"The Barrier World" - Homebrew setting looking for a fresh set of eyes


Homebrew and House Rules

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Liberty's Edge

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Ok due to formatting issues (Spoilers within spoilers), the compiled information can be found HERE. There's a lot of stuff there thus far, most of it sectioned up between areas on the map or by category. Take your time, there's no rush.

Right, the TL;DR of the world is a combination of these:

Quote:
Emerging technology built on the foundation of a lost age, the new civilization living amongst the ruins, having made them their own, with adventurers delving into the places that were once seen as "taboo" or "dangerous" to discover what the previous age held and possibly clues (for the shorter lived races) of what exactly happened to cause the world to be the way it is.

and

Quote:

Prevalent guns (Early guns = Martial weapons)

No Gods (Effectively killed off during the apocalypse)
After-The-Apocalypse feel (1000 years after when civilization is getting back on its feet)
Steampunk/magitech
High magic, low fantasy (Druid cities, quasi-deities, and magocracies, but low on creatures outside the mundane. So no dragons for example)
Switched up races (Orcs are shamanistic, Drow are neutral mad scientists and (Lesser) Centaur and Harpies are playable)

What I'm looking for:


  • Where are the glaring holes in this world as it's currently written, and any suggestions on plugging said holes? (No suggestions are fine, helping me be aware of the problems is more than help enough)
  • What aspects need clarification? Basically what do I need to expand on?
  • Suggestions on making this setting work while maintaining the above quoted bits. Basically how can I make this work in the general way I want this to work?
  • Suggestions for the locations marked "WIP"?

What I'm not looking for:


  • "You're better off with a different system." No, I'm sticking with D20 'cause I'm stubborn and I know the system.
  • Suggestions that drastically alter the premise of the world. The quoted bits there? They're stickin'.
  • Urgings or suggestions to not bother with a homebrew setting/scrap the idea. 1) I'm stubborn, 2) I've already put a bunch of work in, I ain't stoppin' now.

Honestly I really need some fresh eyes to look at this to help me figure out how to make this stuff work. I've not had the chance to playtest a lot of it and the players in my gaming group don't really provide a good amount of constructive feedback.


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I would suggest not making your orcs too much like Eberron orcs. Sure, they're more insular and less war-like now. But how has the passing of the old world and the recovery from the apocalypse changed them? Perhaps they are not tech savvy like some other races, but have spent hundreds of years scavenged material from ruined cities and become builders (of sorts).

As for the gods, I would delve a little deeper than simply saying they are all dead. Maybe the events that destroyed the known world was a side effect of what was happening to the gods at the time, such as they were drawn into their own war with other gods in a far off world. Many died, but other are missing/captured/cannot travel home/weakened/forgotten who they are. It was the lack of their influence on this world that allowed events to spiral out of control. You could also say that while the important deities are all gone, some of their servants (lesser outsiders) remain and seek to one day ascend to godhood, like politicians campaigning to gain constituents.

Finally, I would continue fleshing out more of the physical locations the PCs can travel to so you have some material to work off of when they get there or begin to ask questions. The mysteries of the world can wait until the time is right to reveal them.

Liberty's Edge

Ciaran Barnes wrote:

I would suggest not making your orcs too much like Eberron orcs. Sure, they're more insular and less war-like now. But how has the passing of the old world and the recovery from the apocalypse changed them? Perhaps they are not tech savvy like some other races, but have spent hundreds of years scavenged material from ruined cities and become builders (of sorts).

As for the gods, I would delve a little deeper than simply saying they are all dead. Maybe the events that destroyed the known world was a side effect of what was happening to the gods at the time, such as they were drawn into their own war with other gods in a far off world. Many died, but other are missing/captured/cannot travel home/weakened/forgotten who they are. It was the lack of their influence on this world that allowed events to spiral out of control. You could also say that while the important deities are all gone, some of their servants (lesser outsiders) remain and seek to one day ascend to godhood, like politicians campaigning to gain constituents.

Finally, I would continue fleshing out more of the physical locations the PCs can travel to so you have some material to work off of when they get there or begin to ask questions. The mysteries of the world can wait until the time is right to reveal them.

Hey man I really appreciate the feedback =D If you don't mind, I've some followup questions/ideas.

1) What about making the orcs a bit more wise in their racial teachings, with them respecting the technology of the past? "Yes we are aware that these machines helped cause the end of the world as we knew it, but it is not the machine that is evil, but the person using the machine. It is a tool, nothing more." in contrast to, say, the Principality who reveres tech or the Queen's Lands (Mostly Bastion) that is headed towards recreating the technological problems of the past.

2) I had actually tinkered with the idea of some Outsiders either living in the world in secret or as prisoners. For example, one of the things for the Gear Wastes I was tinkering with was that the whole "All the creatures here are clockwork" thing came about as a result of invasive tinkering/dissection of still living Inevitables (Now Broken Soul Inevitables). But yeah the thing with the Gods in general does need some expanding on and I'll work on getting that sorted out.

3) By fleshing out, ya mean like adding more locations or just expanding on the ones I currently have? I mean, I could mock up some maps and info on who/what may be found in the location no problem...


1) Hmm. That could work.They could have the "no more than an hour of tv a day" kind of philosophy towards things like magic and technology.

2) Question. Has the lack of deities in the world increased or decreased the number of native outsiders like aasimar and tiefling?

3) When i have worked on a home brew gaming world in the past, I have tried to come up with about a paragraph detailing each key location. This includes nations, geographical regions, and major cities. I might include a major export, favored religion, prevalent races, notable NPCs, unique aspects, etc. Travel guide kind of stuff. I make up most of it on the fly, but I begin with a crafted seed so that each important place has some unique aspects that make it different from the others. Just my personal approach.

Liberty's Edge

1) "Everything in moderation" kinda people with some of the tribes/factions swinging further for or against the use of tech. Could see those factions leading to more of a "standard" view of Orcs as marauding savages simply based off the tribe/faction that's violently anti-tech.

2) I would say decreased. Without a constantish influx of planar creatures, the number of Aasimar, Tiefling and various other such partial-planar races is at an all time low. Previous generations of such would account for Sorcerer Bloodlines, but proper races would be rare in the extreme barring secluded villages of them or individuals in stasis (Medical, magical or otherwise). As a DM I wouldn't say no for playing them, but the player would need to do their homework and submit a viable backstory for how they're existing.

3) Righty-o, suppose I'll start with the Queen's Land and work out from there.


Silus wrote:
  • What aspects need clarification? Basically what do I need to expand on?

One thing that springs to mind is: will there be Divine Magic and if so: where does it come from / where do people think it comes from?


Devils posing as angels? ;)

Liberty's Edge

VRMH wrote:
Silus wrote:
  • What aspects need clarification? Basically what do I need to expand on?
One thing that springs to mind is: will there be Divine Magic and if so: where does it come from / where do people think it comes from?

A buddy of mine actually presented an idea for it, though it doesn't really translate well now that I moved away from a proper "barrier" to "Shunted over a dimension and a half".

