Okay, so before I get started I am aware of how ridiculously cheesy this question is.
That said, this question involves Spellstrike, a lance, and the charge action. I know that charge is its own, unique action and therefore cannot be combined with Spellstrike. Is there a way to cast a spell as part of a charge?
Alternatively, could a spell be case in one round, the charge held, and then delivered with a charge attack on a subsequent round? Or, if a Magus used haste on himself, could he then cast the spell, and take a charge as a full-round action to deliver it with a Spellstrike?
I ask this because a friend of mine said he wanted to make a cavalier Magus. He was referring to a personality type, but I thought if there was some way to combine mounted combat prowess with magical might, that would be a force to be reckoned with. Anyone have any thoughts?
Is there a way to cast a spell as part of a charge?
I think no on this.Alternatively, could a spell be case in one round, the charge held, and then delivered with a charge attack on a subsequent round?
Yes you could hold the charge.
if a Magus used haste on himself, could he then cast the spell, and take a charge as a full-round action to deliver it with a Spellstrike?
Haste does not give move actions a round.
I think the magus/cavalier could be fun. Take the Order of the Staff for more fun.
Challenge: Whenever an order of the staff cavalier issues a challenge, his target takes a –1 penalty on saving throws against spells and spell-like abilities for 1 round after the cavalier successfully damages the target. This penalty increases by 1 for every four levels the cavalier possesses.
You can cast a spell while your mount charges, but you yourself would not charge. If you used spell combat in this manner (and I don't see anything prohibiting it except the type of weapon used), your would not gain the effects of the charge, and you wouldn't get any iterative attacks as the mount's movement prohibits them. I'm not sure you can use spell combat with a lance at all, as even though you can wield it in one hand, it's still a two-handed weapon, and the distinction has been pretty hotly debated lately. Even if you could use the lance, since you aren't charging, you wouldn't get the double damage from the lance.
You could certainly cast the spell on one turn (perhaps while your mount closes the distance), then charge on the next turn and deliver the charge (er, the spell's charge, that is) with your lance via spellstrike. That would give you double lance damage and deliver the spell as well. Pretty sweet, actually, if even more situational than a typical cavalier's mounted charge.
I'm getting some crazy ideas now for an army of sneak-attacking rogues not-really-charging from the backs of giant spiders.
Okay, so before I get started I am aware of how ridiculously cheesy this question is.
That said, this question involves Spellstrike, a lance, and the charge action. I know that charge is its own, unique action and therefore cannot be combined with Spellstrike. Is there a way to cast a spell as part of a charge?
You could cast a quickened spell. You could not use Spell Combat with a charge (be it a personal charge or a mounted charge) because a charge leaves the rider with only an attack action left. The Mounted Skirmisher feat allows you to take a full-attack action, but Spell Combat requires a full-round action that is explicitly not a full-attack action, so I don't believe that would work either.
Alternatively, could a spell be case in one round, the charge held, and then delivered with a charge attack on a subsequent round? Or, if a Magus used haste on himself, could he then cast the spell, and take a charge as a full-round action to deliver it with a Spellstrike?
Yes, if you hold a charge of a spell and then on the next round use the charge action, the attack you make with the charge action would deliver the held spell charge.
Haste does not give you an extra standard action but instead grants extra movement, hit bonus, AC, and an extra attack (on a full-attack action), so it would be of limited benefit. If you took Mounted Skirmisher, you could cast a spell, hold the charge, wait a round, have your mount charge, then take a full-attack action with an extra attack from Haste - but that's about it.
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Blahpers: When your mount charges, you cannot take a full-round or full-attack action normally. It's obscure, but see the text in the Mounted Skirmisher feat:
Mounted Skirmisher (Combat)
You are adept at attacking from upon a swift moving steed.
Prerequisites: Ride rank 14, Mounted Combat, Trick Riding.
Benefit: If your mount moves its speed or less, you can still take a full-attack action.
Normal: If your mount moves more than 5 feet, you can only take an attack action.
So without the feat, even though you, the rider, are not technically charging with your own actions, you are only allowed an attack action at the end of the process. With the feat, you can take a full-attack action - but Spell Combat isn't a full-attack, it's a full round action. So it's questionable whether the feat would allow you to Spell Combat on a charging mount.
I mentioned it because it's one of the core abilities of the class; I figured 'losing' the ability to use it consistently should be factored in. :)
Since you're likely not going to be able to use Spell Combat frequently while mounted, going with a big two-hander from the back of a mount and then possibly going with the kensai archetype (so you can automatically maximize the damage from your weapon) would be an excellent combination. Spirited Charge with a lucerne hammer (2d12 while charging, spend an arcane point to do an automatic 24 damage from weapon alone)? Yes please.
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Just a thought, but this might make an interesting archetype for the Magus. Perhaps extend the ability to enhance your weapons using arcane points to apply to your mount's attacks? I might have to try writing that up...
You know, a friend of mine and I were talking about this very thing last night.
I thought spellstriking with a lance would be awesome, he seemed to think Magis stuff only works with one handed weapons..
Turns out spell combat only works with one handed (or light) weapons, but Spellstrike works with "any weapon he is wielding"..
So cast Shocking Grasp, hold the charge in the Lance, and then charge.
Ouch.
Spell combat was never an option on horseback, full round actions aren't readily available on horseback. Ride by attack would be fun though.
Okay, so before I get started I am aware of how ridiculously cheesy this question is.
