Reference: Skills, Trainers, and Training Structures

[Giorgo]

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Gathering Skills:
Dowser (PER)
Requires: Alchemist Lab, Arcanist's Workshop, Artificer Workshop, Enchanter, Iconographer
Gathers: Essences

Forester (WIS)
Requires: Apothecary, Sawmill
Gathers: Plants

Miner (CON)
Requires: Geologist, Smeltmill
Gathers: Rocks

Scavenger (WIS)
Requires: Jeweler, Loom, Tailor
Gathers: Junk

Refining skills:
Apothecary (WIS)
Requires: Apothecary
Refines: Chemical
Raw Materials: Combat/Forester/Miner/Scavenger

Gemcutter (DEX)
Requires: Geologist
Refines: Gem
Raw Materials: Combat/Miner

Sage (PER)
Requires: Arcanist's Workshop
Refines: Essence
Raw Materials: Combat/Dowser/Miner

Sawyer (CON)
Requires: Sawmill
Refines: Wood
Raw Materials: Combat/Forester/Miner

Smelter (CON)
Requires: Smeltmill
Refines: Metal
Raw Materials: Combat/Miner

Tanner (CON)
Requires: Tannery
Refines: Leather
Raw Materials: Combat

Weaver (DEX)
Requires: Loom
Refines: Cloth
Raw Materials: Combat/Forester

Crafting Skills:
Alchemist (INT)
Requires: Alchemist Lab
Produces: Consumables
Production Line: Apothecary/Sage/Smelter

Armorsmith (STR)
Requires: Quartermaster
Produces: Medium and Heavy armors
Production Line: Apothecary/Gemcutter/Sage/Sawyer/Smelter/Tannery/Weaver

Artificer (INT)
Requires: Artificer Workshop
Produces: Arcane weapons and implements
Production Line: Gemcutter/Sage/Sawyer/Smelter

Blacksmith (STR)
Requires: ?
Produces: ?
Production Line: ?

Bowyer (DEX)
Requires: Woodshop
Produces: Ranged weapons
Production Line: Apothecary/Sawyer/Smelter/Tannery/Weaver

Carpenter (CON)
Requirements: Sawmill, Woodshop
Produces: ?
Production Line: ?

Engineer (INT)
Requires: Quartermaster
Produces: Shields, Camp Consumables, campsites, and kit implements [Aristocrat, Expert, Rogue]
Production Line: Apothecary/Sawyer/Smelter/Weaver

Iconographer (WIS)
Requires: Iconographer
Produces: Divine and miscellaneous implements (Barbarian, Cleric, Druid)
Production Line: Apothecary/Gemcutter/Sage/Sawyer/Smelter/Tannery

Jeweler (INT)
Requires: Jeweler
Produces: Jewelry accessory items: Belts, Bracelets, Circlets, Necklaces, and Rings), and implements (Fighter)
Production Line: Gemcutter/Smelter

Leatherworker (DEX )
Requires: Leather Worker
Produces: Light armors and leather accessory items: Belts, Boots, Gloves, Hats, and Pouches/Packs
Production Line: Apothecary/Smelter/Tannery/Weaver

Tailor (DEX)
Requires: Tailor
Produces: Cloth armors and cloth accessory items: Robes, Belts, Caps, Cloaks, Clothes, Gloves, Slippers, and Pouches
Production Line: Sage/Smelter/Tannery/Weaver

Weaponsmith (STR)
Requires: Quartermaster
Produces: Melee weapons, commoner implements
Production Line: Apothecary/Gemcutter/Sage/Smelter/Tannery

Stonemason (STR)
Requires: Geologist
Produces: ?
Production Line:?

Crafting & Refining
Spellcraft (INT)
Requires: Enchanter
Produces: ?
Production Line: ?

Settlement Skills:
Architect (INT)
Requires: ?
Effect: ?

Officer (PER)
Requires: ?
Effect: ?

Seneschal (PER)
Requires: ?
Effect: ?

Soldier (STR)
Requires: ?
Effect: ?

Knowledge Skills:
Arcana (INT)
Requires:?
Effect: ?