Anyway the idea was that when the "in the know" gods (The Queen, Exile, Librarian, Oracle and Warlord) gave up their divinity, they used their former divine power, broke it down to a non-domain level and used it to build the barrier, allowing divine casters to pull from it while at the same time leaving the world locked away. Unlike the Forgotten Realms, the divine power wouldn't be reliant necessarily on worshippers, though the lifespan of the gods would be (No worshippers/believers and the gods would die and the divine power would go elsewhere).

Perhaps now instead of powering the barrier the deity power that makes divine magic work has...devolved(?) into primal sources and the divine casters are just pulling from a raw pool of divine power?

*Shrugs* I'm just spitballing ideas.

Liberty's Edge

Updated the bit about the Orcs, Centaur and Harpies.

Orcs:
For the most part, Orcs fall into the noble savage category. They prefer their tribes and clans be left alone by the majority of the outside world. Unlike many of the other races (barring the Harpies), Orcs tend to forego technology and arcane magics in excess. Far more wise than the "civilized" races give them credit for, the Orcs have a healthy respect for the pre-apocalypse technology, but are aware that their misuse has the potential to lead to another such apocalypse, or at least the highly destructive wars that followed the world being shunted over. Of course, with every race and civilization, there are those that do not share the ideals of the others. Fanatical tribes of Orcs dedicated to the destruction of technology are not unknown and have begun giving the race as a whole a bad name. In recent years, the native Orc tribes in the Queen's Lands and the Principality of the Moon have been forced out, resettling in the southern jungles.

Centaur:
Lesser Centaurs, often simply referred to as City Centaurs or 'Taurs, are a subrace of centaur that have taken to living in more civilized locals. They are noticeably smaller than "proper" centaurs, but are more technologically minded, able to wield firearms with unusual proficiency. While horse, pony and donkey breeds are the most common, deer, elk and non-hoofed varieties are also known, depending on location (No change to stats, differentiation is purely cosmetic on a mechanical standpoint). It is thanks to Centaur gunsmiths that the Gear Wastes was even settled. The Golem-Stopper rifles, modified from pre-apocalypse anti-material rifles with the assistance of magic, helped level the playing field between the settlers and the clockwork monstrosities of the Wastes. As Centaurs don't have a land of their own, most have begun settling the generally neutral territory of the Gear Wastes and tend to be responsible for most of the large-profit kills (Due to their natural affinity for firearms and their ability to haul far larger kills than non-quadruped races).

Harpies:
A tribal species, Lesser Harpies are often found in mountain colonies, though civilized tribes are not unheard of. As a race, they are not evil, though are often mistaken for their evil True Harpy counterparts (A myth on the Barrier World). Lesser Harpies are, as a rule, all female, but posses the ability to interbreed with other humanoid species. Such pairings always result in Lesser Harpies, though these offspring posses traits indicative of their father's heritage. Like the Centaurs, Harpies don't have a proper nation of their own. Instead they are broken into clans and tribes often situated in the various mountain ranges. The governments of the more civilized nations have long ago stopped trying to govern the tribes and simply tolerate the tribes in their borders. Harpies tend to have a combination of oral history and a crude written history, though some near more civilized lands have the opportunity to receive a somewhat formal education.

Liberty's Edge

Right, so I'm working on a Google Doc that'll later become a sort of handout for my group (and that I'll make available to people that, for whatever reason, want to run this crazy setting).

So a few other things I'm looking for help on:

  • Proper names of the dead/retired/missing Gods. I have some difficulty coming up with proper names, as evidenced by the location names.
  • Suggestions on expanding the descriptions of already set locations.
  • Suggestions for other environmental hazards leftover from ages past (Radiation, unexploded spell bombs, etc)
  • Suggestions on fixing the Centaur and Harpy stat block. Centaur still needs work and I feel that the Harpy could do with a little bit of pizzaz.
  • MAJOR ONE: Assistance on making the Gear Wastes an economically viable location without cocking everything up elsewhere.


Do your centaurs have halfling-sized upper bodies on a pony-sized base? Because that is adorable and it is the only way I can see a medium sized centaur. I would maybe give them a draw-back that requires them to use small-sized weapons and hand-held instruments but offset this drawback with another "jazzier" benefit. Maybe give the centaur a bonus too its hoof attack (and/or damage) rolls while flanked (as centaur's legs can smash backwards into foes).

If you want to jazz up the harpy stat block then I would throw some kind of song-based ability on there. I worry that too many new abilities would make the race overpowered, though.

Easy song implementation: give the race some spell-like abilities themed as songs (not perfect but okay, I think).

Liberty's Edge

Excaliburproxy wrote:

Do your centaurs have halfling-sized upper bodies on a pony-sized base? Because that is adorable and it is the only way I can see a medium sized centaur. I would maybe give them a draw-back that requires them to use small-sized weapons and hand-held instruments but offset this drawback with another "jazzier" benefit. Maybe give the centaur a bonus too its hoof attack (and/or damage) rolls while flanked (as centaur's legs can smash backwards into foes).

If you want to jazz up the harpy stat block then I would throw some kind of song-based ability on there. I worry that too many new abilities would make the race overpowered, though.

Easy song implementation: give the race some spell-like abilities themed as songs (not perfect but okay, I think).

Gonna add in the +Damage/Attack for the hooves, but for the smaller weapons, figure that there should be some exceptions? I was considering maybe allowing them to use Medium-sized Firearms, as I'd expect the main issue would be stability and the kick, which their legs would offset.

For the Harpies, maybe Ghost Sound or some 0-level spell a couple times a day? Maybe 3/Day?

Edit: How about +DC for spells with the Sonic descriptor?


I think the firearm exception makes a lot of sense to me. Maybe crossbows too for consistency's sake? Like: their racial background includes training in using these types of weapons that allows them to take advantage of their pony-bodies more.

I think ghost sound might work okay. I would want to take time to think of something more unique, though. Maybe some kind of lesser inspire competence-like ability? I dunno.

Liberty's Edge

Hmm...How about Ear-Piercing Scream as a SLA? Little bit more unique and keeps with the sonic theme.

Sczarni

Dotting for interest. Also to politely ask about a play-by-post of a campaign of this.

If I may suggest something that was the first thing to pop in my head after reading about the Gear Wastes (probably my favourite place until the Poisoned Lands get a better description), how about a homebrew ranger archetype that is essentially attuned to deal with mechanical creatures, and has a trained/reprogramed one? Probably replacing Wis with Int and some other stuff.

I did notice the fact that the creatures are apparently "programmed" to attack organic beings, but I just decided to mention that.

Liberty's Edge

The Lion Cleric wrote:

Dotting for interest. Also to politely ask about a play-by-post of a campaign of this.

If I may suggest something that was the first thing to pop in my head after reading about the Gear Wastes (probably my favourite place until the Poisoned Lands get a better description), how about a homebrew ranger archetype that is essentially attuned to deal with mechanical creatures, and has a trained/reprogramed one? Probably replacing Wis with Int and some other stuff.

