and armor should also be accessible anywhere is questionable. I would hope not.
As far as we know, you'll be able to open the market in Thornkeep and see what's for sale in Fort Inevitable*, but physical goods won't be magically delivered around the world. Someone will have to carry them from place to place. Someone will probably be along to guard them, because someone will probably be out there waiting to intercept and steal them.
*If the game didn't show us global price data, cartels would just place characters in all the major market hubs and display the prices on Web sites anyway.
I was under the impression Fort Inevitable will not exist for quite some time after EE?
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Goblin Squad Member
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I was under the impression Fort Inevitable will not exist for quite some time after EE?Once they're banked they're no longer objects that reside in particular places, they're abstracted to the global financial system.Considering banking pretty much has been around since the first Templars realized that escorting 20 bags of gold from Rome to Paris and meeting half way another bunch of Templars coming the other way escorting 20 bags of gold from Paris to Rome for a different customer was an exercise in futility I think it is historically pretty accurate to have centralised money.
Whether other items such as raw materials and armor should also be accessible anywhere is questionable. I would hope not.
As far as we know, you'll be able to open the market in Thornkeep and see what's for sale in Fort Inevitable*, but physical goods won't be magically delivered around the world. Someone will have to carry them from place to place. Someone will probably be along to guard them, because someone will probably be out there waiting to intercept and steal them.
*If the game didn't show us global price data, cartels would just place characters in all the major market hubs and display the prices on Web sites anyway.
I'm under the same impression. I believe the order of appearance will be Thornkeep, then Fort Inevitable, then Fort Riverwatch.
For purposes of the price data discussion, you could fill in any of the player settlements. The idea is that if you open a market window in any of them, you'll be able to see prices in all of them.
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Goblin Squad Member
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In relationship to the posts a page or two back about Cleric defensive feats and armor, I thought I would post up the proposed keywords for the three cleric feats up to level 14.
The significant thing is as more keywords match the keywords i the armor, the keyword bonuses from that feat will increase.
Interestingly, unless its a typo, Evangelist 14 acquires the Heavy keyword as well as Medium.
Crusader 1 Heavy
Crusader 2 Heavy, Blessed
Crusader 3 Heavy, Blessed
Crusader 4 Heavy, Blessed, Distributed
Crusader 5 Heavy, Blessed, Distributed
Crusader 6 Masterwork, Heavy, Blessed, Distributed
Crusader 7 Masterwork, Heavy, Blessed, Distributed
Crusader 8 Masterwork, Heavy, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened
Crusader 9 Masterwork, Heavy, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened
Crusader 10 Celestial, Fiendish, Masterwork, Heavy, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened
Crusader 11 Celestial, Fiendish, Masterwork, Heavy, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened
Crusader 12 Celestial, Fiendish, Masterwork, Heavy, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened, Dense
Crusader 13 Celestial, Fiendish, Masterwork, Heavy, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened, Dense
Crusader 14 Celestial, Fiendish, Adamantine, Masterwork, Heavy, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened, Dense
Evangelist 1 Medium
Evangelist 2 Medium, Blessed
Evangelist 3 Medium, Blessed
Evangelist 4 Medium, Blessed, Distributed
Evangelist 5 Medium, Blessed, Distributed
Evangelist 6 Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Distributed
Evangelist 7 Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Distributed
Evangelist 8 Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened
Evangelist 9 Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened
Evangelist 10 Celestial, Fiendish, Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened
Evangelist 11 Celestial, Fiendish, Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened
Evangelist 12 Celestial, Fiendish, Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened, Dense
Evangelist 13 Celestial, Fiendish, Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened, Dense
Evangelist 14 Celestial, Fiendish, Masterwork, Medium, Heavy, Blessed, Distributed, Strengthened, Dense
Healer 1 Medium
Healer 2 Medium, Blessed
Healer 3 Medium, Blessed
Healer 4 Medium, Blessed, Supple
Healer 5 Medium, Blessed, Supple
Healer 6 Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Supple
Healer 7 Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Supple
Healer 8 Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Supple, Flexible
Healer 9 Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Supple, Flexible
Healer 10 Celestial, Fiendish, Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Supple, Flexible
Healer 11 Celestial, Fiendish, Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Supple, Flexible
Healer 12 Celestial, Fiendish, Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Supple, Flexible, Quiet
Healer 13 Celestial, Fiendish, Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Supple, Flexible, Quiet
Healer 14 Celestial, Fiendish, Truesilver, Masterwork, Medium, Blessed, Supple, Flexible, Quiet