That said, this question involves Spellstrike, a lance, and the charge action. I know that charge is its own, unique action and therefore cannot be combined with Spellstrike. Is there a way to cast a spell as part of a charge?
You could cast a quickened spell. You could not use Spell Combat with a charge (be it a personal charge or a mounted charge) because a charge leaves the rider with only an attack action left. The Mounted Skirmisher feat allows you to take a full-attack action, but Spell Combat requires a full-round action that is explicitly not a full-attack action, so I don't believe that would work either.
Alternatively, could a spell be case in one round, the charge held, and then delivered with a charge attack on a subsequent round? Or, if a Magus used haste on himself, could he then cast the spell, and take a charge as a full-round action to deliver it with a Spellstrike?Yes, if you hold a charge of a spell and then on the next round use the charge action, the attack you make with the charge action would deliver the held spell charge.
Haste does not give you an extra standard action but instead grants extra movement, hit bonus, AC, and an extra attack (on a full-attack action), so it would be of limited benefit. If you took Mounted Skirmisher, you could cast a spell, hold the charge, wait a round, have your mount charge, then take a full-attack action with an extra attack from Haste - but that's about it.
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Blahpers: When your mount charges, you cannot take a full-round or full-attack action normally. It's obscure, but see the text in the Mounted Skirmisher feat:...Mounted Skirmisher (Combat)
You are adept at attacking from upon a swift moving steed.
Prerequisites: Ride rank 14, Mounted Combat, Trick Riding.
Benefit: If your mount moves its speed or less, you can still take a
I'm ignoring Mounted Skirmisher because the Normal line of a feat is meant to call out the specific thing boosted by the feat. Since the feat wasn't mentioned, I'm going by the rules in the Combat section under Combat While Mounted.
That said, you're correct about spell combat, or practically so. Featless, you could cast a spell and still make your attack at the end of a mounted charge--there is no prohibition against taking full-round actions when your mount moves more than 5 feet, only multiple attacks--but you could not deliver the spell from spell combat along with your weapon attack, since that would be more than a single attack. So you could cast shield and attack with spell combat, but if you cast shocking grasp and attack with spell combat, you won't actually deliver the charge--you'll still be holding it at the end of your turn.
Spellstrike is as already mentioned, of course.
Spell combat was never an option on horseback, full round actions aren't readily available on horseback.
Citation? Guiding your mount is a free action. That leaves you with a move action and a standard action, or a full-round action. The only prohibition I've seen is that you can only make a single attack if your mount moves more than 5 feet.
The rules in question:
With a DC 5 Ride check, you can guide your mount with your knees so as to use both hands to attack or defend yourself. This is a free action.
When you attack a creature smaller than your mount that is on foot, you get the +1 bonus on melee attacks for being on higher ground. If your mount moves more than 5 feet, you can only make a single melee attack. Essentially, you have to wait until the mount gets to your enemy before attacking, so you can't make a full attack. Even at your mount's full speed, you don't take any penalty on melee attacks while mounted.
If your mount charges, you also take the AC penalty associated with a charge. If you make an attack at the end of the charge, you receive the bonus gained from the charge. When charging on horseback, you deal double damage with a lance (see Charge).
You can use ranged weapons while your mount is taking a double move, but at a –4 penalty on the attack roll. You can use ranged weapons while your mount is running (quadruple speed) at a –8 penalty. In either case, you make the attack roll when your mount has completed half its movement. You can make a full attack with a ranged weapon while your mount is moving. Likewise, you can take move actions normally.
Note that, for example, you can still make a full attack with a ranged weapon, so clearly full-round actions are not blanket prohibited. The reasoning is that you can still do anything that requires a full round action, but you must be able to do that thing for the duration of the action. A melee full-attack doesn't qualify because you won't be able the threaten your enemy for the entire action, but a ranged full-attack, as well as many other full-round actions, is fine.
Spell combat was never an option on horseback, full round actions aren't readily available on horseback.Citation? Guiding your mount is a free action. That leaves you with a move action and a standard action, or a full-round action. The only prohibition I've seen is that you can only make a single attack if your mount moves more than 5 feet.
The rules in question:
** spoiler omitted **Note that, for example, you can still make a full attack with a ranged weapon, so clearly full-round actions are not blanket prohibited. The reasoning is that you can still do anything that requires a full round action, but you must be able to do that thing for the duration of the action. A melee full-attack doesn't qualify because you won't be able the...
Mounted combat section of the core.
You could make a full attack if your horse doesn't move more than 5ft in a round. If the horse moves more than 5ft, you are only allowed to make a single attack
You can cast spells on horseback, but if you cast in the middle of a move you need to make concentration checks or lose the spell.
You can indeed make full attacks with ranged weapons, but only ranged weapons. It specifically makes the distinction, ranged weapons.
So I suppose you could pull spell combat off on the back of a horse, but you'd be pulling concentration checks for the spell. You could cast a ranged spell, and then hit with melee, or once you get Spellstrike, cast, move on horse, attack. Etc.. That's a bit nasty...
That's more than a bit nasty.
Spell Combat is a full-round action that grants you all of your melee attacks in combination with being able to cast a spell. Technically, if Spell Combat were allowed while mounted, it would be a loophole around the "no full attack" action that a charge imposes.
My thought is that, if you could use Spell Combat during a mounted charge, you'd get to cast a spell but would be limited to a single attack at the end of the charge.
Even that is pretty gross.
It's no loophole, as you are still limited to a single attack at the end of a charge. The limitation is not, er, limited to the full attack action. I agree with your thought and don't find it gross at all.