I did notice the fact that the creatures are apparently "programmed" to attack organic beings, but I just decided to mention that.

I may actually change up the whole "programmed to attack" bit and just make them act like flesh-and-blood animals.

But I was actually considering adding in class stuff regarding the Wastes, though I hadn't considered Archetypes. One idea was a Gunslinger Prestige class built around putting down Constructs, a prerequisite being killing a higher-than-CR-than-you Construct solo. Granted when cows from the Wastes are CR7, that's not really that hard to do (Two templates and like a 25 AC).

And honestly you're like the second or third person to ask for a PbP of this setting XD


Scream sounds good. Maybe it could be a fort save or be deafened for a few rounds a few times per day. Then feats could give it more serious effects (like nauseous, staggered, or stunned).

Sczarni

I usually dislike prestige classes, for the simple reason that Archetypes are much more fun, less disruptive and generally enough to achieve flavour from early levels. However, they are a bit harder to balance out if your gamers are in the more optimiser/powergamer camp. (Not using those as an insult, slang, just as a general mindset. People play games differently.)

Also, regarding PbP, people on Paizo come up with great ideas, and sadly, most of them are thousands of kilometers apart, so it's only natural.


Sorry, I have no constructive feedback yet. I just like the setting and how you present it.


Hmm.

-Gear wastes, if whatever formed them is going to be a "thing" in the plot, you need to work out what it is now. There could be ramifications. This goes for any "large-scale mystery" like how the barrier was formed or what clinically immortal paracritters are still out there biding their time or plotting their plots.

-It seems a little weird that a culture with widespread "convenience" (I'm not sure how else to describe "a nation where life isn't cheap because lifespans are longer") and education would have widespread theocracies and holy wars. Maybe that's just me.

-The Golem-stopper rifle is good, but I would give bipeds a slim chance (DC 20 strength check) to avoid getting knocked prone and I wouldn't make it naturally Golem-bane. Make that the ammunition, and make it specialized that it ONLY affects constructs that are clockwork or robotic in nature. This opens the door for other brands of ammunition for other critter types.

-In the same vein, perhaps the centaur use a specialized lance called a Pilum-lance (it's like a pilum and/or a harpoon, but it also does damage like a lance when you charge and impale a robot with it) and oversized, extra-heavy nets that are designed to be used by two people.

-It seems reasonable that the Centaur would have "weapon familiarity" with these weapons, and treat them as martial instead of exotic.

-You say "no weird monsters" then you list weird monsters like all the Gear Waste beasties. I assume you mean "I'm using my own list of what bestiary creatures are common, rare, or nonexistent" but that means the players have no way of knowing, even if their characters probably should, what common threats are and what equipment is good to have to combat them. Maybe that's the plan, maybe not.

-Shamanistic, not-quite-luddite orcs are fine, but your description implies a culture of asceticism. They glorify personal perfection and inner strength, just like monks. It's calling out for some brand of monastic order and/or monk variant, perhaps a prestige class that has the character taming and using his barbarian ferocity beneath a tranquil pond of will, "like the thrashing legs of a swan, serenely ..." okay yeah I can't finish that sentence with a straight face.

-Mutants, radiation, and technology are all pretty heavily covered in the new PF books coming out revolving around the new Adventure path set in Numeria.

-Culturally, how do people feel about The Gods and/or The Barrier? Is it common wisdom that The Gods were all crazy, evil, and we're better off without them and their supernatural ilk or are they sorely missed and the Barrier a great crime against the world? Are the "mortal" dieties the same as any other supernatural movers-and-shakers or are they "one of the good ones"?

-It is not entirely clear what The Barrier is. First it sounds like Barrier world was making trouble for the galaxy so the Galactic UN came in and installed an embargo. Then it sounds like the galaxy (and more importantly the other planes of existence) were making trouble for Barrier world and a handful of the local gods built a Great Wall of China to block it out. Basically, who built The Barrier and was it built to keep the outside out or the inside in? (If the answer is "both" it still demands you give a general idea, if only to your own DMing notes, how much of each)

-What happens when we die? Or rather, what happens when PCs die and their souls hit The Barrier? Reincarnate is a 4th level spell, this matters as early as level 7.

-You've implied zero dimensional travel. I can dig it, but the planar cosmology of PF is laced into the magic system like a major artery and ripping it out has consequences. Bags of holding, Teleportation, a lot of brands of conjuration, Etherealness, etc. Heck, even healing is pulling positive energy (arguably) from the positive material plane. Either you're taking all that stuff out of the game (which has repercussions) or you need a workaround for whatever is still supposed to be working.

-The fact that Pink mist doesn't decay at all is problematic. In the real world even the worst chemical weapons decay and dissolve relatively quickly, if they didn't then the entire world would be in much worse shape after World War I. I assume you are wanting "dead zones" where the weapon never got cleaned up, but that becomes problematic when you add in "affected by wind" and "never breaks down, ever." Even the boxiest of box canyons cycles its air and water with the rest of the world a bit. It seems easier to have a very slow breakdown and magical things which continue to generate the stuff. Or treat it like Fallout, which isn't actually gaseous and once it settles in an area is pretty much settled in.

Liberty's Edge

boring7 wrote:

Hmm.

-Gear wastes, if whatever formed them is going to be a "thing" in the plot, you need to work out what it is now. There could be ramifications. This goes for any "large-scale mystery" like how the barrier was formed or what clinically immortal paracritters are still out there biding their time or plotting their plots.

-It seems a little weird that a culture with widespread "convenience" (I'm not sure how else to describe "a nation where life isn't cheap because lifespans are longer") and education would have widespread theocracies and holy wars. Maybe that's just me.

-The Golem-stopper rifle is good, but I would give bipeds a slim chance (DC 20 strength check) to avoid getting knocked prone and I wouldn't make it naturally Golem-bane. Make that the ammunition, and make it specialized that it ONLY affects constructs that are clockwork or robotic in nature. This opens the door for other brands of ammunition for other critter types.

-In the same vein, perhaps the centaur use a specialized lance called a Pilum-lance (it's like a pilum and/or a harpoon, but it also does damage like a lance when you charge and impale a robot with it) and oversized, extra-heavy nets that are designed to be used by two people.

-It seems reasonable that the Centaur would have "weapon familiarity" with these weapons, and treat them as martial instead of exotic.

-You say "no weird monsters" then you list weird monsters like all the Gear Waste beasties. I assume you mean "I'm using my own list of what bestiary creatures are common, rare, or nonexistent" but that means the players have no way of knowing, even if their characters probably should, what common threats are and what equipment is good to have to combat them. Maybe that's the plan, maybe not.

-Shamanistic, not-quite-luddite orcs are fine, but your description implies a culture of asceticism. They glorify personal perfection and inner strength, just like monks. It's calling out for some brand of monastic order and/or monk variant,...