Dungeoneering (INT)
Requires:?
Effect: ?

Geography (INT)
Requires: Artificer Workshop
Effect: ?

History (INT)
Requires:?
Effect: ?

Local (INT)
Requires:?
Effect: ?

Nature (INT)
Requires: Tannery
Effect: ?

Religion (INT)
Requires:?
Effect: ?

Planes (INT)
Requires:?
Effect: ?

General Skills
Athletics (STR)
Bluff (PER)
Disable Device (DEX)
Escape Artist (DEX)
Fly (DEX)
Handle Animal (PER)
Perception (WIS)
Perform (PER)
Persuasion (PER)
Ride (DEX)
Sense Motive (WIS)
Stealth (DEX)
Survival (WIS)

[Giorgo]

Is the above information correct?

[DeciusBrutus]

So far it's just a list. I don't think it's very useful to list every refining skill that produces an item that is used in a crafting skill, but meh.

[Nightdrifter]

Disguise isn't on the list of skills currently. Presumably a bunch of new tech would need to be in place before it becomes a meaningful skill (if it's not being scrapped). Then again Fly is already on the skills list and it's questionable as to whether we'll ever be able to fly.

[Guurzak]

Knowledge skills increase the loot available from monster kills in appropriate families.

[Nihimon]

Guurzak wrote:

Knowledge skills increase the loot available from monster kills in appropriate families.

Just in case any of the folks with new Alpha Access see this, this hasn't been functional in Alpha yet. Although it might be in this weekend's build. Keep an eye out for it in the Release Notes :)

[Gol Xykal]

DeciusBrutus wrote:

So far it's just a list. I don't think it's very useful to list every refining skill that produces an item that is used in a crafting skill, but meh.

Well I for one find this list useful. Thank you, Giorgio.

[Giorgo]

I believe more people will find this as a valuable reference during the Alpha period, and before this information will be made more user-friendly for future PFO Wiki articles. At this time, most of this information is scattered all over the place, and its a detriment for new players to get up to speed.

I am glad a few people have found it useful. :)

[Bringslite of Fidelis]

Giorgo wrote:

I believe more people will find this as a valuable reference during the Alpha period, and before this information will be made more user-friendly for future PFO Wiki articles. At this time, most of this information is scattered all over the place, and its a detriment for new players to get up to speed.

I am glad a few people have found it useful. :)

The single most common problem/question that I hear (from new or inquisitive people) is "where can I find consolidated information?" It isn't always a requirement that it be "hard" fact. Just what the most current ideas (GW statements) are.

[Giorgo]

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Next Update:

Settlement Skills:
Architect (INT)
Requires: Keep
Effect: ?

Officer (PER)
Requires: Barracks
Effect: ?

Seneschal (PER)
Requires: Keep, Guild House
Effect: ?

Soldier (STR)
Requires: Barracks, Training Field
Effect: ?

Pending Confirmation
Blacksmith, Carpenter, Stonemanson

[Lam]

As there are many skill a commoner or expert may train, I suspect there are a few that aristocrats can choose.

[randomwalker]

Giorgo wrote:

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Pending Confirmation
Blacksmith, Carpenter, Stonemanson

these three skills match the bulk construction resources very well:

Blacksmith -> bulk iron ore
Carpenter -> bulk wood
Stonemason -> bulk stone

I expect the 3 skills are for constructing buildings (settlements/PoI). So far unknown how they interface with Architect (and siege engineer...)

[Guurzak]

Lam wrote:

As there are many skill a commoner or expert may train, I suspect there are a few that aristocrats can choose.

Any character can train any skill, regardless of role, so long as he has the needed attributes.

Some skills have a particular affinity or bonus for some roles: Commoners for gathering and refining skills, Experts for refining, and Aristocrats for group-oriented skills like Officer and Seneschal. But those bonuses are not limitations: an Aristocrat with high Personality could make an excellent Dowser or Sage even though those are considered Commoner skills.

[Nihimon]

Guurzak wrote:

Any character can train any skill, regardless of role, so long as he has the needed attributes.

... so long as he has the needed ability scores, feats, and achievements.

