Baseline info:
I'm building a character that is going to be a dex-based duelist, using a single (agile, when affordable) sword and the snake style feats (from a monk splash, equal for both classes). Assuming that the "Singleton" ability of the Freehand Fighter qualifies for Dueling Gloves: would you prefer to use a Kensai or the Freehand Fighter (or the Swordlord)? Mind you, in case it's the Kensai he would use NO elemental dmg spells, and possibly only use cantrips (Touch of Fatigue) for spellstrike (plus a few utility spells of course).
The reason that the Freehand Fighter sprang to mind is that it grants the attack and damage bonus from "Singleton" to all attacks. With one hand holding a sword, that still means the unarmed snake style attacks can benefit from that.
Initially, I was strongly looking at Swordlord, but neither the GM nor I are too fond of the Crane feats, and although Steel Net is awesome, it also only gains Weapon Training I at level 9, which is very late. I'm not sure whether Snake Style alone will make a Steel Net worthwhile, if it delays the damage that much.
Note, that I'm ruling the Swashbuckler class out, since I'm not going to have a good enough charisma to make it all that worthwhile, I think. There's some minimums in wisdom I need to hit for the concept, and points only can be spread so far.
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If you are going by strict RAW, singleton does not work with the gloves of dueling. Lore warden is almost always a stronger choice. They are better at maneuvers, they have real weapon training instead of singleton, and have more skills. Also, crane style is better than snake style for non-monks. Crane riposte attacks can be made with a weapon, but snake fang attacks must be unarmed.
If you are set on using a sword this (my suggestion) will not work but for smaller weapons the brawler archetype is great. So If you are ok with using a ok with using a weapon from the close weapon group I'd suggest taking the brawler. It gives +1 to hit and +3 to damage instead +1/+1 and it includes unarmed strikes.
And following some FAQ/errata the brawler'S ability and others that work like weapon training but for specific choices count as weapon training. So it would work with gloves of duelling.
I'm myself working at some build for a fighting fan user with the brawler archetype.
And if you do the math those additional +2 give an 1d4 weapon the same average damage as a 1d8 weapon (like the longsword) but the full bonus also applies to you unarmed attacks. But fluff wise it's a big difference between using a punching dagger/cestus/tekko kagi or a longsword/duelling swod/scimitar.
First of all, thank you all for the commentary and suggestions. Both the lack of Crane Style and the use of a sword as a main weapon are set in stone, though - I'm building a character here, and his background's already written. Aside from that, I agree that Brawler is a strong archetype - it just won't work in this particular case :).
I do agree that a kensai with monk dip is a BAB worry - which is one of the reasons I brought it up. Even with reduced spellcasting, they still have some extra versatility that a non-caster will never achieve, and it'd be a decent fit for the background. Using a mithril chain shirt means no attack penalties and perfectly functional armour that works with the class features, too. [I did consider the sohei monk archetype in addition to MoMS for the dip, but I'm not eager to reduce the offhand damage - although I might, since I doubt I'd get more than maybe half a dozen monk levels in the long run.)
The charisma issue aside (I had not thought of the extra grit feat) - how do you feel the swashbuckler compares? I'm not worried over feats right now, as I think I'll have a fairly forgiving "must have" list, so spending one to make a concept work is perfectly fine.
Freehand Fighter and Kensai seem to have better AC than some of the alternatives, such as a crane-less Swordlord or Lorewarden, since the latter only gets to parry melee attacks, and it scales slower than Elusive et.al.
The Lorewarden is on an even keel wih the others (and better than kensai) when it comes to the Disarm maneuver, and better at the rest of them, which is worth a small measure to me. Thematiclaly important, and maneuvers are great for zorro-esque tricks, but in the end they aren't a very good use of your time. Still, I'd use it if the character were capable enough. They also have extra skill points, which is a great boon.
Well, I haven't made up my mind, that much is clear. Please keep the comments flowing, as I am thankful for them and I like these comparisons between conceptual implementations.
Well, it's currently looking like this:
Fighter 2 (Lorewarden archetype)
Monk 1 (Martial Artist & MoMS archetypes)
Although I started out thinking I wanted Swordlord for archetype and/or PrC, I'm currently thinking Duelist may work out better, after picking up the second weapon training group (for sword and unarmed).
Race: human (fixed - it's the ONLY race)
Traits:
heirloom weapon (+2 disarm, free masterwork quality as a campaign bonus)
defender of the society (+1 AC when wearing any armour)
[Note: no campaign traits allowed, or I would have taken sword scion]
Str 10, Dex 18, Con 12, Int 14, Wis 14, Cha 8.
[There will be a way to get dex to dmg in the near future for the character, so I'm not too worried]
The Lorewarden in the end sealed it, almost purely because it allowed for a lot more out of combat options with the extra skill points and class skills. Also, talking with the GM showed that actual duels might well occur, so I felt that a maneuver build would be good. Still going to aim for Snake style / fang at level 3, mind.
Kind of tempted to look at the Maneuver Master archetype, but it doesn't combine with Martial Artist, and I feel I'll need a reliable way to deal with DR - especially since that heirloom weapon isn't suddenly going to become adamantine over time.
Please feel free to continue suggestions. Thank you!
a maneuver master's flurry of maneuvers has no restrictions on weapons that can be used, or against doing it while wearing armor (so you can trade 14 from Wis to Str and just wear a chain shirt).... a Maneuver Master 2/Lore Warden X-2 is a deadly combo, particularly against humanoid opponents (though you do have to take snake style the old fashion way)
a maneuver master's flurry of maneuvers has no restrictions on weapons that can be used, or against doing it while wearing armor (so you can trade 14 from Wis to Str and just wear a chain shirt).... a Maneuver Master 2/Lore Warden X-2 is a deadly combo, particularly against humanoid opponents (though you do have to take snake style the old fashion way)
Oh, it's very appealing, but since we start at level 3, it's a long, long way to Snake Fang (requires 9 ranks of Sense Motive). That just is going to be too long a wait for me to get the moving parts in place, I'm afraid.
As a "sideways" consideration: I plan to play a duelist that is honorable to opponents of standing, and would thus allow opponents (during a formal duel) to pick up their weapons after disarming them. They'd lose face each time, of course, but until they break the code, they get to fight with blade in hand. With that in mind, the "free" disarm each round would likely be overkill. Chances are, I'll pick up the improved disarm feat (and maybe the trip one as well) anyway, if not perhaps right out of the gate.
Do you feel that the Duelist PrC is worth pursuing, or is it best to stick with Lorewarden and a monk splash? Of course, such a decision can easily change over time. Out of the prerequisites, only Mobility is a feat I might not automatically take.
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The thing I really dislike about the Duelist (and the swashbuckler too for that matter) is that too many things are immune to precise strike.
As for Maneuver master, you don't have to make the free maneuver a disarm. Dirty Trick is a very appropriate manuever for a fencer, and it doesn't have to be an actual dirty trick. A classic example from fiction is Zorro cutting a Z into his opponents clothes to inflict the shaken condition.