1) The current idea is that one of the many hidden away research labs (Treated sort of like Vaults in Fallout, marked by the orangish Omega type symbol on the map) was experimenting on captured Inevitables, seeing what made them...tick (Haha is joke because they're clockwork). Anyway, their research got loose/out of control and leaked out into the surrounding landscape, turning things into clockwork whatnots. Perhaps it's a curse, perhaps a disease that's run its course, who knows (I'm leaning towards a curse that everyone's just become fine with).

2) If you're referring to the pre-barrier nations, imagine the world being like...a more technologically advanced Forgotten Realms, but with no Wall of the Faithless. The Gods were active, but jerks to those outside of their religion, and people at the time were far more religious and willing to do what their God said. Barrier goes up, Gods go poof, people start throwing around accusations of "This is YOUR God's doing!" and the more level headed people duck for cover as the bombs start to fly. After a while people realized they were on their own and that they needed to just pick themselves up and soldier on.

3) Perhaps specialized Alchemical rounds? The rifle thus far's been kinda touch on the balance end ^^;

4/5) Aye, that'd work. The Bastard Sword proficiency was just sorta a placeholder. Figure I should keep the musket familiarity though?

6) Ah yeah...that. That needs changing soonish. The idea was for a world that didn't rely on big'ol monsters or planar shenanigans to serve as the bad guys. That I've actually gone with is "We're starting from earth-like and peppering in creatures that would fit as we go". For example, the Southern Jungles will have all manner of exotic and dangerous creatures befitting its micro-Death World status. Soooooo yeah I need to change that bit ^^;

7) I'm not going to be touching archetypes and prestige classes for a while, but I don't see why an Orc Monk variant would be a problem. But yeah, that's going on the To-Do list for sure.

8) Oh that's wonderful news =D I was honestly just going to pull stuff from Gamma World or D20 Apocalypse or the like for those rules. But if Paizo is going it, that saves me a heap of work with regards to some of the underground locations and the Plagued Lands.

9) As stated above (#2), people sort of just accepted it after about a hundred years or so when nothing changed. There are minor religions out and about, ancestor worship, druidic faiths, maybe a small group of engineers that are kinda headed towards the Warhammer 40k Mech Priest route, but the only current major religions are a small following that pays homage to the Queen (Despite her not really wanting worship), the Librarian (More of a "Hey you're awesome, props to you" thing instead of "Wololo") and the Principality state religion. As for the "mortal" Gods, the only two really active ones are the Queen and the Oracle. The Queen serves as a figurehead lynchpin for her nation (If she fell, the nation would devolve into a "I'm in charge" sort of chaos) and the Oracle accepts visitors willing to make the trek, but such visits are regulated by the local druids. Other than that the mortal Gods just kinda keep to themselves, having realized that their meddling caused as much destruction as it had.

10) Well the Barrier initially was a sort of mass shield type deal, similar to Sigil's thing for keeping gods out. What it currently is is the whole planet, the moon and an artificial sun being shunted over a dimension and a half, severing ties with the main universe. It's sort of in a pocket dimension in the space between spaces, but without all the eldritch horrors therein. The whole thing was done by the mortal gods with the assistance of proper mortals. The mortals worked out how to do it, the gods provided the power and a good deal of the funding. Kinda the equivalent of taking a kid's toy that he's abusing and butting it on the top shelf where he can't reach it.

11) Ah yeah, this is where things get grim. The idea is that there is no afterlife, just a sort of...dreaming limbo? The souls float about, unseen and not affecting things in the world. It's not like the Wall of the Faithless in FR where it's all torture all day 'erry day, but more like, well, dreaming. It's not bad but it's not good either. Even worse when you consider A) people have found a way to bind souls and wipe the memories to power new golems (in place of elementals) and B) if the world were to be reverted to the universe proper, there'd be a massive planar rush to claim those souls. Imagine Gates opening up and legions of planar outsiders marching in to claim the souls floating about. For all intents and purposes though, resurrection type spells function normally.

12) Well with regard to things like teleportation, I kinda figure things like that would work more on a folding space type of deal instead of "Let's shortcut through the Ethereal". Bags of Holding and Portable Holes would generate mini pocket dimensions anchored in the Barrier, and healing spells would pull from the Barrier itself (essentially the latticework of magic and raw divine power that keeps the world anchored a dimension and a half away). Conjuration spells (Summon Monsters and Nature's Ally) are actually not allowed, same with the Summoner class, mostly because they just won't work. For the most part there'd be fluff-based work-arounds for most of the spells.

13) Well as you mentioned earlier, the Numeria AP is in the works and will serve to address things like radiation and possibly other such hazards, so I may just switch up the Pink Mist as a pervasive form of visual radiation. The idea, admittedly, for the the Pink Mist came from Fallout: Equestria, which in turn I think got the idea from the Dead Money DLC for New Vegas. The idea is to sort of emulate the Cloud from New Vegas and drop it in locations where things might not have the luxury of dispersing winds (Interiors, underground locations, etc.) But yeah, the thing needs work for sure.

I've got the next few days off of work, so I'll go back and update/clarify the stuff on the main page then get to work on the Google Doc once everything is all hammered out all nice and pretty like.


Inevitables work, but you need an excuse for why the Wasteland Frontier of the Robotic Plague is being settled by the expansion of organics instead of expanding and settling the organics' territories. My first assumption is that something was or is self-policing. Perhaps there is a quiet war going on, and along with the mindless or animal-intellgence bot-critters are agents of the Cogs of The Broken God (evil 'bots, hate any life not part of the collective, worship their "Overmind" like the Zerg) and the Guardians of Life (good and neutral 'bots, mixed philosophies but united against the forcible assimilation Cogs)

In this theory I'm throwing together both sides hide among the feral-intelligence "Wildebots" because both sides are fighting a shadow war. If one side congregates, the other side attacks them and hits 'em where they hurt. As a result they aren't widely known and most outsiders think all the Mechanical Beasties in the Gear Wastes are just animals.

Alchemical rounds are always good. A Clockbane round would combine ceramic chunks and acid meant to gum up a machine's inner workings in a single shell. The shell is designed to pop AFTER punching through a construct's skin. They get a +1 to hit, deal an extra 2d4 to clockwork creatures (not all constructs. just the ones with gearworks), have a base price of 80g per round (the shell and acid are tough to craft right) but require only the craft alchemy skill to make. They turn the base damage of the gun into half physical, half acid. Also yes on musket familiarity.

Other alchemical rounds, like those specializing in killing organics would doubtless exist.

Other than that, sounds good. I think every world needs dragons, but I'm just a dracophile.

And if it's not too presumptious of me, here's my idea for the Pilum Lance.

The Pilum-Lance is a standard Lance (1d8, 3x; double damage on charge) which breaks upon a successful attack. If the wielder succeeds at a CMB check the Pilum-lance also impales the target, giving it a -4 penalty on Dexterity and allowing you to drag it around by the rope attached to the Pilum Lance unless it removes the attachment. Removing the Pilum Lance requires a standard action as well as a free hand (or similar appendage) to grip it. It is used by 'Taur teams in conjunction with well-anchored winches to bear down and kill the larger clockwork monstrosities of the Gear Wastes.