It's a very minor correction, but it's probably worth saying it that way. This is the actual way the requirements are noted, so getting the community used to thinking of it this way is probably a good idea.

[Edit] Also, it's Experts for Crafting, not Refining.

[Guurzak]

Nihimon wrote:

Guurzak wrote:

Any character can train any skill, regardless of role, so long as he has the needed attributes.

... so long as he has the needed ability scores, feats, and achievements.

It's a very minor correction, but it's probably worth saying it that way. This is the actual way the requirements are noted, so getting the community used to thinking of it this way is probably a good idea.

Yeah, I had forgotten the achievement gating. I wasn't aware there was any feat gating on skill training- do you have an example?

Quote:

Also, it's Experts for Crafting, not Refining.

That was purely a "changed my wording three times and didn't finish cleaning up" error. Part of the reason for that is that "crafting" could mean specifically "finished goods creation" or could mean the item production systems as a whole. Do we need a word to refer specifically to finished goods creation, or should we just agree that "crafting" does not include gathering and refining? If the latter, do we need a general word that includes the entire process?

[DeciusBrutus]

You need the appropriate proficiency feats for each weapon or armor feat, and the previous level for feats above level 1.

[Guurzak]

Of course. Those aren't skills, though.

[DeciusBrutus]

"Skills" isn't a term of art that refers to a trainable of PFO. The things that you purchase at trainers are "Feats", some of which improve the part of the character sheet labeled "Skills".

Sorry if the pedantry is too much, I've been spending time trying to organize the wiki namespace for simple automated updating, and it's a pain.

[Guurzak]

I think you've strayed past pedantry into obstructionism, in this case. Even having agreed that everything you train is a feat, it should be obvious to any reader except the willfully obtuse that "skill training" specifically refers to training those feat lines "which improve the part of the character sheet labeled 'Skills'."

I'm not aware of any cases where skill training is gated by a feat requirement other than the prior steps in that skill line, but if there are such I'd love to improve my understanding.

[Nihimon]

Guurzak wrote:

I wasn't aware there was any feat gating on skill training- do you have an example?

The Feat Advancements spreadsheet at Pathfinder Online (Public) lists the requirements to train Feats. Looking over that just now, I realize I left out the Category requirements.

Category Requirements refer to Achievement Categories rather than specific Achievements. For example, the Achievement Arcane Expert 1 awards 1 Arcane Category point. You can see all the Achievements and how many points of which Category they award in the Achievements spreadsheet.

Feat Requirements refer to Feats that must be purchased with XP from a Trainer.

Achievement Requirements refer to specific Achievements that must be earned by completing tasks in-game.

Ability Score Requirements refer to Ability Scores that must be increased by purchasing appropriate Feats.

Every Level of every Feat has a spot for each type of requirement: Category, Feat, Achievement, Ability Score.

I think you were subconsciously resisting thinking of Proficiencies and Bonuses as Feats, but they are. To answer the question I think you were asking, though:

Cantrip Acid Dart requires the Conjurer.
Reactive Turn Undead requires Channel Positive Energy.
Utility Lookout requires Perception.

[Nihimon]

Guurzak wrote:

... "skill training" specifically refers to training those feat lines "which improve the part of the character sheet labeled 'Skills'."

And it's clear now that I missed the fact that you were limiting your statement to training "Skills".

I am not aware of any Feat requirements for any Skills at all, in that the Feat Requirement column is empty for every level of every Feat on the Skills tab.

[Nihimon]

It may be pedantic, but I feel I should point out that I might have better understood you were referring specifically to Skills if you'd capitalized it to indicate it was a term of art. I also feel the need to point out that using the term "attributes" instead of the term of art "Ability Scores" or "Abilities" lulled me into thinking you were using vernacular terms for general concepts.

[Giorgo]

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Alpha Build 6 (8/22/14)

Gathering Skills:
Profession: Dowser (PER)
Requires: Alchemist Lab, Arcanist's Workshop, Artificer Workshop, Enchanter,
Iconographer
Gathers: Essences ("Colorful collection of sparks"; ?)

Profession: Forester (WIS)
Requires: Apothecary, Sawmill
Gathers: Plants ("A few interesting plants"; Logs, Berries, Leaves, Foxfire, Smoke Peppers...)

Profession: Miner (CON)
Requires: Geologist, Smeltmill
Gathers: Rocks ("A mound of shiny rocks"; Ore, Coal, Gems...)

Profession: Scavenger (WIS)
Requires: Jeweler, Loom, Tailor
Gathers: Junk ("Pile of trash"; generally has something you'd find in that same hex in either a Forester or Miner node)

Note: All resource nodes show up on the mini-map with yellow-ish icons. You can hover over them on the mini-map to see what they are from a distance. After you deplete a node, there is a slight delay before it disappears from your mini-map.

Refining skills:
Profession: Apothecary (WIS)
Requires: Apothecary
Refines: Chemical
Raw Materials: Combat/Forester/Miner/Scavenger

Profession: Gemcutter (DEX)
Requires: Geologist
Refines: Gem
Raw Materials: Combat/Miner

Profession: Sage (PER)
Requires: Arcanist's Workshop
Refines: Essence
Raw Materials: Combat/Dowser/Miner

Profession: Sawyer (CON)
Requires: Sawmill
Refines: Wood
Raw Materials: Combat/Forester/Miner

Profession: Smelter (CON)
Requires: Smeltmill
Refines: Metal
Raw Materials: Combat/Miner

Profession: Tanner (CON)
Requires: Tannery
Refines: Leather
Raw Materials: Combat

Profession: Weaver (DEX)
Requires: Loom
Refines: Cloth
Raw Materials: Combat/Forester

Crafting Skills:
Craft: Alchemist (INT)
Requires: Alchemist Lab
Produces: Consumables
Production Line: Apothecary/Sage/Smelter

Craft: Armorsmith (STR)
Requires: Quartermaster
Produces: Medium and Heavy armors
Production Line: Apothecary/Gemcutter/Sage/Sawyer/Smelter/Tannery/Weaver

Craft: Artificer (INT)
Requires: Artificer Workshop
Produces: Arcane weapons and implements
Production Line: Gemcutter/Sage/Sawyer/Smelter

Craft: Bowyer (DEX)
Requires: Woodshop
Produces: Ranged weapons
Production Line: Apothecary/Sawyer/Smelter/Tannery/Weaver

Craft: Engineer (INT)
Requires: Quartermaster
Produces: Shields, Camp Consumables, campsites, and kit implements [Aristocrat, Expert, Rogue]
Production Line: Apothecary/Sawyer/Smelter/Weaver

Craft: Iconographer (WIS)
Requires: Iconographer
Produces: Divine and miscellaneous implements (Barbarian, Cleric, Druid)
Production Line: Apothecary/Gemcutter/Sage/Sawyer/Smelter/Tannery

Craft: Jeweler (INT)
Requires: Jeweler
Produces: Jewelry accessory items: Belts, Bracelets, Circlets, Necklaces, and Rings), and implements (Fighter)
Production Line: Gemcutter/Smelter

Craft: Leatherworker (DEX )
Requires: Leather Worker
Produces: Light armors and leather accessory items: Belts, Boots, Gloves, Hats, and Pouches/Packs
Production Line: Apothecary/Smelter/Tannery/Weaver

Craft: Tailor (DEX)
Requires: Tailor
Produces: Cloth armors and cloth accessory items: Robes, Belts, Caps, Cloaks, Clothes, Gloves, Slippers, and Pouches
Production Line: Sage/Smelter/Tannery/Weaver

Craft: Weaponsmith (STR)
Requires: Quartermaster
Produces: Melee weapons, commoner implements
Production Line: Apothecary/Gemcutter/Sage/Smelter/Tannery

Crafting & Refining
Spellcraft (INT)
Requires: Enchanter
Produces: ?
Production Line: ?

Settlement Skills:
Trade: Architect (INT)
Requires: Keep
Effect: ?

Trade: Carpenter (CON)
Requirements: Sawmill, Woodshop
Produces: ?
Production Line: ?