Liberty's Edge

Ok so I'm going to have to make a new thread on GitP because APPARENTLY there's a character limit I was not aware of (50,000 and I was at like 52,223).

Link can be found HERE. I'll be transferring the info over shortly.

Edit: Also looking for ideas for archetypes (racial or otherwise) and prestige classes. Have these so far:

Archetypes

Wastes Hunter: Racial archetype for Gunslinger/Fighter for Centaur

Clock Stopper: Racial archetype for Monk for Orc

Principality Missionary: Cleric Archetype

Wind Dancer: Racial Archetype for Bard for Harpy

Prestige Classes

Wyrm Hunter: Skilled at taking out large constructs quickly, be it in close range or from afar.

Queen's Guard: Magic swordsman dedicated to keeping the Queen's Lands safe and lawful.

Principality Priest/ess: Passes on the teachings of the Church of the Moon. Capstone being pureblood Lycanthrope status.

Flesh Shaper: Taking Mutigens to the next level, allowing for Eidalon-type physical customization.

Sczarni

About the Poisoned Lands, I was kind of imagining a Fallout feel to them, poisonous water, lots and lots of swarms (players will be really, really surprised by a swarm of flying leeches).
Here's my suggestion for another interesting encounter HERE. (not with the same CR, obviously. Could be just a little pond.)

Another thing that could be found there would be sort of a weapon, designed to be used against the enemies over there, since most of them aren't really giving a damn about normal weapons:

The Swarmslayer 1d10 range 20ft B and P scatter, special

The Swarmslayer is a do-it-yourself blunderbuss, mostly used against big, unpleasant things, or lots of unpleasant things. The Swarmslayer usually takes the shape of a double-barreled blunderbuss, shooting all sorts of junk in extremely close range. The Swarmslayer doesn't reduce weapon damage versus swarms.

If used against enemies with less than 6+(item enhancement bonus) the Swarmslayer inflicts an additional 1d10 damage as the junk tears through the exposed flesh.
If used against enemies with less than 2+(item enhancement bonus) the gout of flame from the barrel sets them on fire for 1d4 damage each round, or until they take a full round action to get rid of the flames.

The Swarmslayer uses special ammunition, but can be loaded with normal alchemical cartriges. In such case, it loses the special quality.

Cartriges for the Swarmslayer.

Firedragon Rounds. Some gun-nuts in (Poisoned Lands town name) decided that there isn't enough nasties outside the town set on fire. The Firedragon rounds lost the ability to tear, but always set the enemy on fire for 1d8 per round unless they make a reflex check, DC = the attack roll against them.

Impaler rounds. Invented by nessesity by some raiding parties that faced tough, armored targets, Impaler rounds fire a cluster of metal bars (it's totally rebar nicked from the old skyscrapers). They lose the ability to set fire on targets and half weapon damage against swarms is still applicable, but always do bonus damage versus targets and the damage is doubled to 2d10.

I'm sure the number could be balanced around if they seem too high, but I am imagining the crazies in a town in the Poisoned Lands are packing some serious tech.

I'll try and think of some melee weapons, since we've been giving the gunslingers too much love.

Liberty's Edge

The Lion Cleric wrote:

About the Poisoned Lands, I was kind of imagining a Fallout feel to them, poisonous water, lots and lots of swarms (players will be really, really surprised by a swarm of flying leeches).

Here's my suggestion for another interesting encounter HERE. (not with the same CR, obviously. Could be just a little pond.)

Another thing that could be found there would be sort of a weapon, designed to be used against the enemies over there, since most of them aren't really giving a damn about normal weapons:

The Swarmslayer 1d10 range 20ft B and P scatter, special

The Swarmslayer is a do-it-yourself blunderbuss, mostly used against big, unpleasant things, or lots of unpleasant things. The Swarmslayer usually takes the shape of a double-barreled blunderbuss, shooting all sorts of junk in extremely close range. The Swarmslayer doesn't reduce weapon damage versus swarms.

If used against enemies with less than 6+(item enhancement bonus) the Swarmslayer inflicts an additional 1d10 damage as the junk tears through the exposed flesh.
If used against enemies with less than 2+(item enhancement bonus) the gout of flame from the barrel sets them on fire for 1d4 damage each round, or until they take a full round action to get rid of the flames.

The Swarmslayer uses special ammunition, but can be loaded with normal alchemical cartriges. In such case, it loses the special quality.

Cartriges for the Swarmslayer.

Firedragon Rounds. Some gun-nuts in (Poisoned Lands town name) decided that there isn't enough nasties outside the town set on fire. The Firedragon rounds lost the ability to tear, but always set the enemy on fire for 1d8 per round unless they make a reflex check, DC = the attack roll against them.

Impaler rounds. Invented by nessesity by some raiding parties that faced tough, armored targets, Impaler rounds fire a cluster of metal bars (it's totally rebar nicked from the old skyscrapers). They lose the ability to set fire...

Added the Swarmslayer to the main page on GitP, though quick question:

Quote:


If used against enemies with less than 6+(item enhancement bonus) the Swarmslayer inflicts an additional 1d10 damage as the junk tears through the exposed flesh.

If used against enemies with less than 2+(item enhancement bonus) the gout of flame from the barrel sets them on fire for 1d4 damage each round, or until they take a full round action to get rid of the flames.

What're the "6+(item enhancement bonus)" regarding? Little confused >.>

Edit: Also, Argus are going to be in the Plagued Lands along with the more mutated looking creatures. Also Monster Hunter type sea monster type things around the coast (Looking to make a Lagiacrus type monster named "Blackheart the Invincible" that threatens the coastal city built into the skyscrapers).

Sczarni

Whoops, I forgot to put that in. It's supposed to be natural armor. Also, if someone else has ideas about the Poisoned Lands, I'd love to hear them. I love swampy places in games. Any opinions on the Living pond?

Liberty's Edge

The Lion Cleric wrote:
Whoops, I forgot to put that in. It's supposed to be natural armor. Also, if someone else has ideas about the Poisoned Lands, I'd love to hear them. I love swampy places in games. Any opinions on the Living pond?

While interesting, I think I'm gonna have to pass on the lake ^^;

I was thinking the Poisoned Lands would be more of a large city (NYC size perhaps) that got hit particularly bad and is just oozing with magical and conventional radiation and chemical weapon residue, and the only reason the coastal city is safe is because the ocean breezes keep the worst of the chems and radiation at bay.

But I could see some of the coastal areas being turned into swampy marshlands inside of city ruins. Streets getting flooded, mangroves growing over rusted hulks of vehicles, vines and creepers snaking up the side of ruined buildings...

Sczarni

Are dragons a thing in The Barrier World? If not, maybe there's some rumors about one in the Poisoned Lands? A Blightburn Breathing Gator in the sewers?


I really like what you have going for the persons and locations of note. Great start. Keep going!

Upon perusing the rest of it, I would like to more about the barrier. What is it? Who made it and how? You mention why it was built, but even that is still pretty thin on details.


Airborne toxins are always a problem, because they're airborne. The atmosphere should cycle them across the entire world unless they are stopped by some magic, aren't really airborne, or they actually decay over time but are replenished by some source.

The Living Magic template which was born in the Eberron campaign setting (another post-world-war with magic realm) and serves well for the "replenish" method. You can have Living Cloudkill spells floating around the place, constantly turning the air to poison wherever they go and having that poison dissipate again when they leave. It makes poison without poisoning everything forever.

Another option is a giant shield wall. The Coastal City I am spontaneously naming New Providence with modern-day survivors is protected from the occasional cloud of Pink Mist by 50-meter high stone walls erected by the spellcaster/cult leader who first built the city (3 generations ago) as a getaway for his creepy polygamist cult. When the mist comes from inland, it hits the wall. When the winds reverse, the mist gets hit with the salty sea air and breaks down into harmless chemicals. This salt-breakdown property also keeps the Pink Mist from crossing oceans and covering the earth.

Finally, radiation sources will either be fallout particles (which would mostly be heavy metals, mostly sticking to the ground and lowlands) or great big radioactive solids/field generators. It doesn't generally move, but it leaves a place deadly to explorers.

Of course you also need monsters that are immune to the local hazards because evolution works really fastobviously a wizard did it and because otherwise everything in the Poison Lands is dead. Perhaps adaptation to the Pink Mist or radiation, perhaps something like the Tiberium fiends from Command and Conquer where the stuff that poisons normal folk actually heals them. And PCs can even get it at the low-low cost of being hideously mutated and getting a really lucky roll.

Also, Strange Fluids.

Liberty's Edge

boring7 wrote:

Airborne toxins are always a problem, because they're airborne. The atmosphere should cycle them across the entire world unless they are stopped by some magic, aren't really airborne, or they actually decay over time but are replenished by some source.

The Living Magic template which was born in the Eberron campaign setting (another post-world-war with magic realm) and serves well for the "replenish" method. You can have Living Cloudkill spells floating around the place, constantly turning the air to poison wherever they go and having that poison dissipate again when they leave. It makes poison without poisoning everything forever.

Another option is a giant shield wall. The Coastal City I am spontaneously naming New Providence with modern-day survivors is protected from the occasional cloud of Pink Mist by 50-meter high stone walls erected by the spellcaster/cult leader who first built the city (3 generations ago) as a getaway for his creepy polygamist cult. When the mist comes from inland, it hits the wall. When the winds reverse, the mist gets hit with the salty sea air and breaks down into harmless chemicals. This salt-breakdown property also keeps the Pink Mist from crossing oceans and covering the earth.

Finally, radiation sources will either be fallout particles (which would mostly be heavy metals, mostly sticking to the ground and lowlands) or great big radioactive solids/field generators. It doesn't generally move, but it leaves a place deadly to explorers.

Of course you also need monsters that are immune to the local hazards because evolution works really fastobviously a wizard did it and because otherwise everything in the Poison Lands is dead. Perhaps adaptation to the Pink Mist or radiation, perhaps something like the Tiberium fiends from Command and Conquer where the stuff that poisons normal folk actually heals them. And PCs can even get it at the low-low cost of being hideously mutated and...

WAT.

NUMERIA BOOK. WAT.

Ok I totally need to swing by the gaming store tomorrow and get that.

We could always just tack on a thing like "Native to the Poisoned Lands" and have them be so horribly mutated that they just ignore a good deal of the environmental hazards barring the really freaky stuff like the Strange Fluids and areas of absurd radiation (Or make stronger, more mutated things that thrive in the radiation and Pink Mists). Also there's an Amalgam Template that lets you combine creatures, possibly use that and a bit of homebrewing to make a living Pink Mist cloud (Living Cloudkill+Living Bleed+Living Rusting Grasp)?

Ciaran Barnes wrote:

I really like what you have going for the persons and locations of note. Great start. Keep going!

Upon perusing the rest of it, I would like to more about the barrier. What is it? Who made it and how? You mention why it was built, but even that is still pretty thin on details.

I suppose I'll go ahead and hammer out the bit about the Barrier tonight.

The Lion Cleric wrote:
Are dragons a thing in The Barrier World? If not, maybe there's some rumors about one in the Poisoned Lands? A Blightburn Breathing Gator in the sewers?

Unfortunately the dragons that DID live in the Barrier World either left before the Barrier Project was enacted or were killed shortly thereafter. Quasi-dragons like winged Blightburn Breathing Gators or the like would work however. Also Clockwork Dragons are totally a thing. Maybe they're rare but naturally occurring Gear Waste creatures based on the Metallic dragons?

EDIT: Also taking suggestions for other Gods that forced themselves mortal, either to help with the Barrier or because they caught wind of the Barrier going up and didn't want to, you know, starve and die.

Liberty's Edge

Right, so I went ahead and added the following:

  • The standard Paizo "Alignment/Notable NPCs/Notable Settlements/etc." thing for the current sections.
  • Added a few new NPCs of note.
  • Added in some new locations for the existing areas (Southern Jungle has a little bit more info now)
  • Expanded upon the Barrier, how it was formed and more or less how it works (Would appreciate some help in ironing out any issues here)
  • Expanded upon how magic interacts with the Barrier (Again, could do with a look or two)


Thrag, CN god of war. Went mortal(ish) in the form of a giant mechanical monstrosity because he's CN, and joined the "final war" that started after The Barrier went up. Unsurprisingly, he died violently but left behind fragments of his broken metal and magic body which find their way into weapons, constructs, and even people. Gears, blades, sprockets, and the like all show up and have unpredictable effects, but are as hard-to-destroy as minor artifacts and often mysteriously disappear.

Harpy idea: Flyers tend to prefer hit-and-run, nets aid that by slowing down the target. Perhaps weapon familiarity is in order, perhaps not, but this line of thinking led me to a specialty weapon. It functions like a regular net, but after a successful hit the person who threw it can attempt a Combat Maneuver Check. If the check is successful, the net's secondary effect activates and the weights on the ends of the net rapidly expand and inflate with a lighter-than-air gas. These balloons lift the net and captured person/cargo upwards at a rate of 20 feet per round, rising to an altitude of 1000 feet before coming to a halt, and remain bouyant for 1d4 hours before quickly deflating and depositing the payload back on the ground (relatively) gently.

It costs 1000 gold to make, I haven't decided if it's alchemy or magic that makes the gas, but the balloons are not magical. Anybody caught in them can escape the entanglement easily enough, but if they don't do it quick they'll be too high to survive the fall. Harpy clans use these tools to steal/kidnap high-value targets. Once the item is secured and floating, they just tow it back to base.

Liberty's Edge

boring7 wrote:

Thrag, CN god of war. Went mortal(ish) in the form of a giant mechanical monstrosity because he's CN, and joined the "final war" that started after The Barrier went up. Unsurprisingly, he died violently but left behind fragments of his broken metal and magic body which find their way into weapons, constructs, and even people. Gears, blades, sprockets, and the like all show up and have unpredictable effects, but are as hard-to-destroy as minor artifacts and often mysteriously disappear.