Trade: Officer (PER)
Requires: Barracks
Effect: ?

Trade: Seneschal (PER)
Requires: Keep, Guild House
Effect: ?

Trade: Soldier (STR)
Requires: Barracks, Training Field
Effect: ?

Trade: Stonemason (STR)
Requires: Geologist
Produces: ?
Production Line:?

Knowledge Skills:
Knowledge: Arcana (INT)
Requires:
Effect: ?

Knowledge: Dungeons (INT)
Requires:
Effect: ?

Knowledge: Geography (INT)
Requires: Artificer Workshop
Effect: ?

Knowledge: History (INT)
Requires:
Effect: ?

Knowledge: Local (INT)
Requires:
Effect: ?

Knowledge: Nature (INT)
Requires: Tannery
Effect: ?

Knowledge: Planes (INT)
Requires:
Effect: ?

Knowledge: Survival (WIS or INT?)
Requires:
Effect: ?
(Edit): Was moved from General to Knowledge skill list.

Note: Knowledge skills increase the loot available from monster kills in appropriate categories (not yet implemented).

General Skills
Athletics (STR)
Bluff (PER)
Disable Device (DEX)
Escape Artist (DEX)
Fly (DEX)
Handle Animal (PER)
Heal (?)
Perception (WIS)
Perform (PER)
Persuasion (PER)
Ride (DEX)
Sense Motive (WIS)
Stealth (DEX)

Not on Character Sheet, but previously mentioned:
Religion (INT)
Requires:
Effect: ?

Blacksmith (STR)
Requires: ?
Produces: ?
Production Line: ?

Change log:
1- Updated list above to represent what shows on the Character Sheet (Press "C"), and with the correct wording.
2- Added notes where needed.

[Being]

Guurzak wrote:

I'm not aware of any cases where skill training is gated by a feat requirement other than the prior steps in that skill line, but if there are such I'd love to improve my understanding.

I know that in order to advance your skill at the loom you must first actually spin hemp twine. I suspect there are similar achievements for all the crafts that act as a gating mechanism with varying amount and quality (+0, +1, +2) requirements.

[Guurzak]

that's an achievement gate, not a feat gate. In order to advance your skill at a loom you must first spin twine, but you do not have to visit a trainer and spend XP on "shuttle attack bonus" or any other feats except the actual skill itself.

[Being]

Cleric 3 or 4 required a martial feat from the Dreadnaught trainer. The cleric cannot progress without that feat from a different skill line.

[Guurzak]

Weaver is a skill. Cleric is not a skill.

[Nihimon]

Yeah, Being, that threw me a bit at first, too.

I believe Guurzak is very specifically talking only about Skills, as in the Feats that only appear on the Skills tab of the Feat Advancements spreadsheet in Pathfinder Online (Public).

[Guurzak]

It's perfectly obvious to me what I mean!

>8-[

[T7V Jazzlvraz]

The fact that this has become a point of conversation, and possibly confusion, makes it a valuable learning, both for us and, I hope, for Goblinworks.

[Giorgo]

Update: Alpha Build 11.0 (11/07/14)

Alpha 10 blog wrote:
“Added Commoner and Expert trainers to starting towns, crafting towns, and Thornkeep. Currently they only train the armor feats related to Commoners and Experts.”

Lee Hammock wrote:
“Commoner and Expert trainers are not currently associated with any buildings. Eventually they will have their own buildings, but the art assets were not requested for this stage as getting the armor feats set up for them was a bit of an unexpected bonus. I figured giving crafters and gatherers another thing to spend XP on was worth not waiting for the building. ”

[Giorgo]

Update 11/12/14:

A developer wrote (link pending):
Survival (animals - wolves)
Local (humanoids - goblins, bandits, raiders, knights, cultists)
Geography (giants - ogres)
Planes (outsiders - hellhounds)
History (undead - skeletons and ghouls)

Waiting for PFO Wiki page to be available again so I can start formatting this data.

[Giorgo]

PFO Wiki Skills

Work in progress, feedback welcomed. :)

[Giorgo]

This will soon be updated; don't think much has change since EE, but will double check on my next day off.