Harpy idea: Flyers tend to prefer hit-and-run, nets aid that by slowing down the target. Perhaps weapon familiarity is in order, perhaps not, but this line of thinking led me to a specialty weapon. It functions like a regular net, but after a successful hit the person who threw it can attempt a Combat Maneuver Check. If the check is successful, the net's secondary effect activates and the weights on the ends of the net rapidly expand and inflate with a lighter-than-air gas. These balloons lift the net and captured person/cargo upwards at a rate of 20 feet per round, rising to an altitude of 1000 feet before coming to a halt, and remain bouyant for 1d4 hours before quickly deflating and depositing the payload back on the ground (relatively) gently.

It costs 1000 gold to make, I haven't decided if it's alchemy or magic that makes the gas, but the balloons are not magical. Anybody caught in them can escape the entanglement easily enough, but if they don't do it quick they'll be too high to survive the fall. Harpy clans use these tools to steal/kidnap high-value targets. Once the item is secured and floating, they just tow it back to base.

I'll add in Thrag a little later on.

Regarding the net, might it be better to have the net entangle as per normal, then the next round the balloons inflate automatically, giving the entangled victim one round to be all "OH CRAP NET!"?

Liberty's Edge

Right, so Archetypes thus far:

Wastes Hunter: Racial archetype for Gunslinger/Fighter for Centaur. Tacking and bonuses vs Constructs + wasteland survival.

Clock Stopper: Racial archetype for Monk for Orc. Bonuses vs constructs and object hardness.

Principality Missionary: Cleric Archetype

Wind Dancer: Racial Archetype for Bard for Harpy. Battle Dance Bard Song, must be mobile to use. (Acts like Bard Song, but double the bonuses, but must CONSTANTLY be on the move to use. 10ft minimum movement, anything that stops movement immediately halts the song/dance)

Gear Tamer: Ranger Archetype, tame animals with the Construct type. (Specifically, a Gear Tamer may gain an animal companion with the Clockwork Creature Template and later may apply the Metal Clad template atop it. May upgrade metals via cost)

[Unnamed Alchemist Archetype]: Racial Archetype for Alchemist for Drow. Bard-song-like Mutigen.

Thoughts, suggestions, improvements?


So when are you running this so I can play? I'll have to drag you down to South Florida.

Liberty's Edge

Odraude wrote:
So when are you running this so I can play? I'll have to drag you down to South Florida.

*Laughs* Actually I had planned on compiling all the finalized information into a Google Doc (complete with pictures) and just distributing it out to whoever wanted to use it. Then again, if I can figure out how to do a PbP then I may just run it that way (I'll have to poke around, see if I can find a PbP to sit in on to see how people do it).

Liberty's Edge

Also, started up a suggestion thread on Giants in the Playground, which can be found HERE.

Liberty's Edge

Right then, so plan today:

  • Hammer out the rest of these NPCs of note
  • Touch up the detail on the Principality and Gear Waste maps
  • Add to and clean up the Queen's Land's Entry (Ugh tangle of Spoiler tags)
  • Start re-looking at the Drow, seeing how they can be balanced out and worked (Cherry-picking stock Drow abilities I think).
  • Start working on the Principality of the Moon entry


  • With the increased attention your world gives to orcs, I thought it inappropriate to leave them the same old blockheads they have been for years. So, for your consideration...

    Barrier Orc (10 RP)
    In the barrier world, orcs and half-orcs have interbred for so long that there is no longer any difference between the two.

    Ability Score Racial Traits: Barrier orcs are strong and wise, but slow to learn new ideas. They gain +2 Strength, +2 Wisdom, and –2 Intelligence.
    Type: Barrier orcs are Humanoid creatures with the orc subtypes.
    Size: Barrier Orcs are Medium creatures and thus have no bonuses or penalties due to their size.
    Base Speed: Barrier orcs possess a speed that belies their muscular build, and have a base speed of 40 feet.
    Languages: Barrier orcs begin play speaking Common and Orc. Barrier orcs with high Intelligence scores can choose from the following: Dwarven, Giant, Goblin, Sylvan, and Undercommon.
    Skill Bonus: Barrier orcs spend their lives amongst the hills and trees, and are wary of the intentions of strangers. They receive a +2 racial bonus on Sense Motive and Survival checks.
    Weapon Familiarity: Barrier Orcs are proficient with greataxes and falchions and treat any weapon with the word “orc” in its name as a martial weapon.
    Defensive Training: Due to the threat of extinction from the apocalypse and being forced out of the Queen's Land, barrier orcs have developed a wariness of humans, and gain a +4 dodge bonus to AC against monsters of the human subtype.

    Liberty's Edge

    So I was kinda thinking about adding some homebrewed monsters to the Poisoned Lands based kinda heavily off some creatures from Monster Hunter as stable mutations resulting in apex predators.

    The two big ones being:

    Zinogre (Gargantuan horned lightning wolf)
    Lagiacrus (Colossal (Long) aquatic lightning dragon...thing)

    Refluffed and tweaked to emphasize the mutations and environmentally hardy nature (High Fort saves to resist radiation for example).

    Allow me to point a picture for you:

    Your party has just managed to get out of a Coalition supply depot deep in the Poisoned Lands, but not before waking up an Annihilator-class Robot. The scorpion-like engine of destruction chases you through the complex, plowing through walls to get at you. Finally you emerge from the complex out into the muggy, overcast day, only to see a huge armor plated, horned wolf like thing, about the size of a house. Behind you, the Annihilator burst through the last wall, its chainguns speeding up.

    The wolf thing gives a howl and charges, tackling the robot and throwing its aim off. The wolf thing claws and bites and rends the robot asunder as the robot blasts away with plasma bursts and hacks away with its claws. The spines and plates on the back of the wolf thing raise and begin to glow. With a feral howl, a shockwave of electricity erupts from the biological capacitors along the wolf's back, frying the Annihilator. As the lightning wolf chews away at the destroyed robot, apparently gaining some sort of sustenance from the inner workings, the party manages to escape, putting those wolf things on their list of things to never screw with.

    Again, just an idea, though I do wanna make a Lagiacrus type creature (Massive dragon-like serpent lizard thing that generates electricity that causes havoc for the city of New Providence).

    EDIT: Also I figured out how/why there would still be robots in the Poisoned Lands: Factories deep inside the Coalition facilities that churn out robots via Fabricate and True Creation spells, coupled with automated systems. So if not discovered and shut down, one facility could probably put out an Annihilator every two years or so (Though they're not really a priority).

    Liberty's Edge

    So, added in The Frozen Wilds, anyone got any suggestions for arctic whatnot?

    Liberty's Edge

    Right, so currently trying to hammer out some of the Prestige classes.

    Thread can be found here.

    Liberty's Edge

    Right, so initial build for the Queen's Guard prestige class is up here.

    Feedback is appreciated, as I don't know 100% what the heck I'm doing.


    It's a very similar class to the Devoted Defender (3.5) and the Stalwart Defender (pathfinder), with full caster progression it's probably balanced but there are some powers that might be worth swapping in or out. The "get behind me" could be replaced with that one that increases a defended charge's AC and/or lets the Queen's Guard "Take the hit."

    Liberty's Edge

    boring7 wrote:
    It's a very similar class to the Devoted Defender (3.5) and the Stalwart Defender (pathfinder), with full caster progression it's probably balanced but there are some powers that might be worth swapping in or out. The "get behind me" could be replaced with that one that increases a defended charge's AC and/or lets the Queen's Guard "Take the hit."

    I actually used the Devoted Defender as a basis for the class.

    The Defender's Charge ability already increases the AC or the charge, and the capstone doubles as a Pain Split and damage bounce ability =3


    I'm sometimes incompetent and reading. I need to caffinate.

    Sorry I'm not posting more, laziness + short attention sp-ooh, shiny objects!

    wait, what were we talking about?

    Another concern that pops into my head is the arcane points. I realize it's built for Magus, but it's one of those unwritten rules that you're supposed to make it POSSIBLE for other classes to "fake it." Perhaps you could have an option where the caster could, say, cast using a higher level spell slot or using two spell slots would make that ability available (but more expensive) for other caster classes. I mean you don't HAVE to, there are classes that literally only Monk or ninja can use, and it's only one class ability.

    I'm also not sure about the "damage reflect" ability. It's not necessarily BAD, it's just a mechanic I never see using a methodology I almost never see in Pathfinder. It's the old conservative fear of change and the 'untested' new.

    Finally, if you're doing half-favored saves, I'd give 'em reflex too.

    Night Witch: Take 'er up to 3x speed. Flying PCs start out slow, flying monsters are freaky-fast. Actually, just use an amped-up version of the Monk's speed table giving +60 by level 10 instead of 20. This also means you don't have to worry about "hacks" like using the Travel Domain and then doubling or tripling its bonus.

    As raiders, they are more likely to roll with Fly-by-attack than pounce, though that's arguable. A special ability that lets them drop multiple bombs (flasks of acid, etc.) in a manner akin to Manyshot might be in order.

    Darkvision and increasing the range of someone's darkvision make sense, since the character is flying at night. Blindsense is tempting but kind of huge freakin' deal.

    Wyrm Hunter, my first thought, increasing the range increment on a firearm, is a sledgehammer of a rules mechanic. It means you can use your "guns ignore natural armor" to punch a hole in a Steelwyrm (touch AC) from further away, or any other creature with non-dodge armor. That's really powerful, maybe too powerful. But without it most of your ranged attacks are either normal (and kinda weak) or being fired within a large creature's threat radius.

    My computer appears to be doing a slow crash, have to stop here.

    Liberty's Edge

    boring7 wrote:

    I'm sometimes incompetent and reading. I need to caffinate.

    Sorry I'm not posting more, laziness + short attention sp-ooh, shiny objects!

    wait, what were we talking about?

    Another concern that pops into my head is the arcane points. I realize it's built for Magus, but it's one of those unwritten rules that you're supposed to make it POSSIBLE for other classes to "fake it." Perhaps you could have an option where the caster could, say, cast using a higher level spell slot or using two spell slots would make that ability available (but more expensive) for other caster classes. I mean you don't HAVE to, there are classes that literally only Monk or ninja can use, and it's only one class ability.

    I'm also not sure about the "damage reflect" ability. It's not necessarily BAD, it's just a mechanic I never see using a methodology I almost never see in Pathfinder. It's the old conservative fear of change and the 'untested' new.

    Finally, if you're doing half-favored saves, I'd give 'em reflex too.

    Night Witch: Take 'er up to 3x speed. Flying PCs start out slow, flying monsters are freaky-fast. Actually, just use an amped-up version of the Monk's speed table giving +60 by level 10 instead of 20. This also means you don't have to worry about "hacks" like using the Travel Domain and then doubling or tripling its bonus.

    As raiders, they are more likely to roll with Fly-by-attack than pounce, though that's arguable. A special ability that lets them drop multiple bombs (flasks of acid, etc.) in a manner akin to Manyshot might be in order.

    Darkvision and increasing the range of someone's darkvision make sense, since the character is flying at night. Blindsense is tempting but kind of huge freakin' deal.

    Wyrm Hunter, my first thought, increasing the range increment on a firearm, is a sledgehammer of a rules mechanic. It means you can use your "guns ignore natural armor" to punch a hole in a Steelwyrm (touch AC) from further away, or any other creature with non-dodge...

    1) I was considering giving non-magus classes a sort of [Stat]+1 Arcane Points to allow them to make use of the whole spellcasting thing on their charge (wouldn't work for classes like Fighter or Barbarians obviously).

    2) I honestly couldn't think of any capstone things for a super-defensive class aside from a bunch of passive things. The alternative would be Fear and Charm Immunity, DR10/- and tweaking armor's max Dex bonuses by ~2-3 to allow for more dodge and AoO.

    3) Actually the theme of the Night Witch I'd want to go with is "You can fly, you can fight while you fly, and now you can do it really, really scary good". Was thinking of, in addition to the whole +speed and maneuverability, a Skirmish-like ability that gives precision damage upon moving ~10ft a round (must be flying) with the capstone being like one of the Dervish abilities in 3.5 where you can full-attack and move up between each attack up to your total movement. So like if you have three attacks and can move 90ft a round while flying, you could move 30ft, attack, move another 30ft to attack again, then move another 30ft and attack once more.

    4) Someone elsewhere had suggested just adding more Deeds specific to taking out large creatures. I do want there to be some crossover with the Pilum-Lance though.

    Liberty's Edge

    So I basically pulled some stuff from the 3.5 Dervish and tweaked it for the Night Witch. Now it's a highly mobile killing machine.


    I don't claim to have a good idea on balancing prestige classes, but I feel like a full BAB, two good saves, full spell casting, and class features every level is too much

    Special: The requirement is fine, but I wonder what happens to a queen's guard who renounces his vows? Can he still advance in the class? Does he lose abilities? This information should be detailed at the end of the class, like the paladin.

    Skills: 3 + Int? Just pick 2 or 4.

    Defenders Charge: what kind of action is it to declare a charge? Since there is no entry requirement for this class to be a magus, I would remove the thingy about spending arcane points. I would move the ability to the end of the paragraph and do something so any caster can use it. For example:

    Defender's Charge: A queen's guard is devoted to protecting those under her care. She can declare a creature as her charge as a swift action. The charge gains a +1 to AC as long as the queen's guard is adjacent to it. The queen's guard also gains a +1 bonus to weapon damage rolls and rolls to overcome spell resistance against creatures who threaten her charge. These bonuses increase by 1 at 3rd level and every two levels thereafter. Once per day, she can cast a spell with a range of personal on her charge.

    Whats the difference between a bonus feat and a free feat?

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